[Tvflguy]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

What facts do the pro EV people have? Even the OP stated they only had 25-mile range on their older electric cart. I also like the idea of quiet/no fumes electric carts, BUT.....they are not ready for prime time in a place as large as TV. When they have a reliable 80-mile range and no degradation for 10 years, I'm in. But anyone claiming that we are at that point now is delusional.

OMG, now we’re “delusional”? Why does an average cart driver need 80 miles? As we said even 50 is great. Plug it in for a few hours and Bam, a full tank. I guess that’s what we get for trying to be helpful and post our experience with our new lithium cart. And NOW you state to provide facts??? OMG. And if you’d take the time to read my initial post, I stated our previous cart was Battery, not lithium.

[biker1]

People often fear what they don’t understand. I believe all of the contemporary lithium-ion battery packs being used in golf carts have an LFP chemistry. A reasonable assumption would be about 2% degradation per year or about 20% in 10 years although the rate can be non linear and also depends on the actual number of charge cycles. Our electric has about a 60 mile range so 20% degradation in 10 years would be fine. In 10 years, the furthest we have ever traveled in 1 day in either our electric cart or our gas cart is 30 miles. We will replace the gas cart with another electric in a couple of years as it is getting a bit long in the tooth.

Originally Posted by phylt

yikes, the nay-sayers here. Just like the anti-Tesla folks.... What facts do you have to state this? And as I said before, we'd be very happy with 50 mile range... Next guy will say..."you'll need to pay $4,000 for a new battery in 4 years", or the so-unproven "It will catch on fire..."

What WE love is the smooth, quiet, and no-smell. BTW we are NOT "green-obsessed", just the opposite actually.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Tvflguy

OMG, now we’re “delusional”? Why does an average cart driver need 80 miles? As we said even 50 is great. Plug it in for a few hours and Bam, a full tank. I guess that’s what we get for trying to be helpful and post our experience with our new lithium cart. And NOW you state to provide facts??? OMG. And if you’d take the time to read my initial post, I stated our previous cart was Battery, not lithium.

If you state that you expect a 50-mile range and may lose range as the battery ages and eventually will need to be replaced in 5-7 years, fine, YOU are NOT delusional

If someone ELSE states that they get 90-mile range, no degradation with an aging battery, and no need to replace until 10+ years, they ARE delusional. I think we'll eventually get there, but it is NOT today

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by biker1

People often fear what they don’t understand. I believe all of the contemporary lithium-ion battery packs being used in golf carts have an LFP chemistry. A reasonable assumption would be about 2% degradation per year or about 20% in 10 years although the rate can be non linear and also depends on the actual number of charge cycles. Our electric has about a 60 mile range so 20% degradation in 10 years would be fine. In 10 years, the furthest we have ever traveled in 1 day in either our electric cart or our gas cart is 30 miles. We will replace the gas cart with another electric in a couple of years as it is getting a bit long in the tooth.

And I'd like to replace my 10-year-old gas cart with electric as well. But I would prefer an 80-mile range, and more than an "assumption" that the battery only degrades 2%/year.

[phylt]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

If you state that you expect a 50-mile range and may lose range as the battery ages and eventually will need to be replaced in 5-7 years, fine, YOU are NOT delusional

If someone ELSE states that they get 90-mile range, no degradation with an aging battery, and no need to replace until 10+ years, they ARE delusional. I think we'll eventually get there, but it is NOT today

Oh thanks for the not-delusional remark. Some folks here can be "my views are Correct, and nothing you say will change that". I'm simply providing information regarding US and our experience. But as usual here, it leaves one open for bashing and name-calling. So be it....

[biker1]

Degradation is a function of time, the number of recharge cycles, and whether you abuse the battery. Without knowing how many miles are actually going to be put on a cart it is hard to be more precise than my approximate 2% number. It could be more but could be less. Based on actual usage you can get a more tailored estimate with a minimal amount of effort. 3000-5000 full recharge cycles is often referenced. This would correspond to over 200k miles. The current sweet spot seems to be 160 to 210 amp-hours. This seems to satisfy the range requirements of most buyers. In the event the battery goes prematurely south in 10 years then you can replace it for less than it cost now since prices of lithium-ion batteries will likely continue to decrease.

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

And I'd like to replace my 10-year-old gas cart with electric as well. But I would prefer an 80-mile range, and more than an "assumption" that the battery only degrades 2%/year.

[Vermilion Villager]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

What facts do the pro EV people have? Even the OP stated they only had 25-mile range on their older electric cart. I also like the idea of quiet/no fumes electric carts, BUT.....they are not ready for prime time in a place as large as TV. When they have a reliable 80-mile range and no degradation for 10 years, I'm in. But anyone claiming that we are at that point now is delusional.

The OP who got 25 miles range had a 48v battery powered cart. Technically they're both electric vehicles but I think the term "EV" is now more reserved for vehicles that have lithium ion batteries. Most of them now have 200Ah batteries. I've had mine since 2021 and get a steady 70 to 75 miles per charge. I know of a few individuals who purchased lithium powered golf carts way back in 2016 and they are still getting the same range as when new… So your tenure benchmark is coming up real soon.....then what are you going to do????

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Vermilion Villager

The OP who got 25 miles range had a 48v battery powered cart. Technically they're both electric vehicles but I think the term "EV" is now more reserved for vehicles that have lithium ion batteries. Most of them now have 200Ah batteries. I've had mine since 2021 and get a steady 70 to 75 miles per charge. I know of a few individuals who purchased lithium powered golf carts way back in 2016 and they are still getting the same range as when new… So your tenure benchmark is coming up real soon.....then what are you going to do????

Happy to buy electric when it meets that benchmark

[Vermilion Villager]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

If you state that you expect a 50-mile range and may lose range as the battery ages and eventually will need to be replaced in 5-7 years, fine, YOU are NOT delusional

If someone ELSE states that they get 90-mile range, no degradation with an aging battery, and no need to replace until 10+ years, they ARE delusional. I think we'll eventually get there, but it is NOT today

I find it entertaining that a person who doesn't even have one of these weighs in with so many posts.....on one of these!
However, I also see you have over 12,000 posts and I'm wondering is the measurement of success come in the form of posting information useful to others based on your factual experience, or is it more driven by the post count?

[MikeVillages]

Isn't Village Yamaha a non yamaha dealer and can only sale used Yamahas? Anyway, do your own research. Many of us have seen videos of the blowtorch type flames coming out of lithium battery automobiles. Most people like to think they got the best xyz. I’m concert about charging in a hot TV garage.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Vermilion Villager

I find it entertaining that a person who doesn't even have one of these weighs in with so many posts.....on one of these!
However, I also see you have over 12,000 posts and I'm wondering is the measurement of success come in the form of posting information useful to others based on your factual experience, or is it more driven by the post count?

No idea what you are talking about. What is a "post count"???

And, no, I don't own an EV....yet. But I will when it is ready for prime time. Meanwhile, my knowledge about EV's, their range and battery life comes from posts by people who DO own them.

[Vermilion Villager]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

No idea what you are talking about. What is a "post count"???

And, no, I don't own an EV....yet. But I will when it is ready for prime time. Meanwhile, my knowledge about EV's, their range and battery life comes from posts by people who DO own them.

With all due respect… Almost all of your posts concerning EV's are negative. It doesn't involve much of a forum search to realize that 99%+ of the people who own EV's post positive comments about them.
As I said before EV's are not lead acid battery powered. They are lithium powered.
I watch this forum daily so I also see whats posted. I challenge you to find me five posts in the thousands of posts, where is somebody who actually owns a lithium ion battery powered golf cart posted something negative about it.......

[Vermilion Villager]

Originally Posted by MikeVillages

Isn't Village Yamaha a non yamaha dealer and can only sale used Yamahas? Anyway, do your own research. Many of us have seen videos of the blowtorch type flames coming out of lithium battery automobiles. Most people like to think they got the best xyz. I’m concert about charging in a hot TV garage.

I think you are correct on Village Yamaha…
I was reading an article about lithium battery fires and it appears a majority of them are caused by people purchasing lower quality battery chargers. The good ones are very expensive. However, the high-end battery chargers have all the safety features the prevent the overcharging and over heating the battery which could lead to a fire.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Vermilion Villager

With all due respect… Almost all of your posts concerning EV's are negative. It doesn't involve much of a forum search to realize that 99%+ of the people who own EV's post positive comments about them.
As I said before EV's are not lead acid battery powered. They are lithium powered.
I watch this forum daily so I also see whats posted. I challenge you to find me five posts in the thousands of posts, where is somebody who actually owns a lithium ion battery powered golf cart posted something negative about it.......

You do realize, as psychiatrists will tell you, that human nature is almost always unwilling to admit that ANY purchase was a mistake---hence a skewed population of posts.

The only two reasons that my EV posts have been negative (so far) are:

1) They are not ready for prime time --both carts and EVs. Of the two, carts are much closer, and lithium ion for those that will use it less than 25-30 miles/day has arrived. Personally I want more range. EVs have a much longer way to go---I want at least a 500 mile range and would prefer 800

2) There is a subset of EV proponents who out of politeness I will only call uninformed and gullible who have been brainwashed into believing that they are saving the planet by not burning fossil fuels. They give a bad name to those who prefer EVs for the quiet and lack of fumes.

[BrianL99]

I keep hearing this 80-90 mile range for Lithium Golf Carts ... nonsense.

I have a Star EV, 210 Amp.

I had a Star EV 120 Amp as a loaner for a week.

Your battery gauge is non-linear folks. Just because you get 35 miles and your gauge says 50%, don't count on it.

The 120 Amp I had, showed 1/2 charge at 18 miles. It really had about 3 miles left or 1 mile less than I needed.

Carts in The Villages are driven "pedal to the metal", almost all the time. If you don't believe that, go drive around in your cart at 17 mph and see if anyone stays behind you for more than 2 minutes.

As others have said, the general degradation of Lithium depends on a lot of factors and they don't seem enough have been in use, long enough to actually quantify what's really going to happen.

In the meantime, I wouldn't gamble on that 80-90 mile range. If I get 45-50 out my 210 AMP, I figure I'm doing ok.