[Mikeod]

Originally Posted by waynet

with the money the Morse family gets from us there is no valid reason for any of the golf courses being in bad shape. All I hear are empty excuses. People it's all about the money they put into these courses,plain and simple. Yes, I'm bummed out,Cane is my favorite layout,it's one of the reasons I bought a home in Duval. Hire people who know what they are doing,give them a reasonable budget, and get on with it.

The championship courses are self-sustaining, i.e, they exist on the revenue from greens fees, mostly. No amenity fee money is used.

Other than Orange Blossom, all the other courses are still under water restrictions limiting them to one day on fairways and two days on greens/tees and none on the rough. Yes, we've had some rain, but the ground got so hard from the dry winter/spring and all the cart traffic, that it is not penetrating well yet. It is not a coincidence that the courses doing best are those that are older with more mature turf.

Some of the brown areas of new sod are the result of treating aggressive weed infestations. The chemical used to destroy the weeds will result in temporary browning of the new sod. Give it time.



If you think about it, where would the benefit be for the developer to allow the courses to deteriorate for no reason. Would that not affect sales?

[waynet]

I was under the impression that each course had its own budget and greens fees were only part of the equation. I was also told that the reason Palmer is always in good shape is that its' budget is more that the others. I will also say that even if all the info in the above post is true Cane has been suffering for more that a year now and Mallory is not far behind.

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by nitehawk

I rest my case- Please pass the cool-aid

Okay, make that 4 out of 10 courses are in poor shape. Not good. As far as the mature turf argument, how about Havana? That course seems to be in good shape, and its much newer than Cane and Mallory. And the last time I played Cane, which was maybe 3 weeks ago, it was just loaded with weeds. Sorry, but that is just poor maintenance, plain and simple.

[ronat1]

Originally Posted by mickey100

How terrible. I think what might help if is people write or call the head of golf operations and let him know your dissatisfaction. That happened when Orange Blossom got really bad a couple of years ago, and enough people complained that they went and got a new maintenance company to take over. And the course has been so much better this past year as a result. Time to do that with Cane and Mallory. They both are just awful. I can't remember the man's name - it might be John something. Does anyone else know the name/phone number of the head of golf operations?

The Director of Country Club Operations is Ken Creely, the Asst. Director of Country Club Operations is Eric Greulach and the Golf Operations Manager is Todd Basso. Also the Head Groundskeeper at Cane Garden has been fired and rightfully so. The above three individuals should also take just as much of the responsibility and blame for the conditions because nothing is allowed to be done on the courses without their approval.

[Bogie Shooter]

Posting all your complaints on this site will accomplish nothing. Why not call the above individuals and discuss your "issues"??

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by ronat1

The Director of Country Club Operations is Ken Creely, the Asst. Director of Country Club Operations is Eric Greulach and the Golf Operations Manager is Todd Basso. Also the Head Groundskeeper at Cane Garden has been fired and rightfully so. The above three individuals should also take just as much of the responsibility and blame for the conditions because nothing is allowed to be done on the courses without their approval.

Todd Basso is the name I was looking for. I've spoken to him in the past, and he seems very honest, and concerned about the course conditions. Thanks Ronat1.

[Mikeod]

Originally Posted by mickey100

Okay, make that 4 out of 10 courses are in poor shape. Not good. As far as the mature turf argument, how about Havana? That course seems to be in good shape, and its much newer than Cane and Mallory. And the last time I played Cane, which was maybe 3 weeks ago, it was just loaded with weeds. Sorry, but that is just poor maintenance, plain and simple.

Can't comment about Cane. I haven't played it in a while. Not one of my favorite courses. There is a post that the maintenance company has been fired. The maintenance of all the courses is outsourced to several companies and they can be, and are, terminated for poor performance.

My point is that the courses have suffered through two winters of exceptionally cold weather followed by dry summers. Then we experienced a mild winter/spring this year with little rainfall. The mild season coupled with the increased play from seasonal residents, guests, and visitors created a situation that severely compromised the turf quality, more in the southern area of TV, than northern. It will take more than the rain we've had so far for the courses to recover completely. Aerating will help. Rotating closing a nine on each course will help a bit. Following the 90 degree rule will help.

Perhaps having lived previously in an area that suffered water shortages annually and living with that effect on golf courses has given me a different perspective on conditions. Public, private, and muni courses alike suffered from shortages of water and they had nowhere near the amount of play we have on these courses.

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

Posting all your complaints on this site will accomplish nothing. Why not call the above individuals and discuss your "issues"??

I agree and really believe they listen when they get complaints regarding the courses. But it has to be more than one person. One person is a crank. 50 people is something they will pay attention to.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by mickey100

I agree and really believe they listen when they get complaints regarding the courses. But it has to be more than one person. One person is a crank. 50 people is something they will pay attention to.

I think I have read some "crank" posts.

[rubicon]

The Developer owns both championship and executive courses. these courses get heavy play and that will only increase as the population increases.

Championship courses charge top dollar in prime season and off season to courses off campus and keep in mind the price does not consider a cat since residents use their own so add upward of $18.00 for 18 holes of golf . Ccourses off campus seem to do better with fair/greesn perhaps because they do not get as much play (?)

I am a priority member but will drop it this year because I am not getting bang for my buck. My neighborhood plays mostly off campus.
Obviously what TV courses offer residents is quicker access.

[spk7951]

Originally Posted by rubicon

The Developer owns both championship and executive courses. these courses get heavy play and that will only increase as the population increases.

Championship courses charge top dollar in prime season and off season to courses off campus and keep in mind the price does not consider a cat since residents use their own so add upward of $18.00 for 18 holes of golf . Ccourses off campus seem to do better with fair/greesn perhaps because they do not get as much play (?)

I am a priority member but will drop it this year because I am not getting bang for my buck. My neighborhood plays mostly off campus.
Obviously what TV courses offer residents is quicker access.

Not so sure that is entirely correct. I thought the VCCDD owned the exec courses north of 466 and SLCDD owned the exec courses south of 466, at least for now?

[Mikeod]

Originally Posted by spk7951

Not so sure that is entirely correct. I thought the VCCDD owned the exec courses north of 466 and SLCDD owned the exec courses south of 466, at least for now?

The developer owns all the championship courses and all executive courses south of 466 except Pimlico, Churchill Greens, and Belmont. Other courses have been turned over to the VCCDD and SLCDD.

[Threeputt]

Originally Posted by mikeod

Can't comment about Cane. I haven't played it in a while. Not one of my favorite courses. There is a post that the maintenance company has been fired. The maintenance of all the courses is outsourced to several companies and they can be, and are, terminated for poor performance.

My point is that the courses have suffered through two winters of exceptionally cold weather followed by dry summers. Then we experienced a mild winter/spring this year with little rainfall. The mild season coupled with the increased play from seasonal residents, guests, and visitors created a situation that severely compromised the turf quality, more in the southern area of TV, than northern. It will take more than the rain we've had so far for the courses to recover completely. Aerating will help. Rotating closing a nine on each course will help a bit. Following the 90 degree rule will help.

Perhaps having lived previously in an area that suffered water shortages annually and living with that effect on golf courses has given me a different perspective on conditions. Public, private, and muni courses alike suffered from shortages of water and they had nowhere near the amount of play we have on these courses.

Well said. Ken Creely and his GMS organization is also an outsourced company hired to manage golf operations.

[Threeputt]

Originally Posted by rubicon

The Developer owns both championship and executive courses. these courses get heavy play and that will only increase as the population increases.

Championship courses charge top dollar in prime season and off season to courses off campus and keep in mind the price does not consider a cat since residents use their own so add upward of $18.00 for 18 holes of golf . Ccourses off campus seem to do better with fair/greesn perhaps because they do not get as much play (?)

I am a priority member but will drop it this year because I am not getting bang for my buck. My neighborhood plays mostly off campus.
Obviously what TV courses offer residents is quicker access.

This staement is not correct in that the VCDD/Slcdd owns most of the execs. Cart fees at $18? Never seen that as the most we rent em for is 10$. Fees too high in the winter? Try getting a tee time..... just sayin.

[ronat1]

Just to clear up the point of golf course ownership by quoting the VCDD Community Development District's website Village Community Development Districts, "While the Country Clubs are owned and operated by the developer of The Villages, the Executive Golf Trail courses are owned and operated by the Village Center Community Development District and the Sumter Landing Community Development District. They are supported and maintained by the amenities fees of the residents of The Villages, meaning Greens Fees are free for all Village Residents." Hope this clarifies the different opinions.