We think just the opposite, enclosed the lanai and landscaping makes a kissing lanai no problem but we don't want our vehicles parked with the bumper feet from the street when we need to park outside the garages. Right in the street and you may as well live in a brownstone in Boston that is feet from the curb.

If the developer is liable for the medicare overruns might mean changes in how they operate which could affect the rest of us. I do not see the developer business failing.

However so far we have not heard most of what is going on and the Sun sure what be giving us a blow by blow description unless someone else can be blamed.

I agree. I am not sure the lots are smaller in the south. I know the house I own in the LSL area has a 0.15 acre lot, whereas the one I own near Eastport has a 0.27 acre lot. But the models are completely different so that doesn't mean anything.

I do like having a relatively big backyard. Room for a pool and a big bird cage and still a good amount of grass behind. The driveway is really short, but its wide. Can easily fit two cars and a golf cart across, so nothing needs to be shuffled.

No worries, the developer has an army of attorneys that slice and dice their risk, and separate any liabilities between many different business entities. I most certainly don’t blame them for that, I would also if in their position. A bigger worry would be if that wasn’t the case, then their competence would be in question. That being said, a legitimate concern should be the fallout from the whole Villages Health disaster, and the future of quality accessible health care in a rapidly growing senior citizen community.

they have cut back on courses in the south and the maintenance of these courses has gone astray, JMHO

Failing? Do not think so. Their expertise is developing land and they are doing well. They have 0 interest after that. Surprised that they still own golf courses. They are not great money makers

They appear to be selling close to 15 homes a week when you look at the names on the sales boards?

They're adding lots of golf in the Eastport areas.

The courses are more "linear" which allows more golf view lots at $250K a pop.

Following is just the executives.

Two New Executive Courses for You to Enjoy

WOW!!!!!!! Why do some of you continue to live here if you are so angry about everything?

I see questioning from myself and others but not anger.

MBA business course historical analysis is that family businesses seldom succeed as well as the founder after starting with the second generation or founders grandkids. By about the second generation, the interest and desire and skill is not there, and this is when outside management is considered.

TV could be different, but i suspect that there is a third generation which might be the last direct descendants to run the business. . just from my education. . . i am speculating from a position of historical probability

Many of them don't...............they are just on this site.

:beer3:

0 interest?

They're the largest Commercial property owners in mid-Florida and they're as smart or smarter, than most anyone else in that business.

& the golf courses are cash cows. Their return on investment on the golf courses, is staggering.

There you go.

That's exactly what's probably happening.

Gary Morse was a "one man band".

Then it was his 3 children and responsibility was divided amongst them.

They're getting older and less interested in the day to day.

This is when the trouble starts.

This won't mean anything to most here, but I'm sure Coach knows how to spell "DeMoulas".

You have me curious, how do you know that? Are you privy to the financials?

Wow, that would be amazing if true, and I assume it is or you would not have said it. Most golf courses are not profitable.

Because of my irrational attraction to golf, I have, on three separate occasions in my life, looked into buying a golf course, and got to the point of receiving financials. In each case they were terrible. Of course these were not in the Villages. Its nice to hear that some are making good money.

I don't need to see the financials. I know what it costs to run golf courses and golf course revenue in TV, is basically public information. You can look at the Tee Sheets and see how many Tee Times are sold and interpolate revenue.

To say nothing of the fact, the Developer (who's very smart) kept building courses, right through the bad times and we're now in the biggest golf boom since the late 90's.

Pre-Covid, golf courses were selling for about 1 times revenue. These days, golf courses are running 4-6 times revenue. Obvious every case is different, but it's a pretty good business these days.

Gots to agree with you.

When they sell the championship courses, Villagers will be shocked at the price.
(mostly with a captive customer base)

that would be one of those secondary effects which might impact one's current lifestyle.
:bigbow::agree:

:cus::cus::cus:

Every resident of TV has a contract with the DEVELOPER
 

Like it or not, enforced or not, if you own a home you have a contract with the developer.
The deed may have been Xeroxed 10 times and be almost unreadable but it is still a contract with the DEVELOPER.
Every other aspect of TV, except for the public roads, is controlled by the developer or their sycophants.
If the developer fails who will anoint the members of the boards that control the rec centers?
With the tail end of the boomers reaching retirement age and the front edge dropping dead the business model is in jeopardy.

Then don't buy it! Many people ARE buying them, since they don't want the big (unusable) front yards...

I've got about 15' of back yard from the back of my lanai. I would have gladly given up a few feet of my front yard to have more yard in the back...

Luckily, the street behind me is a cul-de-sac and I don't have inyone directly behiind me. Just the side yards of my back yard neighbors...

Unless you have a land yacht, or a huge truck, that isn't a problem...

Me thinks you're exaggerating just a bit...

They are building multiple executive and championship courses south of 44. Patience grasshopper..

They always in the past built the golf courses first not after the developed housing areas. The newer generations are not as interested in golf which brings Eastport. Believe what you want but the golf course are not as profitable as people think and the upkeep is a ginormous expense.
The maintenance of these courses has fell by the waste side and now the villages is directly managing the maintenance now and got rid of the management company years ago!

Always open the courses first
 

The Villages always opens the golf courses before homes are purchased or built. It removes the liability of golf ball damage from the golfers.

Really? How much is "ginourmous" in dollars?

If they're "not as profitable as people think", how much do they make? How much is the revenue? Expenses? Fixed costs. Please enlighten us.


The Villages directly manage the maintenance of what golf courses?

Other than the newer courses in South, the maintenance of all the other Championship Golf Courses was contracted out to one of (3-4) companies, as of last year.

I guess the sales pitch “the build out nearly complete” better buy now not tactic/sales pitch point any more?

And that still happens. The new course in Wellpoint / Oak Hollow was nearly complete before the first house was built. Same with Laurel Oak. The new course south of Bexley Trail is being built now, and there are no homes there.

Yes yes I know that this is not what some want to hear. However, you are welcome to take a drive down Bexley and have a look for yourself.

I definitely never got that sales pitch. It was more like " the villages owns land pretty much as far as you can see, and they plan to keep building indefinitely"

Difference between a very new residents perspective and sales pitch versus the experience of much more seasoned residents. Based on the above referenced TOTV join date, it’s a newbie’s perspective.

There is at least one other long thread about that.

Golf courses and golfers are not liable for unintentional damage to homes along a golf course. That *might* be one of the documents signed at closing.

Well I guess if you say it in caps then it must be true.

You Don’t engage with the golfer…On the property that you chose to purchase knowing there will be damages at some point. If the golfer chooses an offer it’s kind of them, because they are not responsible according to insurance adjusters.

Up north all the years living on Oakland Hills, if a member or their guest hit into a home, the caddy would leave information for the homeowner. Most homeowners would just take care of the damage themselves.

It may be how you were raised, but Florida law protects golfers due to presumption of risk which homeowners assume when living on a golf course.

It was removed by the Home Owner, when they purchased a home on a golf course and assumed the inherent risk associated with living on a golf course.

No different than folks who buy homes near airports or prisons ... they assume the risk.

They always sell. Always have. They start it up, then sell it.

I don't think anybody is finding a statute talking about golf and stating that a golfer is or is not liable for damage caused by a wayward shot. Its a case law thing.

I wish I had access to actual cases, but I don't. I am not a lawyer and would not know where to look. AI and many internet articles say that the golfer is not usually liable, if we are talking specifically about hitting a house built on the golf course. And its not just a Florida concept. It is the same in all 50 states or at least all the ones I have played golf in. Personally, if I broke somebody's window I would volunteer to pay for it. But that is just my choice. I don't think they would win a lawsuit against me.

The real liability starts when you have a roadway along the course and golfers can possibly hit passing cars. I don't think we have that situation in the villages. But it can be a real nail biter, and you are liable there.

Why would a roadway have relief from crappy golfers but individual homeowners none?

Because passing motorists don't assume the risk of being hit by golf balls just by driving down a public road that passes a golf course. But homeowner's who build or buy homes on golf courses do.

At least that is what the internet says.

BTW its not all crappy golfers. Good golfers hit the ball long and powerfully and still sometimes slice and hook it. They may hit fewer bad shots, but when they do it can be a doozy.