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-   -   Why The Assault On Religious Liberty? (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-political-talk-88/why-assault-religious-liberty-189401/)

Guest 04-11-2016 02:19 PM

Why The Assault On Religious Liberty?
 
The American founders believed religious freedom so essential to the forming of our Republic that they incorporated it into our First Amendment.

However in today's political climate and ensuing cultural divisions religious liberty/freedom is under constant attack.

The Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) or similar bills incorporated into RFRA have been challenged in Georgia. North Carolina, Mississippi, Tennessee, Indiana, Missouri not to forget the number of assaults committed by the Obama Administration.

Those opposing religious freedoms/liberty have mounted massive boycott campaigns in these states and have included threats to various corporations to support their demands or face economic retribution These radicals have enlisted the help of celebrities the liberal media and left leaning corporate leaders to peddle misinformed and misleading propaganda.

Yet these very same people promote diversity and inclusion except for people of faith.

The founders understood that religious liberty was essential because all other freedoms flowed from it as intended by God.

If Americans do not fight for the right of religious freedom then we will fall into a secular state and a secular state dictates that rights flow from the state and thus we will be governed by men and not by the rule of law. Anyone not understanding this or placing their selfish needs above this concept sow the seeds of America's destruction.

Personal Best Regards:

Guest 04-11-2016 02:32 PM

Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

"The phrase gives three examples of the "unalienable rights" which the Declaration says has been given to all human beings by their Creator, and for which governments are created to protect."

Of the 3, I think the Pursuit of Happiness is most in jeopardy. I think the middle class is not worried about anyone taking away their freedom to worship. They just want to make a decent living and have a chance of pursuing the American dream like their parents and grandparents.

Guest 04-11-2016 02:41 PM

If you're religious, you've been brainwashed. I mean really, God watches over everything and knows everything...about us? Really?

If anything, we're his dissertation on infectious lifeforms on otherwise pristine planets.

Guest 04-11-2016 02:46 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211313)
If you're religious, you've been brainwashed. I mean really, God watches over everything and knows everything...about us? Really?

If anything, we're his dissertation on infectious lifeforms on otherwise pristine planets.

I think the conversation is about the freedom to think what you want as you do.

Guest 04-11-2016 02:56 PM

Religious liberty to libtards means to be liberated from any form of religion that might hamper their deviant lifestyle. They know that they can't be liberal and religious. That would definitely put a stop to their fun, as they know it. The only charity they believe in is take from those that have and give it to those that don't have, as long as they are not included in the taking away part.

Guest 04-11-2016 03:00 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211313)
If you're religious, you've been brainwashed. I mean really, God watches over everything and knows everything...about us? Really?

If anything, we're his dissertation on infectious lifeforms on otherwise pristine planets.

Do you have car insurance? Isn't it better to be insured and not need it, than to not be insured and then be screwed when it's too late? I would rather have faith and find out that I was wrong (not going to happen) than to not believe and find out too late. And besides, I have not found one scholar that has been able to give me evidence to disprove my faith. And certainly not a retard on this forum.......:loco:

Guest 04-11-2016 03:08 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211323)
Do you have car insurance? Isn't it better to be insured and not need it, than to not be insured and then be screwed when it's too late? I would rather have faith and find out that I was wrong (not going to happen) than to not believe and find out too late. And besides, I have not found one scholar that has been able to give me evidence to disprove my faith. And certainly not a retard on this forum.......:loco:

Better retarded than insane...

Guest 04-11-2016 03:11 PM

I answered on post 2 and 4 . In case you are keeping score. Can you recogmnize my style? See any name calling? See how I am willing to listen to other points of view?

Guest 04-11-2016 04:22 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211306)
The American founders believed religious freedom so essential to the forming of our Republic that they incorporated it into our First Amendment.

However in today's political climate and ensuing cultural divisions religious liberty/freedom is under constant attack.

The Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) or similar bills incorporated into RFRA have been challenged in Georgia. North Carolina, Mississippi, Tennessee, Indiana, Missouri not to forget the number of assaults committed by the Obama Administration.

Those opposing religious freedoms/liberty have mounted massive boycott campaigns in these states and have included threats to various corporations to support their demands or face economic retribution These radicals have enlisted the help of celebrities the liberal media and left leaning corporate leaders to peddle misinformed and misleading propaganda.

Yet these very same people promote diversity and inclusion except for people of faith.

The founders understood that religious liberty was essential because all other freedoms flowed from it as intended by God.

If Americans do not fight for the right of religious freedom then we will fall into a secular state and a secular state dictates that rights flow from the state and thus we will be governed by men and not by the rule of law. Anyone not understanding this or placing their selfish needs above this concept sow the seeds of America's destruction.

Personal Best Regards:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I clearly understand this amendment but I also understand how it can be misunderstood.

I am going to use the Private Country example. For many years women, such as myself, were NOT allowed to be a primary member of a Country Club and they were NOT allowed to get a tee time on Saturday and Sunday afternoons. As membership fell over the years Country Clubs looked for other streams of income. So they opened these clubs for public uses for a fee. Think weddings.

Had they remained a PRIVATE club nothing could be done to change the rules. Think Augusta! However, once they opened their doors to accommodate the PUBLIC they were required to treat everyone the same. So that is how I a single women got a primary membership in a country club.

This, of course, went through the court system.

If you are an establishment open to the public you also have to treat everyone the same. You can't say you won't bake a cake for a gay person or a black person or a Muslim.

In my opinion, if these laws go though the Courts they will be struct down.

This is NOT an assault on your religion, if you don't want to bake cakes for a protected class then don't be a PUBLIC company.

Guest 04-11-2016 06:08 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211309)
Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

"The phrase gives three examples of the "unalienable rights" which the Declaration says has been given to all human beings by their Creator, and for which governments are created to protect."

Of the 3, I think the Pursuit of Happiness is most in jeopardy. I think the middle class is not worried about anyone taking away their freedom to worship. They just want to make a decent living and have a chance of pursuing the American dream like their parents and grandparents.

Ask the slaves at the time of the Declaration of Independence if they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Guest 04-11-2016 06:12 PM

QUOTE=Guest;1211306]The American founders believed religious freedom so essential to the forming of our Republic that they incorporated it into our First Amendment.

However in today's political climate and ensuing cultural divisions religious liberty/freedom is under constant attack.

The Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) or similar bills incorporated into RFRA have been challenged in Georgia. North Carolina, Mississippi, Tennessee, Indiana, Missouri not to forget the number of assaults committed by the Obama Administration.

Those opposing religious freedoms/liberty have mounted massive boycott campaigns in these states and have included threats to various corporations to support their demands or face economic retribution These radicals have enlisted the help of celebrities the liberal media and left leaning corporate leaders to peddle misinformed and misleading propaganda.

Yet these very same people promote diversity and inclusion except for people of faith.

The founders understood that religious liberty was essential because all other freedoms flowed from it as intended by God.

If Americans do not fight for the right of religious freedom then we will fall into a secular state and a secular state dictates that rights flow from the state and thus we will be governed by men and not by the rule of law. Anyone not understanding this or placing their selfish needs above this concept sow the seeds of America's destruction.

Personal Best Regards:[/QUOTE


B.S. Do not try to sound so high and mighty.

Guest 04-11-2016 06:14 PM

Boy do I miss the IGNORE feature of the original political forum!

Guest 04-11-2016 06:15 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211379)
Ask the slaves at the time of the Declaration of Independence if they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

I don't think they did. I'm not sure they were speaking for women either.
And I wonder if they truly meant everyone was created equally would we have skipped the civil war, spared lives or needed to rebuild the nation.
By now our society would be completely homogeneous too.
What do you think?
[anyone can answer]

Guest 04-11-2016 08:49 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211386)
I don't think they did. I'm not sure they were speaking for women either.
And I wonder if they truly meant everyone was created equally would we have skipped the civil war, spared lives or needed to rebuild the nation.
By now our society would be completely homogeneous too.
What do you think?
[anyone can answer]

If all men were created equally, why did slaves count only as three fifths of a freeman?

Oh no, here we go with the dreaded revisionist history that the regressives are always talking about!

Guest 04-11-2016 09:41 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211379)
Ask the slaves at the time of the Declaration of Independence if they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

I doubt they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. I doubt their decedents are enjoying those things today. Assistance programs have not been helping them over the years, just keeping them in the lower social and economic status. Some of the housing projects have 3 generations of families living there in a row, an absolute failure of those programs.

STOCK UP ON AMMO!

Guest 04-11-2016 10:17 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211421)
If all men were created equally, why did slaves count only as three fifths of a freeman?

Oh no, here we go with the dreaded revisionist history that the regressives are always talking about!

Originally Posted by Guest View Post
I don't think they did. I'm not sure they were speaking for women either.
And I wonder if they truly meant everyone was created equally would we have skipped the civil war, spared lives or needed to rebuild the nation.
By now our society would be completely homogeneous too.
What do you think?
[anyone can answer]


We are in agreement. You missed that point.

Guest 04-12-2016 03:02 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211379)
Ask the slaves at the time of the Declaration of Independence if they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

I guess the slaves can thank God for Republicans, since they are the ones that continued to pursue freedom for them, even into the 50's and 60's with the equal rights Amendments. It's a shame and very disingenuous that the left is always trying to take credit for civil rights.

Guest 04-12-2016 04:57 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211421)
If all men were created equally, why did slaves count only as three fifths of a freeman?

They had it wrong. You have it right. What's your point? We need to fix things to make it right?

Guest 04-12-2016 05:38 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211461)
I guess the slaves can thank God for Republicans, since they are the ones that continued to pursue freedom for them, even into the 50's and 60's with the equal rights Amendments. It's a shame and very disingenuous that the left is always trying to take credit for civil rights.

So the failed programs are caused by the Republicans of the 50's and 60's.

disingenuous-
Lately you see that word quite a bit on the threads.
Synonyms:
misrepresented, twisted, artful, insincere, distorted

Guest 04-12-2016 06:10 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211379)
Ask the slaves at the time of the Declaration of Independence if they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Weren't considered "people", I'm thinking they were right and we're wrong.

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211386)
I don't think they did. I'm not sure they were speaking for women either.
And I wonder if they truly meant everyone was created equally would we have skipped the civil war, spared lives or needed to rebuild the nation.
By now our society would be completely homogeneous too.
What do you think?
[anyone can answer]

All "men" are "created equal", you're not equal, never were and never will be. That's why the "civil rights movement" really destroyed this nation, it didn't improve anything. We WERE at the top before the 60s, now we struggle to stay mediocre. Not everyone has the same potential.

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211436)
I doubt they enjoyed Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. I doubt their decedents are enjoying those things today. Assistance programs have not been helping them over the years, just keeping them in the lower social and economic status. Some of the housing projects have 3 generations of families living there in a row, an absolute failure of those programs.

STOCK UP ON AMMO!

They're not capable, they're not equal, that's why they can't compete equally.

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211466)
They had it wrong. You have it right. What's your point? We need to fix things to make it right?

No, they had it RIGHT...WE have it wrong. Things started downhill with the "civil rights" of the 60s. When we started fooling ourselves that everyone is equal.

Guest 04-12-2016 07:16 AM

Equality is nothing more than another platform for select special interest and minority groups to have a political position that of course it immediately picked up and amplified by the politicians and their lemming media.

Guest 04-12-2016 07:18 AM

I say if you want to be equal to what I have you make the same peronal sacrifices and efforts to get there.

You want it handed to you by making it a political, media side show.....stay where you are....you have what you have (earned).

Guest 04-12-2016 07:50 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211508)
I say if you want to be equal to what I have you make the same peronal sacrifices and efforts to get there.

You want it handed to you by making it a political, media side show.....stay where you are....you have what you have (earned).

:agree:

Guest 04-13-2016 03:57 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1211461)
I guess the slaves can thank God for Republicans, since they are the ones that continued to pursue freedom for them, even into the 50's and 60's with the equal rights Amendments. It's a shame and very disingenuous that the left is always trying to take credit for civil rights.

Sir you are correct but you forget one important fact (not sure you're really into facts though). The democratic southern racists turned republican when Johnson signed the civil rights bill in the 60's. Now those same southern racists are voting for the likes of Ted Cruz and Donald Trump.

Guest 04-13-2016 04:04 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212245)
Sir you are correct but you forget one important fact (not sure you're really into facts though). The democratic southern racists turned republican when Johnson signed the civil rights bill in the 60's. Now those same southern racists are voting for the likes of Ted Cruz and Donald Trump.

I believe the quote was:

"We have lost the South for a generation!"

It has been much longer than that.....

The long goodbye | The Economist

Guest 04-13-2016 04:08 PM

In 1952 and 1956, a majority of blacks backed the Republican Party. The Democratic domination of the African American vote really did not begin until 1960, when Kennedy dramatically called Coretta Scott King, the wife of Dr. Martin Luther King, after her husband was sent to prison in Georgia. On Election Day, blacks showed their appreciation by voting for Kennedy by a margin of 70-30, more than enough to give the Democrat the victory over Richard Nixon.
In 1964, the black preference for the Democrats became a landslide, as president Lyndon Johnson rallied a grieving nation after Kennedy's assassination to demand passage of the strong civil rights bill JFK had proposed during his last year in office. Backed by a national outcry, Johnson jammed through the far-reaching legislation, which ended discrimination against blacks in virtually every area of national life. Ironically, it was only with strong Republican support that the bill was able to pass.
Source: Condi vs. Hillary, by Dick Morris, p. 56-57 , Oct 11, 2005

Guest 04-13-2016 05:32 PM

And yet, the Democrats voted against every civil rights bill for two centuries.

Guest 04-13-2016 05:44 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212281)
And yet, the Democrats voted against every civil rights bill for two centuries.

go figure

Guest 04-13-2016 06:45 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212245)
Sir you are correct but you forget one important fact (not sure you're really into facts though). The democratic southern racists turned republican when Johnson signed the civil rights bill in the 60's. Now those same southern racists are voting for the likes of Ted Cruz and Donald Trump.

Oh? I 've heard that also. Please tell me how many of your so-called Southern Racists turned Republican. Does that mean that the Republicans that were FOR abolishing slavery and voted for all those amendments were really Democrats in disguise? I have heard many myths regarding how Democrats turned Republican so were not responsible for voting against abolishing slavery. I have also heard many excuses as to how they (Democrats) were not against Civil rights, even though they voted against it. I think that it is convenient to repeat myths, and you have been very good at convincing minorities that you are really on their side. So exactly how many Republicans turned Democrat when the Democrats turned Republican?

Guest 04-13-2016 07:04 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212288)
go figure

I believe we both know why? That Democratic party was transformed under Kennedy and Johnson!

Guest 04-13-2016 07:06 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212312)
I believe we both know why? That Democratic party was transformed under Kennedy and Johnson!

FDR had the Black vote. Kennedy reached out to MLK's wife for support.

Guest 04-13-2016 07:11 PM

I think this thread has gotten off topic.....

So to return the Gov of North Carolina is trying amend the bill and the Gov of Louisiana is rescinding Bobby Jindal's Religious Freedom Law.

Gov. John Bel Edwards to Rescind Bobby Jindal's Horrific Anti-Gay 'Religious Freedom' Order - The New Civil Rights Movement

I really don't think supporters of these bill understand the concept of public accommodation. If you don't want to bake a cake for a gay couple open a private bakery.

Guest 04-13-2016 07:43 PM

John Stewart---
The Daily Show - A Million Gays to Deny in the Midwest

I miss him.

Guest 04-13-2016 09:46 PM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212327)
John Stewart---
The Daily Show - A Million Gays to Deny in the Midwest

I miss him.

A better link perhaps.....

https://youtu.be/mppJxR5wPCw

Guest 04-14-2016 04:29 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212318)
I think this thread has gotten off topic.....

So to return the Gov of North Carolina is trying amend the bill and the Gov of Louisiana is rescinding Bobby Jindal's Religious Freedom Law.

Gov. John Bel Edwards to Rescind Bobby Jindal's Horrific Anti-Gay 'Religious Freedom' Order - The New Civil Rights Movement

I really don't think supporters of these bill understand the concept of public accommodation. If you don't want to bake a cake for a gay couple open a private bakery.

Unless the gov owns the bakery, it IS a private bakery. It is a privately owned business, is it not? I am sure that these owners will not be hurt too greatly by gays boycotting their bakeries.

And this is not JUST related to bakeries. It has to do with allowing cross dressing perverts into opposite gender restrooms. If gays want to boycott those states that want to accommodate the majority view, then I say "adios amigas." And don't let the speed limit hinder you when passing through the state.

Guest 04-14-2016 05:45 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212365)
A better link perhaps.....

https://youtu.be/mppJxR5wPCw

Isn't that the same link.It goes to jon stewert again,at least on my browser.

Guest 04-14-2016 06:13 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212387)
Unless the gov owns the bakery, it IS a private bakery. It is a privately owned business, is it not? I am sure that these owners will not be hurt too greatly by gays boycotting their bakeries.

And this is not JUST related to bakeries. It has to do with allowing cross dressing perverts into opposite gender restrooms. If gays want to boycott those states that want to accommodate the majority view, then I say "adios amigas." And don't let the speed limit hinder you when passing through the state.

The business owner does not want to do business with gays because of religious reasons. Isn't that what this is all about? Isn't that discrimination?

Guest 04-14-2016 06:51 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212403)
The business owner does not want to do business with gays because of religious reasons. Isn't that what this is all about? Isn't that discrimination?

A business owner should choose whom he will and won't do business with. It's not up to you to decide. Find someone who will do business with you. If you can't, well, maybe the problem IS you. Unless they're doing VERY well, no business is going to turn away business unless it's important enough to them.

Guest 04-14-2016 07:16 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212416)
A business owner should choose whom he will and won't do business with. It's not up to you to decide. Find someone who will do business with you. If you can't, well, maybe the problem IS you. Unless they're doing VERY well, no business is going to turn away business unless it's important enough to them.

So, YOU would allow restaurants, hotels, or grocery stores to put signs in their windows saying, "Whites Only"?

Guest 04-14-2016 07:18 AM

Quote:

Posted by Guest (Post 1212403)
The business owner does not want to do business with gays because of religious reasons. Isn't that what this is all about? Isn't that discrimination?

You want your rights, how about their rights? Just because a business is "open to the public", doesn't mean it should lose it's right to self determination. It should be able to choose its customers with the freedom you have to choose a business to work for you. A business can turn down a customer for many reasons, one of them should be simply...I don't like you.

Why should you have the "right" to choose, but they don't? Afraid you'd be left out in the cold? If nobody wants to do business with you, it's probably you that needs changing.


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