Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 848772)

I called the article a piece of ridiculousness with the talk of sheep and sheepdogs. Let the trained police officers do their jobs.

What about the alleged claim of 6 per 100,000 per year murders? I have not seen 24 murders in The Villages in the 4 years I have lived here. What about the claim of 4 per 1000 aggravated assaults per year? I have not seen 1600 in the 4 years.

Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 848936)

Chief, I take it you choose not to carry. That's your choice, and I respect it. I don't know how much your decision was affected by the red tape in New Jersey. (Nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there...........snow and all that.)

But if you are now a resident of Florida you can ignore what New Jersey thinks (except for magazine capacity restrictions if you go back there.)

You have the required photo ID from your agency; all you need is a certification that you have qualified TO FLORIDA STANDARDS in the preceding 12 months, and you are compliant with LEOSA.

If you should decide you want to go to the range and get certified, let me know and we will locate the nearest authorized range so you can get it done. You only need 40 rounds to qualify. If you are willing to drive a couple of hours away I know where you can get it done for no cost.

An alternative is to get a Florida Concealed Weapons License. Florida has reciprocity agreements with 33 other states (and a license is not required in Vermont, making 34). The main states excluded are in New England, the Midwest and the West Coast. As you would expect, there is no reciprocity with New Jersey.

In fact, New Jersey even limits the number of rounds out-of-state active duty, and retired, officers may carry in their pistols. Strange............

There are advantages to being LEOSA compliant and having a Florida CCW license for varying situations, but that's a story for another time.

Best wishes Chief,

Carl

Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 849076)

How many murders and aggravated assaults per year would you and the colonel say should be the average for The Villages per year? I can recall one murder back around 2007, I believe.

Anyhow, would a trained police officer pump 6 or 7 9mm shots at a robber in a crowded grocery store and acknowledge only 2 hit the robber? One bullet hit a leg and one hit the forehead. Kind of a wide shot grouping, isn't it? How does a robber flee the store after being shot in the forehead with a 9mm? If it was only a grazing wound, that bullet continued it's flight. Very foolish to do, don't you agree?

Leave the cowboy heroics to the trained police officers.

:popcorn:

Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 849206)

Alas, it has become painfully evident that you do not read the material presented to you with perception.

1. The low murder rate in The Villages is exactly the Colonel's point "that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another." Don't you get that?

2. The news account regarding the convenience store shooting says that the "highly agitated" armed robber "pointed the shotgun" at the CCW holder, who "feared for his life." What would you have had him do, wait until the robber shot him at close range with a shotgun?

Included in the news account is a statement from the Milwaukee County District Attorney: "He disrupted an act that potentially exposed himself and others to great bodily harm," Chisholm said. Video footage from the store showed "he acted reasonably and in a controlled manner during the encounter," Chisholm said. "Reasonably and in a controlled manner." Get it?

3. Your almost childlike faith in how much better a "trained police officer" would perform in such circumstances is touching, but misplaced. It is one thing to stand up and punch holes in a piece of cardboard on a pistol range; it is entirely different to be in an armed confrontation in which you are in grave danger of being injured or killed. No one knows in advance how he will perform under such a stress.

It may have escaped your notice, but "trained police officers" are wounded or killed in armed confrontations all too often.

I have lost friends and comrades to line of duty injury and death.

Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 849206)

Alas, it has become painfully evident that you do not read the material presented to you with perception.

1. The low murder rate in The Villages is exactly the Colonel's point "that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another." Don't you get that?

2. The news account regarding the convenience store shooting says that the "highly agitated" armed robber "pointed the shotgun" at the CCW holder, who "feared for his life." What would you have had him do, wait until the robber shot him at close range with a shotgun?

Included in the news account is a statement from the Milwaukee County District Attorney: "He disrupted an act that potentially exposed himself and others to great bodily harm," Chisholm said. Video footage from the store showed "he acted reasonably and in a controlled manner during the encounter," Chisholm said. "Reasonably and in a controlled manner." Get it?

3. Your almost childlike faith in how much better a "trained police officer" would perform in such circumstances is touching, but misplaced. It is one thing to stand up and punch holes in a piece of cardboard on a pistol range; it is entirely different to be in an armed confrontation in which you are in grave danger of being injured or killed. No one knows in advance how he will perform under such a stress.

It may have escaped your notice, but "trained police officers" are wounded or killed in armed confrontations all too often.

I have lost friends and comrades to line of duty injury and death.

Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 849238)

A well-intentioned civilian playing John Wayne can cause more harm to bystanders than the robber. Obviously, the civilian was not too good of a shot to hit his target with a two shot grouping of 5 feet. Only 2 of 7 bullets hit the target and the robber still left the store on his own power.

Anyhow, you and I will never agree so 'nuff said on this topic for me.
:ohdear:
:popcorn:

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 849218)

Carl, prayers for an easy recovery. Keep the faith.
Kitty

Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 849246)

The 4 or 5 stray 9mm bullets could have very easily killed bystanders in the super market. I doubt if the police would have shot in such a situation.

Anyhow, 'nuff said on this topic for me.

Best wishes for a great recovery from the back surgery.

Buggy

Originally Posted by ilovetv (Post 849262)

IF you'd watch the Video interview (in the linked article) of the man who defended the cashier, himself, his wife, and the others from a lunatic waving a SHOTGUN at them, you would see the CCW man explain how there was only one person in line between himself and the robber waving the shotgun, and the CCW carrier was able to make eye contact with that man to signal for him to step back and away from the robber. This man understood what the CCW carrier wanted to do to defend them, and he got out of the line of fire exactly as was needed.

What kind of cold-blooded brother, husband or father of that lady cashier would demand that this CCW carrier do NOTHING to help her, when he COULD help her, and help her safely--as he did???

And by the way, Aldi is not an all-night "convenience" store. It is a supermarket owned by the same company as Trader Joes, and we have two Aldi stores here. A loser with a shotgun could show up and do the same thing at any store, anywhere in TV or elsewhere.

See video interview with CCW carrier, under the headline and on the left side:

Aldi customer won't be charged in shooting

Originally Posted by chiefrose (Post 849342)

Carl:

Hope you have a speedy and successful recovery.

Rich