[NJblue]

We met with a LTC salesman a few months ago and went through the process of qualifying for Long Term Care insurance at what he claims are the "lowest rates available" due to our "incredible" health (did I mention that he was a salesman?) Despite these "low" rates, they still seem pretty high to me and I'm not sure of its value. I am wondering whether it is the right thing to do to commit to payments of this sort for the rest of our lives. On the other hand, I can see the risk of not having it and if one or both of us end up needing to stay in a long term care facility (or have in-home care).

What is the collective wisdom about LTC among the TOTV community? Are you grasshoppers or ants?

[JohnN]

I don't have LTC insurance, it is very costly.
My family tends to die quick and none has ever needed long term care, so I figure it's a play on hereditary. Insurance is insurance, great when you need it and worthless when you don't. Tough call these days.

[Peazoup]

I also had a meeting with a Long Term Health Care Insurance person. At our age, it's extremely expensive. Statistics show that IF you ever will need it, it will only be for an average of 6 weeks. You either get better or you die. I've told my kids that if they want their inheritance, they had better get used to the idea of looking after me if, God forbid, I can't look after myself. My family also have historically been able to look after themselves in their latter years. It's a roll of the dice. I've decided to risk it. I know, it's a hard decision.

We also have a LTC policy. It is a difficult insurance product to evaluate - the need for it as well as the cost of it. The way we looked at it was that the ones that definitely do not need it are those that (1) cannot afford it to begin with, and (2) those that have a large enough net worth to not need the benefit to keep from significantly eroding the value of their estate to their heirs or their surviving spouse. Those in the middle need to consider it for their heirs and beneficiaries, if not for the their own needs should their LTC needs be lengthy. If the cost of LTC uses up a significant part of ones net worth for either one spouse or two, then the cost of the LTC policy most likely would be worth the investment. If you are concerned about paying the premiums and then not getting to use the benefits (because you die before going into a facility), most carriers offer a rider that will pay back unused premiums - at additional cost, of course. We felt like, as a matter of dignity, we did not want our kids to have to take care of us, if we need it. It is true that its is pricey, and the younger you are when you enroll, the better price you get. No, I'm not an insurance agent or salesman, but I spend a lot of time investigating the same questions you have about this.

[WSOX47]

I think that it really depends on your level of Risk tolerance and your Health (and Family health history) coupled with your assets. You should note that Medicare will not really be a source for coverage for Nursing home stays. For Nursing Home expenses, they pay on a very limited and very short term basis as Medicare was not funded to be LTC insurance (must be a Skilled level of care, and there are caps on days of coverage). A full year in a typical Nursing Home can cost between $50 - $80K, probably more in the $70K range. While not a happy thought, the realty is that most people who stay beyond a few days/weeks for recouping, usually do not live more than 18 months in a Nursing Home.
So one line of reasoning is to compare the Premiums to what you can afford to be self-insured, using about $50k as an average (less than a year there). If you can afford the $50k to use IF you were ever to use a Nursing Home, and can tolerate that "Risk'' level, that may be the better choice. Remember, there are public programs that may pay the facilities, if you qualify as one with very limited remaining assets (generally your home is not in the limit but the limit is very small, a few $Ks). One of those is the Federally supported (with also basic quality requirements), but state adminsitered, Medicaid Program. Most people in TV probably would need to consult an adviser regarding the Spend-Down of assets to qualify for Medicaid Long Term Coverage.

If you do decide to get coverage, one feature that is mentioned as being critical is the escalation/inflation factor for Benefits. Obviously, the risk of inflation erodingthe Benefit is greater if you take the policy in your mid-50s than in your late-60s. Your own guess on when and if and for how long you'd need is proably as good as anyone's else once you look at some of the overall stats, especially those of your own family.

Hope this helps. It's just my opinion based on some research and experiences discussed with others. I'm personally takingthe gamble that IF I need one that it would not be for many months an dthat either I'll have the wherewithall to pay , or be very able to qualify for Medicaid, or similar, coverage.

And just to get an idea of facilities, you may want to do some research there, too. Many facilities have separate wings for Private-Pay/Medicare Coverage and one for Medicaid Coverage.

[billethkid]

When you investigate be sure to ask whether the product your evaluating has a home care alternative.
While it is pricey, it's like any other insurance, you pay but really hope you never have to use it. That is how insurance companies afford the coverage they offer.
The most positive aspect of LTC is having the option of providing the very best care available at a time when it is most needed. Having it takes the burden off family members.
There are all kinds of statistical tables to help decide how much to get and for how long.
One year, while sounding long can be a short time when a debilitating condition is involved.
And LTC institutions get anywhere from $3000 per month and up.
After evaluating the alternatives, I got it for the two of us several years ago.

BTK

[Boomer]

To buy LTC insurance or not?

Like any other financial decision, the answer boils down to your own cost of sleep.

Take the risk?

For those who answer yes to that one, here ends the questioning process.

But if you are even considering buying LTC insurance, you need to understand exactly what you are buying and what it can do and why you are buying it.

Protecting assets for your spouse is a good reason for buying LTC. If a rep is interested only in the sale without establishing that there is a need for asset protection, tell said rep to hit the road. Not everybody needs asset protection.

If you decide to buy, make sure the company's underwriting is strong. Qualifying for coverage should be reasonably stringent. You want your company to be around to cover you should the need arise.

I walked away from a rep who was interested in presenting only one company. It was a good company, but he pushed it so hard that I figured it was paying a fatter commission. I wanted to know what else was available. He did not want to tell me. I said bye-bye. And found a rep that showed what other good companies offered in comparison.

Make sure Assisted Living and Home Care are covered. I believe that some policies also cover paying a family member to do the care, but I think the family member has to be qualified to do so. It may be worth checking into that for some families.

There are companies that now offer shared care policies which basically allow a couple to share the pot of money.

A 5% compound inflation benefit built in can be essential.

The term of the policy affects the cost dramatically. Herein lies another gamble. 3 years? Unlimited? You get to decide the term. I have seen what is called "Memory Care" go on for quite awhile. It can be very expensive.

Realize that the policy you buy may not cover the entire cost, even with the inflation benefit. $200-$250 a day is not uncommon around here in Ohio. This varies a lot depending on your area of the country.

Kids taking care of you? Talk about a gamble. I always say that one of the problems with getting old is that you have old kids. I have heard it suggested that the kids pitch in to cover the premiums for Mom and Dad. Maybe that could be the kids' cost of sleep.

There's a lot more to this. But now I have to go get some sleep. But please, if you are considering LTC insurance, learn everything you can about it. There is a lot of good information available. Heck, we are all too old to go around buying stuff we do not understand.

Boomer

[Sidney Lanier]

We tend to be insurance conscious. Well, in truth, we tend to be over-insurance conscious.... We have LTC insurance, and while the premiums are a chunk, we just feel better knowing it's in place should there be a need. After all, that's what insurance is all about!

[Boomer]

Yep. Those premiums are a chunk. And I guess from the dissertation I wrote here a few days ago, it's obvious that we have it. And like every other insurance, we sure hope we never have to use it.

There is a little method I use to get the number-crunching part of my brain around those chunky premiums we pay.

I look at the annual cost. And I tell myself, "This is the money that we are saving up each year for the possibility of ending up needing LTC." (Now, I know we are not really "saving" it and I hope that we have many, many good years left and that we are really just throwing this money right out the window. But this is how I have to talk to the number-crunching part of my brain.)

And then I multiply the annual cost by the number of years we could maybe end up paying into those premiums.

Then I project the cost of LTC facilities in the decades of the future.

The number I come up with after I do all that indicates that premiums paid in would be less than probably even one year in an LTC place of the future. But who knows? It's just how I work it.

I also find that having this insurance in place makes me feel a little better about spending more money now on stuff that is a lot more fun to spend money on. It's just another base I try to cover. That's my nature. But who knows? I sometimes wonder who is going to be there to take care of all us baby boomers anyway. Especially after I read "Boomsday."

In the Cincinnati tourbooks, you will find my picture next to the description that says, "Typical Cincinnati Financial Conservative." (Although there was that tech-bubble incident of the 90's that I played around with. Mr. Boomer asks me every once in awhile, "Where's that woman I used to sleep with who was getting me 103%?" He still likes me though.)

But like I always say about these financial decisions that come up around here for discussion from time to time, all you really have to figure out is your own personal cost of sleep. After you do that, you will know exactly what to do in your own personal circumstance.

Boomer

[BaylorBear]

Does anyone out there in TOTV Land have this kind of coverage? Can you help to educate me? The hubs and I are looking into this and want feedback from our friends out there regarding reputable companies, rates, etc.

[ssmith]

I will be interested in this post too. We have not bought long term care insurance at this point but had our Financial Advisor review the options and this was his advise..

1. Check to see if the policy you buy is only for the state it is bought in. This could be a problem if say you wanted to be moved closer to family.

2. Check to see if you have any say in the facility that you would have or do they decide which facility and what type of room you would be assigned to.

3. Also know that the younger you are and the healthier you are the policy price will be better

I'm sure there are many other factors but these are 2 that I can remember

SSmith

[Boomer]

Here's an article from Kiplinger which might help. There is a lot to be considered with LTC policies. This short article does not have all the answers. It's just a start. And it's mostly about premium cost considerations.

http://content.kiplinger.com/columns...2009/q0625.htm

Boomer

[another Linda]

We've thought long and hard about this and finally decided to self-insure. I guess only time will tell if that was a good or bad decision.

[Boomer]

There is an old thread in the archives somewhere on this topic. I will go down into the basement of TOTV, into the stacks, and see if I can find it, and if I do, I will link it here.

Boomer

[Boomer]

About this bump of this old thread.....

There is another thread about long-term care insurance running here tonight. And I went into that thread and I said that I thought there was an old thread here and that I would try to find it and link it.

Well, I found it, but I could not make the link work.

And so now I am writing this post in the old thread to explain the bump which looks kind of redundant in the line-up.

When I saw the LTC topic start tonight, I began to write a dissertation in reply to the question, and then I thought, "Wait a minute. I think I wrote about this one." And sure enough, I found the old stuff. (Geez. Geez. Geez. I am now in re-runs. Oh dear.)

But this thread has lots of stuff in it with people talking about LTC. And so here it is. Bumped.

(I suddenly felt so compelled to try to get the information all into one place. You know -- on the right shelf. With the correct Dewey number. So people could find it. I don't know why I sometimes feel so compelled to do that. I just do. )

Boomer

And I hope Mr. Tony will see this and will maybe somehow join the two threads together and pronounce them "Thread and Thread." I knew I could not do that. That takes admin magic. But I tried and tried to link this one into the new one, and then gave up.