Joy, Bliss, Happiness people, you got it wrong
 

According to "The Longevity Project", a study that started in 1922 and kept going until recently, optimism and/or happiness is not the secret to good health and longevity. Not that happiness isn't important, but happy cheerful children were more likely to live shorter lives than those who were more serious or "sober".

You can find out more by reading the book, "The Longevity Project". Chapter 4: "Happiness and Health? A Cheery Conundrum"

:)

You could read that book If you wanted to quell the happy and cheerful attitude you may now have.:):):):)

"Seriously?!"
 

My serious and sober side tells me that joy and bliss can't be beat.:wave:

Graciegirl and quirky, I am trying my best not to take any joy in bringing this news.

:)

You probably feel differently, but quantity of life without quality is not for me.

Do I hear an AMEN!!!!!

However many years I have in this place, I'll take happy and cheerful over the alternative every one of those days.

You okay, VPL?

Yipee!
 

:laugh: :laugh: :a040::a040: :clap2::clap2: :1rotfl::1rotfl:

Wonder how many years that cost me. :024:

Another Amen here!

Maybe those who were abundantly cheerful didn't have as good an ability to deal with adversity or sorrow when it occurred in their lives. Wasn't it Gibran in "The Prophet" who talked about needing to experience sorrow to fully appreciate joy? Hopefully, in our lives we have more joy, happiness and laughter than we have sorrow; and enough seriousness to map out plans and work toward them.

Villages PL: My first thought was you were attempting to "fun us" but that is in another forum. Serious "sober", huh? Okay! All I can think to respond is what my favorite President once said "Most people are as happy as they make up their minds to be." Abraham Lincoln Abe always had that serious and sober look but his life was short even for his time.

AMEN..........

We always say that we raised two of the most cheerful optimistic children into adulthood and they are doing the same with their own little ones.

I'd rather be with a positive, cheerful, happy go lucky and joyful person than a negative rigid "my way or the highway" type individual who lives a spartan lifestyle out of fear of death and dying. We all leave this planet the same way.


All of these "surveys" and books are just another person's opinion, to which they are entitled to.......

So, Amen again..........

I would say it is more of one studies opinion. You know what they say about opinions, so I will wait for an opinion that agrees with mine and that is the secret to a happy and fulfilled life is one that is full of laughter and optimism rather it be 50 years or 100 years.

:ho:

The post about having to experience sorrow in order to fully appreciate joy really is so true.

There are so many of us, I would say most of us seniors,who have had terrible, awful, overwhelming sorrow in our lives and some more than once.

When that happens, and time passes enough to heal the worst of it, we realize that we have an option to look for good times and to try to find joy and laughter again and when we do find it we realize that our emotional health is restored, although we won't forget the sad and bad things that happened.

Since we have felt pain and sadness, our compassion for others and our understanding of others has increased.

We realize that a long life is not granted to all and that we need to use the life we have to live sweetly and find as much joy and laughter as we can. Each day we must give ourselves the right to be happy and to spread happiness to others if we can. Life is not a dress rehearsal.

Gracie, my favorite mantra: Life is not a dress rehearsal.

Well, the opposite of happiness and joy would be unhappiness, negativity and depression.....or fear of death and dying perhaps?

Low serotonin and depression.
 

Serotonin and Depression: 9 Questions and Answers


Simple cure for manufacture of Serotonin in our bodies is eating chicken, turkey and beans, and other food items that contain high levels of tryptophan, but as we age that may not be enough. Medication may be needed. Serotonin levels appear to drop as we age.

Senior Citizen, I'm not trying to cause you any unhappiness, but it was actually (my fave) Henry David Thoreau who wrote: "Most men lead lives of quiet desperation and go to the grave with the song still in them."

Judy the happy singer :kiss:

GG, This is a beautiful post and so very true. At this stage in our lives, most of us have experienced overwhelming grief and pain. Overcoming life's adversities and sadness makes us all stronger and more appreciative. Living life sweetly and finding joy and laughter and serenity is a daily goal. Volunteering and helping others makes life sweet. Every day should be lived with joy and bliss if possible.

A long life is not promised to any of us. No-one can dictate to us how happy we are. We each choose that for ourselves. Live long and prosper.

Thanks Judy.....the newspaper obviously confused the two.
Appreciate your feedback.

Thoughts on Desperation …

On March 27, 2005, in Quotes, by Cyndi Greening

It’s hard to take the idea of desperation seriously when we live in the richest country in the world. I go to bed every night and rest on a comfortable, soft mattress. I have plenty of good food, kind neighbors and inspiring colleagues. As I look at the photos of Iraq, Afghanistan and Bandeh Aceh, I think Thurber and Kierkegaard minimize it best.
“The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.”
Henry David Thoreau (1817 – 1862)
U.S. Author in “Walden”, 1854
“Nowadays men lead lives of noisy desperation.”
James Thurber (1894 – 1961)
U.S. Author
“Nowadays not even a suicide kills himself in desperation. Before taking the step he deliberates so long and so carefully that he literally chokes with thought. It is even questionable whether he ought to be called a suicide, since it is really thought which takes his life. He does not die with deliberation but FROM deliberation.”
Soren Kierkegaard (1813 – 1855)
Danish philosopher
“A dog in desperation will leap over a wall.”
Chinese proverb
“There is nothing so desperately monotonous as the sea, and I no longer wonder at the cruelty of pirates.”
James Russell Lowell (1819 – 1891)
U.S. poet, editor

New Research
 

New research: Smiling may lower your heart rate (in a good way).
Smiling may lower your heart rate - Health - Men's health - NBCNews.com

Happiness Tied To Longer Life, Study Finds
Happiness tied to longer life

Happiness tied to good heart health - KYTX CBS 19 Tyler Longview News Weather Sports
Happiness tied to good heart health

Del Webb Active Adult Retirement Communities | News Story Story
positive thinking tied to longevity

Personality Genes Tied To Lifespan, Study Suggests
happy personalities tied to longevity

Thanks Quirky. :clap2: How could "joy, bliss and happiness" possibly be a bad thing!

:bigbow:

VPL, I think you need to get out and interact with real people more, you'll find that joy, etc... is real. IMHO people who are constantly reading about health, food, medications, etc... do not have time to experience the real joys that are available to us all in real life. You said you tried a class or two and they were to advanced, bet you didn't talk to anyone in the classes, everyone is willing to help you learn......but you need to get out there and put forth a little effort, be willing to eat in a restuarant with a group, etc...I am starting to feel sorry for you and the life that you lead as portrayed in your posts and believe it or not I do worry about you, but you seem unreachable or unwilling to meet others and their views halfway. Everything does have to be argumentative and controversal, let loose a little.

Excellent, thoughtful and heartfelt post. :bigbow: :bigbow: :bigbow:

Finally, someone got curious enough to ask a good question. Thanks!

Here are some highlights from chapter 4 of "The Longevity Project". This is a summary of the first 4 1/2 pages (in my own words) and should answer your question.

The study found that healthy people are happy but happy people do not always enjoy good health. It sort of suggests an answer to the following question: Does good health cause a person to be happy or does happiness cause a person to be healthy?

It's not black or white; it's some of both. People who are characterized by exceptional happiness or cheerfulness have certain advantages (think immune system etc..) but there are also disadvantages. The study found the disadvantages to outweigh the advantages.

The following are some of the disadvantages, some of which carry more weight than others:

Suicide/accident/homicide (not big factors)

Smoking

Drinking

Dangerous activities

Risky hobbies

Overall: A happy carefree disregard for health


:wave:

I am confused. Happy and carefree do not translate to self destructive. Eg. Suicide. What happy person wants to commit suicide? I get they might think drinking and smoking are fun, and dangerous and risky activities/hobbies will not be dangerous for THEM not considering consequences. But suicide? You lose me on that one. I never met a happy person who was carefree about life that thought suicide was attractive.

I totally expected to get this question about suicide. It's not at all straight forward as to why a generally happy person would want to commit suicide. I read this book when it first came out over a year ago. So I'm at a disadvantage; I don't remember every detail. I seem to remember a story in the book somewhere about someone who commited suicide. If I'm lucky I might be able to find it.

As I suggested, everything is not completely black or white. Happy people can and do suffer setbacks like illness, financial losses, loss of a loved one etc.. Some can overcome these setbacks and some can't. But, as I said, suicide was not one of the big factors. There were perhaps a few suicides and slightly more were among those who were judged to be generally happy people. I don't remember how many suicides there were.

The only way I can relate to it is by a friend I had several decades ago. He was a very happy-go-lucky type person. He had a "bubbly" up-beat personality. He fit the description of having a "happy carefree disregard for health."
He was self-indulgent(?) and gained a lot of weight. So he started taking prescription diet pills that he got from his doctor/brother. He became addicted, discouraged by some setbacks, and wanted to commit suicide. I was with him when he put the barrel of a gun in his mouth. I managed to talk him out of it but it was a close call. That's an example of how a generally happy person can become suicidal.

Maybe what is being defined as carefree is really not carefree and a happy disposition but more of a person who is simply not really a "thoughtful" person... Someone who goes through life without thinking things through , or evading things, does not really equate to being a happy person. A happy person is a full person, filled with both sorrow and joy, but arrives at the optimistic edge rather than the burdened edge. What the description above appears to be person who is not carefree but evading reality on some level. That may be the flaw in the argument. Not sure if I have fully explained my point. Hopefully someone understands and can expound.

Well, I don't understand what you are trying to accomplish. Perhaps it might help if I explain how these people were labeled as happy. When the study started in 1922 the study subjects were about 11 and 12 years old. There were several hundred of them (1,500). They interviewed each one and asked questions, as I remember. They also interviewed the child's teachers and parents. This is how they arrived at the conclusion of whether or not the child was a happy child or something else. I doubt it was based on whether or not the child was a "full person" who could arrive at an "optimistic edge". I think you're making it too complicated.

Then every so many years they would reinterview the person to see how their life was progressing.

I don't get the correlation between happy and disregard for health. Something is missing in the definition. Happiness to me would have to be defined by self, not by others. The old saying about laughing on the outside and crying on the inside is closer to the truth than we may realize. I think that a happy person would be one who sees life as a glass half full and could find the silver lining in all situations. I don't think that happy-go-lightly is necessarily an accurate indication of a happy heart.

I do think that a truly happy person is content with his/her lot in life and enjoys other people and their successes. I think people can be very happy and still stay conscious around their food choices. They can still choose not to drink or smoke. In fact that can make them happy if they think they are looking after themselves.

LW888

VPL Given that explanation, they are saying that "happy" children may become etc etc. Well how useful is that? Do "they" think that all happy children would grow into happy adults? My belief is that all children come in happy and depending on their life experience they make choices about how to handle life. But to conclude that because of the stats, happy children develop into carefree adults who disregard their health, makes no sense to me as an argument for suggesting that going for joy, bliss, and happiness is a bad choice for longevity.


Gotta come out with something more convincing than that for me.


LW888

32 posts on this topic and you know what? I think Villages PL is winking and kidding around with us. I honestly don't think that anyone truly believes that joy, happiness and bliss are bad things. ;)

I agree with you Bare. Villages PL is kidding around with us. :jester:
In The Art of Happiness The Dalai Lama he makes a distinction between happiness and pleasure. He says that one can pursue pleasure, but it won't won't necessarily result in happiness. He does believe that the very motion of our lives is toward happiness.

(The book was written by Howard Cutler. It is a series of interviews of The Dalai Lama.)

I don't think VPL is kidding around at all. VPL's whole life seems consumed with health issues, good and bad. VPL also loves to pose controversal statements, ok, maybe that is VPL's sense of humor.
By the way, a study started in 1922 is very out of date even with the updates. We know so much more now about how the brain works, etc....reminds me of VPL's Okinawa study references which are also out dated now.
I'm going out now to play pickleball which brings me joy , bliss, sweat and then the right to go out to Subway to eat ! Cheers.

Reminder to discuss the topic and not each other.

Actually, I (happily)found this and thought it was interesting enough to pust. Sort of like song lyrics we sing incorrectly in our heads for years, but that's another thread.

Most men lead lives of quiet desperation and go to the grave with the song still in them.

Misquotation. The first half of this quotation is a misquotation from Thoreau's Walden:

“The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation. What is called resignation is confirmed desperation. From the desperate city you go into the desperate country, and have to console yourself with the bravery of minks and muskrats. A stereotyped but unconscious despair is concealed even under what are called the games and amusements of mankind. There is no play in them, for this comes after work. But it is a characteristic of wisdom not to do desperate things.”

Misattribution. Second half of this quotation is misattributed to Thoreau and may be a misquotation or misremembering of Oliver Wendell Holmes' (1809-1894) "The Voiceless":

Alas for those that never sing,
But die with all their music in them

Oops! My mistake! Sorry. ;)

If I had a choice to choose healthy or unhealthy, healthy is better.

In caring for myself in the way I cared for my children, seeing that I get exercise and eat a variety of foods with a treat now and then, I find that I am happy, I will embrace it and live in it and drink all of the joy in my cup.

If, illness is sent to me, and my time on this earth is ending, I will try to be happy, I will embrace the time I have, I will surround myself with friends and good times, and drink all of the joy in my cup.

No one, not any single one of us is getting out of here alive.

Some of us have kept a firm faith in the hereafter and some have not.

If there is a good and loving God, he would want us to enjoy the life he has given. And if there is not a good and loving God, then this is the time that we are given.

Thinking about our physical health too much can rob us of our mental health.

Those of us that are too fixated on a subject are sure we are NOT fixated on a subject. Others around us can spot obsession in us when we cannot see it in ourselves.

Again I say, NONE of us are getting out of here alive.

Today is the day, to dance and swim, to golf and laugh, to walk and to chat, to linger over coffee, to have a glass of wine, to breathe in the sunshine and enjoy the sunset. Right now is the time to touch, to hug, to share and to laugh and to forgive.

Tomorrow may not come.