Greece.. are we next?

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  #1  
Old 06-05-2011, 02:38 PM
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Default Greece.. are we next?

Tens of thousands protest outside Greek parliament, demand government stop paying creditors
http://www.google.com/hostednews/can...?docId=7060031

Greek media estimates of the crowd size ranged from 40,000 to more than 100,000.
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-...05-702188.html

Ok big spenders (BOTH PARTIES).. are you ready to admit your big government spending is destroying this country? No.. I am not talking to Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Iceland... I am talking to you America.
What we saw in Wisconsin was just a preview. State and Local budget cuts are starting to occur all over this country. Just starting... They will be cutting more and more as "stimulus", QE2, price supports, corporate welfare, federal block grants, highway money, etc etc. and revenues dry up. It is not surprising that when you borrow and spend money to "stimulate" the economy, and that money is actually used to "save" jobs, saving jobs is not stimulating, and as soon as the borrowed money stops, the layoffs begin. It is so simple.. it is hard to believe it was not done with nefarious motives. The more we rely on government for funding, the more we need government.. is that so surprising?

Our economy and debt is nearly as bad as Greece. The only reason we are not in their position right now is the dollar is the world reserve currency. As we devalue it, more countries will refuse it.
Can we do what the Greek protestors demand and just refuse to pay our debts? No.. because contrary to most beliefs, China does NOT own most of our debt. WE own it.. our employers, our pension funds, our banks and thus our private savings and retirement funds.. Do you really want our government to default on US? That is what we are heading for. They are already doing it by intentionally trying to create inflation using QE2 which decreases the value of our savings. When will you rise up and object?
I OBJECT!!

I predict Greece like protests will break out all over this country as soon as we either do the right thing and cut the ACTUAL federal budget which will put out of work millions of direct and indirect employees dependent on federal money, OR do the wrong thing when the fed and treasure choose to monetize the debt with more printing and debt, and spending. Our debt and deficit will rise even faster, no one will loan us the money (NOT EVEN our banks, pension funds, corporations) because of serious declines in the REAL VALUE of the dollar, and the economy will implode.
FED chairman Bernanke admitted that the more QU, the less bang and more risk (coincidentally just like a drug user) to the economy. Either way, it is bad now, worse soon and and if we chose the wrong path that we are currently on with borrowing and spending, much worse later.

The solution is so simple, but so painful, it will only be adopted out of political or economic necessity. Here it is.
Wages, salaries, savings, and real estate prices must fall to their REAL CURRENT VALUE.. which is far lower than it currently is... that means our standard of living must drop because we are all directly or indirectly living on borrowed money and now borrowed time. Why? Because value is relative to money supply, and our big spending government has artificially inflated our living standard with DEBT, Thanks to both parties. Until they realize we do not have enough money to have wars all over the world, soldiers posted everywhere propping up those countries, Entitlements, free medical, free food, free everything in this country, our economy is chasing its tail and just about to run out of energy.
JJ
  #2  
Old 06-05-2011, 03:51 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJoe View Post
Tens of thousands protest outside Greek parliament, demand government stop paying creditors
http://www.google.com/hostednews/can...?docId=7060031

Greek media estimates of the crowd size ranged from 40,000 to more than 100,000.
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-...05-702188.html

Ok big spenders (BOTH PARTIES).. are you ready to admit your big government spending is destroying this country? No.. I am not talking to Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Iceland... I am talking to you America.
What we saw in Wisconsin was just a preview. State and Local budget cuts are starting to occur all over this country. Just starting... They will be cutting more and more as "stimulus", QE2, price supports, corporate welfare, federal block grants, highway money, etc etc. and revenues dry up. It is not surprising that when you borrow and spend money to "stimulate" the economy, and that money is actually used to "save" jobs, saving jobs is not stimulating, and as soon as the borrowed money stops, the layoffs begin. It is so simple.. it is hard to believe it was not done with nefarious motives. The more we rely on government for funding, the more we need government.. is that so surprising?

Our economy and debt is nearly as bad as Greece. The only reason we are not in their position right now is the dollar is the world reserve currency. As we devalue it, more countries will refuse it.
Can we do what the Greek protestors demand and just refuse to pay our debts? No.. because contrary to most beliefs, China does NOT own most of our debt. WE own it.. our employers, our pension funds, our banks and thus our private savings and retirement funds.. Do you really want our government to default on US? That is what we are heading for. They are already doing it by intentionally trying to create inflation using QE2 which decreases the value of our savings. When will you rise up and object?
I OBJECT!!

I predict Greece like protests will break out all over this country as soon as we either do the right thing and cut the ACTUAL federal budget which will put out of work millions of direct and indirect employees dependent on federal money, OR do the wrong thing when the fed and treasure choose to monetize the debt with more printing and debt, and spending. Our debt and deficit will rise even faster, no one will loan us the money (NOT EVEN our banks, pension funds, corporations) because of serious declines in the REAL VALUE of the dollar, and the economy will implode.
FED chairman Bernanke admitted that the more QU, the less bang and more risk (coincidentally just like a drug user) to the economy. Either way, it is bad now, worse soon and and if we chose the wrong path that we are currently on with borrowing and spending, much worse later.

The solution is so simple, but so painful, it will only be adopted out of political or economic necessity. Here it is.
Wages, salaries, savings, and real estate prices must fall to their REAL CURRENT VALUE.. which is far lower than it currently is... that means our standard of living must drop because we are all directly or indirectly living on borrowed money and now borrowed time. Why? Because value is relative to money supply, and our big spending government has artificially inflated our living standard with DEBT, Thanks to both parties. Until they realize we do not have enough money to have wars all over the world, soldiers posted everywhere propping up those countries, Entitlements, free medical, free food, free everything in this country, our economy is chasing its tail and just about to run out of energy.
JJ
JJ The operative word here is "sacriface". Politicians tell us we have to "sacriface". Good leaders lead by example. Name one politician that will take the lead and make a good faith effort to "sacriface". It "ain't" going to happen. Politician can ignore sacriface because they are politician and writing the policies and rules. The powerful can ignore sacriface because they are powerful. The rich because they are rich. The poor can ignore sacriface because they are poor. That leaves the middle class and again we are going to have to sacriface becuase we are not politicians, rich, powerful or poor.
  #3  
Old 06-05-2011, 04:01 PM
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Default Sacrifice means a lower standard of living for everyone

Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon View Post
JJ The operative word here is "sacriface". Politicians tell us we have to "sacriface". Good leaders lead by example. Name one politician that will take the lead and make a good faith effort to "sacriface". It "ain't" going to happen. Politician can ignore sacriface because they are politician and writing the policies and rules. The powerful can ignore sacriface because they are powerful. The rich because they are rich. The poor can ignore sacriface because they are poor. That leaves the middle class and again we are going to have to sacriface becuase we are not politicians, rich, powerful or poor.
The Rich will not sacrifice because they are rich. The Poor will sacrifice because the government will have fewer entitlements to hand out.. fewer food stamps, heating subsidies, rent subsidies, health care.. cash payments,.. they will suffer or they will protest and riot..
Middle class will sacrifice because they pay for everything.
Doing nothing to solve our debt problems will be a total disaster.. and unfortunately I do not see politicians have the courage to solve the problem.
What kind of sacrifice do you want politicians to have? Reduced pay and benefits? How does that hurt most of them??. most of them are RICH. They go into politics for the power, not the pay and benefits.
JJ
  #4  
Old 06-06-2011, 06:06 AM
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Default

There's one other problem you neglected to mention with regards to Greece.

They are in the EU and do NOT control their currency. Iceland, on the other hand, had a similar crash and is now on the road to recovery because they had the ability to deal with their situation independantly using measures like devaluing their currency (the Icelandic Krona). Greece can't do that because decision concerning the Euro are made a thousand miles away from Athens.

This is exactly what is happening to the US Dollar. I keep tabs on the exchange rate because I have a trip planned this August and I've never seen such crazy swings in the USD-EUR rate. In a matter of days it can swing over 5%. It was $1.33 to the Euro last September and has been between $1.25 and $1.46 since then - not exactly stable.

We won't be Greece because we have our financial sovereignty. But that doesn't mean we won't have significant problems.
 

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