"I am entitled to drive as fast as I like."

police
 

my view. the police in the village area have the best job in the world. lets be real.hardly any crime.very few teenagers to deal with. drugs in the villages very very little.a little shoplifting minor crimes. that leads us to traffic tickets,thats what they spend their time on. cops love it here. best job in florida. if you do not think so, I have heard it first hand.

Good by.

Check out this site...

http://www.speedtrap.org/

Speeding
 

From what I see living near Rio Grande and Chula Vista Ave, MOST DRIVERS DON'T OBEY THE SPEED LIMIT. There is too much traffic now that drivers cut through to 466:(

I am seeing more police presence on Rio Grande and Chula Vista Ave. Since 466 cuts through here, there is an increase of traffic and speeding. There are no sidewalks on Chula and speeding is very dangerous. Please, slow down and follow the speed limit.

i think they are 35 so we that drive lsv's are legal to use these roadways.

Speeds in the Villages
 

After reading 9 pages of posts, my thoughts: If you want to go 45 mph, use US 27/441 or US 301 to get from one end to the other. If you raise the speed on Buena Vista or Morse then LSVs will not be able to use these streets, and yes they use them south of 466. Use your cruise control and you won't inadvertently go too fast. Okay, the major roads are county roads, but its a retirement community with lots of seniors driving around. A law is a law whether you like it or not. Break the law, suffer the consequences if you get caught. We all do it sometimes, nobody's perfect, but as for me, I try to always follow the law. The roundabouts are tricky -- standard rules are impossible to apply to the small Villages roundabouts, but again, I try to avoid all cars around me when I'm in the roundabouts. Police should have our respect -- their job is to protect us. The end.

Typically I won't comment on forums where police matters are brought up --because many people need a scapegoat, rather than take responsibility for their own actions. But this time, having just left Dunkin Donuts, and now sitting in front of my computer, I feel the need to respond.

It has always been interesting to me to hear about law enforcement agencies that are doing one particular function of their job, in this case --traffic enforcement. For the past 30 years, I've heard it all; "why aren't you out there arresting real criminals? What is your quota for speeders? I saw an officer speeding past me and he wasn't responding to a call," etc.

A few have said it on here - "if you don't want a ticket, don't speed". That sounds pretty reasonable to me.

I also like where the Talk Host was asked if he ever had to "flash his tin" to get out of a ticket. He apparently never had to do that, which makes two of us. Maybe we are just more aware of, or pay better attention to the speed limits, having been in an enforcement capacity. Too many people today are preoccupied with that almighty cell phone while they drive, along with those who find it necessary to eat, put on makeup, or a host of other distractors while driving. News Flash -- Driving is a full time job!

Having only lived in the Villages for 7 months, I may be a newcomer, but I have very good observation qualities. Not only do I ride a motorcycle around the Villages, I also run and ride my bicycle 6 days each week, so I do observe a lot of things here including traffic.

My first 4 months here I witnessed two accidents involving my sons car and a friends car that were hit while parked, and I was also hit on my bicycle by a car. One of the drivers told me she was legally blind. Go figure! I've had many close calls while running too. I guess if I stated that the majority of drivers in the Villages are horrible drivers, that would be no different than inferring that cops sit at Dunkin Donuts when the weather is bad.

From what I've seen while living here, I fully understand why the local police have active traffic enforcement patrols. I for one have no problem --even on the Harley-- keeping within the posted limits.

It's kind of like the weather, or perhaps the restaurants around here --some people are just never happy.

Chief X

ive always wondered why retired law enforcement folks still carry a badge. i realize it says' retired ' on it but why carry it?no offense intended i'm just curious?

I'm wondering what it would be like if the police/sheriff NEVER enforced speeding laws in The Villages. What if they weren't there, EVER. What would it be like?

Maybe something like this:

http://youtu.be/RjrEQaG5jPM

I assume that is retorical? I think you know the answer.

Not really. It was a good question.

it was in response of two former law enforcment people saying they have never 'flashed their tin' . got me to wondering why retirees would carry a badge.

My guess is that retired cops still carry their badges for the same reason that 80 year old Marines still say "Semper Fi". Marines and cops are both part of something much larger than themselves, and feel proud. I've been neither a Marine nor a cop, but I think that's a good thing.

:doh:

Originally Posted by NJblue
My observation is that the speed limits are ridiculously low given the roadways. For example, Buena Vista, a 4-lane divided highway with a speed limit of 35 is way too low. It could be at least 45 without being unsafe. Of course, the limits around the circles should be much lower. Same thing with 25 MPH on Morse on the bridge.

These unusually low speed limits given the nature of the roadways constitute a speed trap by my definition

I think line of sight also comes into consideration when determining speed limits. For instance, if traveling north on BV and making a left turn onto Talley Ridge you may find a car not visible when you start to turn suddenly almost on top of you. Increasing the speed limit to 45MPH will result in people driving in excess of 50MPH.

It seems driving in excess of the posted speed limits is considered an entitlement by a lot of drivers. The same applies to running red lights and stop signs.

Speaking personally as to why I carry my police I.D. (typically not a badge) is for identification purposes. It's common for me when I am in an area for an extended period (vacation, visiting relatives, moving to the Villages) I tend to stop in at the local police department and introduce myself, as I still consider these people as family.

I also offer up my assistance at times, like two mornings ago (3:15 a.m. in NJ) when a car crashed into the telephone pole in front of my home and I assisted the operator and with traffic, while waiting for the duty officer to arrive. Anytime that I see an officer in harms way, I will go out of my way to assist. Having my I.D. readily available can be very important at times.

Do active officers and retired officers carry their badge as a means to hopefully "get a break" if they are stopped? Most certainly. Face it, that's just life. Professional courtesy is not limited to the police. I'm sure that a cardiologist needing open heart surgery, will get a much better deal than I will. I'm sure that a dentist doesn't pay full price for a root canal etc.

I also know that many motorists get breaks everyday. It's those who don't that usually feel that cops and the system aren't fair.

Just my two and a half cents. Carry on.

Chief x

Carrying Retired Credentials/badges
 

Agree with Chief on this subject of carrying retired ID or badges.

Law Enforcement is a tight knit family which comes from the fact that many Law Enforcement Officers (LEOS) have many times had to depend on each other to protect themselves and the public when in harms way.

Law Enforcement does not hand out a gold watch or other token of appreciation at retirement. The best they can do is present you with your credentials and or badge with the RETIRED notation on them.

Although a lot of retirees carry them as a sign of pride in their previous career they are also very handy to identify the retiree when he/she will inevitably step in to help a current LEO who may be in need of assistance.

FYI NJblue: Buena Vista isNOT a 4-lane divided highway like 27/441--it is a RESIDENTIAL street. I'll bet you go crazy on Morse Blvd north of 466 where it is 30mph! I set my cruise control to 32mph because if I set it at 30 then people like you are riding my bumper. I have the opposite problem on 466: people driving 35 on a 45mph road! Go figure!:shrug:

Don't get me wrong - I really appreciate anyone in civil service. But to say they don't hand out a gold watch? Most law enforcement people I know have great pensions and health benefits after retirment. My uncle basically triple dipped (SP in the Navy 20 years, 15 years detective in RI and then state fire marshall office). Yes they deserve it but to say they don't get any token of appreciation is just not correct.

It's a brotherhood and that's OK with me - just don't downplay it.

Russ:
By no means was I attempting to downplay the retirement of law enforcement officers. I did not equate an earned retirement and benefits with a "token of appreciation".

You are correct that retirements and benefits are excellent, especially in the current economic climate we are all in.

I for one do not begrudge the benefit packages that are provided after a
FULL career in law enforcement.

I would also hope that your medical profession offers a brotherhood of sorts. Have a great day.

Chief,

Having lived much of my life in New England - cops and Dunkin Donuts jokes are just a part of life. However, when I had need of the police in my town, they were always professional and highly effective at their jobs.

I agree that if you don't want to pay the dime (or do the time), then for goodness sakes don't break the law. And I do agree that speeders are "real" lawbreakers.

However, here is where I take exception and I think that I am not alone. When a speed limit drops by 20 mph or more - with or without warning - in a short expanse of road, and an officer is just waiting, well.... that is revenue raising. Play fair. If the speed limit is going to drop - give adequate warning to allow drivers time to comply. I think it is situations like these that give rise to the "quota" comments.

JMO

I just found this thread. the New York Troopers fought back raising the speed limi from 55MPH when the rest of the country was at 70MPH. They complained that an increase would cause more deaths. Fast forward some 20 years plus and national stats indicate both accident and auto deaths are down. I will concur that safer vehicles contributes to the good stats.

I have repeatedly read in this thread that police do not give tickets as a source of revenue. If not then why is it everytime police begin contract negotiations the first thing they reference is how they can slow up on issuing tickets. Police will never admit it but they patrol or park and wait in areas they know are easy pickings because of the nature of the area such as easily missing the speed limit changing from 45 to 35 ...and guess at which line the police officer waits? It isn't getting a ticket that gets me its the hypocrisy of it. The same applies to red light cameras wherein the timing of changes of the caution (yellow) can be manipulated. Keep in mind the companies selling, installing and maintaining theese lights split the revnue. But you will never win that argument because the public message is "we are keeping your roadways safe". Also keep in mind when an officer investigaterd an accident and can't pinpoint the cause he/she normally will default to "speed too fast for conditions" Its a catchall. Please understand I have great respect for police officers and the work they do but the ticket issuance has always set badly with me and I only got one ticket in my life. I don't like to putt putt around in my car but I do here because they have too many speed traps here and you are bound to get ticket no matter how diligent you are determined to be. But right or wrong that is why they do it. It doesn't make sense and the traffic engineer in an earlier post was spot on. Whenever anyone says "it ain't about the money", its about the money
By the way an ex-police officer (Florida) was looking in TV as he retired. He made mention as to his pension and free medical. His pension and benefits far exceeded in 20 years what most people from the private sector make after 35-40 years.

Every time a ticket is issued in any state, county or city, the fine that is imposed on the lawbreaker goes into the general operating fund of that political subdivision. Let's say at the end of a year, $2,000,000 in fines have been levied, based on, say, 250,000 speeding violations.

That $2,000,000 goes toward operation of that political subdivision. (Fines collected: A line item in the budget)

Now, let's go to next year. Fewer tickets are issued, fewer fines are levied, less money goes into the general fund. BUT that money was already earmarked, based on last years revenue. Let's say it's down by half....to $1,000,000.

Hey taxpayers, guess who's gonna make up the difference.:wave:

Now, I ask, who would you rather pay that difference, you as a tax payer, or a speeder as a lawbreaker?:loco:

JLK

This seems to validate the notion that the issuance of speeding citations is more about revenue generation than public safety.

I agree with that assessment.

I believe people break laws they feel are not reasonable. Many times, speed limits appear rather arbitrary and have little to do with protection of the traveling public.


Just my thinking ....

We live in a golf cart community, hence the lower speeds. Most people go 5 to 10 miles over the posted speeds. So if they are raised to 45, people will go 50 at least, then there goes a villager in a street legal golf cart doing its top speed of 25, bad things could definitely happen. I believe sections of Morse Blvd are posted at 45 and I have traveled it at 45 and been passed by much faster vehicles. We don't need Morse Blvd and Buena Vista to become shortcuts for speeding non-villagers at the peril of Villagers. So support the police and slow down. Just my opinion....

I guessed that.

Nothing is reasonable until someone gets killed.

In the United States in 2009 we managed to kill over 33,500 people in traffic accidents - it was a good year, down from 39,000 the previous year. Who knows how many were hospitalized and the degree of their injuries? It takes about 10 million road accidents a year to cause this carnage. Every day close to 100 more people gone and many more in hospital! These numbers make all of the disasters and wars we hear about every day in the news pale by comparison.

I think the traffic laws are reasonable and thank the police for enforcing them.

Allan.

Just because people have their backyard facing a highway doesn't make it a residential street. If that were the case, there are interstate highways that would qualify as residential streets. Actually, 27/441 are more dangerous than Morse/BV from a traffic entering and leaving the highways perspective since there are many parking lots that cars exit to and enter from. With minor exceptions (e.g. rec centers), on Morse and BV the only place a car can enter or leave it are at controlled access points (roundabouts and traffic lights).

Also, I take exception to being characterized as a tailgater ("people like you") - here's a life lesson for you: just because someone advocates a change in a law, it doesn't mean that they are a law breaker or a discourteous driver. If you are behind me on Morse with your cruise control set at 32, you'll likely rear end me since mine is set at 30.

The Talk Host explained that revnue from tickets is placed in the general fund. If less are collected the following year it is made up with tax increases. However based on taxpayers experiences over the years it more likely that despite the amount of revenue raised by issuance of tickets its likely they will see a tax increase. What the Talk Host didn't explain is what personal rewards or recognition a police officer is given for meeting departmental goals.Think about this such goals create a conflict of interests.

Another member points out that drivers usually o 5mph or more over the posted limits and so increase the limits they will just exceed that raised posted limit. But my experience after 5 years driving on these roads is that most drivers violate the highways by driving well below the posted limit. the same applies to carts and cartpaths. The fact is you have a great number of drivers of golf carts driving below 16mph.

Another member referenced the number of deaths on the highway but based on long term statistics both deaths and accidents are down despite the country moving from a 55mph speed to 70 mph or more. So you would think that the opposite would be true.

If you are a carpenter, you are expected to build things. If you are a doctor,your job is to treat patients. If you are a dog catcher, your job is to catch dogs. If you are a police officer, your job is to enforce the law.

If you are a police chief and have 20 officers. 18 of them issue about 50 tickets a month, but two of them issue 5 or none, who is not doing his job?

Every job has quotas, more specifically productivity requirements to meet. In my broadcasting profession, my job was to get listeners. If I hadn't met my quota, I would have been fired.

If a newspaper carrier delivers only 50 of his 75 papers, he's not doing his job.

If a bulldozer operator moves only part of the dirt, he's gone.

I believe that there is an understandable confusion between quotas and job performance.

What would you think of a cop who sat on the side of the road and watched speeders whiz by and did nothing about it.

One more question. For those who grind an axe about speed enforcement.

At what speed above the limit should a person receive a ticket, or should that decision be left up to the individual driver?

JLK

It should be left up to the driver.....no wait.....12 miles over the speed limit....hmmmmmmm maybe........oh forget it I can't decide.

Do whatever you want but be prepared to pay the price and don't complain if you're caught.

Talk Host I agree with the aforementioned but many of the job position you cite may not create a conflict because they have quotas or goals.

Others however do because the goal becomes the goal. I had a New York ropper give me a ticket for going 60 mph in a 55mph. It didn't matter that I was just entering the on ramp and trying to gain enough speed to merge with traffic. the guy sat right there at the underpass waiting. Was this guy ensuring that he made his monthly goal? The insurance company I was with had strict underwriting rules and that one ticket forced me to pay higher premuims I have great respect for the work police do but again there are some guys out there that abuse their powers.. I would accept that in my chosen profession and so why would I accept it with another

Correction I would not accept that in my profession . so I would not accept thatother professions. this is the very last time ever I will have discussion about the police because I suffer cognitive dissodance.

Good point, rubicon. Another study revealed the number of fatalities per mile is greater on secondary roads than limited access highways in spite of higher speed limits on the latter.

My own experience, on a limited access highway, has shown someone in a pickup towing a overloaded trailer travelling at 45MPH creates a greater hazard than a car travelling at 75MPH.

Did you exercise your right to fight this ticket in court?

JLK

That's a great use of someone's time! Just because it can be fought doesn't mean the officer used good judgement in the first place.

No, but we have a recourse available to us. If we don't exercise our rights as citizens to defend ourselves, we are fostering the use of bad judgement on the part of a few police officers.

It's the same as complaining publicly about a meal at a restaurant but not discussing it with the manager.

JLK