[Indydealmaker]

Originally Posted by mikeod

It is not a "rule" of golf, but is accepted etiquette. Your position on the course is behind the group in front of you rather than in front of the group behind you. If the ambassador tells you your group is 5 minutes ahead of pace, do you sit in the cart for 5 minutes? The stated pace of play is not a minimum, but should be a maximum.

Play on any golf course is a cooperative effort of all players to maximize enjoyment of all. Groups that fall well behind reduce the enjoyment of all who play immediately behind them and for the rest of the day. Groups who push others, hit into them in their haste, also adversely affect the golf experience of others. Nobody is asking anyone to rush their game, just play at a pace that keeps the groups in contact with each other and minimizes delays.

And your analogy is flawed because on the interstate, there is a passing lane to allow faster vehicles to pass. Perhaps another analogy would be the driver on the interstate who rides in the passing lane at the same speed as the vehicle in the right lane and refuses to move over because he/she is going the limit, so no one should be going faster.

I guess I should have used an analogy of a one lane road with a double yellow. So what you are saying is that if a group of pros are ahead of you, you should pick up your ball and keep pace? I still say that if the accepted speed of play is maintained, it is not possible to fall behind just because the group ahead of you plays faster than the norm. Should a foursome be required to keep pace behind a twosome? The reality is that if a foursome observes the general rules of golf with regard to lost ball searches, putting times, etc., there will usually not be a problem with speed of play. But expecting an average golfer to keep pace with a low handicap foursome is just not part of the game. It is no fun for the average guy. If all of the average guys quit playing out of frustration with the stress, then the small percentage of low handicappers will incur much higher costs to play.

Originally Posted by actor

you have. You are supposed to keep pace with the group in front of you. Hope I don't have to play behind your group very often.

Ok Ok maybe I worded it wrong ..I do care.I'm capable of playing at any pace but 4 1/2 hours seems reasonable.I sometime play with folks that 15 minutes a hole is rushed to them.They have a right to enjoy the golf in the villages as much as anyone here.Sounds like if you're not a single digit handicap you don't belong on the championship courses and that's bull....!Why don't we all relax. The next time someone in front of you isn't playing to your liking just remember it sure beats working!! It's another beautiful day in the villages.

[Russ_Boston]

Do what I do - play before the morning wave. I've done this often and usually get paired with 2-3 others. Sometimes we've been so fast the ranger told us to play 2 balls each if we want so we don't catch up with the grounds crew

[ajbrown]

Originally Posted by Russ_Boston

Do what I do - play before the morning wave. I've done this often and usually get paired with 2-3 others. Sometimes we've been so fast the ranger told us to play 2 balls each if we want so we don't catch up with the grounds crew

I apologize if I am missing something obvious, but how does one do this? Are the times before the wave? DO you just play 9?

[Taj44]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan

Ok Ok maybe I worded it wrong ..I do care.I'm capable of playing at any pace but 4 1/2 hours seems reasonable.I sometime play with folks that 15 minutes a hole is rushed to them.They have a right to enjoy the golf in the villages as much as anyone here.Sounds like if you're not a single digit handicap you don't belong on the championship courses and that's bull....!Why don't we all relax. The next time someone in front of you isn't playing to your liking just remember it sure beats working!! It's another beautiful day in the villages.

When you look at the scorecards, it tells you what the pace of play is on the various courses. Havana and Cane are 4 hours 15 or 16 minutes. Ob 4 hours 7 minutes, and so on. Palmer and Lopez are exceptions at 4 hours and 26 minutes. So 4 1/2 hours is not reasonable on most of the golf courses in The Villages. I don't mean this unkindly, but if someone is rushed at 15 minutes per hole, they need to find another place to play, or improve their skills, because they will not be playing at the accepted pace of play. They do not have the right to spoil the game for the rest of us who go by the rules. I play golf with people who have handicaps in their 20's and they have no problem keeping up. They're ready to hit when its their turn, they move quickly between shots; they essentially don't waste time. Its called being courteous i.e. golf etiquette.

[Taj44]

Originally Posted by spk7951

While I do agree with you it does not always play out this way. Earlier this summer when playing on Kilimanjaro we had a group of four in front of us that was slow, or so we thought. The group in front of them was moving along quickly. On the 6th tee the ambassador showed up and asked if everything was ok. One of our group then complained about our concern for the slow play in front of us. The ambassador told us that while there was open fairway between the group in front of us and the next group he was not going to say anything because they were on time and the 1st group was ahead of schedule. But the more I thought about that I disagreed because sooner or later that day the trickle down effect was going to come into play.

I agree with you. I think the ambassador was incorrect here, but that tends to happen. They don't like to rock the boat. The problem is, as you said with the trickle down effect, once things slow down, its iimpossible to get things back up to speed. One slow group in the morning will affect pace of play all day long. Someone else was talking about playing behind pros and/or twosomes, etc. That doesn't happen too frequently in my experience. There is rarely a twosome in the lead, they're generally sandwiched in between foursomes, and in the high season, there will be few if any openings at all due to lack of teetimes.

Originally Posted by Taj44

When you look at the scorecards, it tells you what the pace of play is on the various courses. Havana and Cane are 4 hours 15 or 16 minutes. Ob 4 hours 7 minutes, and so on. Palmer and Lopez are exceptions at 4 hours and 26 minutes. So 4 1/2 hours is not reasonable on most of the golf courses in The Villages. I don't mean this unkindly, but if someone is rushed at 15 minutes per hole, they need to find another place to play, or improve their skills, because they will not be playing at the accepted pace of play. They do not have the right to spoil the game for the rest of us who go by the rules. I play golf with people who have handicaps in their 20's and they have no problem keeping up. They're ready to hit when its their turn, they move quickly between shots; they essentially don't waste time. Its called being courteous i.e. golf etiquette.

WOW!!!

[thistrucksforyou]

You are retired or have you forgotten....Slow down enjoy yourself, have a beer enjoy your friends, what,s the hurry....I am not there yet but from the outside looking in, I here that your past hecktick life of hurry to work,hurry home,is still with you, slow down, stress out , you have the rest of your life...

JMO

[ajbrown]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan

I sometime play with folks that 15 minutes a hole is rushed to them.They have a right to enjoy the golf in the villages as much as anyone here.Sounds like if you're not a single digit handicap you don't belong on the championship courses and that's bull....!

Not sure why I am chirping in except I could not sleep and am bored .

Let me first say one of the slowest players I frequently play in a group with is a two handicap, so this is not just about ability. As many of us, I have played lots of golf in my life and I cannot remember playing with anyone who could not keep up. That includes players with physical handicaps as well as high golf handicaps. If they were golfers, i.e., understood rules and etiquette, then they each found their own way to keep pace.

My wife is a perfect example for this thread. When she started her golf journey she had trouble consistently hitting the ball, never mind hitting 150 yards. She understood one thing though, she had as much responsibility for pace of play on the course as any other player out there. During that first year if she could not keep up, the ball went in hand and we drove up to where the others were and she continued. No stress and in time this happened less and less. Today she is a pretty solid 24 handicap.

To me it is simple. We each own the pace of play for the whole course and with that the enjoyment of others who come behind us.

[charlie49]

There is no doubt that people who believe it is their right to play at any pace they want to are inconsiderate of others on the course. A five hour round, last week at Mallory, is not acceptable. New golfers should follow the advice of more experienced players regarding when they should pick up and move along.

A good experiment would be for the Villages be to designate one course as one where pace of play would be ridgidly enforced. Any group behind would move ahead to where they should be when instructed by an ambassador. Slow players would avoid that course and those who enjoyed maintaining pace would desire playing at that course.

One course could also be designated as one where pace of play will not be enforced at all. Slow players could choose that course and play as slow as they wanted.

I wonder what course would be more popular?

Charlie

[Talk Host]

I walk most of the championship courses and have never once held up play. I am usually at the next tee box waiting for my teammates. There is no reason for anybody to hold up play. Hit your ball and move on. If I can do it on foot, it can be done in a cart.

There use to be a guy in one group I played with that, before he hit the ball, would lean on his club "in the fairway" and start to tell us a story about when he "lived back up north." ARRRRGGGGGGHHHH. I've played with guys who "don't care" that they are holding up play. They insist that they'll play at their own pace and "screw" everybody else.

Proper pace of play is not "hurry" it is the normal pace. It's not hard to do. Just play the game and move on.

[golf2140]

Originally Posted by Talk Host

I walk most of the championship courses and have never once held up play. I am usually at the next tee box waiting for my teammates. There is no reason for anybody to hold up play. Hit your ball and move on. If I can do it on foot, it can be done in a cart.

There use to be a guy in one group I played with that, before he hit the ball, would lean on his club "in the fairway" and start to tell us a story about when he "lived back up north." ARRRRGGGGGGHHHH. I've played with guys who "don't care" that they are holding up play. They insist that they'll play at their own pace and "screw" everybody else.

Proper pace of play is not "hurry" it is the normal pace. It's not hard to do. Just play the game and move on.

Well said, think of others while on the course.

[dillywho]

As others have pointed out, it is not about handicaps but about pace of play.... play ready golf, pick up when you need to (no need to play till it's in the hole when you've already hit it and hit it and hit it unless you're in a tournament where you have no choice), save the stories for the clubhouse, limit practice swings (you're either gonna hit it or miss it so practice on the practice areas instead), don't spend all day "reading" the putt, replacing head covers and the club back in the bag, etc. Some of the slowest players are the lower handicap "experienced" players. Many need to remember that they are not putting for a Green Jacket on every putt and don't need to take 5 practice swings and then change clubs and do it again on their other shots.

Keeping up does not mean playing fast nor is golf about seeing how fast you can get around the course. Isn't it acceptable here for faster players to "play through" but only if there is anywhere for them to go because it is not always the group directly ahead that is the problem. Sometimes they are waiting, too.

BTW, these same things apply on the executive courses as well so it's not just about the championship courses.

If you watch golf then you know, some of golf's slowest players are on tour and frequently get clocked and sometimes even penalized.

[Jhooman]

Hey

I'm with you!! I live in Southern California and would love to have a 4.5 round. We average about 5 hours and that's a marvel.

I can hardly wait to live in the Villages, I hope the Neja golfers will not tailgate me.

But if they do, I'll encourage them to play through and they can torment the next group.

I'm a long hitter and need to wait for the group to clear, I do not want to hurt anyone. Sometimes my waiting aggravates the group behind me, especially men, but when they see how far I hit the ball they quiet down.

Simple manners and patience will go a long way.

J

[tankdvr1950]

As a former TV Ambassador/Starter I can attest to the fact that there is slow play out there....at any time of the year. A lot of it has to do with the experience level of the golfer, not undertaanding the various things once can do to "play ready golf" and keep play morning.....but the most prevelant one I witnessed so many many times.....too many guys have too much testosterone.....i.e. way too many guys -play from a T box (Executive as well as Championship course) that they have no business (nor the ability) to play from.

Time after time i saw golfers hitting from the Black T's because....."thats where the real men play from"....only to see their drives barely trickle past the forward T box...in many of these circumstances, a par 4 quickly turns into a part 8 or more (and very few people know about or observe the "double par rule"....once u get to double par...pick up the damn ball and more on to the next hole)

Many times i would approach these "real men" golfers and suggest that they minght enjoy their round more if they moved to a more forward T box that better fit their game....i dont ever recall that that suggesting was well received with the "best" response I got being "i paid my fee....now i want to hit as many shorts as i can for my money" (true story),

So here's one more way to speed up play on all the courses....hit from the T box that your game can handle...trust me...u will enjoy the game more and keep the course moving on time.