[senior citizen]

Originally Posted by ilovetv

"Unpasteurized apple cider and juice have been associated with outbreaks of E. coli O157:H7 infection, cryptosporidiosis, and salmonellosis (1-4). Animals are the primary reservoir for the pathogenic organisms associated with these outbreaks. In particular, cattle, deer, and sheep can asymptomatically carry E. coli O157:H7 and Cryptosporidium, and many animals, including cattle, chickens, and pigs, can asymptomatically carry Salmonella.

Although the exact mechanisms of contamination for these previous outbreaks were not clearly determined, in three of the outbreaks, manure was suspected to have contaminated the apples. For example, in an outbreak of cryptosporidiosis in 1993, drop apples were collected from trees adjacent to an area grazed by cattle whose stool contained Cryptosporidium (3), and in a salmonellosis outbreak in 1974, drop apples had been collected from an orchard fertilized with manure (4).

The practice of using drop apples for making apple cider is common (2), and apples can become contaminated by resting on ground contaminated with manure. In an outbreak of E. coli O157:H7 infections in 1991 (2), the cider press operator also raised cattle, and cattle grazed in a field adjacent to the mill. The presence of animals near a cider mill can result in manure inadvertently contacting apples, equipment, or workers' hands. In addition, apples can become contaminated if transported or stored in areas that contain manure, or if rinsed with contaminated water.

These previous outbreaks of illness prompted recommendations to reduce the risk for producing contaminated cider, including 1) preventing the introduction of animal manure into orchards, 2) avoiding use of apples that have fallen to the ground, 3) washing and brushing apples before pressing, 4) using a preservative such as sodium benzoate, and 5) routine pasteurization."


Centers for Disease Control (CDC)

Outbreaks of Escherichia coli O157:H7 Infection and Cryptosporidiosis Associated with Drinking Unpasteurized Apple Cider

Outbreaks of Escherichia coli O157:H7 Infection and Cryptosporidiosis Associated with Drinking Unpasteurized Apple Cider -- Connecticut and New York, October 1996

Excellent posting.....!!!

I've come to the conclusion nothing is quite as safe as we once assumed.
Including produce.

Thanks for sharing above information.........again, excellent posting.

My husband's father used to bring home "manure from the circus" to put on their tomatoes.........yuck.

I even wonder about our little garden here; whether or not the groundhogs and chipmunks and deer , who do pass through at night, and fox, etc. ....contaminate the garden.

Obviously, I wash the stuff.

[ssmith]

I am just finishing the book, Eat to Live. One thing I have to agree with is that a person can be Vegan and never eat veggies and fruit which skips some important nutrients some of which may even be unknown as to how beneficial they can be in a diet.

I have read many books over the years and I feel that many people are so confused by this study and that i.e.. Eat more protein, don't eat protein. It is really too bad. One conclusion I do believe is that we all need more unprocessed veggies and fruit in our diet (ooops protein diets don't want you to eat fruit .

I believe there are many passionate people are on this subject but would have to agree that the delivery at times has not appeared to be careful. I always told my kids "It's not what you say but how you say it". Also you catch for flies with honey than vinegar.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by ssmith

I am just finishing the book, Eat to Live. One thing I have to agree with is that a person can be Vegan and never eat veggies and fruit which skips some important nutrients some of which may even be unknown as to how beneficial they can be in a diet.

I have read many books over the years and I feel that many people are so confused by this study and that i.e.. Eat more protein, don't eat protein. It is really too bad. One conclusion I do believe is that we all need more unprocessed veggies and fruit in our diet (ooops protein diets don't want you to eat fruit .

I believe there are many passionate people are on this subject but would have to agree that the delivery at times has not appeared to be careful. I always told my kids "It's not what you say but how you say it". Also you catch for flies with honey than vinegar.

You are right.

My aunt who was a wonderful cook and could make almost anything palatable, said "keep it colorful AND LOTS OF VARIETY..and far more fruits and vegetables than meat and keep it low fat and you will live a long time and enjoy it." She was also big on hot and cold foods and presenting them on pretty dishes and not serving large portions. I think she was on the right track but I do not go around being an evangelist about food.

Some people have diverticula and cannot take a lot of seeds and things, some people have the inability to digest a lot of fibrous vegetables that end of in strands and hurt their innards. Some people have such an aversion to some foods that it is almost impossible to change them. For instance, I don't believe anything could make me consume a plate of bugs now after a life of not eating them and no matter if someone said it tastes just like chicken.

We should try to improve but that doesn't always mean radical changes.

[senior citizen]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

You are right.

My aunt who was a wonderful cook and could make almost anything palatable, said "keep it colorful AND LOTS OF VARIETY..and far more fruits and vegetables than meat and keep it low fat and you will live a long time and enjoy it." She was also big on hot and cold foods and presenting them on pretty dishes and not serving large portions. I think she was on the right track but I do not go around being an evangelist about food.

Some people have diverticula and cannot take a lot of seeds and things, some people have the inability to digest a lot of fibrous vegetables that end of in strands and hurt their innards. Some people have such an aversion to some foods that it is almost impossible to change them. For instance, I don't believe anything could make me consume a plate of bugs now after a life of not eating them and no matter if someone said it tastes just like chicken.

We should try to improve but that doesn't always mean radical changes.

Again, words of wisdom.

Married almost 50 years, my hubby never particularly liked any vegetables except corn and a green tossed salad.

Now, he will eat most any vegetable and has broadened his choices in all foods groups.

The one food he had a particular aversion to was red beets, which I always loved.........the pickled variety.
My mom and his mom made Polish borscht which is beet soup.

However, he had been FORCED to eat hot cooked beets in grammar school, by the nuns, around 1st grade and remembers vomiting them up.
It was traumatic to say the least........and to this day, he will not eat beets....as rich as they are in iron.

His mom would also make him grate horseradish root and beets for the holidays. Our parents and grandparents did eat all the healthy foods
as there were no processed foods back then.

Preaching never works.

I know many people with diverticulitis........so what you say above is so true. If they consume nuts and seeds, they end up in the hospital.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Some people have diverticula and cannot take a lot of seeds and things,...

And there's a reason for diverticuala. Look it up. Poor diet strikes again. If they had eaten a good diet to begin with, they wouldn't have diverticuala.

That's why I like to inform people. Grandparents, it may be too late for you, in some cases. But you can inform your childern and grandchildren. It may not be too late for them. Don't worry about people calling it "preaching". That's just a red herring.

And don't worry about your delivery. It's far worse not to deliver the message at all.

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by Bill-n-Brillo

This thread is missing something. Hmmmm......what could that be?

WAIT!! - - - here it is................................



Bill

Thanks for sharing!

[jimbo2012]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Some people have diverticula and cannot take a lot of seeds and things, some people have the inability to digest a lot of fibrous vegetables that end of in strands and hurt their innards.

Gracie, the Mayo Clinic says to eat a high fiber diet if you have that condition.

No veggies, that appears to be a myth, in fact the opposite is true, veggies are high fiber. Here is list of veggies high in fiber from Mayo

Oh and seeds & nuts, Mayo says there is no scientific evidence of that.

Villages Pl is on point I think, do you agree Gracie?

It also said no popcorn

On another note and please just take this as an observation, but you said

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I feel in my heart you mean well, but this kind of anecdotal information is not only terribly misleading but dangerous. ... We must be so careful in our giving advice like this..

I always try not to give advise or opinions without supporting evidence.

.

[OscarOlden]

I think what Gracie says makes sense - common sense.

[rubicon]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

And there's a reason for diverticuala. Look it up. Poor diet strikes again. If they had eaten a good diet to begin with, they wouldn't have diverticuala.

That's why I like to inform people. Grandparents, it may be too late for you, in some cases. But you can inform your childern and grandchildren. It may not be too late for them. Don't worry about people calling it "preaching". That's just a red herring.

And don't worry about your delivery. It's far worse not to deliver the message at all.

Diverticulitis like irritable bowel ,colitis etc are autoimmune illnesses and while diet may or may not help the main cause is the weaken of this system. To suggest that diet alone will control these diseases is misleading. I would submit that extraordinary stress does more harm than food

[graciegirl]

VillagePL you are right about high fiber being good for diverticula, and I am wrong..

However, Your following statement;

"And don't worry about your delivery. It's far worse not to deliver the message at all.[/QUOTE]"



I think it is very like hearing about religion. It is better to live your message and teach without words.


People grow very tired of a repetitive subject and then don't listen to anything one says.

If you are a good example, a healthy person, a good person, a funny person, a well rounded person with varied interests, a person with a smile and a helping hand, then people might wonder about your habits and seek to emulate them.

If you don't capture your audience and repeat yourself again and again, you have lost the chance to change anyone's mind about anything.

[ssmith]

Gracie, It sounds like your Aunt was a wise woman but then I am not surprised....it must run in the family

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by rubicon

Diverticulitis like irritable bowel ,colitis etc are autoimmune illnesses and while diet may or may not help the main cause is the weaken of this system. To suggest that diet alone will control these diseases is misleading. I would submit that extraordinary stress does more harm than food

Sorry, I disagree. In other cultures, where high fiber diets are the norm, the conditions of diverticulosis and diverticulitis are practically unknown.

Here's what hpppens to cause diverticulosis: A lack of fiber causes food to get packed tight in the intestines/colon. (You will know about this if you've ever been constipated because a lack of fiber will make it hard to pass a stool. The stool can feel hard like a rock. And you can get hemorrhoids from forcing yourself.) When the intestines/colon contract in an effort to move things along, they become "ruptured" (small hernias). In some people diverticulosis becomes inflammed and that's known as diverticulitis.

The small pouches or hernias are called "diverticula".

I never suggested that diet alone will control it. So I never mislead anyone. As a matter of fact, I suggested diet as prevention. My advice was to never get these conditions to begin with. If it's too late for some older people who already have it, they should warn their children and grandchildren. That way it can be prevented by forming good eating habits while they are still young.