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ColdNoMore 09-23-2017 02:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452038)
I would argue that there were millions of women who did not share your point of view during the 1950s.

Among them would be those women who had been forced out of their preferred feminine roles as housewives and homemakers to work in the various defense industries during the 1940s, building airplanes, tanks, arms and munitions for our military forces engaged in a world-wide armed struggle that we were by no means assured we would win.

During World War II, American women demonstrated their ability to perform in the mechanical crafts and trades which had previously been closed to them, and they developed a new pride and self-confidence in their abilities. But, most of them preferred to removed to the traditional "feminine" roles of the pre-war era; and most did, welcoming home their husbands, and expecting to again be the ruler of their households while their husbands brought home a paycheck.

One of the greatest aspirations of our military men returning to civilian life was to settle down with a wife and family in their own home, working at a good job, and enjoying life.

Technology which was developed in war time found civilian applications which blossomed quickly into "modern conveniences" such as tape recorders, AM/FM transistor radios, and television. The 1950s was also characterized by the introduction of a wide variety of automobiles, and the American romance with cars began a decades-long love affair.

You mention lynchings, but you fail to mention that the Civil Rights Movement took wing in the 1950s, with such events as Brown vs. Board of Education, Rosa Parks and the Montgomery Bus Boycott, and the rise of Martin Luther King, Jr., as leader of the Civil Rights Movement. By the 1950s the Armed Forces had been ordered integrated, and minorities were moving into the supervisory ranks.

I don't know where you lived in the 1950s, but in none of the places where I lived was wife beating legal or accepted.

You properly decry the disparity in moral values between sexual promiscuity of men and women in the 1950s, but seem to feel that lowering the standard for women was the proper solution, while there are those of us who argue that raising the standard for men would have been the proper solution.

In the 1950s, I was a white, male, heterosexual teenager with a beautiful high school sweetheart who I later married, and a nice late model car to ride around in for trips to church, parties, and the beach. I did well in high school, attended church regularly, grew up in a two-parent family, with a younger brother who also did well.

I was aware of alcohol and drugs, but did not use them. I had a part time job in which I worked with a Black male who I considered a friend. I lived in a city in which White, Black, Italian and Spanish influences were all in evidence. I read a weekly newspaper that had articles written in English, Italian and Spanish. I ate "soul food," Italian food, Cuban food, and lots of sea food.

And I was happy.

Clearly, we have very different memories of the 1950s.
Women's Rights in the 1950s | Our Everyday Life

Quote:
In many states women's property rights were still restricted.

In some states women could not make contracts, including wills. They also could not sell property and in many cases they could not control their own earnings. All of these were the legal right of the woman's husband or father.

In almost every state, men had the right to have sex with their wife any time they wanted to, with or without her consent.

There was, in other words, no such thing as rape if a couple was married

, and any form of birth control was still illegal in many places. The combination of these two meant that a woman was almost legally obligated to have children if her husband wanted them.
And this is considered 'the good old days?' :ohdear:

Schaumburger 09-23-2017 02:56 PM
Set just after the 1950's (the early 1960's), watch the movie "Hidden Figures" and see what these women went through and how they were treated on the job with NASA. So glad I didn't start working full-time until the early 1980's, and I still saw and heard things 34 years ago that are not tolerated in today's workplace.

CowBubba 09-23-2017 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452038)
I would argue that there were millions of women who did not share your point of view during the 1950s.

Among them would be those women who had been forced out of their preferred feminine roles as housewives and homemakers to work in the various defense industries during the 1940s, building airplanes, tanks, arms and munitions for our military forces engaged in a world-wide armed struggle that we were by no means assured we would win.

During World War II, American women demonstrated their ability to perform in the mechanical crafts and trades which had previously been closed to them, and they developed a new pride and self-confidence in their abilities. But, most of them preferred to removed to the traditional "feminine" roles of the pre-war era; and most did, welcoming home their husbands, and expecting to again be the ruler of their households while their husbands brought home a paycheck.

One of the greatest aspirations of our military men returning to civilian life was to settle down with a wife and family in their own home, working at a good job, and enjoying life.

Technology which was developed in war time found civilian applications which blossomed quickly into "modern conveniences" such as tape recorders, AM/FM transistor radios, and television. The 1950s was also characterized by the introduction of a wide variety of automobiles, and the American romance with cars began a decades-long love affair.

You mention lynchings, but you fail to mention that the Civil Rights Movement took wing in the 1950s, with such events as Brown vs. Board of Education, Rosa Parks and the Montgomery Bus Boycott, and the rise of Martin Luther King, Jr., as leader of the Civil Rights Movement. By the 1950s the Armed Forces had been ordered integrated, and minorities were moving into the supervisory ranks.

I don't know where you lived in the 1950s, but in none of the places where I lived was wife beating legal or accepted.

You properly decry the disparity in moral values between sexual promiscuity of men and women in the 1950s, but seem to feel that lowering the standard for women was the proper solution, while there are those of us who argue that raising the standard for men would have been the proper solution.

In the 1950s, I was a white, male, heterosexual teenager with a beautiful high school sweetheart who I later married, and a nice late model car to ride around in for trips to church, parties, and the beach. I did well in high school, attended church regularly, grew up in a two-parent family, with a younger brother who also did well.

I was aware of alcohol and drugs, but did not use them. I had a part time job in which I worked with a Black male who I considered a friend. I lived in a city in which White, Black, Italian and Spanish influences were all in evidence. I read a weekly newspaper that had articles written in English, Italian and Spanish. I ate "soul food," Italian food, Cuban food, and lots of sea food.

And I was happy.

Clearly, we have very different memories of the 1950s.
your wrong carl, but you sound just like my father so I defer further comment.

CowBubba 09-23-2017 03:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CowBubba (Post 1452110)
You for sure are an example of what is produced by white privilege. I don't doubt that you are a decent American, but I am positive that you would make a determination in a criminal investigation by using race, religion and faith to help you with your final determination.
I edited.

redwitch 09-23-2017 04:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452038)
I would argue that there were millions of women who did not share your point of view during the 1950s.

Among them would be those women who had been forced out of their preferred feminine roles as housewives and homemakers to work in the various defense industries during the 1940s, building airplanes, tanks, arms and munitions for our military forces engaged in a world-wide armed struggle that we were by no means assured we would win.

During World War II, American women demonstrated their ability to perform in the mechanical crafts and trades which had previously been closed to them, and they developed a new pride and self-confidence in their abilities. But, most of them preferred to removed to the traditional "feminine" roles of the pre-war era; and most did, welcoming home their husbands, and expecting to again be the ruler of their households while their husbands brought home a paycheck.

Many women that I talked to of that era were proud that they had been to work, become skilled. Some were thrilled to go back to being a housewife, some were not. Today, women have a choice. Not only can they work, but they can work in the profession of their choice. The only limitations are physical abilities. Personally, I believe that if a family can afford it, there should be no stigma to a man or woman staying home and running the household.

One of the greatest aspirations of our military men returning to civilian life was to settle down with a wife and family in their own home, working at a good job, and enjoying life.

This aspiration forced many women back into a role they did not cherish.

Technology which was developed in war time found civilian applications which blossomed quickly into "modern conveniences" such as tape recorders, AM/FM transistor radios, and television. The 1950s was also characterized by the introduction of a wide variety of automobiles, and the American romance with cars began a decades-long love affair.

You mention lynchings, but you fail to mention that the Civil Rights Movement took wing in the 1950s, with such events as Brown vs. Board of Education, Rosa Parks and the Montgomery Bus Boycott, and the rise of Martin Luther King, Jr., as leader of the Civil Rights Movement. By the 1950s the Armed Forces had been ordered integrated, and minorities were moving into the supervisory ranks.

Yes, Brown was made law in 1954. Even so, schools were still segregated. I saw that in Kentucky, Georgia, Mississippi and Kansas in the late 50's and early 60's. Let's remember that it was 1964 when George Wallace stood on stairs of the University of Alabama to block black students from attending the school..

I don't know where you lived in the 1950s, but in none of the places where I lived was wife beating legal or accepted.

Legal, no. Frowned upon, generally, yes. Accepted, sadly, yes. Even today women are afraid to admit they have been beaten. A slap or a light punch was very much tolerated back then. Full out beatings, no.

And, as someone else mentioned, it was not rape if the woman was your wife, regardless of how much your wife objected.

You properly decry the disparity in moral values between sexual promiscuity of men and women in the 1950s, but seem to feel that lowering the standard for women was the proper solution, while there are those of us who argue that raising the standard for men would have been the proper solution.

Actually, I'm with you on this one. I would much prefer that sexual standards be raised for both sexes. But, if that's not going to happen, then let's make both sexes equally responsible.

In the 1950s, I was a white, male, heterosexual teenager with a beautiful high school sweetheart who I later married, and a nice late model car to ride around in for trips to church, parties, and the beach. I did well in high school, attended church regularly, grew up in a two-parent family, with a younger brother who also did well.

I was aware of alcohol and drugs, but did not use them. I had a part time job in which I worked with a Black male who I considered a friend. I lived in a city in which White, Black, Italian and Spanish influences were all in evidence. I read a weekly newspaper that had articles written in English, Italian and Spanish. I ate "soul food," Italian food, Cuban food, and lots of sea food.

And I was happy.

Clearly, we have very different memories of the 1950s.

I was an Army/embassy brat. English was my fifth language. As a child I hated all the moving around. As an adult, I wouldn't trade my childhood for all the money in the world.

I was loved, cherished, cosseted. I saw some ugly things in my travels and had parents who didn't gloss over these events but did try to help me understand why people did the things they did.

The 50's I remember aren't the 50's I write about here. How could they be? I was ten when they ended. I had little knowledge of how women were considered chattels, how different schools in the same town meant different levels of education, etc. I was pretty happy barring all the moving. Even so, I refuse to romanticize the 50's, the 60's or any other era. Just because you weren't aware of the issues, doesn't make them any less real.
My comments in bold.

Carl in Tampa 09-23-2017 06:48 PM
Show me.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CowBubba (Post 1452110)
your wrong carl, but you sound just like my father so I defer further comment.
I am hard pressed to accept your assertion that I am wrong, when all I have done is state facts, and my experience. I didn't say that these were the only things going on, but they were what happened to me.

And, based upon my experience, the 1950s were a happy time for me. That's what I said.

Demonstrate where I am wrong.

Taltarzac725 09-23-2017 07:34 PM
I was born at the end of the 50s so do not know and my Mom had the flu while I was in the womb so I had to overcome some serious handicaps-- speech and coordination. I remember a lot of bullying and taking the short bus, literally once in a while. Had to get me trained to use my right hand as I was bad with both to begin with. So the 60s are a bit of a painful blur with some good moments. Did not come into my own until Mrs. Barbara Mitchell (Earl Wooster High School) in 1975 saw something worthwhile in me and later a number of University of Nevada, Reno Philosophy professors did the same along with German male professor as well as French woman professor. No mentor in librarianship nor in law school but did find a few friends among law students. And lots of friends in the librarianship program.

One of my cases as a law student at the U of MN Law School Legal Assistance to Minnesota Prisoners Clinic was doing something for the first man sentenced for raping his wife in Minnesota. I cannot say what I did for him but he was infamous in Minnesota and the Judge I dealt with chewed me out for doing this in 1988 or so. Even though the law would have notified his ex-wife about anything a law student lawyer and the lawyer of record did concerning this inmate.

I did have a hard time believing that people before the 1980s in many states seemed to be able to rape their wives. Marital rape (United States law - Wikipedia)

I did have a harder time dealing with the two youth who burned down a school library in upstate Minnesota though but while a law student you get the cases your supervising lawyer gives you.

That could have happened in the 1950s as well though I suppose.

Incidentally, the U of MN Law School when I was there had more women than men attending and often these were one of the people giving the Valedictorian speech at Graduation. Quite a change I will bet from the 1950s.

Carl in Tampa 09-23-2017 07:54 PM
Happy days
 
3 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwitch (Post 1452130)
My comments in bold.
It makes it virtually impossible to continue a dialogue when you insert your observations inside of my quoted material.

Accordingly, I will simply say that you may be well read on the "evils" of the 1950s, a period during which you were an infant and young child, but I was living through that time as a college student, college graduate, police department employee, and married man. You read about it; I lived it.

I will skip over the Feminist rhetoric that "many women" did not want to be housewives because there never was, nor ever will be a situation where everyone is happy with their life roles. Having a daughter with a college degree, I would be happy to see her in any life role of which she is capable and in which she would be happy.

I didn't state that racial segregation was abolished in the 1950s; I did point out that certain history changing events occurred in that period that laid the foundation for eventual progress. By the way, Governor Wallace "standing in the schoolhouse door" was entirely for show. He was using the Alabama National Guard for muscle, so President Kennedy federalized the Guard and had their Commanding Officer order Wallace to move. After further assertions of State's Rights, Wallace moved away. President Kennedy also directed that the federalized Guard facilitate Black registration in schools throughout Alabama.

Again, I don't know where you lived, but the places where I lived did not tolerate wife beating, which you characterized as being accepted so long as the item used was "less than the width of the man's thumb." And, under current Florida law, if police are called to a report of domestic abuse and one partner shows signs of having been struck, the other person IS going to jail. There is no wiggle room.

It is not "romanticizing the fifties" to have happy memories of the great era of muscle cars, Rock and Roll, and growing prosperity of the Middle Class after the deprivations of World War II. It was, in fact, an era of evolving and improving conditions in America.

.

xNYer 09-23-2017 08:03 PM
My father told me what degenerates people were in the fifties. Elvis shakin those damn hips in public. Morality was far better when he grew up in the 30's.

Polar Bear 09-23-2017 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452239)
It makes it virtually impossible to continue a dialogue when you insert your observations inside of my quoted material...
Agree. Use multiple quotes instead.

Fraugoofy 09-23-2017 08:09 PM
...

Fredman 09-23-2017 08:23 PM
In the 50’s we were taught respect and the value of hard work. We weren’t entitled and we didn’t get participation trophy’s.

Taltarzac725 09-23-2017 09:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xNYer (Post 1452244)
My father told me what degenerates people were in the fifties. Elvis shakin those damn hips in public. Morality was far better when he grew up in the 30's.
I heard that the 20s were really roaring with all those flappers. And all the men just grateful to be alive after the horrors of trench warfare coupled with the Spanish flu after that.

manaboutown 09-23-2017 09:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraugoofy (Post 1452246)
Man. Of course you are going to find rotten apples. GENERALLY SPEAKING, I believe kids are kinder, more accepting, and better able to see the world from different lenses than kids from the 70's. I can't speak for the 1950's. My parents didn't even meet until 1966...

Sent from my SM-N920R4 using Tapatalk
Well the topic is the the traditional values of the 1950's, not the 1970's. I am sticking to addressing the traditional values of the 1950's which I miss.

charmed59 09-23-2017 09:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452038)
During World War II, American women demonstrated their ability to perform in the mechanical crafts and trades which had previously been closed to them, and they developed a new pride and self-confidence in their abilities. But, most of them preferred to removed to the traditional "feminine" roles of the pre-war era; and most did, welcoming home their husbands, and expecting to again be the ruler of their households while their husbands brought home a paycheck.
I would argue that most did not prefer to be relegated to the traditional "feminine" role of the pre-war era. Many did because they had no choice. I find in today's world, where there are very few stay-at-home parents that did not choose to take on that role, parents are happier. Women who are better at science than child rearing are making a different difference in this world. Men who are better at child rearing than selling insurance are also making a huge difference in this world.

As a child of the 60s, I didn't see the nurturing happy stay at home parents I see today. They are ridiculously good at their jobs. Better than I could have been, and much better than my mother was, despite her best efforts. Choice tends to put people into roles where they are the most productive and happy.

Fraugoofy 09-23-2017 09:18 PM
...

Carl in Tampa 09-23-2017 10:38 PM
The 1930s.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by xNYer (Post 1452244)
My father told me what degenerates people were in the fifties. Elvis shakin those damn hips in public. Morality was far better when he grew up in the 30's.
Yep. SO much better. Prohibition in the early 30's led to illegal gin mills and Organized Crime gangs such as Al Capone's in Chicago, with murder, bribery and intimidation the order of the day.

Then there was also the Great Depression of course. Not to mention Bonnie and Clyde, Machine Gun Kelly, Baby Face Nelson, John Dillinger, and Giuseppe Zangara. Who was Zangara, you ask? He was the assassin who attempted to shoot President Franklin Roosevelt at an outdoor appearance and accidentally killed Chicago Mayor Anton Cermak instead.

He killed the Mayor on February 13, 1933. He was tried, sentenced, and by March 20, 1933, he was executed in federal prison. Humm. Maybe the 30's were the good old days.

:evil6:

CowBubba 09-24-2017 06:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452296)
Yep. SO much better. Prohibition in the early 30's led to illegal gin mills and Organized Crime gangs such as Al Capone's in Chicago, with murder, bribery and intimidation the order of the day.

Then there was also the Great Depression of course. Not to mention Bonnie and Clyde, Machine Gun Kelly, Baby Face Nelson, John Dillinger, and Giuseppe Zangara. Who was Zangara, you ask? He was the assassin who attempted to shoot President Franklin Roosevelt at an outdoor appearance and accidentally killed Chicago Mayor Anton Cermak instead.

He killed the Mayor on February 13, 1933. He was tried, sentenced, and by March 20, 1933, he was executed in federal prison. Humm. Maybe the 30's were the good old days.

:evil6:
Now we have organized crime gangs like the cartel that gave way to pot mills with murder, bribery and intimidation the order of the day. Maybe we need to learn the prohibition lesson once again.

HimandMe 09-24-2017 07:27 AM
Reply
 
I grew up in the 50's. I lost my dad to the war, my mom worked 2 sometimes 3 jobs to support 4 children. We didn't notice we were poor as kids as everyone in the neighborhood seemed the same. We played on the street, we roamed all over town without care, we all watched the same 3 TV stations as all the other kids. Native Indians lived nearby, they were friends with everyone as we depended on each other. Perhaps we were isolated because there was never talk of discrimination only "you are no better, no worse,than anyone else, just different..and different is good. It would be boring otherwise. Mom suffered. Later she started her own business but had to present herself as an employee to get attention as she was not a male. She complained rarely. I never heard of anyone on drugs other than liquor. Yes, it was better and worse depending on what issue you dwell on. It did seem more wholesome, more loving, less violent. I do think the media today promotes violence and claims it reflects society...but not society I see often. I would prefer the media show us society but emphasize the positive, what we are and can be at our best. It's much easier to let things go, live our animal instincts, but humans are of a higher order, not just animals, and that is what I would prefer to see emphasized.
We have gained much in the last 50 years, and we have lost sight of some of our excellence. The pendulum swings back and forth but never again to the exact same spot individually and collectively. IMHO, the question is "Who do I want to be? Who do we want to be?"

Carl in Tampa 09-24-2017 03:42 PM
Growing up right.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HimandMe (Post 1452359)
I grew up in the 50's. I lost my dad to the war, my mom worked 2 sometimes 3 jobs to support 4 children. We didn't notice we were poor as kids as everyone in the neighborhood seemed the same. We played on the street, we roamed all over town without care, we all watched the same 3 TV stations as all the other kids. Native Indians lived nearby, they were friends with everyone as we depended on each other. Perhaps we were isolated because there was never talk of discrimination only "you are no better, no worse,than anyone else, just different..and different is good. It would be boring otherwise. Mom suffered. Later she started her own business but had to present herself as an employee to get attention as she was not a male. She complained rarely. I never heard of anyone on drugs other than liquor. Yes, it was better and worse depending on what issue you dwell on. It did seem more wholesome, more loving, less violent. I do think the media today promotes violence and claims it reflects society...but not society I see often. I would prefer the media show us society but emphasize the positive, what we are and can be at our best. It's much easier to let things go, live our animal instincts, but humans are of a higher order, not just animals, and that is what I would prefer to see emphasized.
We have gained much in the last 50 years, and we have lost sight of some of our excellence. The pendulum swings back and forth but never again to the exact same spot individually and collectively. IMHO, the question is "Who do I want to be? Who do we want to be?"
:agree:

My parents were young adults in the Depression. I didn't realize how poor we were because all of our neighbors were similarly situated. I benefited from having a highly intelligent father and a highly practical mother. They could not have imagined what a nice home and amenities I now have.

God blessed me with precisely the right wife, which meant more than all of the financial advantages I later received.

rubicon 09-24-2017 05:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwitch (Post 1451773)
Rubicon, I agree with some of what you said in Post 19, but not quite all. No question our kids and grandkids lose their innocence much too early. I do blame the media for that -- books, television, movies have all gotten much more graphic, both for violence and sex. I have met more than one girl under 16 who has told me she is a virgin, but the only thing she hasn't experienced is intercourse. That's just sad.

My daughter was raised to say please and thank you, yes ma'am/sir not so much (I hate being called ma'am -- it makes me feel ancient and I work for a living tyvm). My grandson is yes sir/ma'am on a regular basis. He is not a bully nor subjected to bullying as much as I or my daughter was. The kids today are more willing to include the children that are different. Skin color really doesn't matter to them. Ability counts more than socio/economic background to these kids.

As to women working in your town -- what were their positions? Teachers? Nurses? Babysitters? Shop clerks? Secretaries? Any that owned a business not female related? A surgeon? Police officer (not meter maid)? Mayor? Working for pin money doesn't count.

How did you miss out having to see Reefer Madness in school? Funniest dang movie I was ever forced to watch. Marijuana was around in the fifties. So was heroin, cocaine, anti-depressants, speed. Most of us kids were too young and innocent to see it, but it was there. The punks existed in our schools. They were just as violent towards teachers as today's punks. Only difference is they didn't carry guns. And, back then, they were kicked out of school -- while education was free, it was more of a privilege than a right back then.

Personally, I'm grateful whistling has gone to the wayside. To me, it is noise pollution.

The main difference back then is that everyone was truly more innocent. Kids were still molested, killed, kidnapped. Women were raped and beaten. Beat cops were known for swinging their batons both on the street and in the station. It all happened, we just didn't know about it. There was no way to know. Newspapers carried little international, national news -- just the most important events. The paper was much like the Daily Sun -- feel good rags. Television was just beginning to make a dent. So, radio was the big news carrier and it rarely cared about social issues -- that took Vietnam, civil rights and women's lib to bring those items into the forefront. Today, thanks to Amber Alerts, we know a child is missing minutes after it occurs. Thanks to the internet, we know when a victim is beaten or murdered by a cop. We know who has slept with whom, when, how many and sometimes even what positions they used. Everything is out there. But the events happened in the fifties just as they do today. Father Knows Best, I Love Lucy, Leave it to Beaver were lovely fantasies but had little to do with reality unless you were a child.
Redwitch: When I started this thread I acknowledged that the 1950's had its share of problems . It is also apparent that a person's recollection of the 1950's is unique to each.

"Girls like boys." Boys like sex" is a theme that runs back to the beginning of time. what I recall about those days is a predominate "kiss and don't tell code. what I recall is how when a guy pulled a dirty trick on a girl or soiled her name he was admonished by all. What I recall was that indeed the chase was long and arduous and many a girl responded with but you won't respect me in the morning. I began dating my wife as a freshman in high school. We made a commitment to celibacy not because we were catholic but because we did not want it to interfere and confuse our feelings for one another. we sat on her porch many a night and planned out our marital lives . We honored our commitment

We were to my knowledge absent of drugs in our high school. As a 17 year old in the navy was aware of the availability of drugs: to wit one guy from NYC lay in his bunk nightly injecting himself with heroin. Not to my liking. Was married in the service returned home worked went to college nights and so we missed the late 1960's-70's dropping out .........

But all of this discussion misses the intent of the thread. its not only fond memories of years passed its ignoring the ugliness of today's world.

why is it today, an entire movie is shot around one pornographic scene? I miss seeing a man and woman become engaged on a beach and then a break away to waves washing ashore on the beach. Voyeurism was never my strong suite. I deplore the drug cultural because I witnessed what devastating
affect it has on people.................

Personal Best Regards:

John_W 09-24-2017 05:27 PM
Actually I preferred the 1970's. It seemed everything just fell to me without really trying. Today you pretty much need a college degree to get interviewed for any decent job, much less get hired. In the 1970's I was on my own after 1968 and everything I touched seemed to work out and go in my favor.

Carl in Tampa 09-24-2017 05:40 PM
I agree.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon (Post 1452711)
Redwitch: When I started this thread I acknowledged that the 1950's had its share of problems . It is also apparent that a person's recollection of the 1950's is unique to each.

"Girls like boys." Boys like sex" is a theme that runs back to the beginning of time. what I recall about those days is a predominate "kiss and don't tell code. what I recall is how when a guy pulled a dirty trick on a girl or soiled her name he was admonished by all. What I recall was that indeed the chase was long and arduous and many a girl responded with but you won't respect me in the morning. I began dating my wife as a freshman in high school. We made a commitment to celibacy not because we were catholic but because we did not want it to interfere and confuse our feelings for one another. we sat on her porch many a night and planned out our marital lives . We honored our commitment

We were to my knowledge absent of drugs in our high school. As a 17 year old in the navy was aware of the availability of drugs: to wit one guy from NYC lay in his bunk nightly injecting himself with heroin. Not to my liking. Was married in the service returned home worked went to college nights and so we missed the late 1960's-70's dropping out .........

But all of this discussion misses the intent of the thread. its not only fond memories of years passed its ignoring the ugliness of today's world.

why is it today, an entire movie is shot around one pornographic scene? I miss seeing a man and woman become engaged on a beach and then a break away to waves washing ashore on the beach. Voyeurism was never my strong suite. I deplore the drug cultural because I witnessed what devastating
affect it has on people.................

Personal Best Regards:
:agree:

I had similar experiences.

On another subject, there was no overt homosexuality at school, although two of my closest friends were in fact homosexuals. One of them continues to be a good friend with whom I am in frequent contact to the present.

Our political differences are so severe that we do not debate them. Our friendship survives.

Fredster 09-24-2017 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fredman (Post 1452255)
In the 50’s we were taught respect and the value of hard work. We weren’t entitled and we didn’t get participation trophy’s.
:BigApplause:
All kids, that got this guidance tended to do well in life!

villagerjack 09-24-2017 07:29 PM
[QUOTE=redwitch;1451587]I remember the fifties a lot differently -- it was a time of great fear because of the A-bomb. Women rarely worked outside of the home and, if they did, it was usually in a subservient role. Even professional women were pushed into the lesser roles (attorneys for estate planning, trusts, family law; physicians were ob-gyns) most of the time. It was okay for a male to have pre-marital sex and extra-curricular marital affairs were to be bragged about. A female was shamed. Minorities were kept in their place, separate but equal was the way of life, lynchings were common. It was acceptable to beat your wife so long as the stick was no bigger than the width of your thumb. Not only could parents spank their children, so could your neighbor or the principal and some of those spankings were flat out beatings. Sexual abuse was common and the girl was nearly always at fault, even if only ten. Miscegenation was a crime. So was homosexuality. And so on and so forth. The fifties were a time of violence, fear, cruelty and bigotry.

A lot of the values such as hard work, honesty, respect, trust are still prevalent today. Yes, the language is rougher today, chivalry towards females is gone, some of the niceties have disappeared. Even so, I'll take today's world. It's a lot more honest and, in many ways, kinder.[/QUOTE

Where the heck did you live?

xNYer 09-24-2017 08:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452730)
:agree:

On another subject, there was no overt homosexuality at school, although two of my closest friends were in fact homosexuals.

.
Does no overt homosexuality mean they had to hide who they were for fear of being ridiculed or ostracized? Is that a positive characteristic of the 1950's?

Taltarzac725 09-24-2017 09:40 PM
Crime Victims had Very Few Rights in the Justice System and Elsewhere.
 
There was not much in the way of crime victim rights in the 1950s and from my readings religious organizations seemed to be the only ones really offering some kind of support system for them and sometimes these would be within organizations that had people creating more victims. The Catholic Church for instance.

The History of Crime Victims' Rights In America - Maryland Crime Victims Resource Center

Responsibility, Rehabilitation, and Restoration: A Catholic Perspective on Crime and Criminal Justice

Carl in Tampa 09-24-2017 09:48 PM
Don't be silly........try.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by xNYer (Post 1452803)
Does no overt homosexuality mean they had to hide who they were for fear of being ridiculed or ostracized? Is that a positive characteristic of the 1950's?
Well, try not to stumble over being ridiculous. No one said it was a positive feature of the 1950s. :ohdear:

The positive feature is that we were, and are, friends to this day. :coolsmiley:

Taltarzac725 09-24-2017 09:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 1452824)
Well, try not to stumble over being ridiculous. No one said it was a positive feature of the 1950s. :ohdear:

The positive feature is that we were, and are, friends to this day. :coolsmiley:
I have met some really nice lesbian couples in the Villages and worked with gays in the San Francisco Bay area and also in the Twin Cities region in Minnesota. They just seem like ordinary people who are attracted sexually to members of the same sex. No big deal really unless you become the target of these advances. Then you find out what women deal with every day from some men.

HimandMe 09-25-2017 08:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon (Post 1452711)
Redwitch: When I started this thread I acknowledged that the 1950's had its share of problems . It is also apparent that a person's recollection of the 1950's is unique to each.

"Girls like boys." Boys like sex" is a theme that runs back to the beginning of time. what I recall about those days is a predominate "kiss and don't tell code. what I recall is how when a guy pulled a dirty trick on a girl or soiled her name he was admonished by all. What I recall was that indeed the chase was long and arduous and many a girl responded with but you won't respect me in the morning. I began dating my wife as a freshman in high school. We made a commitment to celibacy not because we were catholic but because we did not want it to interfere and confuse our feelings for one another. we sat on her porch many a night and planned out our marital lives . We honored our commitment

We were to my knowledge absent of drugs in our high school. As a 17 year old in the navy was aware of the availability of drugs: to wit one guy from NYC lay in his bunk nightly injecting himself with heroin. Not to my liking. Was married in the service returned home worked went to college nights and so we missed the late 1960's-70's dropping out .........

But all of this discussion misses the intent of the thread. its not only fond memories of years passed its ignoring the ugliness of today's world.

why is it today, an entire movie is shot around one pornographic scene? I miss seeing a man and woman become engaged on a beach and then a break away to waves washing ashore on the beach. Voyeurism was never my strong suite. I deplore the drug cultural because I witnessed what devastating
affect it has on people.................

Personal Best Regards:
Re your last paragraph,

I think it is romance we are missing in many movies, replaced by instant attraction and lust. Romance is about love, longing, holding onto every beloveds word, slowing getting to know one another. Yes, it may be love s trance, but Wonderful. In the 50s, we would spend hours on the phone, walk miles, linger with the memory of a touch on the cheek. It's still alive of course but lessened, especially in the media. I'd hate it if my kids missed knowing the beauty of romance.

rubicon 09-25-2017 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HimandMe (Post 1452988)
Re your last paragraph,

I think it is romance we are missing in many movies, replaced by instant attraction and lust. Romance is about love, longing, holding onto every beloveds word, slowing getting to know one another. Yes, it may be love s trance, but Wonderful. In the 50s, we would spend hours on the phone, walk miles, linger with the memory of a touch on the cheek. It's still alive of course but lessened, especially in the media. I'd hate it if my kids missed knowing the beauty of romance.
Himand Me

I have often had this conversation with my wife. We comment on how sad it is that the movie industry long ago lost its ability to convey a true romance story

Look at today's versions and courtships are nonexistent because well its a hook up one nighter and they portray it as so kool. Kids have sex today as if it were like shaking hands. What effect to you believe this practice has on a person's long term emotional state? On relationships?

My mother admonished her boys to never swear in front of ladies. Listen to today's females and they put most men to shame. to this day I refrain from swearing (period) If someone or something disturbs me the word might enter my brain but it will never leave my lips:D

Personal Best Regards:

drstevens 09-25-2017 03:04 PM
I agree with the premise: "I Miss 1950's Traditional Values" We had the best music, the best movies, the best comedians, the best entertainers, the best schools, and the best culture! I grew up in the slums of Chicago, as an orphan, and I wouldn't trade those years for any other. I lived in the best of times. Amen!

manaboutown 09-25-2017 03:12 PM
I certainly felt safe (and was) as a child during the '50's, riding my bike all over town. Few communities offer that degree of safety anymore.

Fredster 09-25-2017 03:57 PM
I attended grammar school and high school in the 50's,
and when I look back I only knew one kid who's parents were divorced.
His name was Butch and on one hand I envied him, because he seemed to be able
to do whatever he wanted (his mom worked)
but I also felt sorry for him because it seemed
that most of the time the neighborhood streets were his home!
I guess my point is that divorce and disolution of the family unit were not as common as today!
Good parenting by both parents is really important...IMHO!
Just sharing my personal experience!

Aloha1 09-25-2017 04:06 PM
I recall waking up the morning after the 1956 Presidential Election and feeling all was right with the world because Ike had won. I grew up in Detroit and my best friend until age 6 was black. I slept over at his house and he at mine. Never thought twice about it. Getting a cowboy outfit and a cap shooting "six gun" was the BEST gift ever. Staying out late in the summer playing Cowboys and Indians, switching sides frequently without a politically correct thought in our heads. Drive in movies; my Mom taking us to see Imitation of Life in 1959 - a story about prejudice she thought was important for us to see. My Dad, a Teamster Cartage owner( truck driver) hiring the first colored man at his shop and being shunned by his "Union". I was taught nobody owed me anything and that my success in life was solely dependent on me. Were the 50's perfect? Of course not but they were a time when we were brought up with values and respect for others. Some things sadly lacking today and the lack of which is a root cause of the discord we see now. And heck, who could not like the 50's "music of love" where there were actually words you could understand and a theme unlike today. Do I miss the 50's? Sure, but I love the 2010's tech that has raised the standard of living for all Americans. If we can only realize that our social programs have done more harm than good, the 2020's could be the next 50's.

Miles42 09-25-2017 10:36 PM
Values are passed down, some parents missed the boat

rubicon 09-26-2017 05:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miles42 (Post 1453448)
Values are passed down, some parents missed the boat
Once I would have agreed with you but so much is going against "good parents" in today's world. Kids are not only facing peer pressure but today they have more exposure to drugs, etc.

Also consider the affect that teachers once had on students as authority figures. they once were the pillars of a community. Not today and what I am referencing is the reason school choice is such a serious issue with parents.

I went to a catholic grammar school and we all know about the Mother Superior stories. In 6th grade I fell in the playground. It resulted in a deep cut on my arm. I still carry the scar.

I was treated by the nurse and returned to the classroom. I had my sleeves rolled up. Mother Superior hardly glanced up and said OK warrior you can roll down your sleeves now. Teaching humility. Humility is a very attractive quality

redwitch 09-26-2017 06:27 AM
What seems to be missing the most today, to me, is pride. Pride in yourself, your accomplishments, your community... Every kid gets a trophy or ribbon, no matter how bad the performance was. Performers get standing O's even if they fall down on stage, hit sour notes, miss the beat, obviously forget a line. How do you feel pride for a job well done when you get praise for a job poorly done? Right along with that is there's little shame. You do something criminal, you get a slap on the wrist. Athletes, entertainers, politicians say and do things that are not just they're downright evil at times. They still get the accolades, the money, the hero worship. Our grands see this on a daily basis. Without pride and shame, a lot of self is lost. Ethics fall to the wayside. Honor gradually becomes none existent. That is what I truly miss from the fifties and I feel is where kids of today are sorely cheated.

rubicon 09-26-2017 06:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwitch (Post 1453493)
What seems to be missing the most today, to me, is pride. Pride in yourself, your accomplishments, your community... Every kid gets a trophy or ribbon, no matter how bad the performance was. Performers get standing O's even if they fall down on stage, hit sour notes, miss the beat, obviously forget a line. How do you feel pride for a job well done when you get praise for a job poorly done? Right along with that is there's little shame. You do something criminal, you get a slap on the wrist. Athletes, entertainers, politicians say and do things that are not just they're downright evil at times. They still get the accolades, the money, the hero worship. Our grands see this on a daily basis. Without pride and shame, a lot of self is lost. Ethics fall to the wayside. Honor gradually becomes none existent. That is what I truly miss from the fifties and I feel is where kids of today are sorely cheated.
Kids for so long had no track to run on. too many helicopter parents. too many teachers pushing the social warrior agenda rather than the cold hard facts taught to us by history, the classics, etc

Heroes today do not exist they are all anti-hero Bad is good and good is laughed at. Only a nerd doesn't do drugs. only a nerd believes in being responsible as to the issue of sexual relations. Hollywood's message is very damaging to our society . secularism is kool religion for the naive .

I submit that if people did nothing else but follow the tenets of the 10 Commandments we would have a better nation. and yet here we are with people demanding these intelligent rules be moved from public institutions

Personal Best Regards:

Byte1 09-28-2017 10:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon (Post 1451537)
Sometime we just need a break from today's political climate and I one way is to tune in old movies .

I watched Jennifer Jones in "Good Morning Miss Dove" It presented an idyllic America. I recognize that the 1950's had its problems but this movie represented pretty much the America I remember.

Miss Dove, an elementary teacher made demands on her students both stoic and scholastic and she reciprocated by taking a personal interest in each of her students.

Traditional values were apparent had work, self discipline, self respect, respect for authority, respect for others , calculated reticence , honor.

Personal Best Regards:
Good post, friend. I was young in the 50's, and maybe that is why I did not notice any hardship. It seems like there was so much anger during the 60's and now it's like it is flaring up again in the past few years.


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