[frank1975]

With indy racing coming in oct 24th this should be good. I was planning on being there. Not sure now.

[Scorpyo]

Actually I’m in favor of this. Up to now all we’ve had is a bunch of people who were all talk and no action. They made it seem like the majority of police were brutal hate mongers. They talked about defunding police. They claimed social workers could do the job of police in many instances. Well, up to that point it was nothing but talking points which were supported by a media that sensationalized isolated instances of the rare bad cop using excessive force. I think anyone with a brain would ascertain that this direction, if it was actually employed, would be disastrous. It would show that there really is no alternative to police protection. Sure additional training could not hurt but defunding would be a death sentence for many. As I said, I’m in favor of it. That’s why I’m confident it will never really be fully implemented. The media may show a single picture of one tiny social worker confronting a crazed drug addict but they won’t show the picture of SWAT standing 2 feet behind the social worker.

[newgirl]

I disagree !!! Totally disagree and if this happens it will take a bit but in the long run our country will be safer in areas that they do send the right professional for the job.
Would you want a cop to do surgery on you? Then why do you expect them to correctly do other jobs that they were not trained to handle?

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by allsport

Nurses have handled these situations for decades without fire power. Violent people cause violence and the police have escalated situations for years. Rarely in the ED did we need to call police and we had most of those situations present on a regular basis. Call when you need help.

Most social workers are women and the most active time for 911 calls is midnight. Sending a women to a private home late at night to handle a 911 situation is entirely different from handling a difficult situation in a hospital emergency room. Apples and oranges.

[dewilson58]

The response time will probably be significantly delayed. The party could be over by the time someone responds.


Let the experiment begin.

[nn0wheremann]

Originally Posted by John41

“Crazy as hell” is what a St. Petersburg, Florida resident called the mayor’s plan to replace 25 police with 25 social workers. Beginning October 1 unarmed social workers will be responding to the following “non violent” 911 calls instead of the police.

Disorderly intoxication
Intoxication
Mental health crisis
Drug overdose
Disorderly juvenile
Homeless complaint
Panhandling
Neighborhood dispute

We sometimes visited attractions in the St Pete area. No more.

Hell’s Belles, most police work is social work. If the responding official has the the skills, training and temperament to handle these calls without further entangling the criminal justice system, so much the better. Gives more time for police to handle police business, like the pickpockets, muggers, and thieves that prey upon visitors. Gives the courts more time to handle criminal business, and it saves taxpayer dollars.

[sallybowron]

Actually, with the stories we are hearing about police lately, this may be a good idea. We can't expect our police officers to do it all. Since these are more mental and emotional crimes, a social worker would be good. When I treated people with cancer they had several of the aforementioned situations. We had them meet with social workers and many of those situations were solved. Can you see a policeman helping him criminal with ways to find housing, etc?

[Get real]

It's time for the American public to decide what we want from law enforcement. Warriors? Counselors? Guardians? Priests? Social workers? Magicians?
Do we want the cheapest cops possible? Or, do we want well-trained and well-screened cops who are equipped with every tool needed for every possible eventuality?
Or do we want the beat cop from grandaddy's hometown, with nothing but a smile, a wheelgun and one set of cuffs?
Really, we want it all. Admit it, we do – and we want it all without paying for any of it.
Every officer needs to be an empathetic, well-spoken, SEAL-trained ninja, with double majors in psychology and social work, who considers the job a calling, and has no bills to pay, no nerves to fray, and enforces the law completely objectively while also using discretion at all times, unless it's going to result in arresting – or not arresting – the wrong person at the wrong time, for the wrong thing, in the opinion of every member of the public.
If that person existed, he wouldn't work for you. So we've got to deal with what exists, and what exists are humans.
Humans are fallible, and their bodies are frail. Their brains play tricks on them when they're under stress, and then keep them from sleeping by replaying the stressor on an endless loop later, trying to find ways to "fix" whatever went wrong.
Humans come in varieties, not exactly like dog breeds, but close enough that the analogy works: If you need a bite dog, you don't start with a Golden Retriever. Possibly, you can teach the Golden to bite on command, if you're persistent enough, and mean enough, but in the process, you'll ruin everything that made him a Golden to begin with.
Now translate that back to people.
Warriors, soldiers and great war generals like Patton may live for the fight but they don't always play well with others after the battle. They can be harsh. They can use bad language in settings where you wish they were polite. They find humor in ugly, dark places that just frighten the rest of society. They're not always...nice.
If you want only a cuddly, soft, empathetic officer whose first response is always a soft answer and compassion, you can have that. She'll never embarrass her chief at Coffee with a Cop. He'll present well on camera every time and remind you of someone's grandfather. He'll be the perfect SRO until there's an active shooter at your kid's school.
Suddenly, society insists on the warrior.
They want the demon Malinois, 55 pounds of rawhide, spring steel and gator teeth, driving into the gunfire and doing anything it takes – anything – to keep the children safe.
And once the threat is gone, society wants the Malinois to morph back into the therapy dog. They want the warrior gone, the counselor returned, the off switch thrown.
That's not how it works.
And it's not fair.
I tell you now: the unicorn doesn't exist. You can't have it. What you can have is a human.
If you recruit well, conduct thorough background checks and train constantly, you can have a human with a kind heart and good ethics who is willing to fight hard, be uncomfortable and even get hurt for you.
You can have a human who tries. You can have someone who struggles, who sometimes fails, who gets better with time and experience and who has setbacks.
But you can't have perfection. In fact, you can break perfectly good humans by insisting they be something they can't be – things no one can be.
Decide now that as long as cops get recruited from the human race, they're going to be exactly human, with everything that means. The rest of society is also human, after all.
Maybe it's time we decide what we want from the rest of us, too.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by Choro&Swing

Do you know the saying, “To a hammer, every problem looks like a nail”? That’s the problem with having cops handle these problems, we are told. I understand that cops are often not properly trained to act as counselors for these problems. Drunk? Cuff them! Mental health crisis? Use the Taser! Drug overdose? Take them to jail!

Well, of course, that’s not really the way it is. In most instances, they do a better job and make the right decisions and save lives. So is a social worker ready to handle any of these problems when people turn violent? Are they armed? Will they have police backup? Will someone with schizophrenia off his meds understand that this is a “safe” social worker? Would you be willing to handle these problems unarmed on the street or in someone’s house without backup? I wouldn’t!

Maybe what will happen is that one cop and one social worker will start riding together. Cop for handling violence and providing protection, social worker for people who need help solving, say, a homeless crisis or a reference to a drug counselor. Then the social worker would have protection, and the cop could avoid making things worse. But of course, then the cop would have no armed backup unless more cops were called in.

(My dad was the head chaplain for the Denver Police Department and carried a Lieutenant’s shield. He would ride a shift with any cop who wanted to talk, day or night. He didn’t want to carry a gun, so they compromised on his always carrying an Ultra-Stinger flashlight that could blind suspects for a few seconds and crack any skull if swung properly. Maybe social workers would carry these flashlights.)

Perhaps instead, cops should be required to have solid college coursework in social welfare and counseling and thorough training in de-escalation techniques. It would help a LOT if they would learn to speak with a calm, relaxing voice instead of shouting at people to get on the ground. I know a lot of the people cops deal with are low-lifes who treat them badly. That shouldn’t be. The lack of respect shown to police officers is at the root of the problem of “racist” cops. They learn that from how they are treated. I can’t blame them. They aren’t superheroes. But the cycle of abuse has to start somewhere, and it’s easier to train a thousand cops to calm down and de-escalate than train a hundred thousand angry people who have been taught from childhood to hate cops.

Interesting post. Problem with one cop one social worker going to domestic disturbance.

Now the officers will separate the two and talk separately. Very often the call will turn violent. How will the social worker deal with the violence?

[Doro22]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Most social workers are women and the most active time for 911 calls is midnight. Sending a women to a private home late at night to handle a 911 situation is entirely different from handling a difficult situation in a hospital emergency room. Apples and oranges.

Right on. I was thinking the same thing

[karostay]

Originally Posted by John41

“Crazy as hell” is what a St. Petersburg, Florida resident called the mayor’s plan to replace 25 police with 25 social workers. Beginning October 1 unarmed social workers will be responding to the following “non violent” 911 calls instead of the police.

Disorderly intoxication
Intoxication
Mental health crisis
Drug overdose
Disorderly juvenile
Homeless complaint
Panhandling
Neighborhood dispute

We sometimes visited attractions in the St Pete area. No more.

For moment I thought you were describing the Villages

[chvlt57]

Originally Posted by mamamia54

It seems all the the things the social workers will be handling can go south pretty quick. I wonder how the social workers feel about it. I’m sure after the first call where one gets hurt or killed, they will rethink that ridiculous idea. To me, the whole idea of defunding and dismantling the police is ridiculous.

The negative results if these actions will never make it onto the main stream media!

[Holpat39]

Originally Posted by Get real

It's time for the American public to decide what we want from law enforcement. Warriors? Counselors? Guardians? Priests? Social workers? Magicians?
Do we want the cheapest cops possible? Or, do we want well-trained and well-screened cops who are equipped with every tool needed for every possible eventuality?
Or do we want the beat cop from grandaddy's hometown, with nothing but a smile, a wheelgun and one set of cuffs?
Really, we want it all. Admit it, we do – and we want it all without paying for any of it.
Every officer needs to be an empathetic, well-spoken, SEAL-trained ninja, with double majors in psychology and social work, who considers the job a calling, and has no bills to pay, no nerves to fray, and enforces the law completely objectively while also using discretion at all times, unless it's going to result in arresting – or not arresting – the wrong person at the wrong time, for the wrong thing, in the opinion of every member of the public.
If that person existed, he wouldn't work for you. So we've got to deal with what exists, and what exists are humans.
Humans are fallible, and their bodies are frail. Their brains play tricks on them when they're under stress, and then keep them from sleeping by replaying the stressor on an endless loop later, trying to find ways to "fix" whatever went wrong.
Humans come in varieties, not exactly like dog breeds, but close enough that the analogy works: If you need a bite dog, you don't start with a Golden Retriever. Possibly, you can teach the Golden to bite on command, if you're persistent enough, and mean enough, but in the process, you'll ruin everything that made him a Golden to begin with.
Now translate that back to people.
Warriors, soldiers and great war generals like Patton may live for the fight but they don't always play well with others after the battle. They can be harsh. They can use bad language in settings where you wish they were polite. They find humor in ugly, dark places that just frighten the rest of society. They're not always...nice.
If you want only a cuddly, soft, empathetic officer whose first response is always a soft answer and compassion, you can have that. She'll never embarrass her chief at Coffee with a Cop. He'll present well on camera every time and remind you of someone's grandfather. He'll be the perfect SRO until there's an active shooter at your kid's school.
Suddenly, society insists on the warrior.
They want the demon Malinois, 55 pounds of rawhide, spring steel and gator teeth, driving into the gunfire and doing anything it takes – anything – to keep the children safe.
And once the threat is gone, society wants the Malinois to morph back into the therapy dog. They want the warrior gone, the counselor returned, the off switch thrown.
That's not how it works.
And it's not fair.
I tell you now: the unicorn doesn't exist. You can't have it. What you can have is a human.
If you recruit well, conduct thorough background checks and train constantly, you can have a human with a kind heart and good ethics who is willing to fight hard, be uncomfortable and even get hurt for you.
You can have a human who tries. You can have someone who struggles, who sometimes fails, who gets better with time and experience and who has setbacks.
But you can't have perfection. In fact, you can break perfectly good humans by insisting they be something they can't be – things no one can be.
Decide now that as long as cops get recruited from the human race, they're going to be exactly human, with everything that means. The rest of society is also human, after all.
Maybe it's time we decide what we want from the rest of us, too.

Get Real posted one of the most intelligent responses every posted on this site.

[sloanst]

OK liberals. You wanted this. Time for you to step up and take point.

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by mamamia54

It seems all the the things the social workers will be handling can go south pretty quick. I wonder how the social workers feel about it. I’m sure after the first call where one gets hurt or killed, they will rethink that ridiculous idea. To me, the whole idea of defunding and dismantling the police is ridiculous.