What do you do about Islamic violence?

[Madelaine Amee]

I read today about the unimaginable violence of the killing of the 29 students and one teacher at the boarding school in Nigeria. I am a bit squeamish, but I made myself read it through to the end, read about the little boy who had his fingers shot off his writing hand, read about the women screaming in anguish when they tried to identify their children.

Whatever can be done to end this escalating violence which is spreading to every country in the world.

These people are trying to bring their own people back into the dark ages while the rest of the world is advancing technologically by leaps and bounds every day. They have to be stopped, but how does one go about it?

Pity Old Dave has gone off this chat line, he would have had some great thoughts on this massive problem.

[kittygilchrist]

nothing. I have smaller fish to fry.

[perrjojo]

They have been that way for thousands of years....guess it won't change.

[gomoho]

Pray - that is the best I have to offer. I understand your reluctance to read the story - it is heartbreaking to know these things are happening in our lifetimes. So I say again -pray for your own peace of mind and peace to that part of the world. You are not alone with this pain.

[Monkei]

I read today about the unimaginable violence of the killing of the 29 students and one teacher at the boarding school in Nigeria. I am a bit squeamish, but I made myself read it through to the end, read about the little boy who had his fingers shot off his writing hand, read about the women screaming in anguish when they tried to identify their children.

Whatever can be done to end this escalating violence which is spreading to every country in the world.

These people are trying to bring their own people back into the dark ages while the rest of the world is advancing technologically by leaps and bounds every day. They have to be stopped, but how does one go about it?

Pity Old Dave has gone off this chat line, he would have had some great thoughts on this massive problem.

According to statistics I have a better chance of dying by my TV falling off its stand on me than Islamic terrorism. We got a heck of a lot more stuff to fix here in the US than to worry about Nigeria.

My answer is also nothing.

[Monkei]

Pray - that is the best I have to offer. I understand your reluctance to read the story - it is heartbreaking to know these things are happening in our lifetimes. So I say again -pray for your own peace of mind and peace to that part of the world. You are not alone with this pain.

Don't you think those people were already praying? Until we figure out that our god is no better or worse than anyone else's we will continue down this path of religious violence.

[ijusluvit]

I think the first practical stopgap is to prevent the possibility of Islamists forming closed communities in the US which ultimately assert that they are governed by Sharia law. This is a problem in Europe, even in nations where the Muslim population is still very small. These communities essentially withdraw from the home country's society. Law enforcement officers are sometimes afraid to enter the area, so the laws of the land are not enforced, and Sharia law becomes defacto. It is not unusual for extremists to emerge from these communities anxious to spread terrorism elsewhere.

This is not farfetched. Remember, we have militia groups living by their own rules in various places in the country. Thankfully, to date we have not allowed these groups or individuals to violate our laws outside of their private compounds, and we make some effort, although with some controversy, to compel them to obey the law where thy do live.

[ilovetv]

According to statistics I have a better chance of dying by my TV falling off its stand on me than Islamic terrorism. We got a heck of a lot more stuff to fix here in the US than to worry about Nigeria.

My answer is also nothing.

How quickly people forget the people who were killed, maimed and had legs blown off in Boston, Massachusetts less than 3 months ago...by two creeps that were "terrorists", regardless of how formal their ties were or not to these terrorist groups mentioned in the indictments:

"The Islamic organization that includes Dzhokhar Tsarnaev’s mosque has ties to the al-Qaeda operative that reportedly inspired Tsarnaev to carry out the Boston Marathon terrorist attack, according to FBI surveillance documents.

Tsarnaev, 19, was indicted Thursday on 30 criminal counts related to the April 15 bombing at the Boston Marathon, which was allegedly carried out by Tsarnaev and his late brother Tamerlan. The bombing left three people dead and numerous others injured, and resulted in a manhunt during which a Boston-area campus police officer was shot and killed.

Dzhokhar Tsarnaev reportedly left a note in the boat he hid in during the manhunt claiming that he bombed the Boston Marathon as retribution for U.S. wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

“When you attack one Muslim, you attack all Muslims,” Tsarnaev wrote.

Prior to the Boston Marathon attack, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, who attended the Islamic Society of Boston mosque in Cambridge, downloaded radical Islamic propaganda from the Internet, including materials authored by Anwar al-Awlaki, the senior al Qaeda operative who was killed in a U.S. drone strike in Yemen on September 30, 2011. Tsarnaev also downloaded a summer 2010 edition of the al Qaeda magazine “Inspire,” which included bomb-making instructions and which is thought to have been the work of al-Awlaki.

Al-Awlaki lived in the United States between 1990 and 2002, when he moved to the United Kingdom before eventually relocating to Yemen, where he where worked for al-Qaeda and produced propaganda tapes and other materials urging Muslims to commit terrorist attacks against the United States.

Suhaib Webb, imam of the Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center in Roxbury, spoke alongside al-Awlaki at a September 9, 2001 fundraiser at the University of California at Irvine, according to FBI surveillance documents. The fundraiser was intended to raise money for the legal defense of H. Rap Brown, an Atlanta-based Islamic radical who shot and killed two Georgia police officers. Webb and al-Awlaki helped raise $100,000 to defend Brown, who was eventually convicted for his crimes......

Read more: Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's imam shares ties with senior al-Qaeda operative | The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/27/dzhokhar-tsarnaevs-imam-shares-ties-with-senior-al-qaeda-operative/#ixzz2YJPxYdLR)

[waynet]

I think Religions are basically violent organizations Islam or Christian or Jewish,does not matter.

[graciegirl]

I think Religions are basically violent organizations Islam or Christian or Jewish,does not matter.

How can you say that? I am 73 years old and never met anyone from the American Christian or Jewish communities who were taught to harm us.

Have we forgotten nine eleven and Boston so recently? I know that not all Muslims are extremists but still. Who does things like that if they have a heart and a conscience, kill innocent people in the name of God? Not any religion that I know of personally.

[golf2140]

How can you say that? I am 73 years old and never met anyone from the Christian or Jewish communities who were taught to harm us.

Have we forgotten nine eleven and Boston so recently? I know that not all Muslims are extremists but still. Who does things like that if they have a heart and a conscience, kill innocent people in the name of God? Not any religion that I know of personally.

:bowdown:

[Monkei]

How can you say that? I am 73 years old and never met anyone from the American Christian or Jewish communities who were taught to harm us.

Have we forgotten nine eleven and Boston so recently? I know that not all Muslims are extremists but still. Who does things like that if they have a heart and a conscience, kill innocent people in the name of God? Not any religion that I know of personally.

Wrong.

Timothy McVey was a Christian. There have been TONS of Christians who terrorized and killed fellow American citizens because of their skin color, religion, and sexual persuasion. We formed the country by killing savages because we were spreading the teachings of the good book taking their land along the way. Christian missionaries basically stole all the land from the native Hawaiians.

Please don't tell me that Christians are members of the good religion and Muslims are bad members of theirs.

When you asked me who does things ike that? I think you got your answer. We are no better or worse than they are. The only difference is we carry a big stick and they carry a little one.

[JP]

When I asked my highly educated and I think intelligent new partner, who is Persian, how we can improve our relationships with the Iranians, he said, "there is no way, they all must die". I was shocked but it made me think that there are so many people in that region and the world that feel the same way as he does that it is going to be a long and hard struggle for the entire world.

[ilovetv]

When I asked my highly educated and I think intelligent new partner, who is Persian, how we can improve our relationships with the Iranians, he said, "there is no way, they all must die". I was shocked but it made me think that there are so many people in that region and the world that feel the same way as he does that it is going to be a long and hard struggle for the entire world.

I think your highly educated and intelligent partner from Persia is being highly realistic.....sees there is no rational talk nor diplomacy that's going to change the leaders' minds about wanting us and Israel wiped off the face of the earth.

And so some would have us just sit here twiddling our thumbs, being sitting ducks.....unprepared and unarmed, waiting for the next 9-11 but worse.

[l2ridehd]

This is a struggle that has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue until one side completely eliminates the other. The Muslims will not be satisfied until 100% of the world adheres to their laws and beliefs. And the Christians and Jews will never allow that to happen until they stop it or die trying. As long as any religion believes they must have everyone believe as they do, it will continue.

And for those of you who want to stick your head in the sand and ignore it, you or your children and definitely your grand children will pay the price for that folly. Everyone says it's just a few extremists who are out killing people, however the real major issues is the rest of the Muslim religion condones it and does nothing to stop it. I know several Muslims and have discussed this issue with them. And while they will say "it's awful or I would never do that" and while they actually prefer to live in peace, they believe those extremists have a right to do what they are doing. They don't encourage it, they don't engage in it, but they don't denounce it either.

A global religious war will eventually destroy our civilization as we know it.

[graciegirl]

Wrong.

Timothy McVey was a Christian. There have been TONS of Christians who terrorized and killed fellow American citizens because of their skin color, religion, and sexual persuasion. We formed the country by killing savages because we were spreading the teachings of the good book taking their land along the way. Christian missionaries basically stole all the land from the native Hawaiians.

Please don't tell me that Christians are members of the good religion and Muslims are bad members of theirs.

When you asked me who does things ike that? I think you got your answer. We are no better or worse than they are. The only difference is we carry a big stick and they carry a little one.

Timothy Mcvey and the Movie shooter and the killer of the Connecticut children didn't kill in the name of God.

I am not particularly religious, but I see mostly kindness in our religious communities and gatherings here and in our culture. At least most Christians strive toward the golden rule..

I am allowed to tell you and to think whatever I want, but mostly I have lived long enough to know that extremism even in attitude is NOT good. Proud to be moderate.

[gomoho]

Don't you think those people were already praying? Until we figure out that our god is no better or worse than anyone else's we will continue down this path of religious violence.

Which people are you referring to as already praying? and who said anything about anyone's God being better or worse???

I was responding to the OP's question of "what to do about the violence". What are you talking about???

[Madelaine Amee]

This is a struggle that has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue until one side completely eliminates the other. The Muslims will not be satisfied until 100% of the world adheres to their laws and beliefs. And the Christians and Jews will never allow that to happen until they stop it or die trying. As long as any religion believes they must have everyone believe as they do, it will continue.

And for those of you who want to stick your head in the sand and ignore it, you or your children and definitely your grand children will pay the price for that folly. Everyone says it's just a few extremists who are out killing people, however the real major issues is the rest of the Muslim religion condones it and does nothing to stop it. I know several Muslims and have discussed this issue with them. And while they will say "it's awful or I would never do that" and while they actually prefer to live in peace, they believe those extremists have a right to do what they are doing. They don't encourage it, they don't engage in it, but they don't denounce it either.

A global religious war will eventually destroy our civilization as we know it.

:agree:

[nitehawk]

:BigApplause:Wrong.

Timothy McVey was a Christian. There have been TONS of Christians who terrorized and killed fellow American citizens because of their skin color, religion, and sexual persuasion. We formed the country by killing savages because we were spreading the teachings of the good book taking their land along the way. Christian missionaries basically stole all the land from the native Hawaiians.

Please don't tell me that Christians are members of the good religion and Muslims are bad members of theirs.

When you asked me who does things ike that? I think you got your answer. We are no better or worse than they are. The only difference is we carry a big stick and they carry a little one.

[graciegirl]

This is a struggle that has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue until one side completely eliminates the other. The Muslims will not be satisfied until 100% of the world adheres to their laws and beliefs. And the Christians and Jews will never allow that to happen until they stop it or die trying. As long as any religion believes they must have everyone believe as they do, it will continue.

And for those of you who want to stick your head in the sand and ignore it, you or your children and definitely your grand children will pay the price for that folly. Everyone says it's just a few extremists who are out killing people, however the real major issues is the rest of the Muslim religion condones it and does nothing to stop it. I know several Muslims and have discussed this issue with them. And while they will say "it's awful or I would never do that" and while they actually prefer to live in peace, they believe those extremists have a right to do what they are doing. They don't encourage it, they don't engage in it, but they don't denounce it either.

A global religious war will eventually destroy our civilization as we know it.

While I was blathering, you were using words to say it clearly.

[nitehawk]

TBIJ reports that from June 2004 through mid-September 2012, available data indicate that drone strikes killed 2,562 - 3,325 people in Pakistan, of whom 474 - 881 were civilians, including 176 children. TBIJ reports that these strikes also injured an additional 1,228 - 1,362 individuals," according to the Stanford/NYU study.
Put the shoe on the other foot and see how we would feel !!!! Enough to maybe start a terrorist program against the country who was using the drones---- please dont tell me who is right --- nobody is "Right" Everyone is to blame

[angiefox10]

"Now having read some of the posts on this site, i feel that i have to inform the crusaders that, historically and to this day the crimes commited in the name of christianity and more recently democracy have killed more innocent civilians than any unguided terrorist or legitimate muslim army. the 1st crusade = christian army killed all civilians in jerussalem, saladin took it back later without harming civilians. Spain you mention, when spain was under islamic control all 3 of the main religions lived peacefully and spain was at its most advanced in all fields, it was the envy of europe. when the christians took it back they massacred many, look at the country its main beauty is its history.

and many of todays technological advances have evolved from the findings of muslims centuries ago, the koran didnt say the world had for corners, unlike a certain book, which is supposed to be the word of god but has 15 or so versions. the massacre of bosinians was commited by a christian army= 8000 killed many more raped in 1995 america since the end of world war have invaded more nations and killed more civilians than any muslim, 2 million in the vietnam war says a lot, 50000 in iraq. 1ST came the opression of pallestine then came the suicide bombers, 1st came the 1st gulf war and support of israel then cam 9/11, 1st came the invasion of chechniya then came the school massacre. first came the invasion of iraq then came 7/7
AND MY POINT IS THIS IF MUSLIMS HAD DONE TO THE WEST, WHAT THE WEST HAS DONE TO MUSLIMS, HOW WOULD U FEEL. CONSIDERING HOW U FEEL NOW DUE THE ACTS OF A FEW DRIVEN CRAZY BY OPPRESSION AND SEEING THIER POEPLE KILLED, ROBED AND RAPED"

crimes commited in the name of christianity and democracy :: Reader comments at Daniel Pipes (http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/37256)


We are not so nice as we would like to believe we are... Not to mention Hitler was a Christian and had the Catholic church behind him.

[Monkei]

Timothy Mcvey and the Movie shooter and the killer of the Connecticut children didn't kill in the name of God.

I am not particularly religious, but I see mostly kindness in our religious communities and gatherings here and in our culture. At least most Christians strive toward the golden rule..

I am allowed to tell you and to think whatever I want, but mostly I have lived long enough to know that extremism even in attitude is NOT good. Proud to be moderate.

Well how about ths, you don't look your age!

[Monkei]

Which people are you referring to as already praying? and who said anything about anyone's God being better or worse???

I was responding to the OP's question of "what to do about the violence". What are you talking about???

I was posting about the simple response of just pray as if our prayers to our Christian god has any,ore meaning than a young pakastanian father praying to his god to stop the drones from killing innocents in his country. I frankly don't see a difference. We justify our praying to stop Islamic terrorism while we continue ours.

[LI SNOWBIRD]

nothing. I have smaller fish to fry.

You said it kiddo

[blueash]

"If America is to be put in its place – put right – (Muslims) must risk martyrdom and force (America) to the crux where it has to decide either to acknowledge (Mohammad) as (commander) or to begin drinking holy blood"

Scary stuff. Calling for martyrdom against American infidels who don't share the speaker's religious extremism.


Edit: Perhaps I should indicate that where I have utilized parentheses I have not directly quoted the original author. Further clarification to follow

[graciegirl]

"If America is to be put in its place – put right – (Muslims) must risk martyrdom and force (America) to the crux where it has to decide either to acknowledge (Mohammad) as (commander) or to begin drinking holy blood"

Scary stuff. Calling for martyrdom against American infidels who don't share the speaker's religious extremism.


Blueash. I agree. It is scary stuff. No one wants to think along those lines. People don't want to fear anyone based on religion, it just seems to be happening.

[graciegirl]

"Now having read some of the posts on this site, i feel that i have to inform the crusaders that, historically and to this day the crimes commited in the name of christianity and more recently democracy have killed more innocent civilians than any unguided terrorist or legitimate muslim army. the 1st crusade = christian army killed all civilians in jerussalem, saladin took it back later without harming civilians. Spain you mention, when spain was under islamic control all 3 of the main religions lived peacefully and spain was at its most advanced in all fields, it was the envy of europe. when the christians took it back they massacred many, look at the country its main beauty is its history.

and many of todays technological advances have evolved from the findings of muslims centuries ago, the koran didnt say the world had for corners, unlike a certain book, which is supposed to be the word of god but has 15 or so versions. the massacre of bosinians was commited by a christian army= 8000 killed many more raped in 1995 america since the end of world war have invaded more nations and killed more civilians than any muslim, 2 million in the vietnam war says a lot, 50000 in iraq. 1ST came the opression of pallestine then came the suicide bombers, 1st came the 1st gulf war and support of israel then cam 9/11, 1st came the invasion of chechniya then came the school massacre. first came the invasion of iraq then came 7/7
AND MY POINT IS THIS IF MUSLIMS HAD DONE TO THE WEST, WHAT THE WEST HAS DONE TO MUSLIMS, HOW WOULD U FEEL. CONSIDERING HOW U FEEL NOW DUE THE ACTS OF A FEW DRIVEN CRAZY BY OPPRESSION AND SEEING THIER POEPLE KILLED, ROBED AND RAPED"

crimes commited in the name of christianity and democracy :: Reader comments at Daniel Pipes (http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/37256)


We are not so nice as we would like to believe we are... Not to mention Hitler was a Christian and had the Catholic church behind him.

And I hope that your point is not that the JudoChristian Community here are all bad folks. It kinda feels a little like being attacked.

[Gulfhills]

How can you say that? I am 73 years old and never met anyone from the American Christian or Jewish communities who were taught to harm us.

Have we forgotten nine eleven and Boston so recently? I know that not all Muslims are extremists but still. Who does things like that if they have a heart and a conscience, kill innocent people in the name of God? Not any religion that I know of personally.

You took the words out of my mouth!! :clap2:

[quirky3]

"Now having read some of the posts on this site, i feel that i have to inform the crusaders that, historically and to this day the crimes commited in the name of christianity and more recently democracy have killed more innocent civilians than any unguided terrorist or legitimate muslim army. the 1st crusade = christian army killed all civilians in jerussalem, saladin took it back later without harming civilians. Spain you mention, when spain was under islamic control all 3 of the main religions lived peacefully and spain was at its most advanced in all fields, it was the envy of europe. when the christians took it back they massacred many, look at the country its main beauty is its history.

and many of todays technological advances have evolved from the findings of muslims centuries ago, the koran didnt say the world had for corners, unlike a certain book, which is supposed to be the word of god but has 15 or so versions. the massacre of bosinians was commited by a christian army= 8000 killed many more raped in 1995 america since the end of world war have invaded more nations and killed more civilians than any muslim, 2 million in the vietnam war says a lot, 50000 in iraq. 1ST came the opression of pallestine then came the suicide bombers, 1st came the 1st gulf war and support of israel then cam 9/11, 1st came the invasion of chechniya then came the school massacre. first came the invasion of iraq then came 7/7
AND MY POINT IS THIS IF MUSLIMS HAD DONE TO THE WEST, WHAT THE WEST HAS DONE TO MUSLIMS, HOW WOULD U FEEL. CONSIDERING HOW U FEEL NOW DUE THE ACTS OF A FEW DRIVEN CRAZY BY OPPRESSION AND SEEING THIER POEPLE KILLED, ROBED AND RAPED"

crimes commited in the name of christianity and democracy :: Reader comments at Daniel Pipes (http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/37256)


We are not so nice as we would like to believe we are... Not to mention Hitler was a Christian and had the Catholic church behind him.

Good information - I think it is important to keep a perspective, and put ourselves in the shoes of others too.

[angiefox10]

And I hope that your point is not that the JudoChristian Community here are not all bad folks. It kinda feels a little like being attacked.

I am not making a point... I google.. (these were just two quick googles) you come to conclusions... Interesting conclusion....

[chachacha]

when people harken back to the crusades, it does nothing to solve the problems we have today....the crusades were fought to take back territories that were overrun by muslims to begin with...it solves nothing to bring up old hatreds....the most sensible post on here was the poster who advised us to prevent closed muslim communities on our own land where Sharia law trumps the laws of our constitution. the new immigration law allows for much broader immigration from the mideast....this is not a good idea, although i personally know a wonderful young muslim man from jordan who would love to move here for the safety of his family...each person's history must be vetted and at present we don't seem to have the system in place to do that....we have the right to maintain the western civilization of our culture in America.

[billethkid]

I think Religions are basically violent organizations Islam or Christian or Jewish,does not matter.

talk about applying an isolated event to tar a general population......all are entitled to an opinion or "think".....and how many violent christian organizations do you really know of here in the USA??

I always enjoy when the subject of Islamic violence is raised, someone always feels obligated to present Islam is no different than the rest of religions........to me tha is nothing more than :censored: BS and pot stirring/baiting.

btk

[angiefox10]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdtwTeBPYQA

[blueash]

"If America is to be put in its place – put right – (Muslims) must risk martyrdom and force (America) to the crux where it has to decide either to acknowledge (Mohammad) as (commander) or to begin drinking holy blood"

Scary stuff. Calling for martyrdom against American infidels who don't share the speaker's religious extremism.


Edit: Perhaps I should indicate that where I have utilized parentheses I have not directly quoted the original author. Further clarification to follow

Additional information:

Here is the full and unaltered quote, written by Peter Leithart and cited by David Lane in his article "Wage War to Restore a Christian America". Mr Lane http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Lane_(activist) is an activist and organizer for various "Christian" groups and their political allies.

"If America is to be put in its place – put right – Christians must risk martyrdom and force Babel to the crux where it has to decide either to acknowledge Jesus an imperator and the church as God’s imperium or to begin drinking holy blood"

Like I wrote, scary stuff, but coming from the American Taliban

[Suzi]

This is a struggle that has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue until one side completely eliminates the other. The Muslims will not be satisfied until 100% of the world adheres to their laws and beliefs. And the Christians and Jews will never allow that to happen until they stop it or die trying. As long as any religion believes they must have everyone believe as they do, it will continue.

And for those of you who want to stick your head in the sand and ignore it, you or your children and definitely your grand children will pay the price for that folly. Everyone says it's just a few extremists who are out killing people, however the real major issues is the rest of the Muslim religion condones it and does nothing to stop it. I know several Muslims and have discussed this issue with them. And while they will say "it's awful or I would never do that" and while they actually prefer to live in peace, they believe those extremists have a right to do what they are doing. They don't encourage it, they don't engage in it, but they don't denounce it either.

A global religious war will eventually destroy our civilization as we know it.

when people harken back to the crusades, it does nothing to solve the problems we have today....the crusades were fought to take back territories that were overrun by muslims to begin with...it solves nothing to bring up old hatreds....the most sensible post on here was the poster who advised us to prevent closed muslim communities on our own land where Sharia law trumps the laws of our constitution. the new immigration law allows for much broader immigration from the mideast....this is not a good idea, although i personally know a wonderful young muslim man from jordan who would love to move here for the safety of his family...each person's history must be vetted and at present we don't seem to have the system in place to do that....we have the right to maintain the western civilization of our culture in America.

Agree. An earlier poster noted we have a bigger stick, so lets use it....stop the PC discussions and do the work that needs to be done. If we don't have the collective stomach to profile, refuse immigration, deport, retaliate, deny aid, allow them to kill and bomb each other without our intervention, we will eventually end up like many European countries who face dire circumstances very soon.

[Golfingnut]

I think Religions are basically violent organizations Islam or Christian or Jewish,does not matter.

You are correct. The more fanatical people are made to become in there religious beliefs the more violent they are. Even in Christianity, when they believe too deeply in Christianity they misinterprit the word and become violent as evidenced by the nuts that kill abortion doctors. Religion taken too literally has driven many otherwise normal folks to insanity and terribly violent acts thruout history.

[senior citizen]

...........

[Happydaz]

Reading many of these posts is a little scary. I am grateful that our leaders and politicians in the world try to solve things with diplomacy before resorting to war and violence. I think the tone of these postings shows the intransigence and closed mind thinking that many people give in to as they age. Thank goodness for young people, they are often more loving and more forgiving than us older folks. Our leaders need to tread carefully in these minefields of international relations. Still, I cannot forgive the many acts of terrorism that have been done by extreme Islamists. That kind of indiscriminate killing is what is so evil. Their goal is to hurt people, not to really accomplish anything. It is the cowards way to do things behind people's backs. You would think they would spend their money and energies improving their people's lives. There is so much more that could be accomplished there. Maybe leaders can arise that will see the error of these methods and begin to rebuild their countries. It happened in Northern Ireland. Who knows, maybe it can happen some day in these war wracked areas. There can always be hope that change can happen.

[graciegirl]

Additional information:

Here is the full and unaltered quote, written by Peter Leithart and cited by David Lane in his article "Wage War to Restore a Christian America". Mr Lane http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Lane_(activist) is an activist and organizer for various "Christian" groups and their political allies.

"If America is to be put in its place – put right – Christians must risk martyrdom and force Babel to the crux where it has to decide either to acknowledge Jesus an imperator and the church as God’s imperium or to begin drinking holy blood"

Like I wrote, scary stuff, but coming from the American Taliban

I have been an American Christian all of my life and have NEVER heard anything like that from any Christian I know or have read. Assuredly not always a wonderful example of my faith, but none the less a Christian.

I wish that the American people were hearing more denouncing and more disgust and more compassion from the Muslim community over the bombing in Boston.

It is frightening to me that as you become more devout and more involved you become more dangerous. A devout Muslim and a devout Christian or a devout Jew are widely separated in their beliefs in my opinion.

[senior citizen]

..............

[rubicon]

Well it took us and the rest of the Western Hemisphere quite a bit of time and a hard road but through Judeo-Christian teachings, and a respect for the rule a law our democracy has finally reached a maturity and understanding of individual rights, etc. I do agree with those posters who remind us that it is a waste of time going back in history to address the OP's fundamental question. The question is relevant for only today.

The problem with the Arab world is that their still tribal and such will never be united. Compare this to the United States wherein despite racial/ethnic divides citizens unite for the common good. This is the essential issue with immigration wherein assimilation to the American experience and thinking is necessary to protect the common good. This is why it is tragic that some ethic-American are radicalized to go against their country (American terrorist)

I do not deal in absolutes. so while some members of the Islamic faith declare jihad not all do. and this will continue because of the tribal nature of these countries. Tribes cannot be governed their personal perspective as to their religion and the nature their tribal customs will continue to dictate their course of events.

So I believe the only effective way of dealing with Islam violence is to find ways to united these societies in democratic practice. Until then keep your weapons loaded.

Sharia Law can gain power here in America. all one has to do is look at the fact that Wiccan church is the 7th largest in the world.

[senior citizen]

.........

[wendyquat]

:agree:This is a struggle that has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue until one side completely eliminates the other. The Muslims will not be satisfied until 100% of the world adheres to their laws and beliefs. And the Christians and Jews will never allow that to happen until they stop it or die trying. As long as any religion believes they must have everyone believe as they do, it will continue.

And for those of you who want to stick your head in the sand and ignore it, you or your children and definitely your grand children will pay the price for that folly. Everyone says it's just a few extremists who are out killing people, however the real major issues is the rest of the Muslim religion condones it and does nothing to stop it. I know several Muslims and have discussed this issue with them. And while they will say "it's awful or I would never do that" and while they actually prefer to live in peace, they believe those extremists have a right to do what they are doing. They don't encourage it, they don't engage in it, but they don't denounce it either.

A global religious war will eventually destroy our civilization as we know it.

:agree: Sadly!

[BarryRX]

I knew when I read the title of this post that it was a loaded question that would get some very strong responses. It didn't ask "what can we do about Islamic extremist violence"', just "what can we do about Islamic violence?". To say that Jewish and Christian religions are nonviolent is to forget history. Christian history includes the inquisition, the burning of witches in Salem, and anti-semetic pogroms throughout Russia and Eastern Europe for centuries, eventually resulting in the holocaust. As a Jew, I have always questioned the violence in the Old Testament, where a supreme being floods the world and kills almost every living soul. We celebrated Passover in April, in which G-d frees the Jews from Egyptian slavery by sending plagues that culminate in the killing of every Egyptian first born child....innocent children all! One of the ways we built our great country was by the wholesale slaughter of the heathen Indians. So, I think we are in a very fluid time where we are in the process of learning how to balance our constitutional freedoms against our need from safety from terrorists, both of the Muslim extremist variety and the home grown Timothy McVeighs as well as the school and mall mass murderers. They are all terrorists to me, because if something were to happen to one of my grandchildren whether it be a Muslim extremist, a Westboro Baptist church bible thumping nut job, an antigovernment militant, or a mentally deranged teenager with a weapon, my heartache would be the same. Except for a very, very few incidents of antisemitism in my life, I have experienced nothing but love and respect from Christians and Muslims I have known. But, we cannot ignore our histories or we will be in danger of repeating our mistakes.

[quirky3]

I knew when I read the title of this post that it was a loaded question that would get some very strong responses. It didn't ask "what can we do about Islamic extremist violence"', just "what can we do about Islamic violence?". To say that Jewish and Christian religions are nonviolent is to forget history. Christian history includes the inquisition, the burning of witches in Salem, and anti-semetic pogroms throughout Russia and Eastern Europe for centuries, eventually resulting in the holocaust. As a Jew, I have always questioned the violence in the Old Testament, where a supreme being floods the world and kills almost every living soul. We celebrated Passover in April, in which G-d frees the Jews from Egyptian slavery by sending plagues that culminate in the killing of every Egyptian first born child....innocent children all! One of the ways we built our great country was by the wholesale slaughter of the heathen Indians. So, I think we are in a very fluid time where we are in the process of learning how to balance our constitutional freedoms against our need from safety from terrorists, both of the Muslim extremist variety and the home grown Timothy McVeighs as well as the school and mall mass murderers. They are all terrorists to me, because if something were to happen to one of my grandchildren whether it be a Muslim extremist, a Westboro Baptist church bible thumping nut job, an antigovernment militant, or a mentally deranged teenager with a weapon, my heartache would be the same. Except for a very, very few incidents of antisemitism in my life, I have experienced nothing but love and respect from Christians and Muslims I have known. But, we cannot ignore our histories or we will be in danger of repeating our mistakes.

:BigApplause:

[senior citizen]

..........

[nitehawk]

what i could never understand is what could cause such a hatered for a religous group to cause a holacost angainst that group. What did the American indians do to cause such a holacost and what did the jewish people in Germany do to cause a holacost. What causes people to be anti-semetic. Why ??

[Golfingnut]

Any person that that is willing to believe and act on their religious teachings is a danger to us all. ALL faiths encourage violence against others if they differ from their specific religion. When it comes to violence, I see very little difference between Christian and any other belief. The less educated the individual, the easier it is to lead them toward acts of violence. Religious leaders of all faiths have used fear to keep the masses obedient to those in power for thousands of years.

[angiefox10]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YOTxammRTw

[senior citizen]

.....

[graciegirl]

All I know is what I've read on the subject with regard to Adolph Hitler , who probably had mental problems, believing that the blonde blue eyed Aryan race was superior to the Jews......and wanting to exterminate them.

I had a Jewish girlfriend in elementary school who actually was blonde with green eyes as were her parents, blonde with blue and green eyes.
So, go figure. They were Russian Jews. The grandparents had come from Russia.

I have another friend up here in Vermont who comes from Polish Jews; again blonde when young, with beautiful blue eyes; ditto for her husband and kids...now all adults.

In our neighborhood now, our dear friend does have dark brown hair and brown eyes but her kids were blonde........she's the one who was born in a concentration camp where her parents were interred by the Nazi's.
All of her parents families were exterminated by the Germans in those camps. Very sad to hear the stories.

Who knows why people are cruel to others. Hitler was a first class nut job.


p.s.
However, I do remember my mother telling me when I was a child that not only Jews were killed during the holocaust, but Catholics and other religious groups as well...........I know Ukrainians were killed. She was Ukrainian. They'd read it in their Ukie newspapers.

Also, all of my Jewish friends have always been ECUMENICAL to a fault.
They came to our Christmas parties and brought tree ornaments.
They invited us to their Chanukah / Hannukah (still can't spell it) parties.
Love those potato latkes with sour cream and apple sauce.

They still send me Christmas cards as do their children.

I will say it again.....all races, all ethnic groups and all religious groups can enrich our lives..........why anyone would want to exterminate others is a mystery to me..........other than what I've read.

I very much agree with your statement..

I too try to respect others and celebrate cultural and religious differences, but I am really scared when people embrace the idea of killing me and the people I love for religious reasons. And, I wish that the people who speak for the Muslim community would denounce the bombings in such a way that I thought they meant it and I believed that they didn't think it was the right thing to do. Every time they were asked on camera that I saw they didn't denounce but talked about how they were being badly treated.

[Taltarzac725]

I knew when I read the title of this post that it was a loaded question that would get some very strong responses. It didn't ask "what can we do about Islamic extremist violence"', just "what can we do about Islamic violence?". To say that Jewish and Christian religions are nonviolent is to forget history. Christian history includes the inquisition, the burning of witches in Salem, and anti-semetic pogroms throughout Russia and Eastern Europe for centuries, eventually resulting in the holocaust. As a Jew, I have always questioned the violence in the Old Testament, where a supreme being floods the world and kills almost every living soul. We celebrated Passover in April, in which G-d frees the Jews from Egyptian slavery by sending plagues that culminate in the killing of every Egyptian first born child....innocent children all! One of the ways we built our great country was by the wholesale slaughter of the heathen Indians. So, I think we are in a very fluid time where we are in the process of learning how to balance our constitutional freedoms against our need from safety from terrorists, both of the Muslim extremist variety and the home grown Timothy McVeighs as well as the school and mall mass murderers. They are all terrorists to me, because if something were to happen to one of my grandchildren whether it be a Muslim extremist, a Westboro Baptist church bible thumping nut job, an antigovernment militant, or a mentally deranged teenager with a weapon, my heartache would be the same. Except for a very, very few incidents of antisemitism in my life, I have experienced nothing but love and respect from Christians and Muslims I have known. But, we cannot ignore our histories or we will be in danger of repeating our mistakes.

Very well put. I went to the University of Denver in 1983-1984 to get a MA in Librarianship and Information Management. There was a small group of Muslims from various Islamic countries who befriended me after I started to hang out with a librarian from the University of Mosul in Iraq named Mohammad Mahmood. He had very different views from some of the other Muslims whose ideas were each different from another and molded by their families, mosques, nations, etc. Mahmood was a brother of one of Saddam Hussein's military leaders so he was a bit zealous in his opinions. I never met his wife for instance as she always had to stay in another room and the Muslim men did not bring their wives to Mahmood's apartment out of respect for his philosophy and religious views.

The Iran-Iraq war was going on at this time and Mahmood would tell me stuff he got from his brother.

After graduation, I started a correspondence with Mahmood who was back in Mosul. We remained friends for a short amount of time as his views on America became more and more radicalized as the war drag on (the Iran-Iraq war). His views became too anti-US and anti-West for me and mine seemed to have become too whatever for his own approach to life.

My point in this is that Muslims come from different countries, regions, families, and have different educational backgrounds. All kinds of forces can mold how anyone thinks and feels. Mahmood's brother was also involved with the Iran-Iraq war I some way as a military leader and these kind of relationships can also have a dramatic affect on how views develop.

Mahmood even started talking about joining the fight against Iran even though he seemed like one of the most gentle of people when I knew him at the University of Denver.

[TexaninVA]

Wrong.

Timothy McVey was a Christian. There have been TONS of Christians who terrorized and killed fellow American citizens because of their skin color, religion, and sexual persuasion. We formed the country by killing savages because we were spreading the teachings of the good book taking their land along the way. Christian missionaries basically stole all the land from the native Hawaiians.

Please don't tell me that Christians are members of the good religion and Muslims are bad members of theirs.

When you asked me who does things ike that? I think you got your answer. We are no better or worse than they are. The only difference is we carry a big stick and they carry a little one.


Monkei ... To argue that the proclivity for bloody violence amongst modern day Christians is no better or worse than the proclivity amongst contemporary Isalamicsts is to literally deny the reality of what everyone's eyes can easily see in the news. Why would you even attempt to make such an obviously inaccurate assertion ??

[nitehawk]

Wrong.

Timothy McVey was a Christian. There have been TONS of Christians who terrorized and killed fellow American citizens because of their skin color, religion, and sexual persuasion. We formed the country by killing savages because we were spreading the teachings of the good book taking their land along the way. Christian missionaries basically stole all the land from the native Hawaiians.

Please don't tell me that Christians are members of the good religion and Muslims are bad members of theirs.

When you asked me who does things ike that? I think you got your answer. We are no better or worse than they are. The only difference is we carry a big stick and they carry a little one.
:clap2::clap2::clap2:

[TexaninVA]

what i could never understand is what could cause such a hatered for a religous group to cause a holacost angainst that group. What did the American indians do to cause such a holacost and what did the jewish people in Germany do to cause a holacost. What causes people to be anti-semetic. Why ??


Nite … with respect to your comment about what did the Indians “do” to cause such a holocaust (ie by the Europeans against the Native Americans) … they didn’t do anything. They just ended up on the losing side of history. No one’s fault per se … just the way aggressive humans interact when one culture expands and the opponent retreats or is overwhelmed. My great grandmother was a Cherokee so I’m not being critical of Indians per se.

But, for purposes of historical consistency, do you ever wonder what the Gallic tribes of modern day France “did” to cause the Romans to invade and conquer them during Caesar’s time? For that matter, does it still upset you and strike you as unfair that the Vandals, Goths and various other “barbarian” tribes overran the Roman empire? Or what about when the Romans sacked Carthage to include salting the earth such that it literally vanished from the face of the earth? Just asking …

[gustavo]

How can you say that? I am 73 years old and never met anyone from the American Christian or Jewish communities who were taught to harm us.



The Crusades killed millions of Muslims in the name of a Christian God. Just to name one example.

[TexaninVA]

The Crusades killed millions of Muslims in the name of a Christian God. Just to name one example.

Gus ... you seem to have a one sided view of history. People always cite the Crusades in the manner you do, but never mention that Islam conquered the Holy Land several centuries before then. In other words, Islam took the area by force from what was then called Christendom, and to some extent the Crusades was a counter reaction.

Also, lots of people where killed ... no doubt about that, but I'm unaware of any reliable historical source that totals the actual combat casualties in "the millions."

While all cultures have their faults, the history of Islam is largely one of conversion by military conquest whereas Christianity largely spread through the Gospel and voluntary conversions. Muhammad was a (very effective) warrior whereas Christ was a pacifist. In other words, there is indeed an obvious difference between the two religions in this regard.

The OP who started this thread asked what can be done about Islamic violence? Given that it's been going strong since 630AD or so, it's a very good question.

[perrjojo]

Many have posted about what Christians and others have done in the PAST and it is true that many atrocities have been committed in the name of whatever God you believe in. I think the issue is...what is happening TODAY and what can we do, if anything, to stem the tide of violence in the name of God.

[graciegirl]

The Crusades killed millions of Muslims in the name of a Christian God. Just to name one example.


Did I fail to say in THIS DAY AND AGE????? I say what I said again. I don't know of any large group of Christians or Jews out to kill in the NAME of their religion, in this day and age. There are little pockets of extremists like the pastor in Florida that burnt the Quran and the family who ruin funerals of good people. But for the most part people aren't being Christian martyrs much these days. Whereas the more involved in the Muslim faith a person is the more likely they will do what terrorists have done. They believe they are doing the right thing, I will give them that.

There are extreme Christians these days but they don't go around killing people. Don't force them to dance and you are safe.

My uncle always told me, "There are a lot of sincere people in Hell".

[saratogaman]

Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber (among others) were Christians.
It's not about particular religions, it's about nasty individuals regardless of their beliefs or upbringing.

[graciegirl]

Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber (among others) were Christians.
It's not about particular religions, it's about nasty individuals regardless of their beliefs or upbringing.

But they didn't kill in the name of their faith is my point. Islamic terrorists kill in the name of religion and are taught to do that by their faith.