New conspiracy theory is introduced for debate…………

I'm walking around with aluminum foil on my head.

New user name

Same old agenda:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

You are right. My agenda is, and always has been, trying to clean up the cesspool that existed for years at the Developer-controlled County Commission to the detriment of the residents.

But I am not the issue here. How about sticking to it?

Now's your chance. Maybe you can run for one of the two soon to be open Council seats. Then you can be the Sweetheart Deal Killer.

I have no political ambitions and don't live in either Gilpin's or Breeden's district. Hopefully Republican challengers, who are independent of the Developer, will emerge before the next primary.

But, it will collect tax dollars which will pay for it 10 fold.

Why——not.

I read that article too. I came from a County on the Coast in FL with impact fees raised for sewer.

Think of it like this: You own a Yugo (old poor Sumter County) and you decide to buy a Ferrari (new Sumter County that isn't a poverty palace). Then the County decides to charge you 150% in impact fees for buying the Ferrari. You decide not to buy the Ferrari. Now you and the County have nothing but what was already there. You have to PAY the impact fee before you even GET that car. However if the impact fee isn't there then improvements can be taxed or paid over time (like the Bond we pay which is basically a loan we got without even having to qualify for it) .

In my old County (Brevard) I was in a new house on sewer. Other new houses literally next door were being built and required an impact fee for sewer. All of the new houses sought an exemption and requested to put in septic tanks or they wouldn't build. The County, instead of granting an impact fee waiver, allowed septic tanks two doors down from the sewer system. Not one new house in area was added to the sewer system in the three years I was there - all of them installed septic systems. Why? Impact fees were between $20k & $35k and homeowners and builders refused to build without the septic tank being waived in.

Local governments become filled with people who just want to get to retirement and get a pension. From my experience, you start seeing a lot of fat guys in County pickup trucks who cannot wait for lunch to roll around. Nothing of substance gets done.

The Developer is WAAAAAAY better than what seems to be shaping up on the Sumter County Commissioners Board or other counties.

Too bad. If you would be just as entertaining on the County Commission as you are on TOTV, I'd certainly vote for you:)

Exactly, looking beyond the Villages boarders shows what this atea would need like without competent long term planned development.

The impact fee fiasco illustrates what it would have taken to get county approval for the bonds to build the charter school education complex?l.

It is a company town and that's a major reason I retired here.

:ho: Thank you. Exactly how we feel. We like clean, we like rules, we like order, and mostly we like how the Morse family does things. We wonder if some of the complainers moved here because they didn't like the way things were done and figured they could spend what ever time they had left just bitching about things and it would make their days seem longer because they were sooooo unhappy.
I may not be a retired lawyer like Mr.Fenstermaker...... but I know my taxes are lower now compared to my first years here. After 17 years full time I have no complaints. :coolsmiley:

Don’t hold your breath waiting for what you’re hoping for. After watching the new commissioners get repeatedly slandered, strong armed, accused of crimes, and having their lives generally made miserable, who in their right mind would want to follow in their footsteps. Mission accomplished, the emperor has spoken!

//////

I am afraid you may be right.

Welcome to TOTY. We got high bonds and a big property tax hike. It was about the developer and the prior commissioners raising property taxes to pay for the roads in the developers new project South of 44.

Most people don't realize that the issue is not just new county roads. The Developer pays for 40% of his county roads and zero percent for his other county infrastructure like libraries, police and fire stations and equipment, government buildings and equipment, and jail expansion. This is why he wants to maintain control of the County Commission.

I believe that is 40% of the maximum justifiable charge, which doesn't necessarily equate to actual cost.

Can road impact fees be legally spent on any of the things you mention? And are you sure the developer didn't build the Villages fire stations (that's an honest question, I don't know).

Not saying the developer isn't getting a good deal, they are, but Sumter County and Wildwood are definitely benefiting also. They benefit directly from the increasing number of tax payers and indirectly from the increasing number of customers in local businesses. Everybody seems to be winning at the moment.

I believe The Developer builds the Fire Stations and then turns them over to the district for $0. The only stipulation is that they must remain a fire station.
Goldwingnut has stated this numerous times.

I'd like to see the planning for how the county will manage the incremental property taxes the county will collect as a result of expansion.

The following model is very conservative considering the current higher rate of construction and increase in average sell price of new homes.

Estimate they're closer to 5,000 homes per year@ $350K+ sell price currently. At that rate, the county will collect over $100M in incremental tax revenue before the roads completed the next 5 years

This is a difficult question for the current commissioners…………this would require future planning.

Very True..........some posters just post crap and lies.

complain all you like, it's still way cheaper than the northern state from which you came. everybody happy :)

There's nothing wrong with a healthy discussion about things that affect everybody's bottom line. If you include the bond and that groceries and contractors are more expensive it's a dead heat.

Not Even Close.

This will help you.

Cost Of Living Comparison

Other than a few groceries, imported beer and leatheriness shoes, TV is about 25-50% cheaper than where I currently live...

You don’t live in TV?

The Developer's Daily Sun is certainly continuing its unrelenting attack on Commissioners Estep, Miller and Search, who were elected to increase the Developer's sweetheart impact fee and roll back our 25% property-tax increase. That increase was enacted by the predecessors of Estep, Miller, and Search in order to subsidize the Developer's sweetheart impact fee-- which is about 5% of what he would pay in Collier County.

Which might explain why the Villages are primarily in Sumter County and not Collier County. Since I prefer being here rather than on the coast this has worked out well for me.

By the way, you neglected to work the words "massive" and "puppet" into your post.

Not yet full time. We're still "Snowflakes" (we come and go as often as possible), but I'm still working on my exit strategy so I can become a "Frog"...

I should have posted "currently live, most of the time"... I'm working on selling my practice and then we'll sell the house here (just outside DC, in Maryland) and y'all can enjoy my presence full time! LOL!

If you are okay with subsidizing the Developer's business with your property-tax dollars, I can't argue with you.

By the way, do you really think that the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages, which was facilitated by his puppet Commissioners and is being subsidized by the current residents, is good for the current residents? :icon_wink:

Are you sure about that? Aren't they sold to the district along with the rest of the district infrastructure? Have you found a deed where they are conveyed free of charge?

Those fees are passed on to new home buyers.

With the more than 50% increases in home costs the past year, are you OK with new home buyers paying close to double what you are paying in property taxes for the same home? And you want to tax them even more for the privilege to do so?

No, the houses are now priced at the highest level that market conditions will allow. Businesses cannot simply pass all their costs on to buyers, otherwise no business would go bankrupt, especially if the costs are not incurred by all the the business's competitors.

Yes, housing prices would increase to some extent, and I am perfectly fine with that. Then the new residents AND the Developer, who are responsible for the new county infrastructure, would be paying for it, instead of us current residents. Remember, with the new-home buyers no longer paying for the Developer's subsequent county infrastructure through higher property taxes, they would recoup some or all of the higher home price. Better yet, the value of the houses of the current residents would increase correspondingly.

I know this is complicated, but think: If the Developer could simply pass on 100% of higher impact fees and not take a profit hit, do you seriously think he would have paid Hage $350,000.14 and would have fought so hard to keep his Commission puppets in office?

BTW, what makes you think that home prices around here went up 50% in the past year??

:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Love You Guacamole, Love ya.

:cryin2::cryin2::cryin2:

But the developer cannot pass 100% of the higher impact fees on to the buyer. What seems to be frequently disregarded is the impact fees apply to not only to the construction of homes but also to the construction of commercial property.

The additional cost to the home might be about $1,500 which could easily be added to the price of a home in the Villages. Heck, between inflation, the bond, and various state fees and taxes, $4,000 would be lost in the noise.

Commercial property is a different story. There are threads on here asking when a BJs or Costco or whatever might be coming to the area. According to one of the documents analyzing the 2019 study, increasing the impact fee would add $500,000 to the cost of the building for a total of $835,000 in impact fees. A hospital would incur about $1,000,000 in additional impact fees.

While $1,500 might not affect the sale of a home, an additional $500,000 is very likely to affect the profitability of the Costco and may result in it not being built in the first place (not that it seems to be coming soon anyway). I appreciate having businesses and hospitals either in or close to the Villages. I would like lower taxes too, but if an extra $300 per year maintains the lifestyle I enjoy then yes, I am willing to pay it.

:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Yes

How did you calculate $500,000? We don't know what the commercial properties would pay without an impact study, which Hage's legislation essentially blocks.

In any event, you are correct that new commercial property would be initially somewhat more expensive, but the businesses occupying it would subsequently pay less in property taxes.

Bottom line: somebody has to pay for the new county infrastructure, and I argue that that somebody should be the developers and new residents-- not us current residents. The 25% property-tax increase shows clearly what is going on here-- which is the current residents subsidizing the Developer-- it is he who is doing virtually all the new building. That is what the voters of Sumter County decided, by a 2-to-1 margin, in last year's County Commission election.

As I have said elsewhere, if you don't mind, in essence, writing a check each year to the Developer in the amount of your tax increase, I can't argue with you over property taxes and impact fees. However, I don't think higher impact fees, combined with lower property taxes, would slow growth-- it would just reallocate the costs thereof.

I'm surprised you don't have that information. What are you basing your comments on if you haven't reviewed the impact fee documentation?

There are two sources for the $500,000 number though in the end they both come down to the same 2019 Impact Fee Study.

1. The Sumter County Impact Fee Schedule shows $3,356 per 1,000 sq ft for a Discount Club. Assuming a 100,000 sq ft Costco, that comes to $335,600. If we assume your 40% number is correct, at 100% it would come to a total of $839,000 or about $500,000 in additional fees.

2. There were several documents created in conjunction with the 2019 Impact Fee Study. One of those documents is a comparison of current fees at 40%, fees at 100%, and fees from several surrounding counties. The 40% and 100% numbers match the $335,600 and $839,000 numbers and therefore the $500,000 in additional fees.

I don't have the background to argue whether $500,00 in additional fees would keep Costco from coming here or whether $1,000,000 in additional fees would stop a hospital project. But until someone with the background cares to comment, I'll believe that those numbers are large enough to cause second thoughts and slow growth.