Talk of The Villages Florida - Sumter County 25% Tax Increase

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Not at all an expert

Quote:

Originally Posted by SB8476 (Post 1663734)

Did anyone catch on page C4 of the Daily Sun the article regarding Sumter County increasing this years property taxes by 25%? Maybe they should not have asked the developer to continue building south of 44.

Not an expert but, we've all seen this government tactic over and over again. They report a pending 25% tax increase and we panic. It is mass crowd control. They then put through a 10% increase and the voters cheer-only a 10% tax increase..

If they did things honestly and said we are utting in a 10% tax increase the uproar would be louder and might result in political changes.

I would expect there is a cap on how much they can increase taxes per year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAVES (Post 1665094)

How much is the cap?

Some days I listen to people and wonder what color the sky is in their world.

The topic is a large increase in property taxes and how it could be justified should it happen. In my view, not everyone can afford such steep increases without consequences.

Yep a form of doublespeak. Can the County be sued? If someone in business is found to be incompetent and it causes undue hardship and/or monetary loses a recovery could be achieved via the legal system. But, if politicians are incompetent the only recovery comes at the hands of the voters.

This sounds like very poor budget planning to me. Could they not see this coming and gradually increase to meet the need? What effect will this have on those who are trying to sell their homes? A potential home buyer who does their due diligence and sees this will run for the nearest exit. I was confident in a healthy future for this community. But with this lack of foresight, I'm reexamining that belief.

In the new areas, a 25% RE Tax increase, a city property tax, a maintenance fee, a bond fee, and an amenity fee. A beautiful area but quite expensive for many on limited income. The least expensive patio villas will no longer be "affordable" for many. So sad. :cry:

Many off topic posts have been removed as well as some comments directed at members. The topic of this thread is the proposed property tax increase in Sumter County. Please return to the original topic. Further off topic posts will be deleted.

Moderator

Does anyone know which of the Commissioner's are up for re election. They should be voted out! Go by the slogan: "If your in your out". It will be interesting to see what/if they can find a creative way to fix what they created? Where is the accountability for the disaster they brought on to some of the fixed income residents? Where does the State stand in all of this? What is it doing to help out the residents who will have the quality of their lives impacted? These guys in office are beyond incompetent. Where do they live and are they being personally effected by these increases? Were any appointed to office as opposed to voted in? If so who appointed them? What are their backgrounds that support holding major financial positions in the County? There is a lot of bragging of some years had minor tax reduction and using that as a basis for "re election" when in fact it was a ploy and a scam to the residents as expenses were being incurred but hidden. These Commissioner's were either incompetent or scamming the residents. You can't have it both ways!! :ohdear:

Quote:

Originally Posted by PennBF (Post 1665399)

That's what happens when you "drink the Kool-ade" and choose to live in a "bubble." Life happens, and you're not paying attention. The rest of the world revolves, and you reject reality in favor of your shared hallucination.

Then, someone shows up and says HEY - guess what. Life has been happening, and now it's come to collect.

The bubble hasn't been popped, but reality has managed to leak in. Welcome to reality, where people pay MORE taxes every year, not less.

Two observations - 1. 25% is a Big number. 2. Sumter is adding MANY MILLIONS of property assessments. Minimal additional county expense. ("BONDS" cover all infrastructure.) What's wrong with this picture ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut (Post 1664856)

A friend of mine sent the following email to County Commissioner and received a response that also follows.

Mr. Burgress,
Put the tax burden on existing home owners is repugnant. We in The Villages will NOT Tolerate this terrible rate increase.
I moved to Sumter in part due to lower taxes.
Your proposed tax rate increase of 25% in one year is extraordinary and unnecessary. This type of rate increase will cause a great political impact on you, government and the developer. We Villagers are not stupid!
Worst of all this is lapse of trust in Government. We have taxation without representation.
I suggest you re-think your solution to the County’s financial issues.[/B][/COLOR]

Mr. Burgess response:

Thank you for your e-mail regarding the 2019-2020 Sumter County Budget and tentative tax increase.

The BOCC Budget stretches over all areas of our growing County and requires increased expenditures.

Improving and maintaining our County’s transportation infrastructure is a major priority in this year’s Budget. The time is right to make a big investment in our major roads. One specific example is our dedication of $12 million dollars toward the resurfacing of two of our County’s busiest roadways – Buena Vista Blvd. and Morse Blvd.

An equally important priority for this year is further enhancement of school safety and increased support for our Sheriff’s Department. In light of the Parkland shooting, the State of Florida has passed new laws that require us as County taxpayers to make increased payments for school safety. This Budget will be investing in that security with additional trained officers and the hardening of every school campus.

These priorities are a big commitment in Sumter County’s present and future….and will require our first tax increase since 2004. Fourteen straight years of tax decreases have served our citizens well and demonstrated our commitment to wise and frugal spending. Even with this year’s increase, we remain a relatively low tax county, strategically positioned for future success. The steps we are taking now will enable us to keep future taxes low, service levels high and our citizens safe.

Thank you for your interest in our County Budget. Attached are the budget workshop documents in the following link:

Agenda - 07/11/2019

Don Burgess
Commissioner
Sumter County

Looking at the exchange the takeaway is this:
My friend got an expected response for basically getting in Mr. Burgess' face and yelling at him, "thank you, next question please". Had he asked pointed and specific questions about the proposed budget the responses would have much likely been different. The response was obviously an canned response that was prepared in advance to respond to such email. As a District Supervisor I would have responded to the email in a similar manner to such rantings as anything else would service no purpose as it would be falling on deaf ears and a closed mind.

If similar statements are made at the meeting next Tuesday at the meeting at the Colony Rec Center, similar responses, if any, will be received and absolutely nothing will be accomplished.

To get specific answers then the questions need to be specific, direct, factual, answerable, void of emotion, and have to put them on the spot to answer with a response that will justify to the majority that this, or any other, increase is justified.

If you plan to ask questions at the meeting they should be as described above and you should do adequate research to ensure the answers have not already been asked. Statements such as "I'm on a fixed income" are both irrelevant and not a part of the issue. If your questions are making them squirm sweat, stumble over their answers, or resort to canned answers then the issue needs to be pressed until adequate answers are received.

Specific to Mr. Burgess' response:
Past tax increases, or lack there of, are irrelevant to the subject at hand.

The school funding issues avoids the issue that the combined state and local school taxes levied on each home in Sumter county is 5.507 millage points, or $1652 annually for a $300,000 assessable home. The 2300 homes added by The Villages last year accounted for approximal $3,800,000 added school taxes and exactly 0 student population increase (far below the national, state, and local averages). Why is this not adequate to fund these additional costs?

The new roads needed is already address by road impact fees charged by the county and the new home impact fee of $2600 per home that is charged. The new home impact fee for 2300 home is nearly $6,000,000, why was this not applied to the roads being built? The impact fee is also supposed to pay for added infrastructure, parks, schools, jails, etc. most of this is not applicable to the funds collected for development here in the villages, school are obvious-zero impact, parks and infrastructure we pay for with our bonds, maintenance assessments, and monthly amenity fee, the county is off the hook for these. There should be more than enough to address the roads.

Using the resurfacing of Morse and Buena Vista as a justification for increased taxes is disingenuous and lacks merit, did they raise taxes last year to cover the cost of resurfacing the other roads that were accomplished throughout the county? If we pay it this year, it's a one time expense, what happens to the money next year, will we see a tax decrease? Not likely. Why was there no planning to address these roads in previous year's budgets, it was no surprise that these would be needing resurfacing as these are, in Mr. Burgess' words "...two of the County's busiest roadways...".

The claim that the county is growing and requires increased expenditures does not mix well with the higher than average tax base provided by The Villages and the lower than average service requirements. Remember half our population is not here half the year and we're not exactly a haven for crime require extraordinary police coverage.

The impact fees, tax base increase, and school tax increases have occurred for may years now and will continue at a similar rate for the foreseeable future.

The statement that even though we are getting a tax increase we're still one of the lowest tax rates is laughable. We're going to put the screws to you this year, but you should like it because other people are getting it worse than you. Really?

I'll see you all at next week's meeting.

Here are my sources for the information on the impact fees.

Road Impact Fee Schedules | Sumter County, FL - Official Website

Sumter County, FL - Official Website

Thanks Don for taking the time to generate this very intelligent and informative post. Well worth taking the time to study and comprehend the reality of the situation.

Yes, as always well thought out and expressed by Don. Very happy to have you on “our team”.

Is it just my iPad? I can’t read the first letter. At all. I’m getting blue font on a green background. Maybe there’s a way to change this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Villageswimmer (Post 1665532)

Is it just my iPad? I can’t read the first letter. At all. I’m getting blue font on a green background. Maybe there’s a way to change this?

Here's a link to the original post (#107)

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...6-post107.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut (Post 1665542)

Here's a link to the original post (#107)

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...6-post107.html

Formatting corrected.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SB8476 (Post 1663734)

And it’s still lower than Marion county

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie0723 (Post 1665547)

Formatting corrected.

Thanks.

Question: Are the commission jobs part-time or full-time?

I saw an email from the POA stating that "Among the proposed increases was a 12% increase in Commissioners salary/benefit package, bringing the total package to more than $100,000 that includes a $60,678 base salary of (sic), $29,623 retirement contribution plus health insurance!" I wonder where this comes from. In reading the 23-page document justifying the budget (see Post #60 by 2Plane) I don't find where their salaries/benefits are addressed. If true, that is certainly grounds for contention.

View as Webpage

Sumter County Villagers Need to Attend this Meeting!!
Sumter County Commission
Tuesday, July 23, 2019 at 5 P.M.
Colony Cottage Recreation Center
Commissioners will vote on a proposal to increase property taxes for Sumter County residents by 24%!
Among the proposed increases:
· 12% increase in Commissioners salary/benefit package, bringing the total package to more than $100,000 that includes a $60,678 base salary of, $29,623 retirement contribution plus health insurance!
· $3 Million increase in the Sheriff’s Department budget that includes 8 new positions
· Other new employee positions for the Property Tax Appraiser’s office and the Clerk of the Circuit Court
· Higher employee insurance premiums
· Synchronized traffic lights
· Upgrade of Morse Boulevard and Buena Vista Boulevard
The Villages Daily Sun reported this means an increase of $136.35 for every $100,000 of taxable home value, however, the total proposed tax rate (including school assessments and district taxes) of 12.5025 is less than Lake County’s 13.1992 and Marion County’s 16.0452 rates.
This is the first proposed increase in 14 years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by skip0358 (Post 1665687)

Yes, but it sure is a WHOPPER of an increase. :faint:

They really should have planned better 14 years ago. But it looks like they were more interested in patting themselves on the back and attracting others to pat them as well, by telling them how much they will save by living there. "We won't spend money on anything, and we'll keep the taxes really low, maybe even lower them further a couple of times. What's that, you say? Expenses are becoming more expensive? Don't worry about that, we'll figure it out when the bill comes. Excuse me? Things need repair 10 years later? Hm. We didn't save anything, but heck let's just pour what we have into one of those repairs and everyone will love us for keeping the costs down. Eh? We've run out of money and there are MORE repairs to make 14 years later? Well bite me on the backside, it's time to make them PAY."

That is what happened. Y'all voted for it for 14 years. Change the administration, and you'll change how finances cover expenses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian (Post 1663758)

They are not low. Paying double what I paid in the People's Republic of Maryland for a two story full basement brick house, 3100 sq feet with two car garage and theater. All on 4 acres.

Time to start reqular reassesments of houses.

Definitely not low

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Don't forget that taxes are only part of the picture here. We also have bonds being paid and yearly assessments. To me they are very much like taxes - just given a different name.

May not be low but a lot lower then where quite a few of us came from!

Quote:

Originally Posted by almondz (Post 1665897)

Don't forget that taxes are only part of the picture here. We also have bonds being paid and yearly assessments. To me they are very much like taxes - just given a different name.

Don't forget a same name...............no state income taxes.

Lets Look at the 5 Sumter County Commissioner's
1. Al Butler-Dist - #1[/COLOR]
-Came to Sumter County in 2005
-Was a Director of Homeowners Association
(Is there anyone on the face of the earth that does not know
the HOA is an Arm of the Developer and therefore he
[Developer] has a major influence on the Board)
-Degree in Engineering
-Lives in Wildwood
-Term ends 2020
-Background in Commission write up does not indicate what he believes
2. Doug Gilpin - DIST#2
-States he has been able to keep Tax burden low while service
level high
-Believes in personal responsibilities
-Believes use of tax payers money is big responsibility , takes
jt seriously
-Had no opponents in 2010
-Believes to keep tax burden low.
-Term ends in 2022
3.Don Burgess - Dist#3
-Appointed by Governor in 2009
-Chairman of Board of Commissioner
-Believes in Balanced Budget
-Below in low taxes
-Believes in efficient Government Service
-Conservtive Values
-No indication of Education level
-Term runs out in 2020
Gary Breeden - Dist#4
-No statement of beliefs, accomplishments, education, etc
in Commissioner's write up in Official publication
-Term runs out 2022
[COLOR=]5.Steve Printz - Dist#5[/COLOR]
-Believes in focusing on achieving quality growth while
maintaining rural Summter County nature.
-Believes in quality affordable growth.
-Believes have to support and serv growing population
-Education=BS, Secondary Education, MBA in Business Admin.
Term Runs out 2020

Some Observatioins:
How many use "tax" in some form to get elected while ignoring
fundemental reserve planning. Of course everyone believe in lower taxes so what better way than to use that as a basis for election. What is truly shocking is that with these 5 individuals a "Reserve Funding" was not applied to the Village planning and thus it is accountability time.

Returning the topic to County Income Taxes.

So how much is this increase??? $200/yr, $400/yr ???

It's either Pay-me-now, or Pay-me-later.

If the County would have collected these funds earlier/in advance, in smaller amounts, as suggested by some posters.............how many posters would have been up in arms about those increase and building "reserve taxes." I can hear it, "I want to keep the dollars in my pocket".

Net, Net, Net.............the percentage seems large for a portion of the total tax bill, which equates to a relatively small absolute dollar impact. The big County dollars appear to be going to the right places.......Law Enforcement, EMS, Fire, Streets, Technology.

:duck:

Oh de, how dare you say such intelligent things! For all the talk that occurs about people wanting free everything, many in TV seem to forget that growth cost money, labor cost do not go down unless you fire people and in very few instances do materials for building or repairing get cheaper. Agree that there should have been a reserve but there is not. They are trying to fix it now, not sure government new about the amount of growth that would occur in the county, no one else did. How about we try working with them instead of against them all the time. Why is the first thought of people so negative, they are trying to put the screws to us!

"How much is the increase?" On a homesteaded property, assuming the assessed value remains the same as last year at a little over $300K, the increase will be $320. Of course, the assessed value remaining the same is doubtful.

To understand the differences;
What does property tax cover?by county
As compared to Maintenance fees?
And Amenities?
Are there any other fees in TV besides paying off the original bond?
I saw the video from Goldwingnut explaining bonds but the total financial set up in TV Is convoluted. I am a newbie myself but up north when property taxes were increased dramatically some on fixed income lost their long time homes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 1665966)

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...art-1-a-17717/

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...art-2-a-17716/

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...art-3-a-17715/

Very helpful. Thank you. I guess I was wondering what exactly does Say, Sumter property tax cover? Schools, fire etc roads including Morse. How is it calculated? When you are asked to pay for something don’t you want to know what it is for and why the amount? Particularly when there is suddenly a large increase?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 1665966)

:icon_wink: When we moved here 15 years ago I saw 2 bumper stickers that I liked a great deal:
1 - SNOWBIRDS.... taste like chicken.
2 - We DON"T care how you did it up North!

The questions in your post are good ones. I asked them too..... just before moving here. But better late than never! :ho:

The answers to your questions can be found online or in person from the Government either County or District. :)

The wise learn from others’ mistakes. There is something about reinventing the wheel....

Please understand I am not only or even primarily, asking these questions for myself.

The millage rate is a bit of a shell game.
The rate can be lower but your property value can be raised and you still pay more. The mileage can be higher and your property value lower and you pay less. This is a “proposed” increase. I am eager to see the end result. Fingers crossed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 1665966)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 1665991)

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...t=Amenity+fees

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...t=Amenity+fees

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...t=Amenity+fees

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...t=Amenity+fees

Property Taxes - Randy Mask - Sumter County Tax Collector

http://sumterpa.com/

https://www.propertyshark.com/mason/.../Sumter-County

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 1666000)

The wise learn from others’ mistakes. There is something about reinventing the wheel....

Please understand I am not only or even primarily, asking these questions for myself.

/////

Obviously, there has been a lot of past interest in these questions. I always felt that the sum of the whole (community) is always more than just the addition of its parts.
Like up north, (please forgive the comparison, I just couldn’t help myself) there seems to be a lot of information on HOW they collect property tax. I wish I could attend the meetings for the discussions so I hope someone will summarize them here at TOTV if they can.

Again, most helpful information.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carla B (Post 1665956)

Why do you think the assessed value will change? In my experience, it hasn’t changed often and I’ve even seen it lowered.

By FL law the assessed value of a home (primary residence w/homestead exemption) can only increase 3% or the percent change in the CPI (Consumer Price Index), whichever is less. I guess that is better than "unlimited"
"Save Our Homes" Amendment and Its Effects - Rick Singh, CFA - Orange County Property Appraiser