Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 2222434)

You could never be a Christian then. The whole point of that religion is that a rabbi made a lot of statements that were unpopular to the local government, and riled up what amounts to a peace and love rally that really got under their skin. So they vilified him and flogged him over 100 times, then forced him to carry his own cross to the place of his death, where he was then nailed to the cross, his hands and feet bound, with a crown of thorns on his head, and made to die slowly, up there on that cross. He suffered as a sacrifice for the sins of everyone else.

And now we have all these christians glorifying this sacrifice with bloody-painted statues of jesus hanging from crosses over the bedrooms of America.

That's just Christianity. Other religions have similar.

It's why I reject the religiosity of my upbringing, but embrace the cultural, ethnic, and traditional aspects of Judiaism instead.

Originally Posted by Blackbird45 (Post 2222459)

This is not hypothetical my wife died on Friday.
It was not unexpected she was under hospice care for weeks, but the final five days the only thing she was living on was morphine and oxygen.
She laid there barely beathing with her mouth open.
As far as I was concerned, she passed way before her last breath.
I don't know if she was in pain or not because she was long pass communication.
I was glad she passed because she did not need to go through this anymore.
I don't understand our society, we see our pets suffering and we put them to sleep to end their suffering, but we're perfectly find letting humans go through this agony.

Originally Posted by Michael 61 (Post 2222504)

As a Bible-believing Christian, I believe in the sanctity of life - both the unborn and the elderly. I do believe (and have seen with my parents and relatives as they passed), that God gives Christians the strength and ability to endure the pain/struggles that often occur at the end of life.

Originally Posted by ThirdOfFive (Post 2222329)

Agree totally. Often that is the last truly informed decision a person can make, and it seems criminal to take that opportunity away.

Mom did it right. At 85 he was a recent cancer survivor (surgery took a lot out of her), living with a bad heart (triple bypass and a pacemaker) and severe arthritis and accompanying ambulation problems meant that she was basically non-ambulatory except for a few steps now and again. Fortunately her mind was unimpaired. One day she took a tumble and suffered a compound fracture of both leg bones just above the ankle. She knew she'd never walk again, and on top of her other issues she decided she'd had enough. She and my sister, whom she lived with at the time, discussed everything and Mom decided to call the pacemaker company and have them turn it off. Let nature take it's course. Next morning, she was dead.

I hope I have those kinds of guts and clarity of thinking, when it becomes my turn.

Originally Posted by bsloan1960 (Post 2222343)

I worked in hospitals and nursing homes my entire career. I've watched perhaps a thousand people die of terminal illnesses- some of which were horrific.

The battle cry of opponents of Assisted Suicide is to claim that "Effective Pain Management" will give the person a comfortable journey through their battle. The only times I've seen Effective Pain Management is in the final days or hours of life. Doctors are reluctant to give people adequate doses of pain killers because OTHER advocates, such as Social Workers, scrutinize their decisions and claim that people who are "Over Medicated" are in a daze and this affects the quality of their life.

Some oppose assisted suicide for religious reasons- If your religion tells you to suffer in horrible pain then go ahead. But your religion should dictate how I should bring an end to my agony.

I've watch patients slowly suffocate to death. I've had countless patients beg for more medication, and some beg me to kill them. This is the real world of hospitals and nursing homes folks. It isn't like the television ads and brochures. When you drive by a nursing home you should be aware that there is likely horrible suffering inside.

Originally Posted by scooterstang (Post 2222666)

The real big problem is if you do commit suicide then your life insurance is normally voided out.

Originally Posted by Blackbird45 (Post 2222459)

This is not hypothetical my wife died on Friday.
It was not unexpected she was under hospice care for weeks, but the final five days the only thing she was living on was morphine and oxygen.
She laid there barely beathing with her mouth open.
As far as I was concerned, she passed way before her last breath.
I don't know if she was in pain or not because she was long pass communication.
I was glad she passed because she did not need to go through this anymore.
I don't understand our society, we see our pets suffering and we put them to sleep to end their suffering, but we're perfectly find letting humans go through this agony.

Originally Posted by lindaelane (Post 2222512)

Honest question after doctors and nurses sometimes withheld prescribed pain medicine from my mother before hospice, but not after (her particular hospice had no social workers for the 4 days she was in hospice):

Originally Posted by bsloan1960 (Post 2222688)

Some people have at-home hospice care where nurses and doctors concentrate on comfort and pain relief without oversight by people who have advanced degrees in questioning doctor's decisions. Most hospice care is provided in a nursing home by Nursing Home Staff and Doctors- The same staff and doctors that are caring for you before your Status is changed to Hospice.

Your nursing home care changes very little- with the Hospice status being mostly a bookkeeping designation. For the most part you will continue to get the same medications and dosages you did before your status change. Increased medication will usually occur only in the final days of your life. Again- doctor's hands are tied by social workers and state and federal agencies that do yearly inspections and insist that a patient who is "Snowed" by pain medication is being denied quality of life.

I watched this happen 99% of the time over my 50 year career.

Originally Posted by chrisinva (Post 2222576)

Religious Groups’ Views on End-of-Life Issues | Pew Research Center - What an excellent, clear, informative resource with additionals links & references for more info. Thank you very much!

Originally Posted by scooterstang (Post 2222666)

The real big problem is if you do commit suicide then your life insurance is normally voided out.

Originally Posted by Jerry101 (Post 2222612)

By faith Christians believe … the cross is empty … Jesus Christ did indeed die for our sins … he was buried … but God raised him from the dead … and He gave US the great commission to tell that story! He will come again in glory … and EVERY knee will bow and EVERY tongue will confess that he is LORD!

… that is Christianity!

Originally Posted by Jerry101 (Post 2222612)

By faith Christians believe … the cross is empty … Jesus Christ did indeed die for our sins … he was buried … but God raised him from the dead … and He gave US the great commission to tell that story! He will come again in glory … and EVERY knee will bow and EVERY tongue will confess that he is LORD!

… that is Christianity!

Originally Posted by PersonOfInterest (Post 2222752)

Christians will suffer and endure the pain and be happy to do so. The family of those suffering should be willing to suffer along with the ailing member of the family. God knows how much pain and suffering he wants you to endure. He will take you when he is ready for you. It is not your place to interfere with his timing of your departure. You may pray during your suffering and seek a miracle recovery. God will listen and may grant that miracle if there is sufficient supportive prayer and a compelling request.

Originally Posted by Blackbird45 (Post 2222459)

This is not hypothetical my wife died on Friday.
It was not unexpected she was under hospice care for weeks, but the final five days the only thing she was living on was morphine and oxygen.
She laid there barely beathing with her mouth open.
As far as I was concerned, she passed way before her last breath.
I don't know if she was in pain or not because she was long pass communication.
I was glad she passed because she did not need to go through this anymore.
I don't understand our society, we see our pets suffering and we put them to sleep to end their suffering, but we're perfectly find letting humans go through this agony.

Originally Posted by scooterstang (Post 2222666)

The real big problem is if you do commit suicide then your life insurance is normally voided out.

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2222730)

Still waiting for him to "come again in glory". Don't think it will happen. Hasn't happened so far.

Originally Posted by SusanStCatherine (Post 2222615)

A relative of mine living in Florida was diagnosed with end stage pancreatic cancer. She decided against chemo. Her doctor would not prescribe medical marajuana for some reason and I found this rediculous. Someone obtained and gave her the medical marajuana. She seemed so much more comfortable and even happy on it. She even lived longer than the doctor said she would - don't think he ever knew. Be your own health care advocate, do research, try different things, and don't be afraid to switch doctors.

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 2222817)

I’m not sure who started the idea of sadistic goodness, that there is something holy about suffering, but I don’t think it came from the Creator because all living things try to avoid suffering.

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2222730)

Still waiting for him to "come again in glory". Don't think it will happen. Hasn't happened so far.

Originally Posted by PersonOfInterest (Post 2222752)

Christians will suffer and endure the pain and be happy to do so. The family of those suffering should be willing to suffer along with the ailing member of the family. God knows how much pain and suffering he wants you to endure. He will take you when he is ready for you. It is not your place to interfere with his timing of your departure. You may pray during your suffering and seek a miracle recovery. God will listen and may grant that miracle if there is sufficient supportive prayer and a compelling request.

Originally Posted by Tvflguy (Post 2222324)

A thought came upon me when reading about the apparent recent TV murder and suicide.

As I age, I can perceive a time when an elderly person receives the "terminal" news from docs. And close to "the end point" enduring extreme pain as your body, and perhaps mind, slowly declines.

Provided some serious meds to alleviate some of that pain, but still. And the inevitable continues - many days or weeks with your family watching no quality of LIFE impacting your loved one laying there. Enduring rough emotions and expending $$$$$.

My choice at that point would be an understanding with loved ones that I CHOOSE to determine the time and method of my End when I want to. When there is absolutely NO hope. And possibly "live out" the inevitable in a coma/vegetative state or such. IMO NOT fair to ME or the Family. MY Choice would be a Dignified end of life. Our society endures so much which endangers healthy life. We should have a law that provides for a dignified death within strict regulations. period.

There are several USA states that passed a Bill covering this. Florida, not yet.

Originally Posted by bsloan1960 (Post 2222681)

I'm so sorry for your loss and the painful experiences you endured with your wife's illness.

Originally Posted by Nellmack (Post 2222806)

I'm very sorry for your loss and thanks for sharing. I went through a similar situation and it's not easy.

Originally Posted by SallyB (Post 2222595)

I am so sorry for your loss.
I agree with you, we should be able to say enough is enough. When a horse breaks its leg, it is put down immediately no matter the value of the horse and yet humans are left to suffer.
Again, I am very sorry about your wife.

Originally Posted by Sandy and Ed (Post 2222873)

Totally agree. Many have no family members to monitor their care in nursing homes. Humane painless death a better way to go. Hell even death row inmates leave this world more humanely than a slow death in a nursing home surrounded by strangers

Originally Posted by scooterstang (Post 2222666)

The real big problem is if you do commit suicide then your life insurance is normally voided out.

Originally Posted by PersonOfInterest (Post 2222752)

Christians will suffer and endure the pain and be happy to do so. The family of those suffering should be willing to suffer along with the ailing member of the family. God knows how much pain and suffering he wants you to endure. He will take you when he is ready for you. It is not your place to interfere with his timing of your departure. You may pray during your suffering and seek a miracle recovery. God will listen and may grant that miracle if there is sufficient supportive prayer and a compelling request.

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 2223370)

Your god has already granted you a miracle. He gave humans the minds with which they could develop science, and remedies, and relief of pain, in addition to all that he provided through nature's bounty. He gave humans the decision-making processes necessary to determine whether or not they should be forced to endure suffering, and the ability to end it whenever they wanted, so long as they were unfettered and physically capable of doing so. And if that wasn't enough, he gave humans opposable thumbs and language, so they would write down or record their wishes, should there come a time when they would want their lives ended but be physically incapable of carrying out their decisions on their own.

You choose to ignore all that god has given you, in exchange for something you read in a book that may or may not have been written by anyone sane, over 1500 years ago.

Enjoy your suffering. When the time comes, if I feel I can't endure any more. I'll ask to be released from life.

Originally Posted by Tvflguy (Post 2222324)

A thought came upon me when reading about the apparent recent TV murder and suicide.

As I age, I can perceive a time when an elderly person receives the "terminal" news from docs. And close to "the end point" enduring extreme pain as your body, and perhaps mind, slowly declines.

Provided some serious meds to alleviate some of that pain, but still. And the inevitable continues - many days or weeks with your family watching no quality of LIFE impacting your loved one laying there. Enduring rough emotions and expending $$$$$.

My choice at that point would be an understanding with loved ones that I CHOOSE to determine the time and method of my End when I want to. When there is absolutely NO hope. And possibly "live out" the inevitable in a coma/vegetative state or such. IMO NOT fair to ME or the Family. MY Choice would be a Dignified end of life. Our society endures so much which endangers healthy life. We should have a law that provides for a dignified death within strict regulations. period.

There are several USA states that passed a Bill covering this. Florida, not yet.

Originally Posted by PersonOfInterest (Post 2222752)

Christians will suffer and endure the pain and be happy to do so. The family of those suffering should be willing to suffer along with the ailing member of the family. God knows how much pain and suffering he wants you to endure. He will take you when he is ready for you. It is not your place to interfere with his timing of your departure. You may pray during your suffering and seek a miracle recovery. God will listen and may grant that miracle if there is sufficient supportive prayer and a compelling request.