Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

just my $0.02, but if the cdds were run like a state government, tv would consist of a bunch of trailers/mobile homes/whatever on the other side of 27/441 and you'd be driving into leesburg for vittles.

no, the cdd concept implementation is not perfect and 190 could stand a relook -- not a repeal or major overhaul, but a tweak. as it is, i got to sleep nightly thanking my lucky stars that i've had brilliant, dedicated, unselfish folks like :edit: taking care of the interests poor ignorant apathetics like the rest of us. oh lord we are not worthy!!!!

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Dearest Muncle, You seem to be feeling better..a little of that old -iss and vinegar coming out tonight. :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup: :-*

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

But I don't like vittles... Muncle, it is so good to read your colorful comments. Feel better!

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Just a thought I had, nothing more. And...I'm certainly not out to change anything.

However, it still seems to me it would be a better system than having only one person making the decisions for 2 of the CDDs (with these 2 CDDs owning all the rec centers, executive golf courses, and all the land around and near both squares). ??? ??? ???

Personally, I would like to see a second Katie Belle's at Lake Sumter Landing. Having another indoor dance hall would be nice on rainy, chilly, or hot nights in addition to a place to go after the Squares close.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Ah, seems like protest is "Gone With The Wind". Oh, for the days of 1968 again in this instance.

Well, if they are going to build "upscale villas", then they are going to need "upscale" resturants (aka Bonefish Grill). The opportunity is there with two large resturants gone from Lake Sumpter plus a large open storefront. Wonder how Joseph A. Bank is doing?

What kind of resturants could work? How about a good Jewish deli like Ben's in West Boca? How about an English pub/chop house where Dominicks was? How about a Spanish/Portugese resturant? How about a resturant like Angelo's (I think its either Eustis or Tarvares)? Morton's?? LOL. I am not knocking the low end resturants that are here at the same time the median income is $88,000, so tell me is it greed or demographics?

One more thing, rich (nice rich people) like to have something named after them like a building, that will never happen with their mindset.

I want to say one more thing I wrote an email to the POA and HOA and did not even get the courtesy of an acknowledgement.

I love this place and always will at the same time from here on, I will tell people all that glitters is not gold. The best advertising in the world is word of mouth! Think about it!!

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I don't understand this statement. Are you saying that you love this place and will give it BAD word of mouth? OR Are you saying that you love this place and will give it GOOD word of mouth?

Why on earth, even if you thought otherwise, own an investment in some location and then give it BAD word of mouth to endanger your investment?

Just wondering.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I thought the same thing, Russ... if your soup is flat, wouldn't you add salt vs spitting in the pot? :dontknow:

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

OK, why would I say I love it here and then say to a possible new resident what has happened and could that happen again.

Because I came here with the belief that the developer always would put residents into consideration in future planning and building. Obviously this is not the case when you are left with the impression when you are looking at what was planned and would remain that way. Now every piece of open land except the golf courses is open to building. Freedom Point and Old Mill Landing are the examples. Isn't there a point of no return?

Yes, I will tell possible new residents what could happen and if they can live with that, fine. I will just pass along a warning. The ecology (I am far from being a greenie) of Florida is a fragile ecology and if the ecology is altered and/or disrupted the chance of something going wrong increases. South Florida has a long term water issue which could be remedied by the Everglades Restoration Project which will cost billions of dollars. If smart growth was the rule this issue could not happen. I will grant the developer one very important observation, the developer builds according to the contour of the land and does not tear it apart whether be a residential subdivision or commercial. Everything built seems to fit and is low profile. Other developers should be like ours in that respect.

I would be less angry and hurt, if the developer said to us, "there is open land which we could develop in the near future. This would either be residential or commercial." They would probably get more suggestions as to what to do with the open land then go behind the back.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Alan, I don't know if it because we live in an area that has had so much grow in the last 25 years but when hubby and I first visited The Villages four years ago, we wondered what would be put in the undeveloped areas where the buffalo roamed. Even four years ago there was conversation in The Villages that the buffalo were on that land to make the taxes more palatable until the areas were developed. (Hubby and I have seen a lot of beautiful farmland in the Midwest gobbled up for development.) We, also, would like to know what is planned for those areas but I'm sure there is a masterplan for this community and the developer is not looking for our input for changes. If they start filling in the lowlands and lakes, we will then be in trouble.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I guess I'm confused. Who owns the land..we or he? If he owns the land, why shouldn't he be able to develop it, within zoning standards, as he sees fit? He seems to have a grand master plan. His plan has made TV a highly desirable place to live in the US. We are here and many more want to come. Utopia does not exist...but TV is kind of close.
Going back to the buffalo, you had to know they would never be a permanent fixture and were simply a tax tool. We all use tax tools. Why is there this constant demonization of Gary Morse? He is richer and way smarter than I am. That does not awaken the green eyed monster within me. We all made the choice to live here. We could and should try to improve our living conditions here in TV with constuctive suggestions.
I have never felt the developer "went behind my back." He doesn't require my permission or consent to do much of anything.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

When we moved here there was a lawsuit against the developer building Sumpter Landing brought against him because of concerned citizens worried about the water tables in this area and the impact that so much development would have on the land. Much open space was here all that not so long ago. Many residents who bought here were "promised" not written, that no development would take place in several areas. I attended a garden meeting a year ago by a former resident who is very distressed with the loss of natural habitat that was supposed to remain undeveloped for wildlife. There had been an orginal plan that we saw and were told about, about what would be developed in the future ,however that is not so today. Is this a situation where like the Talk Host the railroad was not shown on the Villages maps of that time.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I hate that talk Host has to endure the train. This subject is not about the train. It is about the Lake Sumter Landing area.
People will continue to move to Florida. Central Florida is a wonderful place to live on many levels. You will not stop the influx of people into this area. High density dwelling seems preferable to urban sprawl.
More than once I have seen the attitude " I was here 2,4,5,10,___ years ago. You new people should stay up north where you came from. Is that the real issue here? We have what we want and all you newbie wannabees should not mess up our lifestyle."

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Deb, I agree with your position. Lots of the old not-in-my-back-yard syndrome. I can't imagine how naive someone would have to be to see that large swath of land alongside the hotel and across from that HUGE empty parking lot and think it was going to remain a buffalo pasture forever. It's going to be developed by the evil developer that developed all the rest of the wonderful things in TV. What has the developer done wrong already? Some may find fault in certain areas, but overall everything seems to add to the desirability of TV. Look around at the open space that will stay. The golf courses (yes, of course there are golf courses that won't be developed), the "preserves" that are all around, even just the roads and pools and rec centers - which aren't open space per se, but still not developed with folks living there. Overall the entire effect is positive, and apparently I am not alone thinking that.
IMHO, if the developer puts something in place in that empty cow field, it will be a boon to the area, only making it a little more desirable to be here. I know he (they) are making lots of money, and it's in their continued best interest not to :edit: it up so they can keep doing so.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

We purchased in 2006. Asked at that time what would go across from Barnes & Noble where the buffalo were at that time. (We actually assumed it would NEVER stay a buffalo pasture.) We were told it was zoned for future buildout. Just my humble input to this bashing of the developer.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Sam and Steve, stand up and take a bow, :agree: :agree: :agree:.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I think most people would assume it would never stay a buff pasture. jbsmom.. you still haven't had that cat coiffed??
Peachie, thanks..sometimes it gets scary taking a stand. People get very passionate about these issues.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

You're right, Sam, but many people read this forum and it's so important to present the "other side of the coin". Working together to build up vs tearing down or defaming our community reaps greater rewards. One may want to inform their friends of upcoming changes but that doesn't require blackening the community eye. I think the hardest principle for some people to grasp is perhaps the developer is doing what developers do and not trying to ruin what they have created. (Now don't prove me wrong, Mr. Morse.....)

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

It seems every last son-of-a-gun wants to be the last son-of-a-gun to move to Florida.
Or, as submariners say, Close the hatch and take her down, I'm aboard.

DC

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Let's see, the developer has been dong this successfully for almost 40 years. The very obvious results over the years and to date is they do it better and better and better.
I know of no developer who would go to the masses to test for reaction....see what they want next....can you imagine the multiple inputs....multiple interests...LACK OF PROGRESS!!!!
The Villages I suspect attains approval by residents of 90%++. And of course like everything else, the naysayers (minority) seem to be louder than those of us who are happy and satisfied.
Makes one wonder why they bought here in the first place.
I believe the developer does an outstanding job of providing what the market wants in housing and amenities. There is a different critical mass here now than when the built things like bowling alleys and Katie Bells. The critical mass has worked wonders in attracting national brands of all sorts.
The more they develop, the better it continues to get for us property owners including retaining property values. And in that process the developer et al are getting rich(er).
Aren't we blessed? Because if they weren't, then there would be cause for concern.

We loved it here 5 years ago and like it more each year.

BTK

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

The Villages is no different than anywhere else. The developer can do whatever he wants with the land as long as the plan follows zoning ordinances. Of course, not everyone is going to agree with every plan. That's human nature. However, if the developer has not violated any ordinances then he has the privilege of carrying out his plan regardless of what you or I may think.

amgoldho: I am confused by the statement you made of "I would be less angry and hurt, if the developer said to us, "there is open land which we could develop in the near future. This would either be residential or commercial." They would probably get more suggestions as to what to do with the open land then go behind the back." Please explain how Mr. Morse supposedly (by your claim) went behind anyone's back? What do you base that belief?

Mr. Morse is doing his job of developing the land he owns of which he has every right to do. I don't know of any place that requires a developer to ask for citizen input.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

With all due respect BTK, I think the developer HAS gone to the masses and asked for what they want. I think you can see the results of that in the changes made over the course of the 40 years. The changes made have been driven by the folks buying the homes. Things like wider golf cart trails and tunnels are a great example of ways TV has become even more attractive than it was. Perhaps there was no survey taken, but folks have put their money where their mouths are and bought into the improvements made.

Personally, I can't wait to see what improvements are made below 466A. I think it will be even better.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

OXFORD -- The most hated man in Sumter County lives on a country road in a concrete-block house that he built himself. On his 55 acres he grows hay for sale.

He also raises Cain.

http://www.sptimes.com/2002/07/07/St..._crusade.shtml

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Willy, is the article, "Nudist condo nettles some neighbors, ;D :redface:

Seriously, I think I missed the article in the link, would you advise me...

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Scroll down - it's at the bottom of the link.

Seems to be some very ill-informed quotes in the article. Farnsworth "wishes he could eat in the restaurants but they're all members only" - a crock of :edit:

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Page down. The article is at the bottom of the headlines.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I found it, thank you.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I have been speed reading and probably didn't get this right.

I know that when we moved into a newly built housing area in West Chester, Ohio 35 years ago, I had hoped for but couldn't dream of the wonderful area it has become. Wonderful houses, people, schools, restaurants, library. JUST dazzling. All along there was a low chant. no change, no change no change. But not from us. Now I see all the folks who didn't want change eating at the restaurants, seeing their grandchildren do well at the schools etc.

I am older and I think I have learned a few things. One is if it ain't broke, why fix it. What in heavens name is so wrong with more people moving to TV except for the mild inconvenience of traffic and waiting to be seated at restaurants. I do believe that with the water all around this peninsula that someone will figure out how to desalinate it and restore the water table.

It could be I simplify. But I really don't think the sky is falling. YET.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

A modest observation:

Ever since Harold Schwartz passed away, there have been small rumblings that his family ("The Morses," "The Developer," "Those Guys") cared nothing about the residents, only about $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

To some extent, I think that money does, indeed, drive their lifestyle. They certainly do NOT have the reputation that HS did. However, I agree wholeheartedly that they have the right to do what they want with their property.

It's just too bad, on t'other hand, that they don't have a better "bed-side manner." The sudden destruction of the buffalo ground near Lake Sumter gives many a bad taste in the mouth. I note that there is still no mention in the Daily Sun's Construction Update about this project. Nor, about whatever is happening east of the Homewood Assisted Living Center, where many old and beautiful live oaks are being cut down!

It's too bad that there are many obvious flys in the ointment!

SWR

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

As I recall, the buffalo were gone for quite some time and had been replaced by cows, no?

Since the day I asked my R/E agent about the buffalo - and he told me about the whole tax-dodge concept - I knew they were nothing more than a place holder until the developer decided to do what he does best - develop.

If you liked looking at the tree in my lawn, or the car in my driveway, or my statue on the lawn (heaven forbid), would I be in any way obliged to discuss the trimming of the tree or moving the car or painting the statue with you before I did?

Maybe it's me, but it was undeveloped land sitting in the middle of a huge sprawling development holding a few cows while it waited its turn. It belongs to the developer, and he didn't masquerade anything about it, it was going to be developed, either into a commercial or residential complex. Now you think he owed you the courtesy of telling you what he was developing there? I truly don't get it.

What do you think is going to happen to the land between CVS and WalMart along 466 where a few cows graze? Do you seriously think it's going to remain a cow pasture? Did anyone feel offended that some of it became the Bone Fish Grill, or CVS, or Beall's without letting all of us know? I don't get it!

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Welcome back Muncle - Nice to read you again!

To what point in time would some of you people like the Morse family to roll things back to?

Let's look at this from a business POV. If the new houses that they are building are still selling in this economy THEY must be doing something correct. Yes? If you now have major retail centers (the Wal-Marts, Target etc.) and hundreds of restaurants that you never had THEY must be doing something correct. Yes? If the house that you bought in 1998 is now worth 2 or 3 times what it was worth then THEY must be doing something right. Yes?

From an environmental standpoint when I look at the TV map I see numerous Krestel, Owl etc. preserves etc. I assume that this are permanent preserves and will not be built on. If that is the case then THEY must be doing something correct. Yes?

TV is more desirable today than it was 4 years ago, or 10 years ago or 20+ years ago when HS started this thing. THEY must be doing something correct. Yes?

Just my 4 cents worth from an outsiders perspective.
Russ

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

We moved to West Boca Raton in July 1992 (yep just before Andrew) with our two daughters who were still in high school. We moved to Boca because of the school system. We lived in a subdivision of 7000 homes called Loggers Run.

Ok, During the first few years during the rainy season, there would be rain like clockwork and the thunderstorms would line up along I-95 and move inland. Water and rain was plenty. Then the building increased where we lived out towards the Everglades and between the turnpike and 441. Each year the rainy season seemed shorter and each year the starting point for the thunderstorms was further west until by the time we moved most of the rain was falling west of the turnpike. Water became and still is an issue. I talked to a person well versed in climate and he said if they keep building over the "open" land, water will become a serious problem. South Florida's water issue is greater than ours yet we with our own water system are on a form of rationing. To desalinate is a costly endeavor and guess who pays for it, the taxpayer.

Now we have a community that at buildout (2011??) we will have a population of 101,000+. With smart growth one takes into consideration the infrastructure, land use, etc. This developer is one of the best in this country. To plan out a community like this, is truly amazing and I truly thank him for that. At the same time one must consider the ramifications and the future quality of life.

If you have not been to South Florida, go there and see if you would like to live there.

Also this is a rural society not urban or suburban which makes this area almost unique. There are some beautiful horse farms, ranches which I hope never go.

I am more concerned about the quality of life for the future, not property values. Maybe I am an idealist, well so be it. Go take a ride in your golf cart and look at the open land and picture houses or whatever in those areas, could get a little suffocating.

Progress comes at what price?

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

All the offers of input from the posters are the very reason that the developer should do what he wants. It's worked so far! With home sales in TV 17% ahead of last year, who are we to argue?

Personally, I love coming home for my 10 days off work and just enjoying the surroundings, whatever they may be.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Alan, I have the distinct feeling you were unaware of the size and scope of planned Villages development. I can't believe you thought you would be able to control the development after you moved in to your home. And as for the water issue, surely you have heard about the individual down the road in Sumter County, I believe, who is selling the water and able to ship it out of the area. How desperate can water conditions be if the powers that be see fit to let that happen? Maybe that is the first place to start to control the water problem, stop shipping it out of central FL.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Exactly right. Some people state with surprise that the the developer is selling "our" plazas and "our buffalo fields"!

We should be thankful that the developer had the creativity, energy, financial resources and vision to create this paradise for us to enjoy.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I concur. Anyone in his position wakes up everyday knowing he's gonna take a lot of shots from a lot of directions. Like they say, "The tall trees take the breeze". Face it, The entire Morse family has all the moola they could ever want. If they didn't have their heart and soul into this venture they could have cashed in their chips long ago and done what most Villigers have done... "retired".

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

I don't believe you are an idealist. Some people are never satisfied or able to see the glass as half full. If we all stay as active as we can in the District gov't I believe we can trust the developer to do what he's done so far... which is to create a retirement community that is the envy of the Nation.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Today's Daily Sun had a small photo of lawn grader machines with caption stating they were clearing land for 182 villas and 20 designer homes in field by Old Mill Run. Nothing splashy.

As a topic cop aside for all of you out in the hinterlands, they also said Red Lobster site prep has begun and restaurant will open in Jan 09.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Russ. I agree with your very positive, very accurate post. :agree: :agree: :agree:

I personally have only heard this criticism of the developers on TOTV but never have heard it in TV when we am there. I haven't read a POA newsletter, just exerpts. I wonder why they make me feel not wanted as a newcomer sometimes here on this forum.

I certainly didn't want to spend my final years trying to run a golf course community. We did that once and believe me it isn't fun. A group of residents bought the course we lived on when it went on the market and I thought my neighbors had common sense. WRONG. Anything by committee is just a place for people to showcase their personal ideas. I am glad that the developers are running it and running it so well. I keep hearing about small things, not big things. May we all outlive any change in TV.

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Amen, Gracie!!!!! :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup:

Re: Fence being removed by Lake Sumter Landing where buffalo were!
 

Thanks Gracie, may we all listen well to your message.

For those who have never experienced what Gracie posted, beware. There are hundreds of cases just like hers. Satanic developer leaves only to be replaced by dozens of imps each one with mischief in mind. I, too, have had the same experience. Among other things, it turns neighbor against neighbor. Of all of the reasons I moved from that subdivision to The Villages, that was number one.

DC