Tennessee Promise: Offering free community college to all students
 

I was coming back from golf today listening to NPR. The discussion and Q&A was about Tennessee's free tuition plan. The expert says it costs Tennessee a thousand dollars per student to make this work. Students must maintain a 2.5 GPA and they can choose trade or technology courses too.

For me cheap college was the light at the end of my tunnel and it kept me busy. A little off topic but I sold a house to someone who said the first thing he's going to do after they move in is buy his 12 year old son a horse. He said you can't get in trouble if you are busy and nothing will keep a teenager more busy then owning a horse.

for more information click here

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Florida Residents' State Scholarship and Grant Programs:

http://www.floridastudentfinancialai...ome/uamain.htm

Fantastic idea. Tying it to community service is key. Here in Florida, we have the Bright Futures that helps somewhat but severely lags behind the current costs. It's great for the kids in the middle.

What happens in Tennessee stays in Tennessee....oops Obama's objective of free community college is a take off of that program and it is going to be a catastrophe for taxpayers. First Obama nationalized the student loan market adding $1 trillion in taxpayer liabilities. Then he made forgiving those loans easier which will cost taxpayers $7.6 billion in 2015 when it predicted in 2010 a 10 year $7.4 billion This year he proposes a new rating system to determine which schools the feds will give aid to.

Further there are already several federal financial assistance training programs for community colleges in existence now.

I have to disagree with your argument. The money is state money and if state money can fund such a juncture, why not? In the state of Florida, which severely lags behind academically, we need a more educated population. The kid in the middle of the road as far as income is concerned, is left to fend for themselves. The poor student has more aid than they will ever need and the wealthy kid doesn't have to worry either. The middle-class kid with average grades sees the least amount of aid available. Why not let them "work" for it through community service opportunities?

The first half of my teaching career I was a shop teacher in NJ. We watched all of those programs being phased out. What a shame. Tell me our kids don't need shop skills. Our budgets for the entire year was about $200 a class. At the same time we were preaching to get a good job you need a good education. Kids borrowed thousands and thousands of dollars only to end up in debt with a liberal arts degree, not everyone but many.

This program seems like a way to make things right for young people. It gives me hope and as I said before the guy on NPR said that it is costing Tennessee about a thousand dollars a student.

Hi jbdlfan: I am not questioning the Tennessee state plan. I agree with it and your rationale and in fact want the fed to cut back and stop superseding state rights. My point was to say that the fed is going to nationalize this state plan and we know that old story its going to cost taxpayers big bucks and because it is national it won't be monitored and it will be a complete failure like so many other fed programs

Personal Best Regards

I served on the boards of a community college for four years and a university for 15 years. I don't see how a state can provide 3/4 of the costs incured by a CC student for $1000 per year. My suspicion is that it would exceed $7000 for full time students. The mandates imposed by the Feds would no doubt be unpalatable to many communities. How many programs have we seen where the Feds create a program, suck in cash hungry constituents, then abandon the effort leaving states and cities holding the bag? The devil is,as always, in the details.:MOJE_whot:

Don't you want more people making more money to pay off the debt? How can you make more money without a high paying job? How can you get a high paying job without skills?

I invested in my children's education and 2 out of 3 are making 6 figures. They went to NJIT, a state school with a more reasonable tuition, majored in Engineering and worked part time in college. I invested a lot more then a thousand a year. This also looks like a great investment to me.

I think the real problem is that students can't wait to start studying when they get to a free college. It has to begin when they are 4 or 5 years old. I think we need to somehow tie free college into all of the years leading up to college. Kids need to see the pay-off of studying.

I'm not sure how to do that.

tomwed: I agree many of the blue collar positions have become high paying jobs and many are going unfilled

I don't get it either. It sounds too inexpensive, too good to be true. I'm going to try and figure out what actual show on NPR I was listening to today. I think it was around 12:30. It was just starting to rain.
I got it. It's called the take-away and you can listen to the broadcast by clicking here It's about 20 minutes in the program. It's called Tennessee Promise. They started it in 2008.

1. I funded my way through school and like you my children.

2. Many prospective students need skin in the game

3. It doesn't matter if more people are making more money because if the pols continue with their irrational exuberance their won't ever be enough taxpayer money to keep up with them

How much was your tuition? Mine was $350 a year. I'm guessing all my college living expenses came out to $2,500 a year and my first year teaching my contract was $10,400.
How does that compare to today's tuition and today's first year teaching contracts? It's not even close. But you are a smart person and you know all that.

Sure they need skin in the game. Free tuition does not mean every college expense and living expense is free. You know that too, you raised kids.

Come on now, don't be bashful. Tell us what you really think!

I meant that "SShhhhhhhh…" sarcastically.

I think we should be looking at the existing state tuition assistance programs and making them more known to high-school students, especially in the vocational and trades classes that most kids are not even encouraged to look at.

Our kids are recent college graduates and they and most of their peers were told nothing about vocational/trades curriculum and the fact that some of the coursework can be taken while doing college prep curriculum in high school.

Of course, we wanted our kids to become working taxpayers! We started saving for college the month our first child was born. They didn't qualify for financial aid and we gladly paid their tuition, room and board…..AND they worked summers and holidays all the way thru college. They are on their own with their careers because they are independent-minded and have a work ethic that says "I can do it myself!". That didn't come by accident. We worked on it every single day, reminding ourselves that kids tune in more on what you do than what you say.

As someone said above, it's the kids in the middle income brackets with working parents who need assistance the most. Adding to their parents' "tax liability" and knowing the spending and tax-legislating appetites of legislators, these families will be hurt, not helped by more federal "help" being touted.

I'm sorry. I'm not good at picking up sarcasm on-line.
Are you saying that middle class families taxes will go up more then college tuition would cost their children?
Can you back that up?

How is it that a country, like Germany can fully fund every student for either university or trade school education and we can't do it in this country.

Germany has the strongest economy in Europe and a huge exporter of manufactured goods of high quality. Taxes for workers are higher than in the US, to be sure, but there a lot more of them.

I worked in a manufacturing subsidiary of my company, in Germany and they had the highest skilled workforce I have ever seen. Every single employee was either a university graduate or tech school grad. ...and I do mean EVERY employee, right down to janitorial.

By the way, every one of those employees had free healthcare too...

I'm just astonished they can figure this out and we can't....

For one thing, Germany and the other European countries have not had to bear the full cost of their defense. We have borne the brunt of much of the cost since the end of World War II. Let's also not forget that we bore the cost of rebuilding Germany after WWII.

Don't get me wrong I'm not complaining and there is little I would change if I could. However I think it is only fair to note their ability to pay for other things. As an aside, several times over my career, I hosted German officials who felt their healthcare system was in a poor state and wanted to learn more about ours.

No. I'm saying that middle class families' taxes are already too big of a burden because of all the other existing programs that are already in place in the states and federally, and because of their taxes going toward financing the lower-income students/families' education and increasing medical insurance costs before their own! It leaves little to put toward their own kids' college savings/costs while repaying the parents' own student loans and trying to pay for the family's higher medical insurance premiums and deductibles.

I like the sound of the president's proposal to give community college tuition "free", but knowing how Washington "manages" money, it's their "management results" that I worry about.

I don't know about what you're seeing, but I don't see middle-class tax burdens going down. And then there is inflation that is going to have to be unleashed at some point because of the elephant in the room: $18 trillion in national debt.

Again, I think we need to work on bolstering and making known the existing state college assistance programs, along with serious career-counseling all the way thru high school, about which most 20-somethings would ask "what's that"?

See: http://fortune.com/2012/11/20/why-co...unity-college/

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Actually, it isn't that we haven't figured it out. There are just a lot of us that don't want to invest money in the future of our country. If someone is uneducated, mentally ill, or physically sick and can't pay for it . . . too bad for them. We made our money and we're keeping it, and to hell with everyone else. A rising tide lifts all boats? Not on our watch.

Here's where the happiest people live and what they are doing differently from us:

http://unsdsn.org/wp-content/uploads...013_online.pdf

My grad school was $450 per credit hour. My son's tuition et al at Emory was $40,000 per year back in the 90's. I paid for my and my kids education 100%. No debt involved. I was blessed to be able to afford it. Couldn't do it now!

This is one of those "just WOW" posts. Wanda, our nation is technically bankrupt. We are $18 TRILLION in Debt, have over $100 TRILLION in unfunded liabilities (bills without the money to pay them) and we currently borrow 44 cents out of every federal dollar spent. Please help me understand your post above where the US taxpayer has been unwilling to "invest" money in the future of our country.

To me, it sure sounds like we've gone crazy with the national credit card "investing in the future of our country". Please help me understand your position.

What year and what grad school was $450 per credit hour? I went to school from 1970 to 1975.
Tuition History
What was tuition at Emory University five, ten, fifteen or twenty years ago? Hop into our time machine and take a look. Pay attention to how aggressive the school has been with price increases the past as it provides indication as to how the school may raise tuition in the next few years if you enrolled. Historical tuition and fees for all available data years back to 1988 follows.

Year Tuition Annual Increase
2010 $38,036 4.7%
2009 $36,336 5.8%
2008 $34,336 5.6%
2007 $32,506 5.6%
2006 $30,794 5%
2005 $29,322 4.9%
2004 $27,952 3.8%
2003 $26,932 5.4%
2002 $25,552 4.2%
2001 $24,532 6.1%
2000 $23,130 5.8%
1999 $21,870 3.6%
1998 $21,110 6.2%
1997 $19,870 4.6%
1996 $19,000 6.6%
1995 $17,830 6%
1994 $16,820 7.8%
1993 $15,600 7%
1992 $14,580 6.4%
1991 $13,700 10.4%
1990 $12,410 10.7%
1989 $11,210 10%
1988 $10,190 8.8%
1987 $9,370

You are a good dad. I couldn't afford Emory for my kids. I think the goal is that kids start out in a junior college and the best of the best end up at Emory. They may need to borrow 2 years of tuition but that's half of what they would have needed. These kids, our grandchildren may have the same kind of opportunity us boomers had. Doesn't that make you feel good?

Tennessee Promise: Offering free community college to all students
 

Grad = Boston University Graduate School of Management. 1975 - 1978
Emory = 1994 - 1997 remember I said tuition et al. Et al covers board & room, books etc.

My daughter went to Ole Miss on 50% scholarship. That helped.

I guess I got lucky at Glassboro State College from 1970 to 1975 because while you were paying $450 a credit for a graduate degree, I was paying $5 a credit for an undergraduate degree.
I want it to be as easy for my grandchildren to get ahead as it was for me. This sounds like a plan that might work.

I agree. I'd like it to be easy for my grandchildren as well. But I'd also like our kids to do as well as we have, avoiding wealth redistribution, so their kids have a choice

Can you explain wealth distribution to me?

Should be redistribution. It comes from increased taxes that produce revenue which the government then uses to create programs that dole it out to whomever the government believes is underserved in some sense. An example - some states print materials in 10+ languages in order remain PC and not require English as our primary language. This particular example is rampant throughout many areas of government

I did notice on the attached link that Germany, who pays for tuition is a bit lower in the happy rankings than the USA.

There are VAST differences in countries. Someone mentioned about our military, which has become the world policeman. We spend, and these are estimates about twice as much or more on defense. We pay less taxes than in Germany. The cost of an education is mucho less than in the United States. I think that in Germany, you must choose a major NEVER to be changed.

It is just a different experience in going to college in Germany, and believe it or not, not that high of a percentage go to college. The entire college experience is so much different than in the USA.

Instead of going right to FREE, we should just make it easier and cheaper. Remember the Tenn program began with private funds being used in certain counties and has now become a proposal for the state. It also covers ONLY tuition, not books, not housing, etc.

Just wonderings as I think about this. To make it seem as if the USA is doing something so underhanded I reject. We are so far in debt in this country right now, the financial future is so bleak. If we want to do a favor for young people, get the spending in hand so there is something for them to even have.

Maybe, if they ever talk to each other about tax structure, we can incorporate something in that but nobody wants to talk about that. We do have limits in this country

By just about all accounts, getting our debt under control requires reducing spending in three main areas: Medicare, medicaid, and social security.

In a June 2010 opinion piece in the Wall Street Journal, former chairman of the Federal Reserve, Alan Greenspan noted that "Only politically toxic cuts or rationing of medical care, a marked rise in the eligible age for health and retirement benefits, or significant inflation, can close the deficit."[75] If significant reforms are not undertaken, benefits under entitlement programs will exceed government income by over $40 trillion over the next 75 years.[74]

74. United States Congress, Government Accountability Office (December 17, 2007). FY 2007 Financial Report of the U.S. Government, p. 47, et al. U.S. Government Accountability Office (U.S. GAO). Retrieved February 3, 2011.

75. Greenspan, Alan (June 18, 2010). "U.S. Debt and the Greece analogy". Opinion Journal [online]. Retrieved February 3, 2011.

Any takers? Anyone willing to get their medicare or social security significantly reduced for the good of the country?

Perhaps if the thieves in Congress and the WH could leave trust funds alone, these would not be necessary. And while we are talking abut trust funds, whatever happened to the highway funds that are paid for by federal and state taxes on fuel.

I agree totally with all that you present,

Keep in mind, that all social security reductions, AND THERE WILL BE THOSE DEDUCTIONS and all the other you mention will not effect those already in those programs.

What we need is leaders with the moxie to do the right thing. This has been proposed over and over and over and always never makes it to the floor.

You are correct and it will happen or we go down the tube. Anyone with any knowledge will agree, which is why I am amazed at how we just propose spending...NEW ones I am speaking of, like the college tutition, etc. We cannot afford it.

And not wanting to get p.......l BUT the Affordable Care Act is getting more expensive and health costs are going UP not down. Health care is one of the biggest parts of the GDP and needs to come down. We need someone to start to worry about our children and grandchildren. They,already will be wallowing in debt for so long.

Then today while folks are talking about our manufacturing rebirth, on CNBC, they issue this...

"the employment participation rate remains near historic lows. CNBC's Scott Cohn reports one new study calls the idea of a renaissance in manufacturing a myth. "

Manufacturing myth?

All you say is correct. My opinion we need to get back to the basics...tax reform...employment....ALL entitlement programs reviewed. There are a lot of unpopular items to be discussed that have been skirted for sometime now.

it is my humble opinion that this sudden interest in reducing the cost of tuition for young people is a panacea to keep that demographic, who largely voted republican in the midterms. they are dismayed at the cost of their health insurance, and they have yet to figure out that the subsidies they may receive for health insurance will soon prove to be taxable income when they do their taxes. so throw them a bone with tuition help. never mind that we are already trillions in debt.

I'm confused. Are we selfish and have failed to invest in our country's future or have we overspent and over-invested in our future?

Is the "greatest generation" the greediest generation? Is that the assertion someone is suggesting?

Clearly, our nation's finances are on an unsustainable trajectory of ever-increasing debt. Is it immoral to ring up debt without any intention to repay it? Perhaps it's far more immoral to ring up debt, have no intention of repaying within your lifetime, but FORCE your debt to be repaid by your children, grandchildren and even those yet to be born.

If we can't begin to repay the debt we have now within a lifetime, how moral and reasonable is it to keep piling on more via expensive new programs of free tuition, etc…? When does the insanity stop? When do we stop kicking the debt can down the road? Do some not understand that we are enslaving future generations to a poorer quality of life to pay for our folly?

Both.

Let me be more specific. We've invested in all the wrong things. Certainly not education or infrastructure to name two, but we bail out unscrupulous companies (lenders, etc.).

B767drvr, I have a feeling you and I are going to just have to agree to disagree and leave it at that. No worries! It takes all kinds to make the world turn.

First of all, for years I have been in favor of all kids going to a 2 year community college to get their basics in, work and save some money, and not have to pay-or have someone pay 40K for 2 years to party. But, I read an analysis by someone yesterday that says this does for the college tuitions what has been done by Obamacare for health. This "free" community college is going to cost the taxpayers a boat load of money. And the "work" requirements for this priviledge is not what it seems. I would like to think this is a wonderful idea would really work, but apparently a lot of students according to the article have already said, NO THANKS, OBAMA-you have lied to us too many times already. I am certainly not an authority, but before you think this is a wonderful idea-read about. Maybe you will see things the author did not see.

BINGO!

Throw 'em a bone and assume they're too dumb or lazy to figure out where the money will eventually come from: their paychecks, if they can get/keep a job.