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Your example of playing championship golf 312 times a year for a couple comes out to .30 cents per round to use the online tee time system, now if they golfed a couples times a week at an executive course too, the cost per use would be around .18 cents, looks like a bargain to me.
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Rekop...I certainly understand your comments....BUT...as i said....u have a choice...u can play free at the exec courses.......and i would pay $15,600 at the least expensive (not as nice a TV's) championship courses in my area (NY) and T times would be via phone, first come first served....now lets see.....extra $96/year...when u already pay $10k for golf....thats a .0096% increase.......i wish my food bill would only go up $96/year ....as far as someone making money from the increase...yup...your right....but...if u have investments..would u object to making a profit of $96??????
my intent with the post was not to criticize those who are objecting....just offering my comments.....like with us all....its your call.... as fellow golfer like you....i'll would pay the $96 to play the beautiful courses at TV....hit it long and straight |
Everyone seems to have valid points:
If you want to complain about it then please do. You never know maybe it might work. If nothing comes of the complaints then you could revert to just using the telephone system. If you want to use the on-line system then pony up the $96 I do have a question about its use. Do all members of the foursome need to be members of the on-line system? In other words maybe if you have a regular 4 or more members would it be possible to split the $96 and only have 1 person make the reservations? Personally I think I'd like the ability to make my own but perhaps it is a possibility? |
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If you haven't seen the notice on Villages.Net, take a moment to read. Briefly it mentions the new rates in effect for 2009 and indicates what is included in the 8.00, called "member services". . 2 e-mail addresses per household . access to the villages golf and information system . access to schedules of events in and around the villages Granted you may not want anything other than the t-time access but now you have the info. and can choose to dial or use the web. Incidentally I max out at 100 - 120 rounds per year. At 156 rounds per year each for you and your wife (total 312), you win the prize. 116 for me and 85 for the wife last year. |
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#2. Executive courses are free, but they are not "real" golf to people who golf a lot. They are short, and basically aimed at beginners or elderly people who can't play the longer courses for a variety of reasons. However, there are a number of golfers, myself included, that have started playing the 9 hole exec courses simply to help out with expenses. And they are not "free" they are subsidised by our amenity fees. #3. I have been a member of various golf clubs over the years, including some high end private country clubs, and have never had to pay to make a tee time. That's utterly ridiculous. Your ability to make tee times is always included in your membership fee. I think if you're a priority member, that online ability should be included. When you're managing a group for example and checking out tee times for various days, or researching openings to see if women or men are playing, it would be tedious if not impossible to have to do that over the phone, so online access is necessary. #4. As far as making a profit, I feel the Villages makes plenty of profits off of us. My original post stated that I have no problem with them making a profit, but at some point I think they've gone over the line. You're entitled to your opinion, but we disagree. As far as having 2 email addresses, and access to Villages events, who cares? We have our email with comcast and see the events listed in the rec center papers. Obviously we'll pony up the $$; there is no alternative. But the system doesn't seem fair to me compared to how golf country clubs normally work. They're just taking advantage of people. Some Villagers will sit back and take it. Others, like myself, will question things. To each his own. Stay in the short grass....Rekop |
Perhaps part of the problem is that the villages.net is not owned by TV and so doesn't get any of the profits or amenity fees? I suppose we could vote to have our amenity fees subsidize the online system. But I'll bet non-golfers would object.
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Some folks have made a mistake by buying in The Villages.
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I think some people love it here, but realize it has its imperfections and would like to see it become even better.
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rekop,
So true. My feelings completely! |
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tee time fee
We have always paid for the tee time system because we don;t have comcast internet service. we have been paying $60 a year and don't like the increase but the convience is worth it. everything has gone up and the phone is still free.
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Am I the only one who didn't know that it was free to comcast customers? I've been paying for years....!???
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And frankly, its not the money, its the idea that we as priority country club members pay $10,000 a year and that is not even unlimited golf, and have to pay additional money just for the ability to make an online teetime. There is probably no other country club in the nation that operates that way. End of subject, for me anyways. |
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________________ Recop - From what my golfing friends at TV tell me (and there are some very low handicaps included!) the execs at TV are not just for beginners and elderly (I can't believe you even said that word). Golfers out there please comment. I do agree that perhaps a priority membership should have the on-line system included. I'm just curious Recop - what is your handicap? I thought perhaps during this thread that you were a golfer but I'm beginning to think otherwise from some of the comments in that last posting. I love playing longer courses myself and my handicap hovers just out of the single digit range but I don't feel that playing the 9 hole execs is beneath me the way that you make it out to be. I think that they can be fun and challenging - all they lack is the long first drive. I think you should explain those comments a little. |
You obviously don't play much golf. # 1, the courses here aren't that great. Cane Garden, Mallory and Havana have nice layouts, but the fairways this time of year are like concrete. Hopefully this rain will help some. Glenview, Tierra, Lopez, and Orange Blossom are generally in decent shape, as is Palmer which is very expensive to play.
#2. Executive courses are free, but they are not "real" golf to people who golf a lot. They are short, and basically aimed at beginners or elderly people who can't play the longer courses for a variety of reasons. However, there are a number of golfers, myself included, that have started playing the 9 hole exec courses simply to help out with expenses. And they are not "free" they are subsidised by our amenity fees. #3. I have been a member of various golf clubs over the years, including some high end private country clubs, and have never had to pay to make a tee time. That's utterly ridiculous. Your ability to make tee times is always included in your membership fee. I think if you're a priority member, that online ability should be included. When you're managing a group for example and checking out tee times for various days, or researching openings to see if women or men are playing, it would be tedious if not impossible to have to do that over the phone, so online access is necessary. #4. As far as making a profit, I feel the Villages makes plenty of profits off of us. My original post stated that I have no problem with them making a profit, but at some point I think they've gone over the line. You're entitled to your opinion, but we disagree. As far as having 2 email addresses, and access to Villages events, who cares? We have our email with comcast and see the events listed in the rec center papers. Obviously we'll pony up the $$; there is no alternative. But the system doesn't seem fair to me compared to how golf country clubs normally work. They're just taking advantage of people. Some Villagers will sit back and take it. Others, like myself, will question things. To each his own. Stay in the short grass....Rekop Quotes above are from rekop, following are my responses, keep in mind these are just my opinions, you are entitled to yours. #1 I play golf here everyday and also play courses outside TV and think our courses for the most part are superior, if you don't like the courses why would you play them? #2 executive courses, first you say they are free then you say they are not free, is that your final answer? IMO they are free since everyone pays the same monthly fee. As far as being real golf , IMO they are very challenging and not aimed strictly at beginners or the elderly, however, since you have belonged to a high end country club I will have to defer to your opinion. # 3 the online system here is different than anything I've seen before, but then I've never belonged to a high end country club, you might want to look at going back to your high end private country club to get your free tee time system, it's not an option here but I'd be curious to know what your yearly cost was at your high end country club. IMHO you seem very disenchanted with the setup here and I am curious why you came here as opposed to all the other choices that are out there, if it sounds like I'm having a hard time understanding your responses, well I am....GN |
WOW Russ, a low double digit handicap, good for you, i didn't see your recent post as I was composing mine while yours was coming in but I agree, eldery golfers what a hoot, and I'm also not sure rekop is really a golfer based on his responses, like you I'm curious to see what rekops handicap is, however since rekop has said it's the end of subject for him we will probably never know, how sad....GN
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I hate to beat the sbject to death, by I, too, am curious about Rekop. I grew up playing a very high end private country club in the Chicago area, I worked at a private golf club for 32 years, I was a high school golf coach, and I carry a single diget handicap. I find the courses here both challenging and pretty well maintained. The executive courses are a great bargain for free and a wonderful opportunity to work on your short game. If there was only one course here, you would expect it to be superior. But there are 33 and counting. I think they do a remarkable job of organization and upkeep.
Please don't confuse our country clubs with the private country clubs in other parts of the country. They normally have a huge entrance fee and renewal fee, as well as a minimum that you must spend on food or you will be billed. You have to pay a locker fee and whether or not you use a caddie, you must pay for one. Ours are only called country clubs because they have 18 or 27 holes and a nice restaurant. Despite our amenity fees, it is super expensive to build and maintain a golf course for an entire year, not just 6-7 months like up north. That does not include the clubhouse or all the rest of the wonderful amenities we have in TV. I can't believe someone would buy in a place like this without doing a little homework. If you are a golfer, you should have played some of the courses before you made your decision. If you don't like them and golf is that important to you, then you don't buy here. Also, nobody is forcing you to play a certain number of times per week. That is your choice, as is the choice to use the computer system instead of the phone system. Yes, whether you take advantage of the many opportunities in TV or not, they will nickel and dime you to death. We all know that. But I just went to the grocery store in the Chicago area( I'm a part timer now, full timer come July) and it cost me over $100.00 for a week of groceries for my wife and me. $96.00 just doesn't seem that much for a whole year for what you get. This is just My Humble Opinion, so I hope I didn't offend. I'm looking forward to a high of zero degrees for the next couple of days. I can't wait to get back to Paradise. |
I was confused by Rekops statement about ten thousand dollars a year and then I realized that she must be counting green fees almost daily at the Championship courses. I do agree with her that the executive courses that I have played here pretty much offer you a good time for your short game only, but I have found them well maintained. The dry conditions and the roll are a bit of a challenge when you are trying to make a short iron "stick" but that is fun too. My game has changed over the years but I still cuss when I get into a sand trap or the bull rushes. I find that the executive courses are still a LOT of fun in their own way. I suppose that eight dollars a month could and maybe should be included in the amenity fees, but then you would penalize non golfers further.
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Golfnut - I was not trying to brag about being a 10.1
In fact as we know there are many single digit golfers in TV (and many here on TOTV) and we all strive to become one if possible. I think macgolfnut, who IS a single digit golfer, summed up my feelings. Are TV courses representative of an expensive exclusive club? No they are not. But IMHO they are very nice for courses that costs about $30 - $40 in high season. But this thread is about the $96 and while we all have the right to complain, the biggest impact you can make as a consumer is with your wallet. If, after complaining, they still have the fee you can then decide to pay it or not. It really is that simple. |
Golfers
How is this fee to be paid Is it going to be part of the monthly amenties
Or do you pay only when you use it:shrug: Sorry i should have read the previos posts |
Nothing free or really good lasts forever. We got the deal for a year or so and
it spoiled us. I for one never expected a free-bee from TV or comcast. However if there's anyone who we should complain to is our government that allows comcast to charge such a ridiculous fee for HD Cable TV/Hi-Speed internet and rental of the equipment that we need to for those services. I pay higher prices back home in NJ, on 2 properties we own. One of which we rent out during the summer at the New Jersey shore compared to down here. Thats why I keep talking about satellite dish and FTA (Free to air receivers) looking for a installer here in TV because it has No fees- NOT-TA, except the setup of the dish and receiver costs. So when I read & hear people talk about $ 8.00 bucks, I for one have to laugh. Your not gonna change it so just like everything else in life, we need to live with it. Enjoy heaven on earth here in TV, before we head to the big heaven in the sky. |
$8.00 Fee
This fee is not for the Teetime Reservation System. It is for subscribing to the Villages.Net, which if you don't know, is an ISP and email system. There has always been a charge except for Comcast Subscribers. I think it used to be $6 or $6.50. If you want to make a statement, then don't subscribe and use the telephone system if that's all you use it for. Otherwise you'll have to suck it up and pay the fee.
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The fee is for the golf tee time system is just what it says, you can't use the site for searching or surfing for the fee, just golf tee times, Oh and yea a email address where you can get for free anyplace on the net, I can't understand why the fee went up except to make more money period, And if you think about it why shouldn't it be included in our amenities, They knew that the phone system would be cumbersome once they got more courses open, It was planed that way believe me, Think about it you get more customers and the price goes up, Seems strange to me.
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thevillages.net is not my portal of choice. BTW, I am not endorsing the fee but it is the only game in town as far as I am concerned. |
Don't confuse the tee time reservation system with any sort of ISP availability. At the villages.net (accessible by anyone on the internet through any sort of connection) you can access the tee time system through a username and PW if you pay the $8 fee per month.
The Villages.net also has a dial-up ISP service that you can get with ($20) or without ($17) the tee time system. This could be used by people who have no other internet connection service and it provides access to the web. (think old AOL). This is the way that most people used to connect in the early 1990s when the net was in its infancy. |
The last POA bulletin has a great article about the Tee time charge. To charge the folks who only use the Tee time system at TheVillages.net and nothing else is a grand rip-off that you can thank the developer for. He stands to gross 1.9 million without lifting a finger!!! - and he knows it. Complain to the Gary Morse at the AAC, the VCCCD, Customer Service Center, the Morse Family and TheVillages.net. We've got nothing to lose.
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How did you arrive at 1.9 million rt?? Sounds like a stretch since not every household uses villages.net. The solution is easy. Don't buy/use it. You make a bigger impact by not spending your dollars. Personally I like the convenience and ease of .net for the t-time system and will continue to use it. Remember, there are choices.
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Not A New Charge, Just More
For those of us who did not subscribe to Comcast Television, and who perhaps had Dish TV or Direct TV, we have been paying $6.00 per month for the Tee Time System for over 5 years. We always had the option to use the telephone system for free, but felt, for us the convenience was worth the $6.00. Now TV has raised the fee to $8.00. I'm sure there's a Cost Of Living raise in there somewhere, but we continue to feel the fee is worth the convenience.:read:
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rt, like chuckster I'm looking for an explanation on the $1.9M, please lift your finger, inquiring minds want to know....GN
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In my opinion, the tee time system should be run by the central district, not by the developer, and the charge should be just enough to cover the cost of development and operation. It should NOT be supported by our amenity fee but an extra charge incurred by those that golf. |
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Golf Tee Time System Comcast users are scheduled to pay $8.00 per month to use the developer’s Tee Time System on computers starting June 1, 2009. Out of about 30,000 homes, there probably are close to 20,000 subscribers that use the computer Tee Time System. This would yield $160,000 a month to run the Tee Time System at $8.00 per month per account, or $1.9 million a year. Something is funny here. A fee of $8.00 a month and $1.9 million a year seems unusually high just to make golf reservations. We get the feeling that the developer is trying to take advantage of the residents on this issue. As an alternative, why not charge residents $1.00 per month (billed annually) to access the Villages.net system for only the tee time system? This seems more reasonable and would generate $240,000 annually to pay for operating the system. Surely, the developer can operate the system for less than that. We think the Amenity Authority Committee should research the feasibility of having our amenity fees pay for the Tee Time System. If there are no funds for that, then $240,000 a year is a reasonable compromise that should be able to keep everybody happy. We would ask the AAC to take the lead in negotiating an arrangement. □ |
Oh no, not again!
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I don't like paying increasing or new fees any more than the next guy... but I don't see what is so hard to understand. The developer is not going to make money from this... it is Comcast that is going to reap the benefits. The Villages had a contract with Comcast and that contract is ending and not being renewed because Comcast wanted too much money from the developer so the developer just washed their hands of it. If you want to complain, complain to Comcast. I really don't see what is so hard to understand about this. And Comcast is just raising their fees $2 for the 1st time in over 5 years. Like I said, I don't like this fee any more than anybody else, but business is business. And if you don't want to pay... use the phone line... simple as that!
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Muncle thanks for the reference......I agree with some of the assumptions (the POA does seem to be mellowing) but will continue to pay for the convenience of a "visual" system.
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Greed
You can say what you want; however, with the greed of the developer already evident in many other areas, how could you expect some different treatment?
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Gatb Tester
I must be naive but what are the "many other areas" of developer greed. It would be helpful to list them so that I could be better informed. Thanks. |
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