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-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   US reopening with no cure or vaccine and little testing? (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/us-reopening-no-cure-vaccine-little-testing-305246/)

Topspinmo 04-15-2020 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DianeM (Post 1746322)
Would that really be worth it? Two years in captivity?
Guess, opinion, fear mongering

Topspinmo 04-15-2020 09:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmarklove (Post 1746271)
News' Alexander Nazaryan:
"Florida now has twice as many coronavirus cases (20,601) as South Korea (10,537).
"About 30 million more people live in South Korea than in Florida."
So, more people From all over the world travel here spreading virus.

Jacob85 04-15-2020 09:44 AM
More people may recover from the virus but not the ones who are old and or having pre- existing conditions so those who want things back to normal, are you willing to put money ahead of peoples lives?

Topspinmo 04-15-2020 09:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLife (Post 1746280)
I wonder why New York is currently global epicenter of the pandemic with 160,000 cases?

Crammed in like sardines, people from all over the world travel to aNd through spreading virus. By time they know they had problem it was already out of control.

Bill1701 04-15-2020 09:48 AM
If we open the pools, we'll run into the same problems we had before. Too many people staying too close together. There is not enough staff to monitor the pools,clean the equipment, and check IDs.

Topspinmo 04-15-2020 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob85 (Post 1746671)
More people may recover from the virus but not the ones who are old and or having pre- existing conditions so those who want things back to normal, are you willing to put money ahead of peoples lives?
So, what do you think going to happen when nobody has any money, no hospitals, no federal government, no food?

Aces4 04-15-2020 10:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Love2Swim (Post 1746256)
I don't get it either. Frankly, it sounds like the person in charge wants to open things up the first of May, to ostensibly get the economy going, and of course to aid his re-election bid. Against the advice of the health professionals and experts. I think its just plain stupid. I will be careful and doing social distancing until there is a vaccine available or it is obvious the threat of infection is low. Anyways it is up to the Governors to decide when they open up their states - many are saying it will be at least until June.
If that’s what people have comprehended from the White House updates, I can understand why they have to repeat over and over what is planned. There are excellent, brilliant citizens being tasked with the reopening our country slowly and as safety as possible. While the less than enlightened people stand on the sidelines clucking, the brains of this country know what this country needs to carefully get back to business. Your leaders know much more than the average citizen about the juggling act required to keep US citizens safe and at the same time keeping an eye on the food, medical and basic nessessities supply chain and economy without creating panic. Don’t think there won’t be a food shortage if this country can’t get up and running soon? Our leaders don’t have the luxury of keeping their eyes on just one ball.

sail33or 04-15-2020 10:12 AM
First, this is a "Flu". (Not the Plague). People dying every minute of something. They just aren't posting the score on every media outlet.

I understand if you are 85 or have COPD that you are afraid. But regular flu can kill you also. Falling in Shower will kill you.

I heard a perfectly logical solution to this.

Everyone that is not afraid can resume normal life. Everyone that is "afraid" can stay home as long as they want. They can avoid everyone that has resumed normal life.

Let's not punish hard working families in their 30's, 40's, etc. that have a 99.99% chance of surviving the flu. Healthy people that get Corona Virus are not going to the hospital. They go home to bed for a few days. So overwhelming health care is not going to happen IF those at risk stay home until vaccines, etc.

Jazzman 04-15-2020 10:13 AM
And the longer the economy remains stagnant the more bad news for those out of work. Currently the projected number of people out of work will reach 27 million by June. Think about that. And here in the Villages there are many residents who think once restrictions are eased all will be well. Be rest assured that will not be the case and many business and especially restaurants will remain either closed or go out of business. Those that open will require less employees so the unemployment situation will continue on a large scale which will have more dire consequences socially and economically then the virus itself

Radioman41 04-15-2020 10:14 AM
Interestingly, Sweden and Brazil kept their economies open during the COVD-19 pandemic and their numbers are dropping faster than ours. See Gateway Pundit, April 12, 2020. This would confirm epidemiologist, Knut Wittkowski's statement about herd immunity. The path we are following may lead to a new outbreak next fall. Check out the below video.

Perspectives on the Pandemic | Professor Knut Wittkowski | Episode 2 - YouTube

Bill32 04-15-2020 10:15 AM
When the country starts to open up, and new guidelines are issued, i'll then reevaluate what i'll do and what precautions i'll take....my decision...

Professor 04-15-2020 10:40 AM
For those who have someone in their household with a compromised immune system it is likely the behavior will not go back to what it used to be. Eating out has its hazards with menus that are not sanitized between customers, salt and pepper shakers that rarely if ever get cleaned, ketchup...and the list goes on. Entertainment at the square is important from a social perspective and distance can be somewhat controlled for those who want some distance, but exercise facilities are not likely to be in the cards for some time to come. The country as we knew it will not return to the same old same old in my opinion. Some will of course, but many if us will be much more reserved and aware going forward. At least we can hope we have learned some things through all of this...

Tblue 04-15-2020 10:51 AM
Cuomo said it himself, NYC is being hit so hard for 2 reasons. 1. Our dense population. 2. Our diverse population, our ability to accept people/cultures from all over the world.

LiverpoolWalrus 04-15-2020 11:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Topspinmo (Post 1746684)
So, what do you think going to happen when ... no federal government, no food?
I didn't know these things were at risk. Elaborate?

Rwaccess 04-15-2020 11:15 AM
I agree with you .

Villageswimmer 04-15-2020 11:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall22204 (Post 1746404)
Are you on drugs? Do you know something no one else knows? Chicken little the sky is not falling.
Are you responding to a post??

Aces4 04-15-2020 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiverpoolWalrus (Post 1746760)
I didn't know these things were at risk. Elaborate?
Markets have changed. Farmers are dumping milk, strawberries are beginning to rot in the fields for lack of demand, shelves are difficult to restock with some items, meat processing plants have closed due to virus spread within. Most food industries work on a small profit margin, they can’t hold up very long.

DianeM 04-15-2020 11:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikemalloy (Post 1746579)
......The smart ones know not to show too much disrespect to the individual on the other end of the lifeline.
Perfectly stated.

oldtimes 04-15-2020 11:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746716)
First, this is a "Flu". (Not the Plague). People dying every minute of something. They just aren't posting the score on every media outlet.

I understand if you are 85 or have COPD that you are afraid. But regular flu can kill you also. Falling in Shower will kill you.

I heard a perfectly logical solution to this.

Everyone that is not afraid can resume normal life. Everyone that is "afraid" can stay home as long as they want. They can avoid everyone that has resumed normal life.

Let's not punish hard working families in their 30's, 40's, etc. that have a 99.99% chance of surviving the flu. Healthy people that get Corona Virus are not going to the hospital. They go home to bed for a few days. So overwhelming health care is not going to happen IF those at risk stay home until vaccines, etc.
Yes but ordinarily they don't need makeshift hospitals to take care of them because the regular hospitals are too overloaded.

Aces4 04-15-2020 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746716)
First, this is a "Flu". (Not the Plague). People dying every minute of something. They just aren't posting the score on every media outlet.

I understand if you are 85 or have COPD that you are afraid. But regular flu can kill you also. Falling in Shower will kill you.

I heard a perfectly logical solution to this.

Everyone that is not afraid can resume normal life. Everyone that is "afraid" can stay home as long as they want. They can avoid everyone that has resumed normal life.

Let's not punish hard working families in their 30's, 40's, etc. that have a 99.99% chance of surviving the flu. Healthy people that get Corona Virus are not going to the hospital. They go home to bed for a few days. So overwhelming health care is not going to happen IF those at risk stay home until vaccines, etc.
There was a thirty five year old young man, with no underlying health issues, who passed away a few days ago in our area and a healthy, vibrant 78 year old woman. He was married last August and she was healthy until...

They are only numbers to you, their families are devastated.

DianeM 04-15-2020 11:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob85 (Post 1746671)
More people may recover from the virus but not the ones who are old and or having pre- existing conditions so those who want things back to normal, are you willing to put money ahead of peoples lives?
Not ahead of lives but equally important. Not to be insensitive but in reality in a country of 330 million, the number of deaths is a drop in the bucket. New York is marking anyone who dies as corona related death. We truly have no real idea of the actual number. We cannot stay holed up forever.

DianeM 04-15-2020 11:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtimes (Post 1746779)
Yes but ordinarily they don't need makeshift hospitals to take care of them because the regular hospitals are too overloaded.
Which were not used in New York and are already being removed. Way overestimated number of beds and ventilators needed which is a wonderful thing

vilger 04-15-2020 11:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radioman41 (Post 1746722)
Interestingly, Sweden and Brazil kept their economies open during the COVD-19 pandemic and their numbers are dropping faster than ours. See Gateway Pundit, April 12, 2020. This would confirm epidemiologist, Knut Wittkowski's statement about herd immunity. The path we are following may lead to a new outbreak next fall. Check out the below video.

Perspectives on the Pandemic | Professor Knut Wittkowski | Episode 2 - YouTube
Sweden's numbers are dropping fast? Really? In fact they are increasing much faster than their neighbors.

BAT777 04-15-2020 12:11 PM
Is there spraying of insects in TV? 3 nights ago about 10:30 PM a truck in our Villas (very loud) drove up and down the streets and it was obvious some sort of spray was being done by the looks of things. If yes then exactly what is the spray and are we ever notified beforehand? We have been here 10 years and never saw this.

sail33or 04-15-2020 12:29 PM
People are always going point out the .001 percent who died. Every life is unique. So there is nothing to counter, what if the .001 percent was YOU.

I, also know many people who died in the last week of all sorts of issues. Those "other" issues are not preventing people from working.

Why is a flu death different than cancer??? Second hand smoke, Roundup, hairspray, etc., etc cause cancer. Why do people live in trailer homes when tornados kill them every week.

This has happened because many people believe what they see in the Media. Fear is the best news. If the Media said to buy toilet paper, that is what they do. When the Media says all clear, then, and only then will they believe it is okay. I will return to the squares as soon as there are bands. I am pretty sure they would appear tomorrow if allowed.

Again, if you are afraid, stay isolated. But why advocate everyone stay home. By the way. If you are going to the grocery store, you are basically a hypocrite if you advocate social distancing. Restaurants bad, Lowes/Walmart/Grocery Stores okay. Right.

LiverpoolWalrus 04-15-2020 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746823)

This has happened because many people believe what they see in the Media. Fear is the best news.
I've only been on this board a short while and this topic comes up a lot. There's an individual here that's an ardent defender of the media. I wonder if he'll chime in.

coffeebean 04-15-2020 12:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by villageuser (Post 1746518)
.........

The last thing I read is that the droplets ARE falling on the ground and we have to be aware that the soles of our shoes are contaminated. We should not be outside, especially in the grocery store, Walmart, etc, and go home with our shoes on. ....
Let me think about this for a minute.......I've assumed all along that the virus is all over floors because it remains suspended in the air for , what I have read and heard, 3 hours. Of course, I realize the bottoms of our shoes are contaminated with virus. My car and golf cart gas and brake pedals are also contaminated. Having said that, for the life of me, I can not imagine the virus can propel itself up from these surfaces and contaminate my eyes, nose or mouth. I may be wrong but I'll take my chances.

I am very aware that the floors are all contaminated with virus so I take special precautions when spot cleaning or washing the floors. Has anyone heard how long the virus remains viable on tile or laminate flooring? How about Chattahoochee river rock that is in my garage? Just wondering.

Donb0975 04-15-2020 12:47 PM
Open only the sports pools as there are no lounge chairs and thus you hopefully wouldn't have those that just want to sun out around the pool. One other thing is the sports pools are set up for lane swimming or walking and no guests, children allowed in sports pools.

roscoguy 04-15-2020 01:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746716)
First, this is a "Flu". (Not the Plague).
First, COVID-19 is NOT the flu.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746716)
Let's not punish hard working families in their 30's, 40's, etc. that have a 99.99% chance of surviving the flu.
Second, everybody has a 99.9% chance of surviving the flu as the mortality rate in the U.S. is about 0.1%, or 1 in 1,000 people that become infected. COVID-19 has an estimated mortality rate of 1% by the most optimistic estimates. This is, at minimum, 10 times as high as the flu, or 1 in every 100 who become infected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sail33or (Post 1746716)
Healthy people that get Corona Virus are not going to the hospital. They go home to bed for a few days.
Third, some young and very healthy people definitely are going to hospitals, and some are even dying. Plus, those healthy people that only stay in bed for a few days are very likely capable of infecting others. Where DO you get your news?

roscoguy 04-15-2020 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 1746637)
Ever heard of the Great Depression? There was mass suicides because it was so bad.
Another myth, I'm afraid. According to The History Channel,
Quote:
"Contrary to popular lore, there was no epidemic of suicides—let alone window-jumpings—in the wake of the Stock Market Crash of 1929. “In the United States the suicide wave that followed the stock market crash is also part of the legend of 1929. In fact, there was none,” wrote economist John Kenneth Galbraith in his book The Great Crash 1929."
1929 Stock Market Crash: Did Panicked Investors Really Jump From Windows? - HISTORY

sallybowron 04-15-2020 01:55 PM
Different
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter (Post 1746143)
Would it be different if this wasn't an election year?
Good question, I think it would have been:pray: different at least at the beginnig of the crisis.

OhioBuckeye 04-15-2020 01:58 PM
Ohiobuckeye
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiverpoolWalrus (Post 1746107)
From what I understand, our country is preparing to reopen soon, perhaps on a "rolling" basis, before there's an effective treatment or vaccine for Covid-19. Testing is also projected to remain difficult to get. I'm curious how you all will respond to the call to resume our activities under these conditions.

If the virus is still lurking and we have no weapons against it other than masks, alcohol and distancing, will you go back to your restaurants, town squares, the rec centers for card games, mahjong, jam sessions, Beatles group, ceramics, wood shop, etc.? Or will you continue to stay at home? I'm surprised TV's powers that be haven't polled the community on this important question. (Note to Winston: have you asked your members if they will indeed show up?)

I just don't see the logic in unleashing us prematurely. If the virus is still out there, large numbers of people, or even small numbers of people if you prefer, will continue to contract it and pass it on. And that's the situation that got us into this mess in the first place. Even though the virus was not widespread, there was enough of it to allow it to spread exponentially. What makes us think the same thing won't happen again? It probably will, and that's the set up for the "second wave" we've been hearing about.

So why would we want to make a bad situation worse? And why would the current administration want to commit political suicide in the process?

I just don't get it. Can anyone shed some light? What a Sophie's Choice on the part of our leaders on both sides, huh? Either let the economy crumble and the population go mad or kill off a segment of our citizenry.
I seen on the news that the people in Mich. are protest the stay at home & it showed the streets somewhere
In Mich. & there were thousands of people running the streets. Is this going to be the end of mankind! Now it sounds like the govt. is going to open our country, that’s scary! Also just heard that the banks or the govt. is out of money for loans for businesses. We had better hope there is a god because it’ll take god to help us thru this. Be safe & God Bless!

EdFNJ 04-15-2020 02:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishon (Post 1746397)
You are responsible for your own choices.
You are not in control of the choices made by others.
Act accordingly.
There, that wasn't so difficult, was it?
You missed the most important part of your monologue:

You are right to say you are responsible for your own choices however you must consider how YOUR CHOICES CAN AFFECT OTHERS.

The problem is the choice you are making DOES NOT ONLY AFFECT YOU it could possibly sicken or kill others. If it ONLY helped or hurt you personally I would give a hoot. Example: If you want to drink poison and kill yourself that's very sad but fine by me since it's YOUR CHOICE and won't hurt me, but if you want to kill yourself with a head-on collision into my car, then YOUR CHOICE AFFECTS ME.

So I believe the "it's my life and I'll do what I want" is actually quite selfish when it comes to something like this where your choice can spread all over and hurt others.

Remember, it's "WE" not "YOU". We are all involved in this. Consider others when you make YOUR choice whatever it is.

Velvet 04-15-2020 02:48 PM
Even if they open up the economy, we, seniors, don’t have to be afraid. We just have to remember how this virus works. I look at the virus as if it was a dust particle, it is not alive. The only way that it can hurt you is by getting inside your mouth, nose or eyes (as far as we know). So if you keep your hands clean, and soap is a great disinfectant, keep clothes and all surfaces clean and disinfected, then as soon as we are allowed to get them, wear the n95 mask and clear glasses, gloves or wash hands often - hubby literally walks around with disinfectant wipes he makes at home and carries in a zip lock bag. I can’t see how this virus can get to you. If worried about soles of shoes take off as soon as you can and wash them with soapy water.

I wash everything that comes in the house so that I don’t have to keep washing my hands after touching them. So I’ve never been this clean before, or my clothes and you need a magnifying glass to find a speck of dirt in my bathrooms. But it doesn’t take me that long, about 30 minutes a day of cleaning and hopefully they will have a vaccine for us in the near future.

GoPacers 04-15-2020 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by roscoguy (Post 1746854)

Second, everybody has a 99.9% chance of surviving the flu as the mortality rate in the U.S. is about 0.1%, or 1 in 1,000 people that become infected. COVID-19 has an estimated mortality rate of 1% by the most optimistic estimates. This is, at minimum, 10 times as high as the flu, or 1 in every 100 who become infected.
?
There is NO DATA to support this statement. We have absolutely no idea how many people have been exposed to the virus at this point. We only know how many people have tested positive. Increased testing for the disease and an antibody test that helps us know how many people have been infected will give us the necessary data to accurately determine the denominator. Until then, statements like this are uninformed at best.

In addition, everybody does NOT have a 99.9% chance of surviving the flu. You're taking a population based probability and assigning it to each and every individual which is simply not how it works. If that were the case the mortality rates would be the same for all demographics.

DianeM 04-15-2020 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoPacers (Post 1746946)
There is NO DATA to support this statement. We have absolutely no idea how many people have been exposed to the virus at this point. We only know how many people have tested positive. Increased testing for the disease and an antibody test that helps us know how many people have been infected will give us the necessary data to accurately determine the denominator. Until then, statements like this are uninformed at best.
You cannot test 330 million people, nor should you.
You’re still not shoving a stick up my nose for no good reason.
If I appear sick - fine. If not - don’t even think about it.

blueash 04-15-2020 03:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DianeM (Post 1746784)
New York is marking anyone who dies as corona related death.
Do you have a source for that claim that every death in NY is being recorded as corona related? Because it is untrue AFAIK. I'll await your link. You might wish to consult the direction from the CDC, that CDC in Atlanta, on their suggestion for recording causes of death during this pandemic.

DianeM 04-15-2020 03:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueash (Post 1746957)
Do you have a source for that claim that every death in NY is being recorded as corona related? Because it is untrue AFAIK. I'll await your link. You might wish to consult the direction from the CDC, that CDC in Atlanta, on their suggestion for recording causes of death during this pandemic.
Only my several friends who live there and relate info from local news stations. And I believe I recall Dr. Birx saying something of that nature last week. You can climb down now.

Bogie Shooter 04-15-2020 03:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DianeM (Post 1746959)
Only my several friends who live there and relate info from local news stations. And I believe I recall Dr. Birx saying something of that nature last week. You can climb down now.
So it was second handed...……………………….

44Apple 04-15-2020 03:45 PM
“I want the opportunity to infect others!” Wait, that’s not in the Bill of Rights.


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