Talk of The Villages Florida
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Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   New Gate to be placed. Wall will be removed. (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/new-gate-placed-wall-will-removed-85263/)

Steve9930 08-15-2013 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by justjim (Post 726534)
Yep, the many lawyers of the Developer were involved in this fiasco. Lawyers and lawsuits are just a fact of life. The Developer owns a huge amount of private property within TV. It is possible for a lawyer to make you near paranoid---if you let him/her. Still, just a "little bit" of transparency would be welcomed before you affect the lives of elderly residents already living in TV.
Depending on what happens it also effects the residents of Stonecrest and Spruce creek and I'm not talking about using the entrance that has now been walled up. There is always a far reaching ripple effects when things like this are done. It also is very negative on attitudes throughout the area. No one lives in a vacuum.

Bogie Shooter 08-15-2013 10:26 AM
This thread is becoming a repeat of all the posts on this other thread.
https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...closing-84885/

Number 6 08-15-2013 11:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdV (Post 726416)
Wrong. The bridge is public and maintained by Morse's commercial companies and there are no multimodal trails in any of the retail/medical areas on the west side of 441.
The golf cart bridge is not public, in that it is not owned or maintained by a municipality. It is private property. If non-Village residents have access to the shopping areas, they have access to the multimodal paths (and rec centers).

Steve9930 08-15-2013 11:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Number 6 (Post 726596)
The golf cart bridge is not public, in that it is not owned or maintained by a municipality. It is private property. If non-Village residents have access to the shopping areas, they have access to the multimodal paths (and rec centers).
I was under the impression the bridge was built because the shop owners requested it. Who built and paid for it originally and who pays for its maintenance?

EdV 08-15-2013 12:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Number 6 (Post 726596)
The golf cart bridge is not public, in that it is not owned or maintained by a municipality. It is private property. If non-Village residents have access to the shopping areas, they have access to the multimodal paths (and rec centers).
My use of the word "public" is referring to the legal right to use it, not who built or maintains it. WalMart owns and maintains their parking lot but access to it is open to the public and they cannot discriminate who can use it.

Dr Winston O Boogie jr 08-15-2013 01:04 PM
I think that we're talking about two different things. Public property is property that it owned and maintained by the public or the government. Public access property is property that is privately owned but open to the public.

I don't know in what category the bridge falls, but one does have to transverse private property on the eastern side to get to it. The owners of that property have the right to determine who my use that property and who may not. For example a store may have a parking lot "For Customer's Only".

My backyard is adjacent to another home's backyard. If I cut through their yard, I can get to our neighborhood pool. Otherwise, I have to go around the block to get to the pool. It would be up to the people that own that home to allow me to cut through their yard to get to the pool or not. My yard and his yard connect two public roads. That does not mean that the public has a right to access either of those roads by crossing over our properties.

PennBF 08-15-2013 01:37 PM
Insult
 
Let me get this straight. You have a serious problem going on with a number of residents, there are rumors of picketing, there are petitions being circulated and there are a number of potential "Legal" questions. Your answer is quick get me Janet Tutt and the VHA. Does anyone who ever spent more than 5 minutes in a Business actually think this is how it would be handled as opposed to calling in the Attorney's for discussions and potential alternatives. Who ever thought to try to convince the residents that Janet Tutt/VHA were the answers to the Developers prayers was one of the worst advisors I have heard of and are insulting the residents. If it were not so serious this would make a terrific Saturday Night Comedy Skit. It is depressing they would ever let their names be used in this manner and be a laughing stock?:a040:

donniemac 08-15-2013 01:55 PM
We too have been here since 2007 and visited for several years before that. I'm sure what you say is true but not at the priority pools which are owned by the developer. Most of the non priority pools only have monitors stop by on occassion. We have been carded by them. I believe the Paradise pool now has a full time monitor or at least someone who is there a lot. I personally have not seen a problem with non residents.

EdV 08-15-2013 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr (Post 726648)
I think that we're talking about two different things. Public property is property that it owned and maintained by the public or the government. Public access property is property that is privately owned but open to the public.

I don't know in what category the bridge falls, but one does have to transverse private property on the eastern side to get to it. The owners of that property have the right to determine who my use that property and who may not. For example a store may have a parking lot "For Customer's Only".

My backyard is adjacent to another home's backyard. If I cut through their yard, I can get to our neighborhood pool. Otherwise, I have to go around the block to get to the pool. It would be up to the people that own that home to allow me to cut through their yard to get to the pool or not. My yard and his yard connect two public roads. That does not mean that the public has a right to access either of those roads by crossing over our properties.
Here’s a link to the info on the bridge.

Golf Cart Overpass To Be Link To Shopping - Orlando Sentinel

The roads in TV are open to the public because the CDD form of government is still a public municipality, not a private community. And the multi-modal paths are an integral part of that road system. And just because those paths are maintained by amenity fee does not allow it to be designated for resident use only any more than a city with a city tax can start designating certain roads for resident use only.

Indydealmaker 08-15-2013 04:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdV (Post 726766)
Here’s a link to the info on the bridge.

Golf Cart Overpass To Be Link To Shopping - Orlando Sentinel

The roads in TV are open to the public because the CDD form of government is still a public municipality, not a private community. And the multi-modal paths are an integral part of that road system. And just because those paths are maintained by amenity fee does not allow it to be designated for resident use only any more than a city with a city tax can start designating certain roads for resident use only.
Ed, I like the way you explain things.

linko38 08-15-2013 04:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr (Post 726339)
Whoever owns that property between the Aldi parking lot and Wal-Mart has every right to allow whomever they want to use it and every right to not allow anyone to use it. If the Stonecrest residents want to buy it and allow only Stonecrest residents through they would certainly have that right. I would bet that if Wal-Mart got wind of what was happening, they would outbid everyone who tries to buy that dirt road. Also the Villages residents would also be able to buy it and only allow Villages residents to use it.
What you have proposed here is, of course, ludicrous. The residents of Stonecrest would have absolutely nothing to gain by taking that action. It wouldn't prevent anyone from entering Stonecrest.
The golf cart gate in question is on Villages property. No one is buying it out of spite in order to prevent people from getting to a third unrelated site.
VHA stands for VILLAGES Homeowners Association. They represent the interests of the Villages residents. They have no obligation to do anything that is beneficial to anyone else.

I would have no problem with Stonecrest making any paths on their property, leading into their property for Stonecrest residents only. And I don't think that many of my fellow Villagers would have any problem with it either.
We had a discussion in the pool today regarding the Duke Energy lot. We here in Stonecrest have been waiting months to see if Aldi's and Walmart can come to a solution. They have fenced it off once before and were flooded with angry phone calls. However the "Berlin Wall" could change everything. Mr. Brown could decide to stop allowing golf carts to pass through. Walmart could lose interest in the path and let it be closed to everyone. The lady at Bealls and other busineses have said they are hurting from lack of sales. Golf cart rental companies. Golf cart sales. Everything will be affected.

Steve9930 08-15-2013 04:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by linko38 (Post 726780)
We had a discussion in the pool today regarding the Duke Energy lot. We here in Stonecrest have been waiting months to see if Aldi's and Walmart can come to a solution. They have fenced it off once before and were flooded with angry phone calls. However the "Berlin Wall" could change everything. Mr. Brown could decide to stop allowing golf carts to pass through. Walmart could lose interest in the path and let it be closed to everyone. The lady at Bealls and other busineses have said they are hurting from lack of sales. Golf cart rental companies. Golf cart sales. Everything will be affected.
When a very poor plan is implemented there are always secondary ripples that radiate out from the point of impact. This is why I got involved with these postings. Otherwise I could care if I cannot get into the villages by Golf Cart. As a Florida resident I do care about how my Florida resident neighbors are treated and in this case there are a number of them that have been treated very unfairly. I may live in Stonecrest but I'm a Florida resident also. We all do not live in a vacuum. You are very correct in your posting and a excellent point.

JeffAVEWS 08-15-2013 04:37 PM
Ed I want to join and thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge. You are a pearl of wisdom in these muddy waters.

deltaguy 08-15-2013 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 725694)
Read this morning's Daily Sun. Article from VHA president in Local. Resolution did take more than 48 hours. Pays to be patient.

Can someone take a picture of that article and post it here for people off campus? My camera battery just died.
Saw the Wall for the first time today. Looks to me like a rather obvious display of arrogance. Apologize if this word that describes all who think there is nothing wrong with the developers action is OK. The word is "Schultzitus", a word that only MASH followers would understand!

EdV 08-15-2013 05:01 PM
Thanks Indy and Jeff and others.

At this point I rest my case re selective access and will wait and see what happens.

If a gate is installed as a replacement, it'll be up to the town of Lady Lake or perhaps Lake County to intervene if they do in fact see it as I do. Time will tell.


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