Is Golf Dying?
 

According to The National Golf Foundation, a Jupiter, Fla. consulting firm, Generation Y (18-34 year olds) played 6.4 million rounds of golf in 2014. This is one-third less than 20 years ago.

Does this mean that golf is "dying" in America? It sure sounds like it.

Not really. They'll take up the game in 21-37 years when they move to TV.

Golf may not be their activity choice in the future. They don't like walking slowly and prefer more aggressive action. Some think that "cycling is the new golf." Bicycling is favored by younger people. It is a fast growing sport. Maybe in the future they could convert some of the golf cart trails to bicycle paths!

I suspect it will ebb and flow over time. There is some evidence to support the idea that too many golf courses have been built in the US. This will sort itself out over time via the law of supply and demand. Golf Course communities (except for The Villages) may be the big losers over time as aging players stop playing and less younger players are available to pay the bills.

Anything's possible, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Did golf die when it was outlawed by the Scottish Parliament in 1457? (and again in 1471 and 1491)
Did golf die when Bobby Jones retired? Sports fads come and go, (remember ultimate Frisbee?), but golf has been around for 700 years, possibly 2000 years dating back to the Romans in "Britannia" I think generation Y will gravitate to a sport like golf as they age. Besides, if you read the cart path striping thread, it looks like all the cyclists will be killed off by the road hogs anyway.:1rotfl:

I don't know what to think.
Arnold Palmer tried to change the characteristics of the golf ball so the courses didn't need to be so long. That failed.
In South Jersey, the Philly area it's expensive to play. My sons are ambitious engineers in that age group. They enjoy the game but don't have time to play.
I wonder if exec courses would be profitable elsewhere. We had two but they were poorly maintained and not well designed.
Golf is mostly for the wealthy and may fade.

This place, for exec golf is like a free buffet to me. I'm going to miss the twilight rates too.

For many young people, golf is just too expensive. They can't afford houses, rents in major cities are out of sight and they've got student loans to pay off. Not every municipality offers public courses, and golf club memberships often require a hefty bond. I think it's really a matter of economics. Maybe when they reach their late 40s early 50s, it will be different.

I wonder if a lot of the younger people who aren't playing golf because it's too slow will take up pickle ball when they retire. There's a lot less down time, and they seem to need to be moving constantly when engaged in a sport.

applesoffth: That too is my opinion. the golf industry loved guys like TigerWoods and Phil Mickelson because parents all had a potential Tiger or Phil and so lessons, clothes, golf equipment membership to golf course followed until the recession hit one that to this day has not fully recovered let alone expanded. So while it is a difficult game and time consuming cost is the bigger factor.

Will it may a come back? Don't know but if it doesn't even places like The Villages could be affected because of direct competition for whatever sport/activity draws young generations

Look at it this way. The popularity of golf is quite regional as well as economic. In our hometown, as you may know, Highland is always crowded, and Auburn CC is crowded with tournaments. It's also their bars that are the most crowded. Owasco CC is pretty empty, even on Saturday AM. We're down to about 108 golfing memberships. Maybe because it is double the cost, maybe because it's 9 holes.
Even if golf contracts nationally, I think a place like TV will continue to draw the golfers from all over, We're certainly at a competitive advantage for golf, if not real estate

Less than 10% of the population plays golf. I don't know what percent actually plays regularly. I believe the number is about 30% in golf communities.

The face of America is changing, less golfers for the foreseeable future.

I saw 60 minutes a year or so ago to say that they are thinking of new games that can be played on golf courses as the younger people aren't playing as much golf because it takes so much time and is expensive.

Nationally golf is contracting a bit. About 100-150 private clubs close each year, perhaps because they are the most expensive golfing options. At the other end of the spectrum, I played a state park course in beautiful condition 4 weeks ago for $24 with cart, regular rate, not a special. The time factor needs to be addressed. There is no reason why a foursome cannot play 18 holes in 4 hours and an exec in 1 1/2 hrs playing ready golf and still enjoy the round. We, as golfers, need to change the "emulate the pros" mentality
I still think golfing communities will do well, they draw the golfers, perhaps at the expense of courses elsewhere. On the other hand, I have a friend who spends about 6-8 weeks a year at his home in Naples. He joined the CC of Naples---$20,000 initiation fee, $10,000 per year dues and a $2500 per year assessment to build a new clubhouse. And there was a waiting list!
In TV, "free golf for life" is a strong selling point, even though we all know there is no such thing as free, we just pay for it in other ways. I just don't see our courses being empty anytime soon

I think golf is fading somewhat but not dying anytime soon. Two areas I am familiar with are central Ohio and Myrtle Beach. In central Ohio a decade of so ago, there was a big push to build courses, public and private. The area became over saturated with nice courses. Today, public greens fees are very low, as is the demand for weekday tee times. And most country clubs with the exception of the very high end ones offer memberships for only the monthly minimum expense, and with no initiation fee.
In Myrtle Beach, the spring golf season used to be from February 1st to May 5th or so. It now is pretty much only mid March until the end of April. Fall season has dwindled down to mostly the month of October. One reason for the downfall is two major companies both independantly, then as one controlled thousands of hotel rooms and dozens of golf courses. They increased prices and sacrificed service. Didn't work, now Chinese investors are dominating the market there.
So, I think most if not all reasons given before my post are valid reasons for golf in general being in decline. But there also regional factors other than the economy that affects the golf industry.

Golfing eagles: I initially had written 4 paragraphs on this but decided against it and deleted them. Let me just say perhaps the better comparison is to compare TV with the surrounding area.

I played all those CC's you mentioned over the years.

My favorite places back home Doug's and Lasca's

Personal Best Regards:

I think if the game becomes less popular elsewhere, The Villages will become more popular because we have all these courses. I have met a lot of people that get hooked once they move down here. In time share they sell the dream. In The Villages you live the dream. Non-golfers will be even more attracted when they see their peers in the tv commercials walking and swinging and making it look easy. There is nothing intimidating about being a beginner down here so most won't quit.

It's hard to make that comparison since nothing really compares to TV. I think that is one reason we are insulated against a nationwide downward trend in the popularity of golf. Tiger's decline didn't help, maybe Jordan Spieth will revive some golfing fervor.
BTW , Doug's and Lasca's are still going strong, although Jimmy likes flying his helicopter more and more these days. He's also a regular at our member guest, I think he played with David May

A lot of people in our area of Ohio are playing Frisbee golf. Does anyone play Frisbee golf in this area?

I love you, neighbor. So no comment on this one. Neither about Frisbee or it's popularity in Ohio. Res ipsa loquitur :1rotfl:

Sorry, just could not resist. So I guess the real answer to your question is NOT ME

:beer3:

I'll buy you one when we're both down there

If golf is a dying sport, it doesn't seem that way in TV. Golf is more expensive up North due to the very short seasons that you can play. At least here, you can spend a lot of time outdoors and being active. Great to be a senior.

The advertising campaign, while we are young, was developed to encourage faster play and was supported by Nicklaus, Palmer and Player. There position was that today's generation will not spend 4 - 5 hours on anything unless there is something they get in return. The campaign came out after the CBS special on dying golf including the closing of many courses and contained the comments of the three legends. One of the points was that the costs to maintain and insure the courses continue to rise yet the public's search for a cheap course are at odds. The larger cup, the shorter tees were just a couple of their suggestions (ok, I can't remember the others). The game is generational and without incentive millennials just don't seem to have the interest.

All because golf lost over 5 million people during the last ten years.

Taylor Made (CEO) desperate to bring back golfers sponsored an event included some pro's to promote 15" putting holes. I foresee a lot of broken ankles .

Golf purist won't abide larger putting holes and attempts to make the game any less difficult...because that's the attraction as we are addicted to the agony of defeat and hoping for that moment of victory (the seldom struck pure shot).

And as nature intends as to TV, the growing annoyances are in direct proportion to the growing golf population .

HOLD YOUR TONGUE! Stifle yourself. Someone bring me a glass of water.


OH my dear heavens. I am not going to be alright soon.


I don't even like to use cycling and golf in the same sentence. One thing for sure, golfers aren't high on endorphins and don't wear funny clothes. AND don't have to wear helmets..........yet. Until a certain newcomer begins to think someone might be hit by a ball.


Need coffee. BAD.

Golf is not a verb or a sport. Golf is a serial game whereby one is at the mercy of those ahead. Thus the 4 1/2 to 5 hour 18 hole rounds. TV is unique, in that you have many people who have nothing better to do than get out and attack that little ball on the buffet of all you can eat/play executive courses. We now have people with absolutely no idea what they are doing, filling out their score card on the green, cleaning their club and putting it in the bag at the green, slow walking to and from their cart, standing over a 20 foot putt for a couple of minutes, only to end up three or four putting, BSing for five minutes before each tee shot....and you end up with 1 1/2 hour to 2 hour par 3 rounds. And you wonder why golf is dying? I know, "what's the hurry, you're retired". What's the hurry? I'm getting old. I don't have that much time. That's the hurry. Why not promote match play. Much quicker; easily 9 holes in 50 minutes or less. It really is what golf used to be; a match. Stroke play has contributed to the slowness. I doubt many TVers ever tried match play.
There is one interesting golf thing I have seen. It is this golf scoring in which the players' scores are a composite of strokes and time. Not sure how it works, but the best scores are had by running to your ball. Won't work here; too many hip and knee replacements, but it may catch on with younger, more active people.

Slow play by beginners is mostly on the easier executive courses. The more difficult executive courses generally maintain a good pace of play. I see a good pace of play on the championship courses. Avoid the easier executive courses.

Don't you remember the good old days of golf? The first time my dad took me, it was a new game for him too, I was twelve. I used my own money to buy the most ridiculous clothes I could find in the sports department at Two Guys Department store so I wouldn't look conspicuous. I bought brown and white paisley pants and a brown golf shirt. I can still remember it. [I guess that was back then and not now.]

Are you Ricky Fowler?

As per golf business talk, golf is to expensive for the average family and (3-4] golf courses close each month in the usa now.

I think you're right. I figured it costs about $700 per month to play 18 hole golf in TV about 4 times per week. But, after all, it is expensive to run a golf course.

At least. At 4x/week = 208 rounds/year, given 22 weeks of summer rate, 13 weeks of fall rate and 17 weeks of winter rates, and playing equally on all 12 courses, you get to 522.35/month. That is the priority rate, resident rate would be 1980 more/year or 165/ month, but I doubt anyone would do that---just figure 925/year=77.08/month for priority membership. That's 599.43 month for greens fees for 1 person.
But.....
are you married, does your spouse play--4x, 3x,1x?
if spouse plays: 1x------730.01/ month total greens fees and priority mem
2x------860.59
3x------991.17
4x------1121.75

If you don't own a cart, which is unlikely, add 2080---4160/ year cart rental depending on spouse play, so split it at 2x week=3120/year=260/month
Assuming you own your cart, what percentage of use is for golf vs transportation around TV. How much did it cost, what's the depreciation? What's it's lifespan---Let's say you bought new for a very reasonable 10K(LOL) and it "lives" 10 years--add 1,000/year , say 500 for golf use=41.67/month
Now a single golfer 4x/week = 641.10/ month and with a spouse also playing 4x/week =1163.42/ month

Now add investment in clubs and bag
How many of the 6 million/year lost golf balls each year in TV are yours
How long does your glove last?
Re-grip clubs yearly?
Lessons from a pro?
Range balls?
And for many, cost to fill cart cooler with beer
And for some, cost of psychotherapy to help deal with the game

Not cheap, especially for those on a marginal fixed income or for millennials
But still cheaper than say skiing 4x/week year round on say 12 different mountains. Cheaper than yachting. Much more expensive than shuffleboard

As to OP's original question, yes, golf is dying everywhere but the villages. We are on a pace to hit 3,000,000 rounds played this year. We had 1,800,000 a couple of months ago.

I used to sponsor golf games to promote business and to get the company to pay for my golf. Now I don't have time for some reason and it has become harder to get people to attend. When I offered the graduating students at the local college a day for free golf, food and prizes they would line up. It started to become harder and harder to get students to attend. The older customers don't seem to have the time they used to and the younger people just don't seem to want to socialize like they used to. I do think the economy has a lot to do with the decline. Dead or dying no just not as popular now.

I'm not sure it's dying but I know when it was born?

google Robin Williams on Golf [full version]

It's Robin Williams being Robin Williams, not Mork, so the language my not be suitable for all adults.

Kids like team sports
 

Although golf can be a team sport it is still very much an individual sport. Our grand kids had the opportunity to "grow up" in a country club setting and played junior golf but none of the four play golf today. Our oldest was really pretty good but tells me "Grandpa, I just don't have time".

As one who didn't have the opportunity to play golf until much later in life, It really "puzzles" me why kids today (with few exceptions) have the opportunity to play the game just flat out don't. Perhaps they will later in life they will have more time and interest?

One bright spot for golf is Asia. Golf is thriving in parts of Asia as seen on the PGA and LPGA tours. The LPGA tour is dominated by great Asian players.

Retirees here in The Villages love their golf and we have lots of time to play. Golf as a sport and past time is certainly thriving here. Fore!

Golf Dying?
 

In Cincinnati we had par three courses and County Park courses that made golf more economically and physically accessible for all ages. They were usually packed. They had country clubs (the old kind) that were by membership and that was pricey. I could see them going out of business. A lot of people don't need all the social aspects of a country club to enjoy being there.

:gc: