Talk of The Villages Florida
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Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   VHA (Villages Homeowners Association) (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/vha-villages-homeowners-association-157002/)

rustyp 07-05-2015 05:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1082598)
Don't be out.

I have to agree.



Avogado, does anyone actively involved in leadership of the POA live south of 466?

Please name them and their position.
I need help understanding the significance of the importance of living north or south of 466 neighbor.

ureout 07-05-2015 06:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyp (Post 1082856)
I need help understanding the significance of the importance of living north or south of 466 neighbor.
many of the problems that the property owners went thru on the N side of 466 have yet to happen on the S/side.....that is because the developer still owns everything....wait until the IRS issue is FINALLY complete and then the developer will start selling rec. centers and softball complexes back to the residents of the district they live in

janmcn 07-05-2015 06:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ureout (Post 1082858)
many of the problems that the property owners went thru on the N side of 466 have yet to happen on the S/side.....that is because the developer still owns everything....wait until the IRS issue is FINALLY complete and then the developer will start selling rec. centers and softball complexes back to the residents of the district they live in

That might be the time the residents of those districts need an organization like the POA or the VHA looking out for their interests.

Advogado 07-05-2015 07:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ureout (Post 1082858)
many of the problems that the property owners went thru on the N side of 466 have yet to happen on the S/side.....that is because the developer still owns everything....wait until the IRS issue is FINALLY complete and then the developer will start selling rec. centers and softball complexes back to the residents of the district they live in
An important factual correction: The Developer will not be selling those assets to the residents. If that were the case, the pricing and terms of sale would, by definition, be arm's length since it would be a transaction between unrelated parties.

Instead, the Developer will be selling those assets (and the right to receive the related amenity fees) to Center Community Development Districts that he controls. Thus, he will, in essence, be selling them to himself, and he will be setting the price and terms of sale.

It is this self dealing that underlay both the POA-backed class-action lawsuit and the IRS investigation. It is important that somebody keep a close eye on the pricing and terms of these future sales to ensure that they are arm's length and do not place the viability of our amenities system at risk by unduly burdening the Center Districts. That somebody will certainly not be the VHA.

Warren Kiefer 07-05-2015 08:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado (Post 1082879)
An important factual correction: The Developer will not be selling those assets to the residents. If that were the case, the pricing and terms of sale would, by definition, be arm's length since it would be a transaction between unrelated parties.

Instead, the Developer will be selling those assets (and the right to receive the related amenity fees) to Center Community Development Districts that he controls. Thus, he will, in essence, be selling them to himself, and he will be setting the price and terms of sale.

It is this self dealing that underlay both the POA-backed class-action lawsuit and the IRS investigation. It is important that somebody keep a close eye on the pricing and terms of these future sales to ensure that they are arm's length and do not place the viability of our amenities system at risk by unduly burdening the Center Districts. That somebody will certainly not be the VHA.
You are mostly correct, you failed to make it clear that when sold to the CCDD, it is the Residents who pay the bill.

Warren Kiefer 07-05-2015 08:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1082804)
Road repairs happen everywhere. Are we going to blame the developer for the geological problems underlying the whole area of central west Florida????

It is these kinds of jabs and half truths and innuendos and rumors that make my blood boil.
I am a Highway Engineer and it concerns me that that bridge not being very old is already failing. Bridges are built on pilings usually driven to bed rock. This is not simple road repairs this is a bridge having serious failures. Every day almost everyone drives across interstate bridges that are still functional even though most are more than fifty years old.

Warren Kiefer 07-05-2015 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by advogado (Post 1082855)
as i said in an earlier post: You are entitled to your own opinion. You are not entitled to your own facts. Can you produce any facts whatsoever to substantiate your allegation that poa actions vis-a-vis the developer are politically motivated?

To get my politics and animus toward the developer out of the way, as i have said in earlier posts: I am a registered republican, like the developer. The developer has done many things to be proud of in making the villages the wonderful place it is today.

However, the developer's relationship with the vha (a vha president on his payroll and upon their leaving office, ex-vha presidents rewarded with county commissioner positions, and maybe other favors extended to vha officers that i no way of knowing about) is absolutely disgraceful.
amen!!

Advogado 07-05-2015 08:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Kiefer (Post 1082899)
You are mostly correct, you failed to make it clear that when sold to the CCDD, it is the Residents who pay the bill.
Only in the sense that we, after the sale to the CCDD, pay our amenity fees to the CCDD, instead of to the Developer. In other words, if things work as planned after the sale, everything is fine from the residents' perspective. We keep paying the same amenity fees, but they go to the CCDD instead of to the Developer.

The only problem for residents would arise if the CCDD were, for some reason (like the CCDD's overpaying the Developer for the assets-- the allegation in the class-action lawsuit), financially unable to continue to furnish the amenities at the promised level. In fact, thanks to the recovery in the class-action lawsuit, things now seem to be working out okay. Of course, an adverse outcome in the IRS investigation or other factors (e.g., a huge increase in the minimum wage) increasing costs to the CCDDs at a rate faster than the CPI cap on amenity-fee increases could change that.

Thnonne 07-05-2015 08:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado (Post 1082782)
First, I am not trying to recruit members for the POA, and I don't care whether you join or don't join the POA. And, if knowing the relationship between the VHA and the Developer, you still want to join the VHA, that is certainly up to you.

However, I want to make it clear that when others and myself point out facts demonstrating the corrupt relationship between the Developer and the VHA (and, in particular, between the Developer and certain VHA presidents), we are not "bashing" the VHA. Instead, we are exposing the VHA for what it is-- a phony homeowners' association, supported by the Developer for the purpose of weakening or destroying the POA.
Wow, you don't consider it bashing to describe another as a "corrupt" "phony homeowners association," in print. I have never seen any such claims in the VHA publications about the POA. It must be horrible to live in such fear of your rival organization. Remember if you can't say something good about someone don't say anything, especially in Florida's friendliest hometown.

Advogado 07-05-2015 08:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Kiefer (Post 1082902)
I am a Highway Engineer and it concerns me that that bridge not being very old is already failing. Bridges are built on pilings usually driven to bed rock. This is not simple road repairs this is a bridge having serious failures. Every day almost everyone drives across interstate bridges that are still functional even though most are more than fifty years old.
Warren, in the post that you quote, Graciegirl said her blood was boiling at the suggestion that the Developer might be responsible since bridges fail all the time due to natural causes. I know nothing about the matter, but I suppose that she might be right. In any case, somebody ought to look at whether the bridge was properly constructed in the first place. With the Developer's having put his ex-VHA presidents on the County Commission, I don't know who that somebody will be.

Advogado 07-05-2015 09:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thnonne (Post 1082917)
Wow, you don't consider it bashing to describe another as a "corrupt" "phony homeowners association," in print. I have never seen any such claims in the VHA publications about the POA. It must be horrible to live in such fear of your rival organization. Remember if you can't say something good about someone don't say anything, especially in Florida's friendliest hometown.
First, making those factual statements about the VHA is not bashing. It is exposing.

Second, the VHA is not "my rival organization". I am not the POA and have made it very clear that I am neither an officer or director thereof and never have been. I am a resident of The Villages, who is frankly outraged that the VHA, while its president was an employee of the Developer and whose other presidents, upon leaving office, have had their political careers launched by the Developer, would hold itself out as a homeowners' association.

Third, I would request that you stick to the facts of this issue rather than berating me for pointing out an uncomfortable truth.

A lot of residents do not understand the facts regarding the relationship between the Developer and the VHA. They are not well publicized. Frankly, I did not understand how unsavory that relationship is until, inspired by some of the posts in this thread defending the VHA, I decided to do some digging. Thus, as this thread continued, and I learned more, my criticism of that relationship became more and more harsh.

mickey100 07-05-2015 09:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by outlaw (Post 1082615)
Very informative! I always felt the POA was the true resident advocate, mainly because of the multimillion dollar settlement. But I had not realized all the important things the POA has done in the interest of the residents. WOW! I heard about the cozy relationship between the developer and the VHA, with the developer even funding the VHA. I am amazed at the number of otherwise intelligent and rational people that blindly and continuously ignore the transgressions of the developer; always attacking the messengers as "complainers" and "whiners", but never providing any facts refuting the message.
Another recent example of the POA watching out for the residents is the issue of the offer by the developer to fund a pool at a new recreation center on the proposed Baptist church property if purchased by the AAC. The recent POA monthly pointed out that the developer is offering nothing, because the offer to fund the pool is in lieu of the developer building a neighborhood pool in one of the new 300 home developments in the north end. For this, the developer wants the AAC to allow an additional 300 homes to be built in the north end of TV.
I am as amazed as you are about the people who seem unable to grasp the facts
And then attack the the messenger. For the record, most people I've talked to are big supporters of the POA. We had friends who had some issues they needed help with. They first went to the VHA and found them completely useless, just an arm of the developer. They said they'd never waste time with them again, they would always look to the POA for assistance.

Thanks to Advogado and others for posting facts and educating the residents who read theses postings.

outlaw 07-06-2015 06:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado (Post 1082919)
Warren, in the post that you quote, Graciegirl said her blood was boiling at the suggestion that the Developer might be responsible since bridges fail all the time due to natural causes. I know nothing about the matter, but I suppose that she might be right. In any case, somebody ought to look at whether the bridge was properly constructed in the first place. With the Developer's having put his ex-VHA presidents on the County Commission, I don't know who that somebody will be.
It would be Kimley-Horn & Associates Inc., of course. I wonder what the "study" will show....

Seriously, why isn't the county responsible for this bridge maintenance? I thought Morse Blvd was a county road. Is the bridge ownership carved out?

Moderator 07-06-2015 07:19 AM
Please keep the replies on topic or the thread will be closed.

A number of empty/nonsense and personally-directed posts have been removed.

Thanks.

Moderator

Advogado 07-06-2015 07:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moderator (Post 1082999)
Please keep the replies on topic or the thread will be closed.

A number of empty/nonsense and personally-directed posts have been removed.

Thanks.

Moderator
Closing discussion of this very important subject is exactly what the posters making the "personally directed posts" would like. Therefore, you will be playing into their hands if you close the thread. I would suggest that you continue to delete the "empty/nonsense and personally-directed posts" and leave the thread open.


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