[RichieLion]

New Hampshire State Representative George Lambert has co-sponsered a bill to make it a felony to view or touch someone's private parts without probable cause. The bill would classify the enhanced pat-down and the viewing of passengers with an x-ray as a sexual assault.

It a first step in the direction to stop this de-humanizing practice which amounts to the equivalent of a state sponsored sexual assault.

Kudos to these representatives for the state of New Hampshire.

http://www.unionleader.com/article.a...e-498b569ab8ac

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_830342.html

[Redtail]

Originally Posted by RichieLion

New Hampshire State Representative George Lambert has co-sponsered a bill to make it a felony to view or touch someone's private parts without probable cause. The bill would classify the enhanced pat-down and the viewing of passengers with an x-ray as a sexual assault.

It a first step in the direction to stop this de-humanizing practice which amounts to the equivalent of a state sponsored sexual assault.

Kudos to these representatives for the state of New Hampshire.

http://www.unionleader.com/article.a...e-498b569ab8ac

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_830342.html

hogwash......airline safety must evolve with the times to keep us safe. if you have trouble with it then you should seek other means of tranportation!

[Xavier]

Originally Posted by RichieLion

New Hampshire State Representative George Lambert has co-sponsered a bill to make it a felony to view or touch someone's private parts without probable cause. The bill would classify the enhanced pat-down and the viewing of passengers with an x-ray as a sexual assault.

It a first step in the direction to stop this de-humanizing practice which amounts to the equivalent of a state sponsored sexual assault.

Kudos to these representatives for the state of New Hampshire.

http://www.unionleader.com/article.a...e-498b569ab8ac

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_830342.html

Didn't you like the interaction you got the last time you brought this topic up? A little hung up on this I'd say.

My prescription: It's gorgeous outside, turn off your computer and get some fresh air. Enjoy the day that the good lord has given you.

X-hilarated

[RichieLion]

Originally Posted by Redtail

hogwash......airline safety must evolve with the times to keep us safe. if you have trouble with it then you should seek other means of tranportation!

I don't have to submit to de-humanizing actions in silence. If you're willing to give up your personal freedoms for a false sense of security, by all means spread 'em and put your hands up. I have no problem with you doing that. It's your body and if you have no problem with a stranger feeling and groping your most intimate parts, then by all means do so.

Other's, who cherish personal freedoms and abhor this grab at power over other person's bodies, that has as much to do with enlarging the number of public union employees, have a right to speak out and to demand that the government give good reason and probable cause to commit what in any other venue would be sexual assault.

It's a wretched system and there are better systems, such as in Israel, that do not treat everyone as guilty until proven innocent.

People have a right to speak out and to protest this issue. It's also our constitutional right to try and change the law to prevent this.

I actually don't fly anymore as I have medical implants and I am going to have to submit to personal indignities every time I fly. I am getting a little tired of the 18 hour drive to N.J. to see my family which I do just to avoid the humiliation at the hands of government agents.

[RichieLion]

Originally Posted by Xavier

Didn't you like the interaction you got the last time you brought this topic up? A little hung up on this I'd say.

My prescription: It's gorgeous outside, turn off your computer and get some fresh air. Enjoy the day that the good lord has given you.

X-hilarated

I talking about an issue. Why are you so condescending? Why do you need to confront me personally?

If the issue doesn't concern you, fine, don't respond to it.

The lawmakers in New Hampshire are making this news, not me. You need to stop obsessing on what I post. It's getting a bit dreary.

[Tbugs]

I flew out of Orlando International in December - no scans or pat downs!

I flew out of Portland, Maine in December - no scans or pat downs!

I flew out of Orlando International in January - no scans or pat downs!

I flew out of San Jose, Costa Rica in January - no scans or pat downs!

There was just the usual walking through the airport metal detector and having the carry-on bags x-rayed. Yes, we did have to remove shoes. No big deal.

I have talked with lots of Villagers who have travelled out of Orlando, New York, Washington and none had to have the scans or pat downs! This is entirely overblown as to how many travellers have this done.

Yet, I went to Disney a few days ago, and we had to have backpacks handsearched by Disney rent-a-cops.

How many Villagers actually have had full body pat downs at airports and how many have had the full body "naked" scanner at airports?

[skyguy79]

Originally Posted by Redtail

hogwash......airline safety must evolve with the times to keep us safe. if you have trouble with it then you should seek other means of tranportation!

In the State of New York and most if not all other states, you are assumed under law to be giving permission, when you get behind the wheel of an automobile to be tested for blood content when suspected of driving under the influence. If you refuse you will immediately have your drivers license suspended then later revoked for a minimum of six months. You rarely hear any outrage about this because it is an important safety issue.

Why then should there be any difference in standards from the highway to the airport when you purchase an airline ticket and enter into the security check point? They're both equally significant issues of safety! The only real difference is that with the check point at the airport, you do at least have the right to refuse, turn around and and walk away! You don't have that choice with a drivers sobriety test.

Now one may say "But, I have to fly!" Fooey that! Flying is a priviledge and not a right, just as it is with driving an automobile. No one HAS to fly; it's a choice. If it's because you're employer makes you do it, then it's an issue with your employer and not the thousands that depend on those safety measures every day. I haven't flown since the mid '70 and did love doing it, but for reasons other than safety I had to stop and I've yet to have missed it or have a breakdown or implode from lack of flying!

Our rights under the constitution are very important and it's equally important that they are not undermined by either circumstances or shameless acts of our government's leadership, but IMHO, our rights not to be incenerated or have our body parts scattered all over the ocean or countryside trumps the momentary discomfort of receiving a quick pat-down or incidental "junk" encounters at the airport, nor will it lead to undermining the foundations of our constitution.

[Challenger]

Israeli costs of airline secutity =approx $80.00 per passenger flown, USA =less than $6.00. Israeli passenger traffic approx 11,000,000 annually. San Francisco 10,000,000 annually. Added costs for Israeli model at San Francisco= 3/4 Billion$ times ???
Go online and check the facts, then we can have a rational discussion. Has the TSA made some mistakes, of course. Can procedures be improved, always.

[OpusX1]

While I agree that the current system is bad I would point out that most air travel is interstate/international and as such federal law will trump state law, unless you wll be flying within NH this law will pretty much be moot.

[Tbugs]

The link on Richie's post says that the bill introduced would have a government security agent (not just TSA) classified as a sexual offender if he/she touches or views genitalia or breasts. How about a jailer doing a strip search of a prisoner? How about an off-duty police officer (male or female) visiting a strip club, bachelor or bachelorette party? Too many variables here.

This bill will never make it out of committee. It is just some puffering by a state legislator who wants to be on a newspaper.

As I stated earlier, I do not know anyone personally who has gone through the enhanced pat down or "naked" scans. How many people do you know who have done this, Richie? No, I am not attacking you for this post. Inquiring minds just want to know.

[Challenger]

My wife gets the treatment on every flight and we fly often. She is 72 and has had a knee replacement. Sets off the alarm . She has always been treated with reasonable respect. I have never been patted down.

[Bogie Shooter]

Would the threat of water boarding on the offenders work??

[jackz]

"It's a wretched system and there are better systems, such as in Israel, that do not treat everyone as guilty until proven innocent."

Challenger has already mentioned the prohibitive costs of employing the system utilized in Israel considering the volume of passengers in the USA.

In addition in my view, partially obtained from managing a Federal Air Marshal Office for 5 years, the Israeli system basically views all passengers as possible threats and eliminates them via their extensive use of behavioral assesment tools and lengthy interviews. Are you aware that El Al Airlines require a check in of 4 hours ahead of their departures to be able to complete their screening processes? I don't believe the American flying public would appreciate a check in time of 4 hours prior to flight.

At the end of the day, flying is not a constitutional right but a privilege much the same as driving. I will jump through whatever hoops are necessary to keep me and my fellow passengers safe in flight.

[Challenger]

[RichieLion]

Originally Posted by Tbugs

The link on Richie's post says that the bill introduced would have a government security agent (not just TSA) classified as a sexual offender if he/she touches or views genitalia or breasts. How about a jailer doing a strip search of a prisoner? How about an off-duty police officer (male or female) visiting a strip club, bachelor or bachelorette party? Too many variables here.

This bill will never make it out of committee. It is just some puffering by a state legislator who wants to be on a newspaper.

As I stated earlier, I do not know anyone personally who has gone through the enhanced pat down or "naked" scans. How many people do you know who have done this, Richie? No, I am not attacking you for this post. Inquiring minds just want to know.

The key phrase you've ignored in the bill is "probable cause", and this makes your whole post moot.