Climate change is real. Catastrophic man made climate change is a fraud. CO2 is not a pollutant just because it has the word "carbon" in it.

Dear Posters: If you care to notice the hateful rant by the OP whether real or not set the cadence for this thread and it isn't pretty. Why would any intelligent thinking person try to respond to that nonsense. I feel compelled to apology to my liberal breathren

I am a Republican conservative, my mother and father were liberal Democrats as were most of my family and friends. We hotly debated economic social and foreign issues but we did so with the understanding that we support our position with facts and not feelings. We remain family and friends when the debate was over

For the fourth time this forum was opened on a trial basis and if posters want it to remain so they need to explain to posters like the OP that they need to take care to address issues with fairness and respect.

I do not agree with OP. I see an important role for liberals and conservative alike and a little of each is a good thing. Its when either side gets too righteous that they fail. In other words it is a good thing to envision a better world but it takes pragmatic thinking to get there.

I did not enjoy and felt very uncomfortable about what was said on many of these posts and certainly they added nothing of a positive nature to the discussion

I think you may have said before that you were a Republican Conservative...and I said I was...........................?

Well said and thank you.

Where's the hate? Why don't you quote the exact hateful statement you disagree with? You can't, because there's no hate, just someone's OPINION that differs from yours.

Liberals do want to be taken care of; that's why they pass all sorts of cradle to grave socialist entitlement programs. Notice how most European countries are struggling under the massive weight of all their programs.

Liberals fear risking their capital; that's why they prefer pensions to self-guided retirement programs, and want expanded social security, etc… Tax and spend - except it's confiscate from others and spend largely on themselves in the form of more entitlements.

Liberals envy the successful; that's why Wall St. is the go-to boogie man as well as big corporations and the 1% earners. Success is demonized and portrayed as "unfair". Life is zero-sum in their minds; if someone is successful (ex. Bill Gates) then the liberal mantra is that he "got ahead" by taking from others, or disproportionately receiving too large a share of the nation's bounty. There's NEVER a mention that he legitimately and legally EARNED his wealth! (cue the big idiot and his socialist line, "You didn't build your business!…GOVERNMENT built your business!!"

Truer words were never spoken on this entire forum.

I love to debate political topics but I have not come into this political forum much at all because of this "guest" screen name on everyone.

It's like giving people with no argument a case of spray paint and a 100-foot wall, letting them spray venomous graffiti and then run away like cowards, so they don't have to hear some facts and truth spoken to their closed-minded fantasy world of leftism.

Since there is no ability to Edit my post quoted above, I'm adding here to my post the words "and rightism".

I was ready to rant. - until you added this. :boxing2::boxing2:

This is NOT working for me.
 

It just isn't the same. This isn't debate. It is preaching and ranting and defending and being annoyed.

I do NOT like the way this political forum is set up. It makes it easier for the moderators but it isn't a forum.

For some it is punch and run.

For others it is a fine lecture.

I think Guest is wrong....and right.

What I find troubling is that when the word "liberal" is used the response reaches the level of the "McCarthy Era"..everyone who disagrees with me is a Communist. You have to be from the "silent generation" to remember that golden era of American politics.
Let us revisit "John 8:7"

Well IMO until China, Mexico, India, get in to the 20th Cenntury no matter what the rest of the world does it will make no difference. ESPECIALLY CHINA.

I disagree socialist liberalism started with Woodral Wilson.

Politics and your political beliefs permeate all aspects of our lives. Don't believe me? Even "man-made climate change" is a left/right issue. We all agree pollution is bad and we should try to reduce it. Here's where the left takes a sharp turn down their familiar path of tax and spend. This time, they want to tax the CO2 producers and spend it on….god knows what?

This is simply another thinly disguised job-killing, economy-slowing TAX. Why does the left want to further slow the slowest recovery in history? These foolish policies choke the economic engine just as closing a damper on an old wood-burning stove.

Yeah, that darned science!

no one has ever taken care of me, yet I consider myself more liberal than ultra conservative. Also, I have always worked, at least from 17 - 65, and have never relied on anyone other than myself. Have risked my own money, not yours and now am able to live in The Villages as your neighbor. But I also have never begrudged a helping hand, via my tax dollars, to children who are born to those who may or may not be the entitled type you described. Many children were not aborted by those who couldn't care for them but bought into the ultra conservative idea of sin....are those children part of your idea of the entitled? I also don't have a problem with providing a helping hand to those who were hit with downsizing when they reached an age that is not seen as an employable asset on the same level they had been, and having spent their lifesavings, going for interview after interview while working at walmart, perhaps having lost their home in forclosure, or perhaps having emptied out their lifesavings due to some catastrophic life-threatening event of themself or spouse or child or grandchild. My husband and I, having come from professional fields, have paid our fair, honest share of taxes over the years and while I resent anyone milking the system re disabilities, neither of us begrudge helping anyone truely in need. We personally know four on disability and everyone of them refers to our president as Obummer, and talks about liberals they way you just did. Only one is truely in need while the other three have learned how to play the system...they are no liberals. Your portrait of "liberals" seems ignorant (meaning uneducated not stupid), perhaps you might want to withdraw your stereotyping brush while you educated yourself.

You speak eloquently for many! . :big bow:

If right wingers are a 1, and left wingers are 10, I am a 6, which naturally makes a libtard according to the ones. I too was a professional and an executive in my working days. Thank God I never had to accept any charity or direct government assistance, and paid, and still pay, a lot of income tax, which I have always considered a privilege for enjoying life in this great country. I wore the uniform of the U.S. Army and lost my best friend in Vietnam. I love my country, and would not want to live anywhere else, but also believe my country and its leaders are far from perfect and many other countries do certain things better than we do in education and medical care for example. I hate the devisiveness in our politics, and the way it divides our people. I too am happy that my tax dollars can be used in ways that help people who haven't had the advantages, opportunity, and good fortune that I have enjoyed. I believe in capitalism and have no envy of people making their fortune so long as they do it honestly and ethically. I think that the level of inequality has gotten out of hand however, and that those who have been smart and lucky enough to make fortunes should be more willing to recognize the employees who do the work to help make their fortunes with higher wages and better benefits. I believe in unions, though I never belonged to one, but realize that some of them have abused their power and cheated the rank and file. I believe in them because they were instrumental in raising the American middle class, including some in my family, to the greatest standard of living in the world during the post ww2 era. I fear the middle class is becoming increasingly smaller and not because they are rising out of it, but because many are falling out the other end. It is heartening to me to see the minimum wage being raised in many states and WalMarts announcement of across the board increases is good though long overdue. I believe that race relations have come a long way since the embarrassing conditions of my youth, and I think that most of the advances were because of the efforts of brave liberals many in the face of violent retribution. However, the black community still is discriminated against in many places and in more subtle ways. The Black community deserves some of the blame for the failure to raise their status, but we the majority need to be willing to help those willing to work to raise themselves and their families above systematic poverty. A hopeful and secure person seldom turns to crime, white, black, or other. I suppose some will pick this post apart and attack it, and that's okay by me, it won't affect me or my ideals, it is, after all, a free country(for the most part).

It is post like yours like make me believe there is hope for the people in The Villages! A big THANK YOU!!

Half of the oil from Iraq goes to China. The advantage to China is they deal with any country regardless of race, religion, or national creed. I think China is in the 21st century.

Have you looked at the labels in almost all clothing, electronics, automobile parts, shoes, sneakers, luggage or just about ANYTHING used in everyday life, including now many foods we buy at the store.

If what is stated is considered China's advantage.....because of the reality of the USA dealing with ANY COUNTRY ON THE PLANET......your inference can only be that China is merely catching up to the USA.

I suppose it is possible your inference is not a swipe meaning the USA does not deal with any country, etc.

The USA deals with other countries of course. However if you look at deals for access to resources on a global basis China overlooks the issue of political or religious affiliation of a nation when making a deal. A country with the largest population in the world and a one party political system has to do whatever necessary to sustain and improve it's standard of living.
Look back sixty years when China was virtually a third world country. Look at China today. We ship capital to China to make stuff and they use the $$$ to grow their economy. Stuff needs resources to make. You go to other countries and buy those resources. We had a war in Iraq that cost us billions of $$ and thousands of lives and China walks in and gets 50% of the oil output of the country without "boots on the ground".
I'm proud to be an American. You still have to be aware of what is happening in the world around you.