Seems to be a thing now on TOTV----taking one incident and extrapolating it to a whole group

"I knew a nurse who refused to get vaccinated, so the vaccine must not be good"
"I saw a guy driving down Morse at 60 mph, all Villagers must speed"
"I went to a show at Savannah and no one was wearing a mask"---oops, looks like the crowd got that one right:1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

Well, you get the idea

Well I'm sure you aren't suggesting that cyclists (who are within the law on the road) get in the way of an auto driver trying to speed (which is not within the law). And I'm also sure you aren't saying speeding is fine but rolling a stop sign could be considered a vigilante enforced capital offense.

But hey, I can help you define the roundabout problem. I'm guessing you've experienced coming around a roundabout with a pack of riders incoming. The first few riders...they have plenty of room to go in front of you, no problem. Somewhere in the middle of the pack it's looking like it's going to get close. So you, as a normal and reasonable person, slow down. The riders in the middle of the pack see this and assume you are "letting them go" so they gun it and get into the circle in front of you, forcing you to wait.

When you are riding at the front of the group, you can't determine what the scenario is going to be like at the middle of the group. When you are in the middle of the group, if the car doesn't slow down then you yield, as you should. The problem is when the car slows down....then you often end up with the really awkward situation of everybody stopping. Yes the group should split but if the car stops too then everybody is stopped, the car often won't take the right of way and the cyclists can't really get moving very fast so everybody ends up sitting there frustrated.

I'm not entirely sure how to avoid this problem but I'm with you, both riders and cars should follow the rules, that's for sure.

Joe

I don't know how "speeding" entered into this post, but I agree with you about the problems in a RB. Actually, I don't really have a problem with cyclists who have already started entering the RB, my problem is when I'm coming around and a pack of cyclists just blow through the yield sign right in front of me so that I have to brake hard---I always hope the car behind me is paying attention

This is about the most complete accurate response to this question, which comes up often in various forms, I have ever seen. It may be counterintuitive to non-bikers, but on the road traveling with traffic is the safest place a biker can ride.

Thank you for the clear, accurate informative post. I hope people read and think about it.

Well, since they're not playing golf, I do believe they have to...:icon_wink:

Good question

Bikes On The Road
 

You're a thoughtful person, Toymeister, I couldn't have said it as well.

Bicyclist endanger themselves, don't blame others. On the interstate I don't drive my car in packs of Semi trucks.

. You forgot to take your meds!!!!

Cyclists who want motorists to strictly obey the law, but they themselves don't want to be bothered by stop signs, red lights or yield signs, is not just a TV problem, as it is an 'entitlement mentality' that happens everywhere. The big difference with TV versus most other places, is that cyclists have the option of being able to use miles and miles of MMP's around The Villages, thereby avoiding the more dangerous vehicular traffic on roads. I plan on using my bike a lot when we get there, but after seeing all of the issues in roundabouts with just automobiles, I think I'll take my chances on MMP's whenever possible.

To be a safe walker, walk facing on coming traffic, bikers should ride with the traffic, problem solved.:ho:

Why? because...
 

the multi-paths have walkers, gawkers, and carts all over them. Bikes have access to the roads too, please share the road!:
bigbow:

Great analysis, however.
 

It would be nice if they rode in tantrum ,not parallel across the road blocking cars. Very little conversation happening so why ride side by side.? Speaking of physics , when a 2 ton object strikes a 150 lb object, it always wins. Be careful out there. Winter is coming and it will get crowded!

There are bad everyone
 

Like a couple others replied, there's bad walkers, car drivers, bikers, walkers...
However, being a polite and safety conscious car driver, I have found a good number of bikers, who seem to purposely driven to aggravate car traffic.
I agree that they have as much right to the road as everyone, but there is common courtesy, when car traffic is traveling 2 - 4 times faster and the bikers insist on blocking the road (not riding close to the curb) or hugging the lane divider on a 4 lane or poor signaling.
In TV... there is definitely bad everyone on the road...enough to go around, but the bad bikers create the most dangerous risk to themselves and vehicle traffic.

Bikes, just like cars are allowed on the road so, please share the road with your Village bikers!

If nothing else, all this conversation should have caused everyone - regardless of travel mode - to be more aware of cyclists. Cyclists should obey the law - as motorists and cart drivers should. Cyclists have a legal right to the road ..within the law...as much as anyone else.

I want to reiterate something because I've been a competitive race cyclist for many years. I follow the law. Whether or not I'm entitled to the whole lane or not, I choose to ride within 3ft of the road stripe/curb...I stop and yield when I'm supposed to....that being said, I've had beer cans/bottles thrown at me, motorists get so close they've bumped my leg as they drove by - even when they had no oncoming traffic and plenty of lane to maneuver around me.

I have turned motorists in and they have been ticketed and prosecuted. I will NOT hesitate to do that here. Remember, many of us cycle in groups...for safety and for WITNESSES! Many of us use GoPros. If you willfully endanger us when we are abiding by the law - just because you don't like us being there - you can and will be prosecuted.

I know this doesn't apply to the majority of folks who read this...thank God! But, there are some - and I have witnessed them purposely try to scare or endanger cyclists because they don't like us.

The above is for you.

I live near Spanish Springs, and there is a male biker in my area that rides fast, and only in the street. He almost wiped me out while I was crossing the street from my house, with my dogs in a leash! You can’t hear or see bikers who ride fast, and there is no where to go once they are on your heels! I wish the fast bikers would bike in an unpopulated area. One of these days either he or I will get hurt.

As you know I agree with a lot of what you say, and really only disagree on one thing. But I find it hard to believe that law enforcement would ticket someone much less prosecute them unless the LEO witnessed it. I don't think the word of someone "turning them in" or even a go pro video would do that. And if it did, even a mediocre lawyer would have that case dismissed in about 2 seconds, since you would have to prove intent.

However, it's ridiculous that someone would endanger a cyclist on purpose.

Bicycles have the same rights, privileges and responsibilities on the road as a motor vehicle. That said, some riders do not live up to them. I have ridden roads on over 35 tours in more than 30 states and have experienced good riders and good drivers as well as bad examples of both. Respect is a two way street - pun intended.

It is my understanding that if there are three or more riders in a group TV wants you riding on the streets. So when you see a group of 8 or 10 riders they are most likely in one of the bike clubs and will ride properly.

Some states allow a bicyclist to treat a stop sign as a yield sign, but all states require riders to stop at stop lights. Most police departments follow this as a matter of policy, but riders should visibly slow down and not just roll the stop sign. I have seen riders pulled over for rolling a stop sign when traffic conditions warranted it. Have also seen a rider pulled over for speeding. (Now there is a ticket to be proud of. Over 40 in a 30 on a nice downhill into town.)

Mr....I know of one person in prison today because of vehicular homicide involving a cyclist. I've helped others receive citations and I've personally seen another arrested by an officer at the scene after he almost ran over 3 of us.

Believe what you want ...or better yet...Google prosecutions involving endangering cyclists, etc.

You obviously haven't kept up with the legal rights of cyclists on the road mean just as much as someone in a vehicle.

By the way...these incidents happened in States not nearly as cyclist friendly as Florida.

You may be right, I just don't know. All I know is that in general tickets are only issued when an infraction is witnessed by a LEO or captured on an official traffic cam. Any LEO's out there that could shed light on this?????? Are the situations you are referring to involving personal injury or just someone with their undies in a bunch over a near miss????

Here's a quote from "googling" it:

"A cyclist who regularly submits videos of close passes to police has described the force’s attitude towards such footage as “absolutely vile” after he was told in an email that it would only consider referring drivers filmed endangering cyclists for prosecution when injury or damage had happened – and then, only where there is “concrete evidence and that the matter is in the public interest.” The police force has since said that “often education is the most suitable option.”

Excellent post
 

Excellent post and spot on. Riding a bike on any of the main roads in TV is not for the “faint of heart”.

What decade are you living in? What obscure link did you get that from...or did you invent it? I googled "Motorist charged with endangering cyclists" and got 100s of hits...like this one...of criminally negligent homicide...

"The teenage driver who ran a red light in Brooklyn earlier this month and smashed into another car, which then struck and killed 52-year-old cyclist Jose Alzorriz, has been charged with eleven crimes, including manslaughter and criminally negligent homicide. Both of those charges are felonies.".

Running the red light didn't cause the CNH charge, killing the cyclist did.

While a criminal court may be limited to a fine or jail time...a civil court case will bankrupt you. If me or my fellow cyclists are obeying the law...and someone threatens us in with/in a motor vehicle, I will use both remedies to the utmost of my ability.

My advice is simply learn to live with us on the road...and don't take your preferences and anger out on us...because we're here to stay.

Bikes have as much right to be on the road as you automobile, paths are for walkers and carts!

No, the running a red light most certainly led to the CNH charges...

If the cyclist had run the light and had been hit, there would have been no charges filed...

And bicycles... Hence the term "Multi-Modal"

I agree except the walkers and runners should be in the opposite lane of the cyclists and golf carts. Many walkers and runners do NOT know the rules and they're going to get hit!

Again, you cite cases of personal injury and death. I am referring to the claim that LEO's would issue "tickets" for "near misses" because the cyclist claimed it was true or had a personal video recording. IT IS NOT THE SAME THING.

I was knocked off my bike 6 months back exiting the roundabout near the McClure gate at Fenney Way. The driver of the car who entered the roundabout from warm springs never stopped after clipping my rear tire. I was lucky enough to land in the grass. Even though it's my right to be on the road I avoid them and stay on the mmp's

Even though it's my right as a cyclist to be on the MMP, I avoid them and stay on the walking/biking paths.

Some of us have to use them to get to the walking/bike trails though.

When that happens the group of cyclists are 100% not following the rules and in the wrong, I hope it's not a common occurrence. It would irritated me too...and I'm a cyclist.

On a different subject, I've seen a few posts complaining of cyclists taking up the whole lane and need to comment. The size of the lanes in TV are such that if you are riding 2' left of the white line and a car needs at least 3' to safely pass. So the right side of your car needs to be at least 5 feet left of the white line and the lane simply isn't wide enough to fit your car around a single cyclist without moving into the L lane. Since you need to move into the L lane anyway, does it really matter if two cyclists are riding side by side?

Joe

You are correct and this is actually addressed in the statute. The statute makes reference to "sub-standard width roads". These are roads that are too narrow to allow for a car and a bike to be in the same lane adjacent to each other. The roads in The Villages are "sub-standard width roads". The net result is that cars need to pass cyclists in the oncoming lane on a two lane road (one lane in each direction), when it is safe to do so, and in the passing lane on a four lane road (two lanes in each direction). Cyclists should avoid occupying both lanes on a four lane road since they could be impeding traffic and in violation of the statute.

On Buena Vista and Morse there is not enough room on the right side of the road to safely ride on as there is a big curb. Whenever I ride my bicycle on them I reserve the whole lane as there is not three feet from that curb that a car and bicycle can safely go side by side. I have to compliment the drivers that have passed me on these roads for always respecting that, never honking or shouting. simply changing lanes without ever really having to slow down. I believe that for a motorist to know where I am and what my intentions are removes doubts as to what they think and therefore makes a decision easier for them. Again I want to say that I have found motorists exceptional here in the villages. I have found golf cart drivers much worse on the MMP, especially where there are islands and tunnels.