This morning I received this link in an e-mail. It shows what can be accomplished without the stranglehold of the UAW.

http://info.detnews.com/video/index.cfm?id=1189

Fantastic plant, if only the UAW could move beyond saving their overpaid jobs to saving the company and the industry in the U.S.

Ah but to dream...............

Originally Posted by MelZ

Fantastic plant, if only the UAW could move beyond saving their overpaid jobs to saving the company and the industry in the U.S.

Ah but to dream...............

I can't blame the UAW workers from looking after their interests first. If Baseball's Manny Ramirez and Football's Tyrell Owens sell their labor at the best rate they can get, Joe SixPack at the UAW should have the same privilege.

The problem is that there is no incentive to buy the product, price notwithstanding. Until that issue is resolved, it does not matter how much money is being spent on the Big-3, if in the end the only thing that happens is that several million autos are jammed into storage areas, only to become so much scrap because they aren't bought.

If this was the dairy industry (people not buying milk, ice cream and butter) instead of the auto industry, how would we try to solve the problem? Wouldn't we try to make the product(s) more palatable or would we just fund continued manufacture of product(s) going into inventory and eventual disposal?

I worked for ten years in the auto industry--albeit a long time ago--and my son is an executive with Ford today. There's no question that much of the blame for the weakening of the U.S. auto industry can be laid in the lap of the UAW. Oh, don't get me wrong, the auto company management has demonstrated their own amount of stupidity, as well. They were not aggressive enough in developing, building and selling smaller, fuel-efficient cars when the oncoming and ongoing increase in dependence on foreign oil was obvious. Consumers didn't help much, I must say. They kept buying the gas guzzlers as long as they could afford to fill them up. (As an example, with the recent dramatic drops in gas prices, what kinds of vehicles do you think have picked up in sales? According to my son, who is responsible for scheduling all the the North American car and truck assembly plants for Ford, it's back to the big SUV's and pickup trucks.)

But the UAW and the employees are the ones who will have to take the biggest hit if the U.S. auto industry is to survive. But you don't hear them in Washington offering up very much, do you? Oh boy, they're going to give up the "job bank" over a period of time. Do you know what that is? It's a program whereby laid off employees get paid 95% of their hourly rate plus health insurance for as long as they're laid off. They get first crack at any new jobs when they're created. When GM says they're going to shut down 3-4 plants because of bad sales, they don't save much. The hourly workers get to stay home with the kids and still get paid 95% of their pay. It's his kind of stuff that has to go if we're ever going to have an auto industry.

Unfortunately, I don't believe the UAW will ever give this stuff up unless it's under the gavel of a bankruptcy judge. That certainly wouldn't be good for my son and his family. But I don't think it will happen otherwise.

Originally Posted by Villages Kahuna

I worked for ten years in the auto industry--albeit a long time ago--and my son is an executive with Ford today. There's no question that much of the blame for the weakening of the U.S. auto industry can be laid in the lap of the UAW. Oh, don't get me wrong, the auto company management has demonstrated their own amount of stupidity, as well. They were not aggressive enough in developing, building and selling smaller, fuel-efficient cars when the oncoming and ongoing increase in dependence on foreign oil was obvious. Consumers didn't help much, I must say. They kept buying the gas guzzlers as long as they could afford to fill them up. (As an example, with the recent dramatic drops in gas prices, what kinds of vehicles do you think have picked up in sales? According to my son, who is responsible for scheduling all the the North American car and truck assembly plants for Ford, it's back to the big SUV's and pickup trucks.)

But the UAW and the employees are the ones who will have to take the biggest hit if the U.S. auto industry is to survive. But you don't hear them in Washington offering up very much, do you? Oh boy, they're going to give up the "job bank" over a period of time. Do you know what that is? It's a program whereby laid off employees get paid 95% of their hourly rate plus health insurance for as long as they're laid off. They get first crack at any new jobs when they're created. When GM says they're going to shut down 3-4 plants because of bad sales, they don't save much. The hourly workers get to stay home with the kids and still get paid 95% of their pay. It's his kind of stuff that has to go if we're ever going to have an auto industry.

Unfortunately, I don't believe the UAW will ever give this stuff up unless it's under the gavel of a bankruptcy judge. That certainly wouldn't be good for my son and his family. But I don't think it will happen otherwise.

And that's why we have two types of bankruptcy proceedings - Chapter 7 & 11.

The UAW isn't stupid. The Job Bank may be one of the first items to be suspended in Chapter 11. A smart UAW negotiator would have already worked out a cooperative plan with the Big-3 contingent upon the Big-3 acquiring bailout money.

It's amazing that we have set up via Chapter 11 the best means for a company to stay in business during hard times, yet if the company doesn't want to do an "11," for obvious personal selfish reasons, our elected officials want to ignore the good laws they made and throw uncontrolled money at them. Unbelievable!

Heard an interesting statistic on the news today.

In 2007 GM sold approx 2.3 million cars world wide.
In 2007 Toyota sold approx 2.3 million cars world wide.
In 2007 GM lost 34 billion dollars.
In 2007 Toyota made 17 billion dollars.

What's wrong with this picture?

Originally Posted by dklassen

Heard an interesting statistic on the news today.

In 2007 GM sold approx 2.3 million cars world wide.
In 2007 Toyota sold approx 2.3 million cars world wide.
In 2007 GM lost 34 billion dollars.
In 2007 Toyota made 17 billion dollars.

What's wrong with this picture?

Short post, but shows a strong picture. Solve this probblem and make the rest of the country work right...

That would have an awful lot to do with getting the legislation passed. From all that I can gather on TV this morning (Thursday), the bill going to the Senate has some real teeth in it for the car czar. But who will that be? If it were someone like Jack Welch, I think there really would be a re-structuring. Or, the UAW would refuse and drive the companies into bankruptcy, where the re-structuring might get done or the companies would be liquidated. If that happened, the cost to the taxpayers would be minimal to nothing. But if the car czar is some old, retired, tired businessman or beaurocrat, forget it and let happen what will happen. They say that Bush is considering possible candidates. Tell me that I'm wrong when I say I'm not getting my hopes up for a czar appointed by Bush who would really get something done.

the big 3 have been reducing manufacturing here in the US to save money....yet they lost!!! The foreign car makers continue to move manufacturing to the US to save money and they are profitable.
The foreign auto companies create an expectation of costs per unit then put in place what it takes to achieve the costs.....including what they will pay per hour and what is expected in output in return. Every hour input and paid results in output.

The Big 3 are so far away from expected output per dollar paid it may not be possible for them to get there from where they are now. It is going to take a major shift in philosophy of the management/worker as well as manufacturing concepts. The incumbents are not capable of making the drastic changes required....they know too many reasons why things should stay as they are....including an ongoing incestuous relationship with the union.

Bankruptcy and a major enema to clean out the place...restructure under the courts...restructure the union under court order. When all else fails copy what the foreign car makers are doing at a profit. Throwing money at an industry that is MAKING NO EFFORT TO BE DIFFERENT only means either more money later or bankruptcy (or both). Do not give them the money.

As far as the BS the carmakers are offering about people won't buy from a bankrupt company....BS!!!!! Did not millions fly every day on bankrupt airlines???

The other change that is needed is for the American public start getting back to buying American....a not very popular concept for a lot of reasons...but a country with no manufacturing base IS NOT going to remain a world leader (for long). We are turning into a service society only.....so when things really hit the skids and the unemployment lines are long....I would like to quote Lee Ioccoca.....EAT YOUR IMPORTS when you get hungry!!!!!!!!!!

BTK

Does everyone understand that the Foreign manufacturing facilities that you all praise so highly, including those in this country are; taking all of the profits offshore, and are subsidized by governments that tariff our goods? They also have brand new factories, machinery, and no legacy costs (that's us old retired guys).

I get discouraged when I hear the defeatist comments about the big three and our Union: Let's see how many other companies have survived 100 plus years, (GM as the largest company in the world for decades): The banks? Insurance Companies? Retailers? Airlines? Restaurants: any that you can think of maintaining that type of long term success? I wouldn't classify the big 3 historically as failures, as US business go. Are all of these other failing industries, businesses and companies stupid, overpaid and lazy?

Automotive may be the hardest hit by high gas prices and limited credit, but if they fall and 3 million jobs (to start) are lost, it won't be the last. Ask a small business owner in any of these towns where the auto plants still exist what will become of their; cafe', flower shop, grocery store, retailers, travel agency, lawn service, housing industry....etc.

Support the bridge loans, help the economy get rolling again. Don't be fooled by an anti-union out going group of recently defeated Senators.

http://www.freep.com/article/2008121...ESS01/81210113

DUMP UAW. Forget about car Czar. Let the free market take its course.

Kudos to Billethekid. You're right on.

"Don't be fooled by an anti-union out going group of recently defeated Senators."
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As opposed to being fooled by the recipients of millions of dollars to help get elected ?

by cglenhar...if one has a good understanding of the bankruptcy options available.....each and every one allows for the CONTINUATION of business....each and everyone dictates a structure and procedure resulting in a plan to restructure the business, reorganize the company all aimed at becoming more viable. This could also mean some lawmakers will not continue to get perks and contributions from the big 3 anymore....conflict of interest!!!!

The current management keep saying bankruptcy is not an option for very good reasons...all personal...they lose their job....there is an accountability to a higher authority.

So when folks like me and many others are against the bail out and for bankruptcy it is because in the end result there will be a better, stronger more competitive company....and yes there will not be the ridiculous wages previously paid.....and yes they will have to do more than they do today to take home less....but they will have a job.

We also know the profits from the foreign manufacturers with plants here go back to the home land. That's the point.....they came to the US to reduce costs....manufacture in their biggest market....while the US car companies were doing just the opposite.....whether your talking autos or appliances...or almost anuthing else....they all thrived when they had 90+% of their manufacturing her in the USA. Labor costs, plain and simple were the main driver of pushing, at first, component assembly off shore....eventually it all went off shore as in appliances....and in some automotive the entire assembly plants to Canada, Australia, Mexico. Not only was the labor less costly, the workers put out more per hour than the American unioinized counter part.

Like too many other things in our lives today....the objective is profitability for the sake of profits....in days of old the objective was build the better car....provide health care....service from banks....all customer oriented entities.....now replaced by profit only entities and little emphasis on the customer.

I know....I lived the growth of the appliance business at GE in Louisville KY...1965 employment 10,000......1975-1985 employment pushing 25,000....current employment less than 5,000.......100% driven out by high labor costs while at the same time expecting less out put.

For the loyalists to the automotive industry, you should be praying for bankruptcy and reorganization.....not handing the same old boys at the same old company paying the same old high wages for less output and less quality...it does not take a genius to calculate the success possibility...but just in case....it is zero! Promising an electric car sooner.....what a joke!!!

Having lived it.....don't give them a dime!!!!!!!!!!

BTK