Indian Air plane crash
 

Happened upon a video of the 787 from behind taking off and crashing. Little doubt it was pilot error. The wing flaps were not in takeoff/landing position. Virtually flat. And the plane apparently stalled shortly after wheels off the runway. 254+ killed. So sad. Can’t link the videos. Several videos distinctly show this issue.

How could an experienced pilot do that?

So agree. I now see there was one surviver. Miracle. 40 year old man, his brother aboard, dead. I read that the pilot called Mayday just before the crash. Google Air India plane crash video if you care to see…

Not want I wanted to hear about while on the shuttle to MCO : (

Waaayyyy too soon to call that. It could have been a mechanical malfunction...in fact, it could have been multiple ones.

Let's let it play-out and see what investigators find.

Mechanical malfunction on a Boeing? Outrageous suggestion, with their history.

You forgot the LOL. :wave:

IMO induced by pilot errors most of them. IMO this crash looks like engines wasn’t producing enough thrust For takeoff roll? Pilot error or computer problem? Engine monitoring Gages should have showed thrust problem if that was the problem?

They had an expert on crashes who thinks it might have been bad chemicals in the fuel . This was on CNN.

What! Wait for the facts? There is no fun in that.

You couldn't possibly have posted anything more irresponsible, than blaming someone for the deaths of 254+ people, based on viewing a Youtube video.

Do you have an FAA Airman's Certificate? Do you know not all airplanes use "flaps" for takeoff? Do you know the circumstances when flaps aren't used?

My uncle was Fire Chief in Itasca, IL. when there was a terrible plane crash just outside of O'Hare Airport. The Deadliest Crash: Flight 191 and its Maintenance Legacy | Aviation Maintenance Magazine The Deadliest Crash: Flight 191 and its Maintenance Legacy | Aviation Maintenance Magazine He and fire crews from all over Chicagoland were called in to help with the aftermath. When he told me about his experiences you could see how traumatic the experience was for them. This is still the worst airline accident in the US. My uncle passed in 1994 while I was helping take of another uncle up to when he could get into a nursing home a few hundred feet away . The fire crews in the Chicagoland area rode their fire engines past my uncle's house. The uncle I was helping lived a few houses down the street from the former Itasca Fire Chief.

The Straits Times logo

Air India plane crash draws attention to flaps and landing gear

epa12172316 Officials inspect the site of a plane crash near Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel International Airport in Ahmedabad, Gujarat, western India, 12 June 2025. Air India flight AI171, bound for London carrying 242 passengers and crew members on board a Boeing 787-8 aircraft, crashed minutes after take-off in the Meghaninagar area of Ahmedabad.
Officials inspect the site of a plane crash near Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel International Airport in Ahmedabad, India, on June 12.PHOTO: EPA-EFE
UPDATED JUN 13, 2025, 06:45 AM

Video of the Air India jetliner that crashed into a neighbourhood points to potential anomalies that aviation safety authorities will examine to understand what caused the accident that killed at least 241 people.

The Boeing 787 Dreamliner appeared to not achieve sufficient thrust as it lumbered down nearly the full length of an 11,000-foot runway, a distance that should have been more than enough to take off, said Mr Bob Mann, head of aviation consultant RW Mann.

That could stem from a misconfiguration of the plane prior to takeoff or erroneous weight data entered into the plane’s computer system that determines how much power is needed to get off the ground, he said.

Mr Mann cautioned that his views were unofficial and not corroborated by data or cockpit voice recorders, which have yet to be recovered from the site.

“If the weight is high compared to the actual number, you end up with a very aggressive takeoff,” he said. “If the weight is low compared to the actual, you end up with not enough commanded power.”

The 787’s landing gear was never retracted, which normally occurs just after takeoff, said Mr Jeff Guzzetti, a former accident investigation chief for the US Federal Aviation Administration.

He also said he’d want to know more about whether the plane’s flaps – movable panels along the wing that generate additional lift during takeoff – were in the correct position, noting that it was possible those were raised mistakenly instead of the landing gear.


“You don’t see any smoke or fire or engines burping or anything like that. You don’t see any structural failure occurring,” Mr Guzzetti said. “It just appears the airplane was unable to climb once it got off the runway.”

That could be due to several reasons, he said, including the flaps being raised instead of the landing gear or improper programming of the flight control computer.

“We just don’t know at this time,” he said.

Mr Mann said the flaps appeared to be incorrectly positioned, adding that trying to belatedly adjust the flaps could lead to an aerodynamic stall.

(For those that didn’t know, I didn’t)

The Straits Times (also known informally by its abbreviation ST) is a Singaporean daily English-language newspaper owned by the SPH Media Trust.Established on 15 July 1845, it is the most-widely circulated newspaper in the country and has a significant regional audience. The newspaper is published in the broadsheet format and online, the latter of which was launched in 1994. It is regarded as the newspaper of record for Singapore.

Plane
 

Yea, they have a great track record, let's go with that.

Maybe, the pilot had a stroke.

Sabotage? They did just exchange shooting with Pakistan.

I bet the survivor's miraculous survival will lead to his seat 11A being quite popular on that type of aircraft! There is something to be said for being next to an emergency exit!!!
I hope he doesn't have survivor's guilt like a lot of people in that circumstance experience. What a horrific tragedy.

It's Air India.
They don't have a good track record. Many of their planes are 2nd or 3rd hand leftovers. However, this one wasn't. Need to wait for whatever the black boxes reveal.

Calm down please
 

I was an airline pilot for 33 years and military for over 20. If the flaps or trims and other things were not set for takeoff correctly there are
very loud warnings in the cockpit when throttles are advanced for takeoff. Annoying WARNINGS.
Let the NTSB or Indian equivalent get the FDR and voice recorders and we will eventually get to the truth

Maybe a mechanical problem kept the flaps from extending. Then again there are indicators in the cockpit

The 787 as well as all modern airplanes have a warning system that goes off when the throttles are advanced, and the takeoff configurations are incorrect

The plane was having electronic problems earlier that day. A passenger on the earlier flight posted a video showing him trying to use the touchscreen at his seat, and nothing was working. I don't know if that would have any connection to the crash, but if the pilot's electronics were also not working........ The black box will tell the tale.

[As the widow of a pilot who died in a similar manner I can only say that it is too soon to judge. In my husband’s case the gust lock had been released for take off and the plane had the lift, so proving it was released. Once it took off and achieved elevation the gust lock malfunctioned preventing steering and the plane took a nose dive with a full tank of gas. It took a full year to determine the cause. My heart is breaking for the families that lost their loved ones. The only survivor is truly a miracle man. God clearly isn’t done with him yet.

From what I have observed and read, this cause of the crash was most likely due to pilot error. Specifically, the first officer should have retracked the landing gear at about 50 feet following what appeared to be a normal routine takeoff. Instead, he/she most likely mistakenly retracted the flaps which lead to the loss of lift at the time when the landing gear should have normally been retracted. The pilot probably did not know this had happened and was unable to recover in time.

Nothing suggests power failure either due to a bird strike or engine failure nor do I think the flaps were set improperly (5%) for takeoff. Instead, I sadly believe it was due to the flaps being mistakenly retracted prematurely instead of the landing gear which lead to the loss of lift shortly after takeoff.

Here we go again running around making accusations based on miniscule information.

See link in Comment #8.

Let's wait and allow investigators to do their work rather than giving THE MEDIA too much credit for actually knowing about what they're reporting.

Flaps are used 100% of the time when an airliner takes off; the flaps on that flight were not down, which WOULD have provided additional lift, and the landing gear were still down, which ADDED a lot of additional drag. Something went bad wrong with that flight.

Hubris?

You are not the first one to make this observation. People I know agree with this. We shall see if this was the cause and whether the cause was pilot or mechanical.

So many aeronautical experts. Post #21 has the answer.

Thank you, finally someone with a clue.

"It was the pilot's fault because I saw a video and his flaps weren't down" ? Why do people who don't have a clue how to fly an airplane, post such things? It boggles my mind.

You surely have way more logged time than me, but anyone who flies has heard plenty of "stupid pilot tricks". Fortunately, today's planes of that sort, make it unlikely a pilot is going to make a stupid mistake.

Anything is possible, but I doubt the investigation is going to show the Pilot screwed up, all by himself.

The Mirror US
Expert spots terrifying warning sign moments before Air India Boeing plane crash

Aviation experts believe an issue with the wing flaps of an Air India plane that crashed in the Indian city of Ahmedabad may have played a role in the disaster.

Videos emerged of flight AI171 rapidly dropping shortly after taking off from the Ahmedabad airport and erupting into a fireball as it hit the ground. The plane crashed into a medical college hostel.

After reviewing footage of the crash, aviation analyst Geoffrey Thomas told the BBC that "the undercarriage is still down but the flaps have been retracted."


Thomas said the flaps were in line with the wing, which was quite unusual to happen this soon after take-off.

The undercarriage is normally retracted within 10-15 seconds, and the flaps are then retracted over a period of 10-15 minutes," he explained

Marco Chan, a former pilot and a senior lecturer at Buckinghamshire New University, told the outlet that the incident may "point to potential human error if flaps aren’t set correctly”


"But the resolution of the video is too low to confirm that," Chan added.

Another aviation expert, Terry Tozer, also highlighted an issue with the plane's wings.

"It's very hard to say from the video for sure, it doesn't look as if the flaps are extended and that would be a perfectly obvious explanation for an aircraft not completing its take off correctly," he told the BBC.

Tata Group, which owns the carrier, also said it will also cover the medical expenses of those injured.

"We are deeply anguished by the tragic event involving Air India Flight 171. No words can adequately express the grief we feel at this moment. Our thoughts and prayers are with the families who have lost their loved ones, and with those who have been injured," the company wrote on X.

"Tata Group will provide ₹1 crore to the families of each person who has lost their life in this tragedy. We will also cover the medical expenses of those injured and ensure that they receive all necessary care and support.

"Additionally, we will provide support in the building up of the B J Medical's hostel. We remain steadfast in standing with the affected families and communities during this unimaginable time."

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/198...ibextid=wwXIfr

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1Au...ibextid=wwXIfr

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/16m...ibextid=wwXIfr

You are assuming a whole lot by blaming the pilots. Let the accident board do their thing and do not second guess them.I take it you are an expert in these things.

hmmm. After reviewing the post above yours with videos and such appears he is not the only guy.

From the video it appears that the wheels were not retracted after takeoff. Not realizing what the problem was the crew may have lowered the flaps that compounded the problem.

Reporters "report" and run to find an expert to quoit , I would think that any reputable expert would qualify their answer as speculation with the need to wait for the results of the investigation but a wait and see answer doesn't get band width

I don't know why it crashed. But the accident investigators will find out exactly why this horrible thing happened. Oh, I feel so bad for everyone who died and also for their families.

I have an FAA Airman's Certificate and Instrument Rated and have been for 30 years ... and owned 2 airplanes. Are you licensed to fly an airplane or are you just assuming you know everything about them, because you've been on one?

Flaps are not used 100% of the time. Anyone who thinks they are, doesn't understand flying. Are they typically used on departure by large airplanes? Yep, but not always.

"The first officer should have retracted the landing gear ..... "? Says who? Do you know who was flying the airplane? "Normal, routine takeoff"? According to whom? What was the Density Altitude? Cross winds? W/B? Runway length? Obstacles? Any NOTAMS in effect? Fuel load? What's the MTOW of that airplane?

There is no one alive, who knows that happened in that airplane. Amateurs making uneducated guesses, based on Youtube videos, is ridiculous.

The odds of an airline pilot not knowing if his flaps were in the configuration he wanted (or was required to use), is minuscule. The odds of accidentally raising flaps, while intending to raise the landing gear ... similarly rare. This airplane was departing with a 2 pilot crew, one with an ATP and both of them Type Rated in that airplane.

If it turns out this was "human error", it was "Pilots' error" ... 2 pilots were flying that airplane.

As a previous poster (an ATP) pointed out. It's fairly difficult for 2 pilots to make an error in departure configuration. There are enough bells, whistles and warnings in today's airliners, to drive a pilot nuts. What people don't understand, are the computers that control modern aircraft are not there to "help the pilots", it's the other way around. The Pilots are there to help the computers in case something goes wrong.

Findings to date:

‘No detailed timeline of relevant actions and indicators. No verbatim cockpit transcript. Instead, their (India’s official crash investigators) seeming intention was to focus a global audience on two facts. The fuel supply switches for the plane’s two engines were manually turned off about one second apart, just seconds after the plane left the runway. As the report states without identifying the speakers: “In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so.”’
WSJ July15/25