Fox News, The NRA Totally blind
 

It is about RACE. It is about RACISM. It is about racism being so imbedded and accepted that when a man tells his friends he is going to start a race war they think that's just a good old boy joke.

It's not a mystery Nikki Haley.
Some of us understand what motivated this act and it was not anything to do with a church.

Hey stupid Fox News person. This was not an anti-Christian act
And you GOP candidate for President
Yes they were killed because they were Christians

And you different GOP candidate for President
Oh double Yes, they were killed because Religious Liberty

And you evil NRA member who can twist everything into if we just had a whole lot more guns
Oh thank you, they were killed because GUNS aren't in everyone's hands

And you, another GOP candidate
.
No I guess you're right. It is not going to be fixed by your government if your government actively endorses the message that might encourage your activity, by say flying a flag in memory of those who fought in the first race war in this country, on the side that believed in white superiority. Or sold you a state license plate with that flag on it and whose governor can't understand what motivated this man to act.

Well the killer had told all of you what motivated him and it is RACISM It is the hatred of black people. It has nothing to do with victimizing Christians. It has nothing to do with political votes on guns. Maybe just maybe we can get those on the right to say words to acknowledge that there are racists in this country, who strangely seem to love the good old stars and bars (nothing but a symbol of Southern pride, BS).

I can't say it as well as a comment I found online:

It's hard to imagine a more dismissive treatment of the victims of a mass murder than to studiously ignore their very identity, the very thing that they were explicitly targeted and killed for, because your own ideology would prefer the truth be something different. To go even farther, and claim that their murder was not even about them, it was about your group, and how their murders prove how your group has been victimized. At least have the withered decency to acknowledge that the openly racist murderer was a racist murderer—that the man who said he was there to kill black Americans was, indeed, there to kill his victims for being black Americans. Do not give bull**** statements about your sympathies for the community when you aren't willing to even name the "community" being targeted.

This is pure hate, sans any logic.

The killings are horrible, and in this case determined by race.

Those, like this poster who supposedly can read hearts of those he quoted, and those with agendas of hate that prey on moments like this simply continue to divide us by race, religion, political division, and yes it appears by what network we choose to watch.

Political hate, racial hate, religious hate is simply hate that someone has put into a basket to "justify" hating.

I just cannot understand this kind of thing. I do know that hate, like this,so easily triggered and manifested is scary.

I support more gun control if some kind,but more than that I support a culture that will encourage understanding, allow people to listen and try.

To even attempt to place blame for the horrific acts in South Carolina on anything other than an evil heart is simply continuing the acrimony. To use these terrible actions to motivate politically or racially is just wrong.

If anyone believes truely in equality, justice, etc., then they know that race does not make you evil,a political party does not make you evil,a network does not make you evil, an organization does not make you evil.

These are all EXCUSES to be used. Evil is in your heart,and our society will not recognize that...we need some "political" excuse to hang our hat on.

This is pathetic, at best.

Your post is a perfect example of liberal racism but mixed with an irrationality and deranged view of the world that actually perpetuates what you purport to be opposed to

In your kindergarten level of thinking, it's just incredible to me that you can always find a way to make Fox News "the" bogeyman for everything you don't like. Your susceptibility to mass delusion makes you a perfect candidate for a Liberal Fuhrer to march into town one day and incite you to open up the gas ovens. I mean ... you truly have a sickness.

It's not about race nor guns. It's about "mental illness" and the parents who have no clue (like so many today) Get your kids away from violent video games, get involved and Pay attention to your kids of course these parents most likely had problems if this kid learned to hate. Also responsible are friends who heard him make any unusual comments or noticed any strange behavior and did not report it. And once again this President has no business politicising this for his anti-gun agenda

I am going to continue to say that we continue to look for political, racial, gun control, etc to explain everything.

Did this young man not have a drug problem ? Was he not taking medication that had serious side affects ? Despite his overt racial actions over time, and despite his drug problem, did his father not reward him with a gun ?

Race was not primary...guns were not primary...politics and networks were not primary. Growing up in this society will allow more of this, yet we continue to make it easy on ourselves by going after race, politics or whatever makes us feel good

Folks, our problems cannot be made political. They are basic probems we just simply refuse to discuss...family, morals,etc. and while you cannot mandate morals, we can provide leadership to strengthen the family and those said morals.

When people speak of "anti religion" , I believe they speak of ignoring the basics, and not allowing a moral society to grow.

My guess is that society in America has changed from its all about US to it's all about ME. The virtue of selfishness has corrupted our humanity.
"If I am not for myself ,who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel the Elder

There are few issues on which I agree with Ben Carson but on this point I do!!

Ben Carson warns of 'new hate' in aftermath of church massacre | MSNBC

Once you read, it my reasons for agreeing with him will be clear

Just check the previous posts.

I am going to reject this thread it is clearly apparent that their is no socially redeeming value to it nor is there an intelligent application

Personal Best Regards:

You know , the OP laid out a decent format to state a case, maybe not to your liking as far as content, but still in the spirit of this forum, and what do you do? Hurl insults. Like Rocky said, "Is that all you got?"

Ok..I will take this, and start by saying that I disagree this was a "decent" format

The first part came directly fromHuffington Post, which valiantly attempted to make this political. I saw her press conference and she was in tears most of it, and to take a comment so far out of context strikes me as using a bad situation to make political points. What sane human being does not find it a mystery as to why anyone would do something like that.

The Huffington Post column continues laying aside any reason except for what made good politics.

The post you feel was layed out so well then continues to attack GOP candidates and Fox News. ALL of them think and agree it was an hateful act and it was anti religion and racial.

Making it political was/is the total motive for this post.

Racism certainly was the overt reason for a drug addicted, drug using man with crazy racial ideas who was given a gun by his father.

Why make it politics ? Why not discuss the real underlying causes ?

This chronic using every single disaster as a political tool and another excuse to cry racist has grown very old and tiresome.

I dismiss out of hand the inane comments about the confederate flag

The OP wants a conservative, or as he puts it "those on the right to admit there is racism". Think about it clearly....who, on the right left or middle, has denied racism. The split comes with the name calling of racist on any issue, not on racism itself.

Here, I must turn political myself. Over many years, the liberals in this country OVERTLY courted races, and OVERTLY made a conscious effort to paint anyone who opposed their beliefs as racists. I worked for the Democratic Party and attest to that. It was a quiet, yet overt movement, now brought to the forefront. As you KNOW FACTUALLY, a known race baiter is the face of that party. A man who has made up stories to create problems is in charge, and do not be fooled...he is in charge of this specific dynamic. Control of this voting block is vital, and I am sorry to say, it is working.

BUT, the core problem is US, OUR MORAL COMPASS. We are lost in a haze of name calling, and flat out refuse to recognize that this crime was done by a man who is on drugs, has shown his racial side, and was gited a gun by his father despite all of that

Yet, the conversation immediately turns to right versus left. Black versus white. And as I was in all the other fronts in this ongoing story..from Ferguson to Charleston,the name calling and labeling does not even allow time for facts...the Huffingtonpice was within hours.

No, I find this thread to be EXTREMELY offensive

Totally off the wall......oh I do miss the ignore button so will have to discipline myself to not engage this type rhetoric (I am being generous and polite).

Let me clarify what I meant about "decent". I did not mean it in a moral way, but that the layout was cohesive, not necessarily the content.

Got to love this tread....

Liberals are mentally ill and race baiters while the Right believe the attack is more evidence of the WAR on Christians and then the IRA ways in with "If this CHURCH wasn't a gun free zone these people would still be alive. Of course, that last on is hard to understand given that SC has some very liberal gun laws yet none to the people, other than the gunman, were packing.

:sad::sad::sad:

I am about to make an observation which is factual, but which I also know will cause some anti-gun liberals to potentially overreact. Nonetheless, believeing in free speech here goes ...

IF (i.e. as in hypothetically) had one of the victims in the Church shooting had a concealed carry weapon, and presumably trained in its use, the racist who shot nine people WOULD have been most likely killed before he shot all nine victims. The news reports said he reloaded several times ...!! One reason none of them were carrying is that is currently against the law in SC (ie carrying in a church) and the SC State Rep / Pastor who was shot supported the ban.

From what I can tell about mass shootings, not even the craziest shooter has targeted a place where he knows there are armed men (eg police station) so in general they go to places where they KNOW no one will be armed to resist ...ie schools, churches etc.

Now, I'm just looking for reasonable and coherent comments ... not ideological rants. Does anyone disagree with the content of what I just said? Is it not common sense?

For the record, I mean no disrespect to the nine dead victims. But, more of them would be alive today if one of them had been carrying is all I'm saying.

Dallas police HQ attack: Suspect James Boulware killed - CNN.com


Did you forget about the shooting at Dallas Police Department headquarters just a week ago?

No but thanks for mentioning it. The Dallas shooter from what I recall remained outside the building and fired away ... in effect, he launched an assault on the building. He did not walk in and then open up ... because he knew he would be instantly shot dead.

But, back to my point ... do you agree / disagree that if just one of the Church victims had been armed (i.e. concealed) that it's quite likely many if not most of the victims would still be alive today? That's not really political per se but what I think one can argue is a reasonable inference.

How many did he kill?

I heard Lott on Fox spout this, his favorite theory, however the facts are quite different.

http://takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com/...-gun-use/?_r=0

Only 230 justifiable homicides involving a private citizen using a firearm. In the Aurora school shooting, even though that school had an armed guard, a shooting occurred. In the worse school shooting Colorado Columbine, there were armed guards on duty.

I'm not seeking to swap reference links with you ... which I could do. I've seen the tape of where an older guy chases off two criminals armed with weapons penetrate a facility in Ocala for example. About 18 months ago.

Instead, I'm saying it seems logical ... eg you bring "Fox" into it and use the derisive term "spout" which indicates to me you still have an ideological filter vs thinking it through logically.

If you were the SC shooter, you assumed none of the peaceful folk next to you had a firearm. However, if after you fired the first shot, someone started shooting back to you really think the racist would, or could, have stood there, shot 8 more people and reloaded? I hope you will think about it and respond.

I just want to support your comment on hearing the reference to Fox and spouting and how it was used. It makes me weary to be honest and it NEVER EVER ceases

I very much disagree with that logic. I've owned guns all my adult life but have little use for NRA and the interpertation of 2nd amendment. When you look at the shooting galleries our cities have become you'd really have to stretch to say that is what the Found Fathers had in mind. My home state just passed a anybody can carry a concealed firearm as long as they do not have a felony conviction and can maintain a body temperature of around 98 degrees. So to answer your question I don't this if one of those elderly women had been packing it would have made much difference.

Totally agree! I remember some time ago when an 80 year old lady got knocked to the ground and her purse stolen. This was at one of the strip malls on Hwy 441 just on the outskirts of The Villages. There was a lot of TOTV chat that she should have been armed and the mugger would have been shot by her.

Regarding the guy who shot the robbers inside the Ocala internet gambling hall - very reckless to start shooting inside the building which had quite a few people in it. If I remember correctly, the robbers got away.

Racism, this is about racism and the inability of those on the right, its news outlet and its leaders to be able to say clearly and without ambiguity that this particular killing of 9 black people was motivated by racism. Why are you on the right so afraid to acknowledge the existence of racism? Why do you deflect and ignore the only real motivation that existed in this event. Why didn't Governor Haley or Senator Graham or the other right wing leaders have the wisdom to simply say "This was a racist act by a racist?" No, instead they suggested it was anti-Christian, or we can never understand such things. Funny, but when a Muslim kills we don't hear about mental illness or gun control or poor parenting like so many posters here have said. No, we correctly hear about an evil ideology which is supported by evil institutions. Racism is the ideology in this particular slaughter, the killer announced his reasons loud and clear and that was very early in the news cycle. And as the original poster I can tell you I did not see this on the Huffington website which I rarely read. So you are wrong, wrong about another thing you seem to be so certain of knowing.

Please supply the quotes and links you refer to...the quotes and where they may be read in context !!!

rac·ism
ˈrāˌsizəm/
noun
noun: racism
the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.
prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.
"a program to combat racism"
synonyms: racial discrimination, racialism, racial prejudice, xenophobia, chauvinism, bigotry, casteism
.................................................. .................................................. ....
rac·ist
ˈrāsəst/
noun
noun: racist; plural noun: racists
1.
a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
synonyms: racial bigot, racialist, xenophobe, chauvinist, supremacist More
"he was exposed as a racist"
(racially) discriminatory, racialist, prejudiced, bigoted
"a racist society"
adjective
noun: racist; plural noun: racists; adjective: racist
1.
having or showing the belief that a particular race is superior to another.
"we are investigating complaints about racist abuse at the club"
.................................................. .................................................. ..


THey are truly twisted individuals.....I don't know how his actions were for one category or another..

The black members of the church went a long way toward cutting all the media, special inrest groups, politicians and racist riot supporters, by showing what any true christian believes about their fellow man.......

For example when a twisted person goes into a school and shoots a bunch of kids....what is he?

Or the sniper at the top of a building in TX picking off passers by.

The current one happens to be white on black hence it fits a pigeon hole easier....

Please, do not respond to my question above.

I am sick of the racial stuff. I know where the post I was responding to came from...PJ Media and Daily Beast, two hard left website, but most know what is going on.

I am not going to allow anyone, any longer to do this and make political hay from it. I am so sick and tired of it.

Of course race was a factor...of course he was a racist, but how low can people go to search out what was not said and twist it into a racial thing. Man, there are lows and then there are these lows.

I am sick of the name calling and then saying it is politics. No it is not....this is very sad and those poor people in South Carolina mourning tonight would be angry and sad at this. EXCEPT I might add for the politicians. It is not even how racial crime against any color skin is wrong, it is how this is used. Just disgusting.

This situation will stay with me for a long time. Never saw politics used like this.....ever.

Well, as it turns out, you remember incorrectly.

The guy who was carrying a concealed weapon prevented a robbery, or worse, inside the building. His actions interrupted the felony in progress. Both criminals were shot, and then later arrested.

Florida Man, 71, Shoots at Alleged Robbers at Internet Cafe - ABC News

I think that, had one of the SC victims been carrying and reasonably competent in the use of a firearm, there's no doubt most of the nine dead people would still be alive.

Perhaps, if instead of the constant harangue to make politics out of racial strife and/or killings, we would drop the politics and read and listen..

"The gruesome massacre of nine people at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church, a historically black church in Charleston, S.C., may amount to the worst racially motivated terror attack of our generation and a deeply violent reminder that racism and white supremacy continue to course through America’s veins. One cannot help but draw comparisons to the firebombing of a black church in Birmingham, Ala., almost 52 years ago".

Charleston, Dylann Roof and the racism of millennials - The Washington Post

Damning article without one mention of conservatives, liberals, politics, Fox News or any of the tripe being handed out on here and various far left websites.

RACISM IS NOT A POLITICAL ISSUE TO BE USED WHEN NEEDED. RACIST IS NOT SOMETHING YOU CALL PEOPLE WHEN THEY DO NOT AGREE WITH YOU.

RACISM IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS ADDRESSED WITOUT THE RED AND BLUE STATES AND WITHOUT ANY PARTY AFFLIATION.

First my spout comment was more about Lott than Fox.

Actually, I do have a filter through which I view this subject..... A few years ago I watched as a man was hitting his wife/girlfriend in a public parking lot. I told she could come to safety with me....he had a few choice words for me but I just turned my back to him...just a bully. But then 5-6 years later I asked a man to stop throwing rocks at a dog on the street where I lived. He also had a couple of choice words for me and then he pulled a gun out of his fanny pack. I followed him home and then reported him to the police. He spent the weekend in jail, I was set to testify against when he finally gave up and copped to the charges.

Please don't ask if he had a concealed permit or any permit for that matter as it is irrelevant. Had he shot me I wouldn't be any less dead or wounded based on his permit status.

BTW that was the last time I tried to intervene.... to dangerous!!!

I'm the one who made the spout comment.....it was NOT aimed at Fox but rather the spoutee. My point is made by the facts regarding two high profile school shootings in Colorado. Columbine and Aurora both those schools had armed guards!!!

Then there was the shooting of the young father in the movie house in Wesley Chapel, Florida. The shooter in that case was a retired police captain. He said he was afraid for his life after getting a handful of popcorn thrown at him.

Just think if the young father also had a pistol on him and obviously that is what you advocate. There could have been a real shoot out at the movie house with bullets spraying the rest of the customers - over a handful of popcorn.

It was bound to happen.

ONE sick, drugged up, homicidal devil--well-known by the courts--is clearly a racist, and boobs here use that fact to stereotype and brand the entire GOP and the entire FNC viewership as "racists".

Why even try to talk sense to such a pile of rocks.

Haven't looked in here for two months because of such bigotry and hatred from those who call themselves "tolerant" and "open-minded" liberals, and so now I'm outa here again.

What a waste.

As has beven suggested in the past...do not engage...they are a disgrace to the party they pretend to support.

Oh good first we have a mental illness and now we are a disgrace.....

Seriously!!!

You two are a shinning example Ben Carson made recently and I posted a link to.

The use of the word "WE" is incorrect.

It is YOU.

Liberals and Democrats are NOT represented by your posting. My bet is that there is embarrassment at what you post.

After a mass shooting by some crazy, it always boils down to the same thing. If only all the victims had guns, they would have turned the tables and only the crazy shooter would be dead.
Blame the victims for not being armed? Even Mike Huckabee said that he supports having the congregations being armed and trained in how to kill intruders.
The answer is not too many guns out there BUT NOT ENOUGH guns in the hands of citizens!

I know this one guy in The Villages who answers a knock at the front door with a drawn pistol held behind him - just in case. Another one is a 93 year old man in a wheelchair with a pistol in the sidepocket. He is legally blind, by the way.

Don't forget the Villager on the motorcycle who shot inside an occupied car because they honked at him.

Nope, not enough guns for citizens.

Isolated stories all and not at all representative of the other 99% responsible gun owners.

And now a personal attack.....