Talk of The Villages Florida

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-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Margaret "Peggy" Klemm gets 180 days. (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/margaret-peggy-klemm-gets-180-days-122501/)

zonerboy 08-01-2014 09:00 PM

Being sympathetic does not make one an enabler.
Thinking a six month jail sentence is too harsh does not make one an enabler either.
I have asked before and have not received an answer: what does serving 6 months in jail do to help this woman's problem which many have identified as alcoholism or addiction.
It has been said that "tough love" and "hitting rock bottom" are necessary steps. Well then, how about a 12 month jail sentence. Maybe that would be better since it would be twice as rock bottom.
What about a six month suspended sentence conditional upon enrollment in and continued attendance at an alcoholism treatment program?

KeepingItReal 08-01-2014 09:29 PM

Purpose Of Imprisonment
 

prison :: The purpose of imprisonment -- Encyclopedia Britannica

The purpose of imprisonment:

There are a number of accepted reasons for the use of imprisonment.

One approach aims to deter those who would otherwise commit crimes (general deterrence) and to make it less likely that those who serve a prison sentence will commit crimes after their release (individual deterrence).

A second approach focuses on issuing punishment to, or obtaining retribution from, those who have committed serious crimes.

A third approach encourages the personal reform of those who are sent to prison. Finally, in some cases it is necessary to protect the public from those who commit crimes—particularly from those who do so persistently. In individual cases, all or some of these justifications may apply. The increasing importance of the notion of reform has led some prison systems to be called correctional institutions.

NoMoSno 08-01-2014 09:34 PM

She violated her probation.
She took the plea deal for 6 months, rather than risk getting the 1 year typically given for violating probation, in Lady Lake.
I think the guy also got a bad deal.
He got 6 months, and fined $9000.
He was not on probation and had no prior record.
Hope they both get a early release.

Bonanza 08-02-2014 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zonerboy (Post 916268)
Whew! I feel much safer now. Much less chance of seeing any exposed genitals in my wanderings about The Villages.
Wouldn't want any grand kids to be scarred for life by seeing human body parts.

If your grandchildren are teenagers, they wouldn't be shocked or scarred for life.
Kids today know more and have seen more than most of us.

If your grandchildren are really young, they would have been in bed,
so there would not have been any chance that could have seen any of the "act."

Then -- there's always a chance that they could walk in without knocking,
and find you naked.
Would they then be scarred for life???

LI SNOWBIRD 08-02-2014 07:34 AM

She's made youtube
Grandma Will Spend 6 Months In Jail For Public Sex - YouTube

Taltarzac725 08-02-2014 07:38 AM

https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-...l#NRS201Sec210

I was wondering how this would play out in Reno, Nevada where I grew up. I expect if they did this in a Reno park at 10:30 PM, where kids probably would not be around but might be it would have a similar result as the one in the Villages.

Chi-Town 08-02-2014 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725 (Post 917256)
https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-...l#NRS201Sec210

I was wondering how this would play out in Reno, Nevada where I grew up. I expect if they did this in a Reno park at 10:30 PM, where kids probably would not be around but might be it would have a similar result as the one in the Villages.

You obviously never watched Reno 911. [emoji6]

dirtbanker 08-02-2014 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonanza (Post 917183)
If your grandchildren are teenagers, they wouldn't be shocked or scarred for life.
Kids today know more and have seen more than most of us.

If your grandchildren are really young, they would have been in bed,
so there would not have been any chance that could have seen any of the "act."

Then -- there's always a chance that they could walk in without knocking,
and find you naked.
Would they then be scarred for life???

Sex fest at Bonanza's patio, everyone is invited, don't worry about the kids they either have seen more than you or should be in bed...

Coffee clutch the next morning where idiots that are too stupid to lock the bedroom door when having sex in a house with children are welcome to share experiences...
:a20:

Taltarzac725 08-02-2014 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chi-Town (Post 917261)
You obviously never watched Reno 911. [emoji6]

Actually, I have. I was looking for scenes from Reno but think that most of that is filmed actually in Southern CA. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0370194/...?ref_=tt_dt_dt

I never met any cops like those in Reno, Nevada. ;) Not that I met all that many. I did read the Reno newspaper for years, however, and do not remember any of these kind of shenanigans.

Abster 08-02-2014 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725 (Post 917256)
https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-...l#NRS201Sec210

I was wondering how this would play out in Reno, Nevada where I grew up. I expect if they did this in a Reno park at 10:30 PM, where kids probably would not be around but might be it would have a similar result as the one in the Villages.

Who cares how this would play out anywhere. It's over, done with, finished. Put it to rest and the local news, Daily Mail, Drudge Report and all the others will also.

manaboutown 08-02-2014 01:35 PM

This is being laughed about in various other retirement communities. I know because I am getting emails from friends who reside in them linking me to news articles and jokes. Like the STD thing, this may take awhile before it dies down and out due to the natural ever diminishing loss of interest experienced by most such news.

red tail 08-02-2014 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manaboutown (Post 917530)
This is being laughed about in various other retirement communities. I know because I am getting emails from friends who reside in them linking me to news articles and jokes. Like the STD thing, this may take awhile before it dies down and out due to the natural ever diminishing loss of interest experienced by most such news.

I don't have a problem at all with it. it beats living in a community of old people sitting around in a rocking chair and gossiping about each other. growing old bored and in perceived life without sin and pleasure. you can have that,I prefer lively people around me having a good time. life is waaay too short to worry about what your neighbors are doing.

Patty55 08-02-2014 06:04 PM

Upthread someone posted a link that this all started because some busybody(IMO) witnessed it and called law enforcement. ARE YOU KIDDING ME? What a tattle tale. If I were out and saw it the most I'd do is say "Whoa, check it out." to my friend. Where are these people from, Mayberry?

If I were Ms Klemm I would have insisted in a trial, just to see who these people were. I also would have had an attorney who didn't look like a fakatke

Oh, and another thing, I'm so tired of people pulling out the kid card. If the child sees something like this it seems like a good time to have a chat. Explain what they saw. I have explained much worse than this... why people have powder on their nose and boogers on their shirt, why people are out and about with someone not their wife. In this case I would have said that this woman took her good china to a picnic and we just don't do that.

dave from deland 08-02-2014 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuckinca (Post 916189)
If I was the prosecutor I would change my name.

.

She was on probation for another crime, the sentence was appropriate to me. Probation means, you walk the straight and narrow until it is over. Maybe she will get help now.

KeepingItReal 08-02-2014 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave from deland (Post 917710)
She was on probation for another crime, the sentence was appropriate to me. Probation means, you walk the straight and narrow until it is over. Maybe she will get help now.

Totally appropriate. Sentences serve as punishment and a deterrent for others. Concept is apparently really hard to grasp. Driving drunk alone should be worth 180 days and you would not have 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th + repeat offenders.

CFrance 08-02-2014 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty55 (Post 917687)
Upthread someone posted a link that this all started because some busybody(IMO) witnessed it and called law enforcement. ARE YOU KIDDING ME? What a tattle tale. If I were out and saw it the most I'd do is say "Whoa, check it out." to my friend. Where are these people from, Mayberry?

If I were Ms Klemm I would have insisted in a trial, just to see who these people were. I also would have had an attorney who didn't look like a fakatke

Oh, and another thing, I'm so tired of people pulling out the kid card. If the child sees something like this it seems like a good time to have a chat. Explain what they saw. I have explained much worse than this... why people have powder on their nose and boogers on their shirt, why people are out and about with someone not their wife. In this case I would have said that this woman took her good china to a picnic and we just don't do that.

I so agree with you. But what is a fakatke? I know it's a word. I've googled it but can't find a definition.

blmarie 08-02-2014 08:15 PM

Exactly what I believe! Too much time for too little crime. Go get the ones who get away and save us some money with these two by having them do community service!

Chi-Town 08-02-2014 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty55 (Post 917687)
Upthread someone posted a link that this all started because some busybody(IMO) witnessed it and called law enforcement. ARE YOU KIDDING ME? What a tattle tale. If I were out and saw it the most I'd do is say "Whoa, check it out." to my friend. Where are these people from, Mayberry?

If I were Ms Klemm I would have insisted in a trial, just to see who these people were. I also would have had an attorney who didn't look like a fakatke

Oh, and another thing, I'm so tired of people pulling out the kid card. If the child sees something like this it seems like a good time to have a chat. Explain what they saw. I have explained much worse than this... why people have powder on their nose and boogers on their shirt, why people are out and about with someone not their wife. In this case I would have said that this woman took her good china to a picnic and we just don't do that.

A post that holds your interest. Well done and thanks.

VT2TV 08-02-2014 08:24 PM

I agree that now that this has been settled--just let it drop. It doesn't matter anymore whether you agree or disagree with anything. It is done, let it die.
You will not accomplish anything by continuing to talk about it.

DougB 08-02-2014 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CFrance (Post 917776)
I so agree with you. But what is a fakatke? I know it's a word. I've googled it but can't find a definition.

Lousy, messed up, full of crap

Dr Winston O Boogie jr 08-02-2014 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty55 (Post 917687)
Upthread someone posted a link that this all started because some busybody(IMO) witnessed it and called law enforcement. ARE YOU KIDDING ME? What a tattle tale. If I were out and saw it the most I'd do is say "Whoa, check it out." to my friend. Where are these people from, Mayberry?

If I were Ms Klemm I would have insisted in a trial, just to see who these people were. I also would have had an attorney who didn't look like a fakatke

Oh, and another thing, I'm so tired of people pulling out the kid card. If the child sees something like this it seems like a good time to have a chat. Explain what they saw. I have explained much worse than this... why people have powder on their nose and boogers on their shirt, why people are out and about with someone not their wife. In this case I would have said that this woman took her good china to a picnic and we just don't do that.

She didn't have a trial because she had been advised by her lawyer that she would lose and the sentence would have been a lot worse. Lawyers usually have a good grasp on these things.

Also, because they were still at it when LE arrived it was witnessed by the police so whoever called would not be required to testify. In fact the police may not even know who called.

CFrance 08-02-2014 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DougB (Post 917794)
Lousy, messed up, full of crap

Merci buckets.

Patty55 08-02-2014 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CFrance (Post 917776)
I so agree with you. But what is a fakatke? I know it's a word. I've googled it but can't find a definition.

My bad, it might be spelled facacta. My definition.. (here come the ###s LOL), ****ty, ineffective, a sloppy mess, tacky and ridiculous.

CFrance 08-02-2014 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty55 (Post 917801)
My bad, it might be spelled facacta. My definition.. (here come the ###s LOL), ****ty, ineffective, a sloppy mess, tacky and ridiculous.

Thanks. I think you had one of the correct spellings of it. A great new word for me.

DougB 08-02-2014 08:54 PM

It's yiddish and is spelled a multiple of ways. Don't think there is one "correct" spelling.

Dr Winston O Boogie jr 08-02-2014 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zonerboy (Post 917134)
Being sympathetic does not make one an enabler.
Thinking a six month jail sentence is too harsh does not make one an enabler either.
I have asked before and have not received an answer: what does serving 6 months in jail do to help this woman's problem which many have identified as alcoholism or addiction.
It has been said that "tough love" and "hitting rock bottom" are necessary steps. Well then, how about a 12 month jail sentence. Maybe that would be better since it would be twice as rock bottom.
What about a six month suspended sentence conditional upon enrollment in and continued attendance at an alcoholism treatment program?

And I think that your question has been answered by me and some other people. Sentences are given not only to help the person, but to punish them. It also may serve as a deterrent to others who may contemplate the same behaviour. If it were just the public sex act I think that she might have gotten off with less, but the fact that she was on probation made it that much worse. The court may have been trying to send a message to others who may be tempted to violate their probation.

The judge heard all the facts. Her lawyer and the prosecuting attorney heard all of the facts and worked out a deal to let her off easy. They are the ones who understand what sentence is appropriate under law and under the sentencing guidelines. They don;t just pull these things out of a hat.

zonerboy 08-02-2014 09:26 PM

Taking a case to trial costs big bucks. Maybe she accepted the plea deal cause she couldn't afford any further lawyer bills.
The wealthy who can afford expert lawyers get better justice than regular people. Just ask OJ Simpson.

manaboutown 08-02-2014 09:32 PM

The plea bargain saved the taxpayers a bundle. She did the crime(s), let her do the time.

DougB 08-02-2014 09:57 PM

Geez, let it go. It's over and done.

manaboutown 08-02-2014 10:00 PM

Yes. It is over for now. Hopefully there will be no encore - by Peggy and David or another pair of paramours.

Bizdoc 08-03-2014 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manaboutown (Post 917848)
Yes. It is over for now. Hopefully there will be no encore - by Peggy and David or another pair of paramours.

And if you happen to see someone else, be sure to go up, tap one of them on the shoulder and suggest that they are gonna get arrested. Be sure to let us know how that works out.

Bay Kid 08-03-2014 06:52 AM

A waste of taxpayers money.

Taltarzac725 08-03-2014 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zonerboy (Post 917831)
Taking a case to trial costs big bucks. Maybe she accepted the plea deal cause she couldn't afford any further lawyer bills.
The wealthy who can afford expert lawyers get better justice than regular people. Just ask OJ Simpson.

Yes, but then there are George Zimmerman and Casey Anthony. Some lawyers like a challenging case and the publicity it gives them and their firms if they have one.

I do still think that justice comes down to whom the jury believe, so to even things out we need more sophisticated members of the jury who know all the tricks of the trade and are not easily manipulated. We had classes at the University of Minnesota Law School that pretty much taught trial lawyers trade craft. Like Irving Younger's various courses online. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBP2if0l-a8[/ame] More magician or theater director than someone out to get the best outcome based on the law and the facts of each case. That's our adversary system. It works if the lawyers and more importantly the press on them is fair and balanced. OJ Simpson had the dream team even if they were supposedly bickering in the background and then putting on a game day face.

I could not get into Irving Younger's "Evidence" Class at the University of Minnesota Law School. Too popular and the 3rd Years who had not taken an Evidence class yet got first dibs. And, he died while I was at the University of Minnesota Law School. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irving_Younger

The Mountaineer 08-03-2014 10:00 AM

The most important thing is if
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr (Post 917816)
And I think that your question has been answered by me and some other people. Sentences are given not only to help the person, but to punish them. It also may serve as a deterrent to others who may contemplate the same behaviour. If it were just the public sex act I think that she might have gotten off with less, but the fact that she was on probation made it that much worse. The court may have been trying to send a message to others who may be tempted to violate their probation.

The judge heard all the facts. Her lawyer and the prosecuting attorney heard all of the facts and worked out a deal to let her off easy. They are the ones who understand what sentence is appropriate under law and under the sentencing guidelines. They don;t just pull these things out of a hat.

somehow she gets rehab help and can get this monkey off her back. She is ill, the same as someone with cancer. But she has to be the first to seek the help, unfortunately, or it won't work. Maybe this will shock her into seeking help. Drying out in jail is an involuntary way to go cold turkey. It's brutal, but maybe it will save the rest of her life. Let's pray for her, not condemn her.

CFrance 08-03-2014 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Mountaineer (Post 918041)
somehow she gets rehab help and can get this monkey off her back. She is ill, the same as someone with cancer. But she has to be the first to seek the help, unfortunately, or it won't work. Maybe this will shock her into seeking help. Drying out in jail is an involuntary way to go cold turkey. It's brutal, but maybe it will save the rest of her life. Let's pray for her, not condemn her.

Great post. Thank you. I was thinking the same thing. Six months could spur her on to recovery.

manaboutown 08-03-2014 08:40 PM

In a survey of 88,000 U.S. physicians 75% believed alcoholism is due to personal and emotional problems. Cancer is scientifically proven to be a disease. Alcoholism is only sociologically considered to be a disease, largely through the efforts of AA. It is a behavioral problem, a moral disorder.

http://www2.potsdam.edu/alcohol/Cont...l#.U97jUaXfQfE

Taltarzac725 08-03-2014 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manaboutown (Post 918400)
In a survey of 88,000 U.S. physicians 75% believed alcoholism is due to personal and emotional problems. Cancer is scientifically proven to be a disease. Alcoholism is only sociologically considered to be a disease, largely through the efforts of AA. It is a behavioral problem, a moral disorder.

Is Alcoholism a Disease?

What about this then-- Alcohol Use Disorders | National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism (NIAAA)

mtdjed 08-03-2014 10:17 PM

This person obviously had problems but the publicity is way out of order and the sentence seems to be extremely severe when you look at other things happening. Why do we continue this thread? All has been said, the world knows due to Drudge Report etc. Let it rest and don't cast stones. Notice no discussion regarding the man. Remember that this person must come back and try to reestablish herself with family and friends. Are we putting a Scarlet Letter on her?

Jaggy 08-04-2014 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtdjed (Post 918423)
This person obviously had problems but the publicity is way out of order and the sentence seems to be extremely severe when you look at other things happening. Why do we continue this thread? All has been said, the world knows due to Drudge Report etc. Let it rest and don't cast stones. Notice no discussion regarding the man. Remember that this person must come back and try to reestablish herself with family and friends. Are we putting a Scarlet Letter on her?

We need a like button .. thanks for the common sense post.

BnCinME 08-04-2014 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725 (Post 918422)

Yes. And it's also listed in the DSM IV. Alcoholism is a horrible disease and I hope she can find peace and the strength to overcome it. :pray:
I vote for being supportive rather than condemnation.


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