No legal way to exit roundabout to resident gate
 

The following was confirmed yesterday by a Sumter Deputy: There is a problem with design of roundabout exits into to Village gates that makes one particular maneuver impossible to safely and legally perform.

To follow using a diagram, click the brochure below and follow using the right side diagram. Let's say you are a resident entering the traffic circle in the car that is lowest on the diagram, intending to turn left (taking the 3rd exit)...

So you are in the proper lane, the inside lane. As you approach the 3rd exit, you see that the inside lane carries you to the visitor gate. But you are a resident. How can you change lanes against traffic that may be merging behind you?

My answer is you can't without violating lane change rules and crossing the path of oncoming drivers. In those situations, I use the visitor gate. I've had several near crashes. The deputy said that when there is a crash, "I try to figure out who's at fault." throws his hands in the air; gives a wry chuckle...what else can he do..

http://www.districtgov.org/community...t-02-08-12.pdf

I just split the lanes I try to stay right in the middle of both lanes that way I can go either way it keeps everybody behind me behind me kind of like being the pace car I know your frustration I sometimes worry does the light in the refrigerator really go out when you close the door!?

I believe there is an easy fix to this problem. As per the diagram, add an additional "Channelization Island" to force the inside lane driver who is turning left to the outside lane allowing that driver to pick either entrance. Whether or not this prevents the nut traveling in the same direction as you in the outside lane from rounding the circle to exit at the third exit is debatable. Take for example the roundabout at the St James gate. The south side of the roundabout has a "channelization island" forcing the driver to the outside lane in that part of the circle only but allowing that driver to either stay in the left lane to continue north on BV or stay right into the golf course. But the north side of the roundabout does not have the "channelization island" allowing both lanes to be active. The driver who is traveling north on BV and intends on entering the St James gate needs to drift from the inside lane to the outside lane (on the north side of the circle) to make the resident entrance and prevent vehicles traveling south on BV from merging into the the roundabout. I might be wrong but I think the Stillwater/Canal roundabout has two "channelization islands". Gotta love the term, channelization island!

The easiest fix would be to make the roundabouts one lane only. Traffic should have no issues during the non-snowbird season when The Villages is not at full capacity.

I do understand that they were designed as two lanes due to the traffic volumes.

I do understand your concern and my wife and I had many discussions when we come back "on campus". We drive 466A to BV Blvd north and take the ST. James gate to enter The Villages. We legally go into the inner or left lane and 3/4ths around change over into the Residents gate. Lots of times, due to traffic and yielding to some cars that don't know or are a bit more aggressive, we just stay in the left lane and go thru the Visitor gate.

There is the answer ... both from a right-of-way / legal and some times common sense perspective.

:popcorn::popcorn::icon_bored:

I've come to prefer the visitor gate not only for safety due to not changing lanes as in the OP, but also for convenience.
It lifts just the same as the resident gate with the electronic card, and...
the visitor electronic eye is usually farther from the gate itself than is the eye on the resident side.

This allows me to arrive at the eye quicker, gives me lead time to roll while the gate opens, does not force another lane merge after entry (as does the resident side)...
and I'm usually not in line as are more folks using the resident side. It expedites traffic all over TV if people use whichever gate is not backed up.

(My guess is the visitor gate is straighter and more direct because construction and trades traffic uses it for big vehicles.)

I'll tell ya who's at fault--the idiots who decided on roundabouts! I'm with Bonanza. I don't care what the studies show, this is not a safe area (elderly drivers, people not used to roundabouts who can't figure out the signs, crowded streets in the winter) to have roundabouts, much less two-lane roundabouts. A stop sign or traffic light every so often on BV and Morse would suffice.

Hey , at least you can go around again if you would otherwise get hit trying to get in the resident lane....:highfive:
feel like an idiot, but safe...

I shutter at the thought of the unmitigated horror that would be stop signs on BVB or Morse

No matter what...
 

Regardless of lane changing "best practices", I would never exit if there is a car to my right where I cannot safely exit from the left lane. Since there is no car to my right I can safely use whichever gate I wish.

There should never be a car to your right as you are exiting from the inside lane, unless they have entered the round about incorrectly. If they have done that I am not about to prove "I am right" by taking the exit in front of them.

PS. JMO, I feel much safer traversing a round-about than going through an intersection when the light is green. No one can kill me in a round about...

I don't believe it matters as you exit the round-about to a gate whether you use the visitor or resident lanes. Both work equally well and the same. In fact there are exit lanes on some of the newer gates that have the two lanes that are marked visitor/resident and resident.

:22yikes::22yikes:

I agree with most of what you say, except that... if you are in the inside lane, no matter which entrance you use, you have to cross over that outside lane to get to the gate. And there are so many people who don't yield when entering the roundabout because they think they don't have to if their lane is clear. That puts them frequently in the outside lane when you are crossing over.

If someone's at the yield sign as I pass it on the inside lane, I really keep an eye on them to see where they're going to end up vis-a-vis where I am when crossing over. That means I have to be looking at two places at once.

Roundabouts stink, IMO.

So, use the visitors gate. It's free.

I like Round Abouts as opposed to perpendiculay intersections, controlled by stop signs or stop lights.

Yes you must be alert. You need to scan your mirrors , follow the basic rules and use common sense.

Intersections waste massive amounts of fuel, make serious high speed head on and Tbone collisions possible .

I vote for the circles

I can't even come up with an "educated guess" to how many dollars I've spent in gasoline waiting for a traffic light to change. The roundabouts make "cents" (dollars) to me.

Can we refocus on the topic of danger getting from the left lane into the resident gate lane? Roundabouts aren't likely to change.
That leaves just us drivers to do the best we can.

As for me, if I'm negotiating a turn into a Village gate where I'm supposed to approach from the left lane, I will stay in the left lane and use the visitor gate. That's such a simple solution it seems it should go without saying.

What do the lane use signs approaching the roundabout say. All motorists entering a modern roundabout must yield to all motorists in the circulatory roadway, both lanes. If you are on the inside lane and making a left turn, then you should be able to complete the left turn to exit. If the exit does not have two lanes, then the inside lane should taper out as you go around so it becomes the outside lane as you approach your 'left turn' exit.

What gets me is when someone stops in the circle to let the other traffic go. Also I have always said these circles are to small diameter to be used properly. But I do agree just go in either side the card works both.

Looks like you answered your own OP.

Nothing is perfect.

Defensive driving is always good.

Agree, Kitty. And to paraphrase what I believe George Carlin once said...it goes without saying. That's the reason I'm saying it. ;^)

Can we agree that the roundabouts are what they are and are not going to change?

That is exactly what I thought the first time I encountered those two lane round-a-bouts! They really should be single lane! No one in the Villages needs to be in that big of a rush.

Protecting us from Ourselves
 

I have lived overseas in countries with roundabouts for ten years of my life and they are a significantly more effective method to keep traffic moving versus stop lights/signs. The problem is with the residents here never being properly trained in navigating them and a County Commisioner's brochure designed to protect us from ourselves rather than effectively move traffic under the guidelines followed elsewhere. First note that most TV roundabout lanes are separated by dashed lines. This should be standardized at all roundabouts but is not, adding to the confusion. In all other locations I have been changing lanes within a roundabout is not only permitted, but encouraged. The same cautions and rules apply as changing lanes on a straight stretch of road (check lane, signal, etc.). To exit from the center lane to the residents lane move over safely using a turn signal to the outside lane as you pass the second exit. One must be be cautious of others incorrectly continuing all the way around the outside lane and also of drivers entering the roundabout rather than yielding to vehicles already in the roundabout.

Let the attacks begin.

Your approach seems logical and is one of their best practices, so hard to argue with that. My question is who are you concerned about merging with after exiting round about?

From my experience I have never had an issue merging to the resident gate lane. As I posted earlier, there should be NO CAR in that right lane to merge with if I have safely exited the roundabout to a Village with gates.

No argument here, just trying to understand where you see the issue?

Yes. And the roundabout lovers, of course, win. They're not going away (that would be the roundabouts, not the lovers). But can we agree that us roundabout haters who lose get to b**** ad nauseum? Because we will, every time the subject comes up.

Right, Bonanza?

I totally agree, they should be 1 lane. I have a large roundabout near me and I have watched how it works smoothly. Every car enters 1 lane, yielding, and exits smoothly on right. In TV there are small circles with 2 lanes. For instance, I usually go north on BV from 466a, go 3/4 around to take a right into St Charles. If I am supposed to be in the left lane, I have to cross over quickly to the right lane to enter St Charles. If I am going straight on BV, I am supposed to be in the right lane. It would be safer to stay in the right lane and go 3/4 around, right into St. Charles.

Cars today have blind spots, head rests, and slop up in the back, which makes it differcult to see oncoming traffic.

The second lane is specifically for contractors to enter and exit the roundabout at any speed.

Not easy to describe.

I enter the circle at 6 oclock, circle and exit at 9 oclock. Only after I've exited onto the short runway of vis/res gates, can I legally merge into the right lane. Traffic coming from 12 oclock can enter and exit the roundabout in a second or so completing a right turn into the resident lane.

They are entering the lane to the resident gate at the same time I am trying to merge into it, moving from a position behind and right of me and into the classic blind spot. I am now physically ahead of them in the left lane trying to merge, and even though they entered the circle after me, once they've exited and are in the right lane, they claim the right of way, where a mere an instant before had looked as if a safe merge could be executed.

Where did this directive come from??

:ohdear::shocked:What difference does it make....?! Visitor or Resident gate! Just drive with caution and defensively and you will be fine..! Don''t make a big deal out of something that is fairly simple if you're paying attention!!

This just makes so much sense. Thanks.

It was a joke. That is the way they act.

Excellent! I totally agree! I always use turn signals also so others that may not be paying attention know what my intentions are! Alas turn signal use around here is almost none existent!, but that's another subject ;)

Your description makes perfect sense. You are describing someone entering the roundabout at 12:00 in a dangerous fashion maybe? They must give you room to pass the enter point knowing you may turn right.

I have not experienced that often (if at all). I look at it this way, if I have room to safely exit the round about from the left lane, no one will get to my blind spot. They cannot be that close or I could not safely exit for fear of right hooking them.

I merge to the right lane as soon as I am out of the roundabout. Truth be told I make my intentions pretty clear on my way OUT of the roundabout which is bending the "best practice", but IMO safer :throwtomatoes:.

I guess that some residents are too proud to be seen in a visitor lane.

This is without question the single most INCORRECT thing that can be done in a traffic circle! You are in effect, making a left hand turn - from the far outside lane - across all the other lanes of traffic.