Apartments or town homes could be part of massive Villages of Southern Oaks developme
 

Early this year, The Villages announced it would build 11,000 homes or more on 4,518 acres, mostly south of the Florida Turnpike, east of U.S. 301 and on both sides of County Road 468.

The amendment would permit construction of 26,590 homes, up 31 percent from the previous maximum total, on 8,059 acres, up more than 78 percent from the prior land area.

Non-residential uses, including commercial, would be cut about 45 percent to 925,000 square feet while governmental and office uses would be increased by 166 percent to 765,000 square feet.

More at another news site

If apartments and condos come to the Villages then it's time to find another place to live. Crime is already on the rise.

It's only a matter of time before that happens. There are already apartments on 466A, Sumter Grande I believe.

I don't think apts and condos lead to more crime, what the main news is the huge increase in density. The article got it wrong saying increase in 31% when its actually more like 200% increase. Also of note is decrease in commercial space.

There is a lot of commercial zone land on both sides of 468 and 301 that is not owned by TV, I would assume at this point those that own that land are sitting on a gold mine and I would guess that at some point Coleman will be getting on board for either residential or commercial.

Could be but this is clearly a signal that The Villages development execs have decided they want to develop less commercial space rather than more. Brownwood may have given them a clue.

Sumter Grande on 466A is an Independant Living facility, there is also an Assisted Living Facility and a Memory Care facility there. No apartments.

There are a few townhomes at Glenview CC, overlooking the driving range.

Also some townhomes at Spanish Springs

It appears that Villages development execs might not agree that commercial development is a goldmine, as they would increase not decrease their plans. Perhaps Brownwood gave them a clue.

Gotta keep the Morse Air Force flying and the Morse yachts sailing!

Perhaps the owners of the land would not accept the offers. With 26,000 homes going up there sure as he-- will be a commercial area and if not 441/27 better start adding lanes now.

I am confused as to who owns what properties in the Southern Oaks development area that needs to be changed from over 55 to “just” senior living. While it would be helpful in the long run to have townhouses/ apartments for younger workers in our city, I am not sure how the sharing of amenities would be accomplished to be fair to all.

The difference between leasing commercial property from The Villages vs independent owners can be considerable. So I am not disagreeing with you. Firm believer in "if they build it they will come"

And Some Call This Paradise
 

The Villages of Lake-Sumter, Inc (TVLSI) (The Developer) has much control and influence in the tri-county area. As such developers, politicians, realtors, etc really don't care about managed growth and the affect it has on people. Its all greed.

This issue is the reason TVLSI pushed hard against the repeal of Sumter One. TVLSI wanted all 5 county commissioners in its back pocket and here we are

If the information the OP obtained is accurate this area is going to be so dense people will have to live in shifts to golf, shop etc.

The wide range of housing prices is also problematic

Too many residents on this forum had shown a mistaken fealty toward the developer, which is to say the least puzzling.

The simple truth is the developer took a way of life common to Florida and California and expanded on it.
and the developer did it as cheaply, transferring liabilities to others and reaping record breaking profits.

The Developer focused on how many housing units he could squeeze in an area.

And because of that fact bike and walking trails were ignored and multi-modal paths utilized.

As a consequence the MMP's resemble I-4, walkers looked distressed and annoyed and bottle necks appear everywhere. and some call this paradise..but I digress

""The amendment also removes a stipulation that residents must be age 55 or over, but would require that the project is consistent with federal and Florida fair housing requirements for age-restricted communities.""

Juvenile Delinquents! :22yikes: :22yikes:

I would think the bigger concern all would have is the Championship golf to home ratio. With 25,000 new homes this is a 50% increase in the number of homes in the Villages. The current plans show only one new Championship golf course. To maintain the current home to course ratio you would need 6 more Championship golf courses.

Also it will put a significant stress on the commercial real estate in the southern end of the current Villages.

Wait until it takes a lottery and you get only one tee time each week, then you will see home values plummet.

I do agree that so far the planning of the developer has been pretty good, but as they buy up more small parcels around current developed land and add more houses, it is making the current amenities spread very thin. As an example, they have added several thousand new homes up around the route 42 area and no increase in available amenities. So far the most southern areas seem like it will cause the same stress on current infrastructure.

:agree:

Forget the argument of who has been here longer than another or any of the other negative comments/opinions for just one minute.

I wonder why when we came here in 2003 when 466 (not 466A) was just made into a 4 lane road. When Buena Vista south of 466 was just opening to Bonnyville...that would be one traffic circle in.....no Lake Sumter Landing....no Arbold Palmer facilities.....no shopping anywhere near Rolling Acres....no Sam's Club.....or any shopping in or around or nearby.......

I wonder why back then with a population nearing 30-35,000 there was no negative talk about how big, how fast, how irresponsible, how wealthy the developers were?

As a matter of fact there wasn't really much of that kind of negative chatter while TV continued all the way down to 466A more than doubling the size of TV.

I am happy to say TV is still the community of choice. Because TV has achieved critical mass in size most national chains during the last 15 years have decided to open here for business.

It is all about perspective is it not. So in 15 years the population has tripled. The lifestyle has really gotten better with the advent of the surrounding local and national retail
keeping pace with the growth.

Yes traffic is heavier. Timing is everything. When people complain are they complaining about a general condition or a personal preference? For example...t times.....so bust cannot get a t time? Really? Or I could not get the time or the courses I prefer? Going on 15 years and have NEVER not been able to get A t time, regardless the season.

It is all relative and all perspective.

Find a better place than TV? Maybe.

All the minority reports about TV are duly noted. The majority of us continue to live the life style we bought into 15 years ago.

Yes please...I'll have a large tankard of "over reaction". There are hundreds(if not thousands)of low income apt's/houses/mobile homes already within miles of the villages on both sides/above and below. The location of that the pot stirrer mentions isn't even that close to the villages as it is above 44. There is no place you can move without an income of millions $$$$$$ so why the negative posts. Must some of you always panic? As to "time to leave"...please do. As to the haters of the Morse $$$$...please get real and lose the jealous attitude.

Reasonably priced low maintenance townhomes would be welcomed by many older villagers who are not rich enough to live in places like Freedom Point. Apartments are another subject.

Without affordable income housing within reasonable distances of TV there will be no place for those who work serving TV residents to live. Eventually affecting some business continuity/opportunity.

The problem usually boils down to all agreeing it's needed....but not in my back yard!!!

Incorrect, There will be 133 rooftops in the*Soulliere Villas. Coupled with the Phillips Villas, there will be nearly*300 new courtyard villas in CDD 4. They put a new pool in Phillips area and will do the same in Soulliere area. Villages also bought the old church next to Chatham where they will put new rec center, resort style pool, and putting course.

I'm confused
 

Is the assumption that the apartments will be for workers not residents? Our neighbor across the street is selling her home. She would love to be able to stay in The Villages and take advantage of the amenities, stay by her friends but not have to keep up with the maintenance of a home. I know several widows in the same situation. If the apartments are for Villagers how would crime go up. Some people do not need or want all the services that are provided by facilities like Sumter Grand. I think apartments for retirees might be a nice option.

sooooo , if they are going for more gov. bld and townhouse does that mean .......cell blocks ,got to think outside the box. tv can get into the prison buss.

There is something wrong with the commercial area noted. That is only about 21 acres of land out of over 8000 acres. I think that might only pertain to the Village of Southern Oaks or a section of it and does not include Fenney, DeSoto, or McClure as I would think one plaza with a Publix, bank, gas station and a few small stores would be on 21 acres not enough to handle 26,500 homes. That should be explained further.

Here are two screen shots of the article in the online news. I have reversed them. :(

I just read the post below mine from Goldwingnut, who sends his Drone to see all of the new happenings here and I am sure is abreast of the development. His post could not understand and summarize the situation better. It is excellent.

OH....yes. Bogie Shooter could say; "Patience Grasshopper" and I could say; "Hide and Watch".

Why would someone kill the goose or shoot themselves in the foot? Why would they switch from excellent planning to poor planning? The Morses have already made more money than they could ever spend.

Why so much fret and worry over the little tidbits of information that continue to leak out about the future of TV? The developer obviously has a long term (30 year?) master plan that they are very tight lipped about and will only let out enough information need to get plans solidified for the near future activities. It's a business that has been successful for 30 years, does anyone really think that they would make radical changes to a successful model in an attempt to reap a few extra short term dollars?

The development plans are a closely held company secret that the development company has absolutely zero obligation to disclose to any of us. They owe us no explanations of their plans. Each new snip-it of information that comes out should be treated as an unexpected gift on Christmas morning, instead many act like spoiled children wanting more and complaining about what they got not being good enough or want they wanted.

Do you really think that there is going to be no more executive and championship golf courses built and we are going to overload the existing courses? Take a look at the few early drawings that have so far been released about Southern Oaks on both sides of the Turnpike, they show multiple courses being built. They also show multiple recreation areas (rec centers?) and commercial areas. These are critical areas and items that make TV the successful development they are.

The commercial areas continue to grow as TV grows and it appears that there's actually a plan in place. Look at Brownwood and the commercial area by the Rohan recreation center, at first glance one would have to ask what the heck are they thinking, these areas are too far away and would be difficult to get to. Fast forward a few years, TV will be building on the south side of SR44 were established commercial areas exist because they were planned for in advance. SR44 and CR468 will be a significant economic engine for Sumter County.

I really love to read the comments like "Harold Schwartz didn't want it like this" and similar. Think again, Mr. Schwartz died in December of 2003, in 2004 CDD-9 & CDD-10 were established, this took years of planning and work to make happen, the land had been purchased long before his death. He and his son Gary Morse had a grand master plan and were pushing it along even back them. The 3rd and 4th generation of the family are just continuing the plan that was laid out long ago and building on it as opportunity presents itself. It's not about greed, it's about business. Do you remember before you retired what that was about? Stop the growth and watch the local economy collapse and home values go down the drain. Want to see what failure looks like, do a search for Lehigh Acres in Lee County FL.

When you look back at the history of some of the other developments in the area, many tried or wanted to copy TV model. Southern Oaks was one of these copycat plans that never happened, who knows what happened and why, but it never solidified. As TV continued its growth south it must have been seen as a perfect extension as it was already on the books as a planned development. Wildwood Springs appears to have been a gift that fell into their lap, located on the far side of Southern Oaks and stagnating since 2008 the developer appears to have snatched it up and it's now known a Fenney. Now things are starting to back fill between Fenney and the southern end of The Villages.

The changes to the types of dwellings to be allowed in the development plan is more likely a shift to accommodate changing needs and desires of future retirees. I don't really believe that they want to create their own Pottersville, it doesn't server their business needs. Yes there is a need for affordable housing outside TV and the other local communities are working this, dig into the Wildwood planning meetings and you will see a lot of planning to make that city grow outside of the new TV development areas.

The State of Florida is one of the fastest growing states in the union, TV represents a very small part of this growth. Almost every of the state has positive growth, not all as good percentage wise as Sumter County, but a significant increase none the less. It's not going to stop anytime soon, so I for one would rather live in a place like TV that has a solid plan in place an a proven record.

Few communities have the infrastructure as well planned and in place like TV. Our use of reclaimed water for irrigation is an industry model of success. If you run the numbers on water usage alone for TV as compared to other communities in Florida the differences are significant; first there is the use of reclaimed water for irrigation that limits the drawl from the underground sources, next consider the potable water usage of a retired couple compared to a family of 4 with 2 teenagers - easily less than half as much, finally consider the percentage of seasonal residents who's houses are unoccupied several months out of the year with near zero potable water usage. All these factors lead to a significantly lower annual water usage per home compared to most any other area in the state. The growth of TV on a local level is significant, on a state wide level it is only a small part of the picture.

Is The Villages perfect? Not at all, but it is well planned and as long it continues to be well planned and executed we will continue to live in the best 55+ community in the country.

Far from apartments, sport. My mother-in-law lives there in the independent living side (facing it, to the right); memory care and assisted living to the left.

what is the difference between independent living apartments and regular apartments? I'm asking not to be a smart butt but because I don't know the answer. I have been to Sumter Grande and it is very nice, people drive their own cars and live in apartments, that is all I know about it. I do realize that the other two buildings there come with assistance of varying degrees.

Personally, I think if you are already here and established in a home you like and a location that suits you, none of the new building or changes makes too much difference. I find we do not travel too far out of our immediate neighborhood. I generally shop at the same stores each week, my otherhalf plays the same golf course with the same people and he is involved with another group and that is about it. I am within easy reach of medical facilities and big box stores and that is probably all I need. I am sure people would think we are very boring, but it suits us. The only time I see the new villages is when I am on the Village Airport Van coming or going from the airport and if I was ever dropped off in one I would probably never find my way home!:laugh:

I begrudge no one the opportunity to live here. For us it is the perfect place to age in place and to enjoy the inevitability of aging. One only needs to have a conversation with people visiting from another country to realize that this place is unique and wonderful in its way.

This church is not the beautiful yellow one on 42 as mentioned in another post but the little one at the end of Clearview off Beuna Vista. The big one would have been wonderful. Apparently horse farms and villas are going to be built. Many got excited when they though a much-needed up-to-date center was going to be in the fairly new yellow church as Mulberry is looking dowdy lately.

I am sure this very talented and wildly successful family Over The last 50 years will consult the Talk of the Villages before they dig another hole. Brownwood will be fine and is being built in anticipation of the future population growth in the area.

As far as the apartments are concerned, a wild But educated guess may be that they are being built to house all the workers in the stores and those who build our homes and keep the 35 Square miles in The Villages in pristine condition.

Do you think that all the folks who work in the stores where you shop, serve your food in the restaurants, read your gas meter, manicure the courses where you play Golf can afford to purchase a home? Don’t they deserve a nice apartment or should they live in a broken down trailer? Second guessing the Morse’s has long been a mistake.

Note the max 26k homes is for 8k acres vs 11k homes on 4k acres. Home density increase from 2.43/acre to 3.3/ acre which is 35.5%. A significant increase, but much less than 200%.

Excellent analysis. The “ I am up pull the ladder up” mentality is distressing but also a minority. There is no place like this place anywhere near or far from this place. .

My guess section 8. After all they want life some where over the rainbow also. We could volunteer raise amenities to help them out. Or better yet give them free card:pepper2: NOT them apartments will probably be well over 250k with bond of 50k.

Who said the company town is dead ? All we need now is Morse script.


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If and that’s a big if the intention is to provide housing for groups other than retirees, I wonder how amenities will be shared ?

I predict it will be a buy in.


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I’ll admit that I have not seen the article in the “other” news source, but I have read all of the comments in this thread, so I am at least half informed... In looking at the land maps of the new southern areas there seems to be an area along 301 that is not connected to anything. I don’t know if this is the area being discussed for apartments, but I alway thought this would be a perfect place to have another family neighborhood similar to Oxford Oaks. As The Villages grows there must be adequate housing for all of those who work within The Villages.

As for those like to complain about growth, I drove by Saddlebrook at 9:30 this morning. There wasn’t but 3 or 4 carts in the parking lot and the course was empty. I think we will be ok.