But, it made and produced by fossil fuels.

I had dodge ram charger in early 80’s. I was lucky to get 10 miles gallon. And that was with SB 318 two barrel.

Electric cars aren’t as green as the tree-huggers want us to believe.

The Environmental Impact of Lithium Batteries - IER

Back in 2000 I stopped for diesel fuel for my F-350 at a station on Donner Pass, on the California Nevada border. I paid $5.00 a gallon. I went in and paid and said, "You didn't even buy me dinner." In 2008 I was also paying $5.00 a gallon for diesel. I still have a diesel vehicle, I'll pay what it costs to buy fuel..... cheaper than buying a Tesla <g>

The rising price of gas goes far beyond the mpg of your car. If you only see this issue as a cost to drive your car you have missed the big picture of how this effects every part of your life. It is directly tied to inflation and even if you do not drive a car at all or if you drive an electric car, it has a profound effect on your daily life. This country (and the world) is being destroyed by this climate change agenda. Hope it stops soon.

Ok
 

Larry David

This too shall pass.
The US has options to turn on, AGAIN, to approach energy independence.

It will only happen when it becomes an agenda advantage for the party in power.

If you still think those elected to office are representatives of the people......enjoy the wishful thoughts!!

Ok, thanks. So the statement that most of US electricity is from coal was wrong. 22% is not most and is only equal to the amount produced by renewables. Here is the link for those who want to see the actual data

HERE

The data presented are from 2021 and does NOT include solar production from small sources like home units. That adds 49 billion KWh to US production. The chart shows that industrial solar is 112 billion, and if you add the 49 billion you can see that solar is greater than coal going forward. If only we invested the hundreds of billions we have given to big oil in a Manhattan project effort to improve solar technology and battery storage we and Europe could not be economic hostage to OPEC and Russia.

For those who claim that if only we would drill more, it has everything to do with big oil profits. If price per barrel is low, they won't use the drilling rights they already have, 9000 unused leases that are not profitable with lower prices. For those who say if only we had more oil production now than we need, just look north. Canada is awash in extra oil. So much oil that they export millions of barrels per DAY to the US. Does having lots of extra oil mean that gas prices are low in Canada. No it does not. Canada sells its oil on the international market. Oil companies in Canada buy their oil on the international market.

The price of a gallon of gas in Ontario Canada has increased by 1.24 US dollars between Nov 29 21 and Mar 7 22. It is now 5.79/gallon [yes I converted liters and dollars]
The price of a gallon of gas in Florida has gone up from 3.36 on Nov 29 21 to 4.08 on Mar 7 22, an increase of 0.72. What do you conclude from this?? I conclude that have an over-supply of oil in one's own country does NOT buffer the price you pay at the pump. Being an exporter simply means that you make money on a product when the price is high.

But don't let real, easily googled facts get in the way of a strongly held opinion, see my sig line.

I traded in my first electric car after driving it for 7 years and 135,000 miles. The battery degraded (lost charge) by about 10 miles over 7 years, not too bad. When I bought the car it had a maximum range of 240 miles. My new electric car has a range of almost 400 miles which equates to about 5 hours of driving. After driving for 5 hours I need a 40 minute break so my car is perfect for me, especially on long drives. My new car was expensive to purchase (I love the features and I'm ok with the price) but it has virtually zero maintenance and I charge it at my house or office and I don't even notice the blip on my electric bill.

Most people are stubborn and will never try driving an electric vehicle. I get it and I respect that but I guarantee that their children will try it and I guarantee they will own an electric vehicle in their lifetime. Unless of course they are equally as stubborn. :) There are a lot of EV incentives and you don't have to worry about fluctuating gas prices.

Even though I can afford gas we have to find an alternative fuel and I don't think electric is fully ready for primetime, but this county has to start getting self-reliant. The Saudis chop up a reporter and we ignore it. Putin attacks a country, and we have to be dragged to the table to stop oil imports. We have to come up with a solution or all of us will be slaves forever.

Why don't you provide the sources that refute his argument.

I am not sure that stubborn is the reason. There are many, many other reasons why a different lifestyle will keep a person from buying electric.

My son has one, and he loves it, but again, its only for around town, not for long distance travel. Too much planning for recharge stations and availability which can potentially make reaching the destination on time for an event less certain. Also the small size means that he can't bring all the trip necessities, which also makes the EV impractical

I won't as the cost increase of the car overwhelms the fuel savings, so financially, it doesn't make sense. 20K miles per year * 20 mph * $4 gal = $4K per year in fuel. so if you drive less than 20K per year, the annual cost per fuel is even less.. ..

So to spend more than $20K more per vehicle, which equals $2K savings at 10K miles annually x 10 years, the financial decision is not optimal.

By this he is referring to this vehicle.

This is also true for the much vaunted electric vehicles.

Why don't you provide the sources that support his argument. And see the post from 9:49 AM, which was 20 minutes before your comment, for a start on your research.

If approaching a light or something I much prefer to get to the line of cars to be able to stop to give more time if I want to do something like drink something or look for something. Better to do things when stopped vs while driving. If I am behind someone who leaves a gap and takes lots of time to get to the line of cars, I then can’t do what I planned. To me I’d rather stop then save a penny or two.

This is not a political issue. It wouldn't matter who is president. If your looking to blame anyone look in the mirror. All the problems we face usually are self inflicted. We want cheap products we buy from foreign countries. U.S. companies move offshore to survive the computation and keep their stock prices high. On and on, then we complain there are no job, so we look around to blame someone other than ourselves.

i love my guzzler & wouldn't give Alfred up for all the $$ in the world, simply because they don't make these kind of cars anymore. everything is compact, fiberglass & similar to riding in a tin can, -hardly the safest feeling while doing 70 on the highway trying to keep up with traffic. he gets around 22-24mpg & uses premium.

Ourselves= 1%er. Millions don’t get to make those choices. Agree, we will be our downfall and that downfall coming.

I wouldn’t trust Google, they are invested in the research.

I see we are now going to stop buying Russian Oil at least until Ukraine issue is resolved. I an not interested in if that is good or bad, it just is. The impact, from the reliable sources (to me) that I can find are that gasoline prices are about to "SOAR". The $5/gal we have been discussing could easily be something we look back at and call the "good old days" - real soon now. Suggestions of car pooling for grocery shopping etc and now being seriously considered.

My wife and I have been putting off getting a Tesla until we needed the self driving (which I think will be no more than 5 years from now - based on my ability to drive) and today we sat down to seriously discuss getting a used one.

Or the homeless standing at intersections asking for handouts when on the same
intersection there are "Help Wanted" all over.

Where did we ever go wrong?????

If those of us who think electric is the answer, they better ask themselves a few hard questions:
Do you know the environmental impact of strip mining of minerals used to make them?
Are you aware that countries like China & Russia are in the process of acquiring mineral rights in countries more than willing to sell them?
Do you know the environmental impact of the disposal of said batteries at the end of usage?
Did you know that the U.S. has consistently reduced CO2 emissions since mileage requirements were implemented?
If oceans are/will be rising, why do so many wealthy "green" people continue to purchase coastal property?
Do you know the sources of electric power in your state? Do your utility companies burn natural gas, use coal or nuclear power?
Do you know where most of the solar panels used in the U.S. are manufactured?
Do you know what happens to windmill blades once they must be replaced?

At my age, it's hard not to get political here with my answers. :posting:

I have a modern gas guzzler, it replaced the last model that struggled to get 15mpg downhill with the wind.
Old bangers like yours should have been scrapped years ago!:icon_wink:

Must be the .7mpg we squeeze out of ours that makes it a non guzzler.
Didn't realize how good on fuel consumption our car is!:icon_wink:

Today there are other choices than Tesla. None have full self-driving, but you do have a choice and some when it's available will become self-driving with a simple download. EVs are the future, the only problem at the moment is charging stations. The administration is putting money to cure that, but when the states realize they could make money by putting charging stations on their roads you will find them every 5 feet.

You have have the ability to make power for the charging stations when most populated areas have electricity blackouts now. Electricity is not like the air we breath. It takes a lot to produce it and distribute it.

Actually we been going down hill or struggling since 50s Nash.


Promo model: Nash Metropolitan | Savage On Wheels

You would think 70 years or so of technology vehicles now days would be getting twice that.

You were the one who challenged his statement, not me. What you posted pretty well supported what he said. You also said that the oil companies were receiving subsidies, cite what these subsidies are. You infer that you know the facts, prove it.

getting about 21 mph - very happy with my guzzler

The problem with electric vehicles is having enough electric power generation capacity to provide electricity to those charging stations. I can't remember the number of reports of brown and black outs that happen across the country but they happen frequently. Haven't heard of anyone in government addressing this problem.

I understand the thought. The reality there is no way they would allow you to drive it on the roads. The engines surely required high octane leaded fuel to be compatible with the valves. No one sells it around here. I think you can still buy it as aviation fuel. Huh how many 6 gal plastic cans to fill a tank? Parts? Someone who can and will repair it? It does drive and ride like well a tank. The air conditioning-nonexistent.

Not sure, didn't someone make a tank golf cart? Street legal?

Not to lead you down the path. I will bet you can find a place selling tanks or perhaps an armored truck..

This is a brief over view on subsidies that the government gives out.

Government Subsidies (Farm, Oil, Export, Etc)

A lot of other industries and private individuals get subsidies, not just the oil industry. My solution is to end all subsidies and grants from the government.

additionThis stuff is endless. And there is no shortage of misinformation. I owned a 1964 and I 1970 air cooled VW BUG. They were standard, (stick shift) driving a stick in stop and go traffic with a stick eating a big mac and a thick shake-that is an art. On a straight highway run the delivered around 30mpg. Top speed was like 68 miles per hour unless you were going down hill. My current car Chevy Malibu, rides far more comfortably than the classic VW. It has far better brakes. It has far better acceleration. It has air conditioning. Heat works. A VW being air cooled, being very crude, the heat never worked when it was truly cold. Oh and my Chevy gets better gas mileage than the classic VWs with no need to change plugs and do a full tune up every 10,000 miles and a valve adjust every 30,000.

Cars are far better than they were and safer as well.

Nash vs VW which has the most iconic, annoying horn.

I have a 2017 Nissan Murano with the 3.5 liter V6 engine rated at 265 HP. If I drive the speed limit on the interstate I can get 30 MPG. Even when I run at 80 MPH on the interstate I get 26 MPG.
I had a Dodge conversion van back in the days when they were popular that had a 318 engine with a pretty wild cam, high rise manifold, 4 barrel Holley carb and headers that gave me 11 MPG at 55 MPH. Granted that wasn't a standard engine but I don't believe it generated 265 HP. My friend had a van also with a regular 318 engine and he only got around 16 MPG. The new engines get excellent milage.

Subsidies. All think what others get are wrong corrupt etc but what they get is proper and fair. Sadly that is typical views.
Assuming by logo #10 GI. VA medical, GI college, GI bonus points on civil service tests. GI housing loans. TRUTH do you oppose all of them?

Nothing is perfect. Farm controls, paying farmers not to grow. Prevents production of crops that cannot be sold at the cost to produce. The oil industry. No one will say hey it is my fault. It is no longer shown on the pump, it used to be, roughly 1/3 of the price is taxes. Interesting FACT people pushing electric cars do not mention that the cars get government subsidies. The cost to generate electricity gets subsidies and they do not pay the huge tax stated above like 1/3 33% tax on gasoline and similar if not more on diesel to pay for the roads and road repairs.

Yup, agree. Subsidies are basically social engineering. They are to "encourage" companies to do things the "people" want done. At least that was the theory, I think today they are abused a bit more than they should be. But, I agree with you completely.

There was no shortage of cars put together with parts from places like HC Whitney that were miscombined and not mated properly to the transmission or the brakes.
I had a Triumph GT6 that was beat to hell and had been raced. Basically a Trump spitfire with a TR6 engine. The car would keep the speedometer bouncing off the end. If, I recall the speedometer went to 160. The car would drive 350 miles at average speed of 100 mph and get over 30 miles per gallon.

Someone who could properly tune a four barrel carb, including the linkages and jets is, was rare. Aside my GT6 had two over sized down draft carbs. Typical garage-I refuse to work on that thing.

I worry about the exhaust of the gas golf carts.

We sold our H2 Hummer and our 10 cylinder Excursion to our kids before we moved down here or when we went back for a visit. They both have called for a refund. DENIED!