its the blame game... Blame her for the deal, then the next day change you mind. they are good for that. watch any news show, and you will see that. they had a Republican from Texas on MSNBC lastnight. at least he owned up that it was not her fault for the republicans voting the way they did. i can not understand how in the world the Republicans can change their mind so fast. McCain said it was obama that led the charge to defeat it, then said we have to stop the blame game, and the next morning releases a new ad campaign blaming the Demo's again. As a Registered Repub, i give up.

Too Funny!
 

Hahaha. Last night Jon Stewart did a segment on McCain doing just that! First McCain said it was Obama's fault (???) and in the very next sentence said "this is not the time for blame." Stewart said "Perhaps you should tell that to your previous sentence." :1rotfl:

Calm Down.....
 

If you do dollar cost averaging, or dividend reinvesting in the market, then you know when the prices are down, your invested dividends are buying more stock for you. Just hang in and when it goes up you are ahead. Your invested dividends bought more stock at a very low price. No need to panic. Too many people want to cash out, be patient and do not panic.

I really dont want to get into this silliness, but it appears we should really look to the heavens and give thanks that we have the Democrats who are not blaming anyone and Sen Obama whose ads reflect no blame being passed....aren't we fortunate to have this party as the shining light for us...they who are not blaming anyone but themselves in a most modest manner. Yes, we are lucky to have the Democrats...and if you didn't know about all their wonderfulness, just read and listen, they will be gracious enough to remind you !!!

SO, you'd rather crash the economy for everyone than help alleviate the problem. Do you understand economics? Do you have any idea of the ripple effect on peoples lives if nothing is done?

Apparently You don't have a dime coming from an IRA, 401K, mutual fund. stock dividends or bonds, that you rely on for your retirement. It must be nice not to need a mortgage or auto loan or keep your job. May be a little WPA would be good for our country?

Read Milton Friedman's "Free to Choose" for an economics education and learn how utterly dependent on each other we all are in this world.

Dependency upon others does not equate to subsidy for continuous bad judgment.

The "credit crunch" will and should effect those (individuals and businesses alike) who float paper to cover "investments" on the short. It will and should also effect those whose inability to repay (known at the time of the loan initiation, but they are such nice people...)(or, OMG, the stock went down, not up!) cost all of us via higher interest rates to cover the losses from deadbeats.

There is a difference between industrial support and executive welfare. I'm not sure this bailout/rescue/snowjob isn't the latter more than the former, especially when one looks at the lobbyist activity and "contributions" that have been spread around (and that amount ain't chicken feed!) and to whom. If it is the latter, we lose despite the expense.

The "credit crunch" WILL and SHOULD NOT affect the rest of our countrymen that HAVE DONE NOTHING to warrant being hurt by our economy coming to a standstill.

The "Bailout" is not for business's or executive's, idiots who bought homes they cannot afford, or those who bought stocks short. IT is for us, the people who should not be harmed by the aftereffects of the causes you mentioned.

"They", whoever "THEY" are, have gotten us into the mess, your right, but "They" have created a situation where we all will suffer along with them. You me and everyone else in this country are affected by a shortage in the monetary supply that only the Federal Government can help abate.

My family and I have done nothing to warrant our loss in investment value and inability to obtain loans, but you would have us be hurt by the actions of others in order to not "bailout" those of whom you feel don't deserve it.

Thanks for crapping on me just to punish them!

Agreed!
 

I have tried to see it from both sides, but SteveZ, I don't believe you do understand Economics. :sad:

Gee...Steve.....this poster is an expert on everything....we have been lectured on journalism, business in general, and now economics. We are also lectured on our incorrect postion on politics and always have to understand if you dont agree with her, you are wrong !!!!

Whatever happened to that tired old phrase......."I see your point but I respectfully disagree with you......"

There is no intention to "crap" on anyone. I just don't see adding another $700B this time (and this will happen again) to the National Debt just because Congresspersons and this administration refuse to fix the root cause of the program at the same time throwing 700 Very Large to persons-unnamed-at-this-time, and then say that the hurt will be better because of it. That's bunk!

I too have investments, and realize they are a gamble to obtain greater return than a conventional savings account or equivalent. Some gambles have won, others have lost. That's gambling! The terms investment and guarantee are not synonymous.

Loans are still out there for everyone with a decent credit rating. If someone's credit rating is poor, and they don't have the capacity to be reasonably expected to repay, that's too bad. All of the taxpayer subsidy in the world won't change that, unless the thought is the taxpayer should co-sign all private loans. Being able to borrow money is a privilege granted by the lender to the lendee - it is not a right of residency.

Taxing all of us to protect selected "investments" and the ability of persons not able to qualify for a loan on their own merit to borrow money with the probable risk of skipping out on the loan through bankruptcy or gamesmanship is far from reasonable.

If that is not your viewpoint, then we can agree to disagree. I don't ask anyone to pay my bills, cover my losses due to my investing/gambling, or feel that lending me money should be a risky proposition which requires individual or public co-signing. Taxing all of us to absorb the intentional risks others made to make money can be viewed as crapping on all of us.

Nobody is taxing us, what the government will be doing for us is buying low grade securities and reselling them at a later date to protect us from at least a minor meltdown of the banking/lending industry. This not about protecting bad investments or shady borrowers/lenders, it's about our entire monetary system.

Study the effect of what happened when Americans were buying (gambling) on stocks on margin in the early 1900's. The market collapsed, people got scared and started a run on The Bank of America in N.Y. Other banks and the U.S. Government decided What the Heck, let them fail. Other banks had runs on them when people heard about the collapse of The Bank of America, wrongly believing that it was a government entity based on it's name (it wasn't).

The public ran a huge amount of banks, leaving no money for the banks to loan. Businesses could not borrow for payrolls, equipment, or supplies and laid off workers or closed, putting thousands out of work. Off course I'm talking about The Great Depression. It happened all because the Government and other banks refused to "Bailout" the banks. I know you didn't need this history lesson, but it's necessary sometimes to refresh our memories

History Forgotten is History Relived

Name Calling?
 

Funny Bucco, I've never hear YOU use that phrase. Did I miss something? As far as lecturing goes, you've done plenty of it! Time will prove who's right or wrong. It's that simple. ;)

and "i cant make up my mind McCain and " i have no clue" Palin are any better?????

The "government" is "all of us," not some hybrid entity. The only revenue "the government" has to buy anything is what "all of us" mainly via taxation provide. So, "all of us" are buying these low-grade securities and hoping like heck there will even be a buyer at a later date. The odds of "all of us" getting stuck with junk nobody wants at even 2-cents on the dollar is pretty high. The winners in this debacle become those who were able to dump their trash on "all of us." That's a good deal for "all of us?"

Well SteveZ, I think that we are close to talking about the same thing. Now we are down to semantics.

"We The People" (Hereafter called "The Government") allow The Government (the vehicle that allows "we the people" lower case) to tax us (see previous lower case) for the purposes of the common good.

The common good in what we've been debating is to keep the Government (also known as WTP) from a huge amount of harm, caused by a minority of wtp (lower case) to our WTP monetary system.

It is not a good deal for the majority of the WTP, but the WTP need to protect ourselves from the ongoing effect of the wtp's actions to our economy. The wpt have already done their damage. The debacle is past tense, already complete, the junk dumped in WTP monetary system. WTP must now move on, make sure that wpt can't put WTP in this position again, and protect the WTP from the future harm to our monetary system.

Nice debate Steve. As from this point on "we agree to disagree"

P.S. The quote "crapping" was just bait to keep you engaged in the debate.
It seems to be the favorite tactic for most posters in this Political Forum. Guess it worked.