Cost of Tesla ownership, real time experience
 

I've been a strong advocate of the electric auto's for awhile but I'm been mostly curious about the Tesla and the advanced they have made. Still, I wonder about actual cost of ownership now that there are more and more on the road. In the early days of availability I think Tesla provided some rapid charging stations free of charge but I'm thinking that that was unsustainable. I've been wondering just how things are managed these days and how much it really costs to own and travel in one.

A friend of mine purchased a Tesla in MN and drove down here. He had to stop about every 300 miles and recharge, which took, on average 30 minutes. They had no problem finding charging stations.

Several years ago we spent some time in Colorado (2018, I believe) and all the Walgreens had chargers.

My friend sent me this video. Maybe it will help you.

How Much Does It Really Cost To Own A Tesla Model 3 Over Time?

In what universe can you charge a Tesla in "30 minutes"?

https://evcharging.enelx.com/images/...esla-table.jpg

If you can find a Tesla 220V charging station, you can get from 40% to 80% charge in 1 hour, but a full charge takes 3 hours...

"For most Teslas, it only takes about an hour to charge from 40% to 80% on a 220V system, but another two hours to go from 80% to 100%."

Well it took them 3 days to get here. If they had to wait 8 hours a charge, it would have taken them much longer. Maybe you should buy one and then tell us how long it took.

Tesla Superchargers are super fast
Tesla has their own network of public vehicle chargers known as Superchargers. These 480-volt vehicle charging stations are designed to charge Teslas with incredible speed.

Superchargers recharge at different rates for each of the Tesla models:

Tesla model Miles of range per 15 minutes of Supercharging
Model 3 175 miles
Model S 163 miles
Model X 142 miles
Model Y 158 miles.

This shows a half an hour would give a full charge

That's about 1500 miles +/-. that's a minimum of 5 stops (probably 6), at a minimum of 30 minutes a pop? You're adding 3-4 hours to the trip (assuming you don't have to deviate from your route to find a charging station)...

No thanks...

Not exactly. The charging rate for the Tesla Superchargers is non-linear; the lower the charge level the faster the charging. You can charge to about 80% very quickly but the last 20% will take considerably longer. Apparently, a typical scenario involves about 20 minutes at a Tesla Supercharger to go from about 20% to about 80% every 2 hours or so, depending on where you are. You will spend less time charging if you only go to about 80% but stop more frequently at a Tesla Supercharger. Not all Tesla Supercharger are the same; some will charge faster than others.

When I can recharge the battery on an electric vehicle as quickly as I can fill a gas tank, then I'll consider an electric car. Until then, NOPE!

I have heard enough to decide that I don't want to buy an electric car. But, for me, the biggest issue is that, even with a fast charging time, there is no guarantee that you won't need to wait in line to plug in.

And if there is a problem with the electrical grid or even just a power failure you are SOL. A least gas can be delivered to you if you run out in the middle of the road. Imagine being stuck in a bad traffic jam and running out of power.

For most owners, the majority of their driving is local and they are charging at home at night so charging time is not an issue. For that scenario, they are never spending time at a Tesla Supercharger station but you are spending time at gas stations for a gas car. For road trips, you will spend more time charging than it would take to fill the tank of a gas car. How often are you on road trips that are longer than the range of the car so it would need charging?

My drive from Atlanta to the Villages
 

I just drove down from Atlanta a couple of weeks ago. What would normally take 6 hours in my gas Audi, took about an extra 40 minutes as we stopped in Tifton GA to supercharge. It was a V3 and took about 35 minutes. I love my Tesla - it will do 300 miles which is fine that’s about what my bladder or legs can take before needing a rest - and what’s the hurry? It is a stress less drive also as the car basically drives itself. To get gas it about 10 minutes so its an extra 30 minutes at most.

We stayed in the Hampton inn which had a Tesla charger and loved that I plug it in overnight and have a full charge in the morning - no extra cost.

If there is a problem with the electrical grid or even just a power failure then you are still SOL with a gas car since you can't pump gas without power.

If it hadn't been for Covid we would have been on a lot of trips that year. I don't need the hassle of waiting an indeterminate amount of time to charge a battery on a long trip.

Another reason I don't want an electric car is that most of them are as ugly as a fat plumber's butt crack.

“As it turns out, gas stations that pump while the power is out rely entirely on transfer switches and generators. In the past, gas stations weren’t required to have generators or an alternative way to power their gas pumping if the electricity went out— so during a blackout, residents would be left without power and gasoline.”

Gas stations are apparently required to have transfer switches that would allow the possibility of an alternate power source in case of an extended power outage. There is no requirement to have actual back-up generators on site. There are, however, some stations with back-up generators. I believe Tesla is starting to roll out Supercharger stations with solar panels and battery storage so they can presumably operate without grid power for some period of time.

When is the government going to start charging electric vehicles road tax?

I’ve have had my Tesla over 2 years now and never had to wait for a supercharger. Now in truth, I hardly ever needed to use one as i charge at home and am alway at least 260 miles charged when I wake up and on days I plan on taking a long trip, i fill up the battery to 330 - that’s when i might need to use the supercharger. I also try to stay at hotels that have them so i can charge overnight.

There are a number of states that do that already. I believe about half do. It manifests itself as an additional annual fee to replace the gas tax that isn't being paid.

Also if you plan it right, with around 300 miles or so you can stop for a bathroom break / eat something…. I have never had an issue with the extra 30 minutes and don’t forget you also get all the other benefits of an electric car - better performance and less maintenance cost like oil changes

The biggest cost of driving one of those things is that you aren’t driving a real vehicle. Let me know when they make one with 4WD, lots of ground clearance, can tow a camper, can be charged as fast as filling a gas tank, and doesn’t cost more than an internal combustion engine, and then I might consider one. I prefer to drive a real vehicle, not a computer on wheels.

That's funny. Your so-called "real vehicle" is a computer on wheels. It probably has 30, or more, embedded microprocessors.

So far this year? 8 times...

When is the government going to stop subsidizing 1/2 the cost of EVs?

Talk about tax breaks for the wealthy...

How much it really cost to own and travel in one. Few people could honestly answer that for a Toyota Corolla, a Chevy or a Ford or whatever.

Nothing is perfect. First of all electric cars are subsidized by the tax man. An interesting thing, while it has not been shown on a gas pump for years, roughly 1/3 of the cost of a gallon of gasoline is tax. That tax is supposed to support our road system.
Fair is an impossible to define concept but electric cars are not paying for the roads to the same degree that gasoline cars are.

Just like an electric golf cart or the starter battery in a gasoline car batteries do not last forever. They are good for 5-6 years. In an electric car a new set of batteries is a huge expense-the reason why they depreciate quite a bit. Fast charging actually shortens the battery life-number of charge discharge cycles. Just like an electric golf cart, for snow birds, the battery needs to be charged even when they are not here-stand by losses and the batteries continue to age even though they are not using it.

We tend in all things to demand perfect. In the real world it does not exist.

1/2 the cost? Do you have a reference for that?

Not sure all will understand your last line. I doubt a Tesler or any device running on rechargeable batteries allows you to completely drain the batteries. Doing that will destroy the batteries. A battery low on charge is like a sponge it quickly absorbs the electricity, the charge. The last part of the charge the charger is facing more resistance and the charging rate falls off. If, the charger is powerful enough as in a quick charge, the battery is damaged by the heat.

All is a compromise. If, they advertise a 300 mile range on a charge, that is not driving into a wind, running AC or heat etc. At an 80% charge you would get roughly, very roughly 200 miles. You would need to find a charger every 200 miles and something to do for two hours every 200 miles

No. In Florida, the gas tax is 34 cents per gallon. That is not 1/3 of the cost.

In reality, Teslas retain their value very well.

Tesla Model 3 Bucks Trend of Electric Vehicles Depreciating Fast

Early Nissan Leafs, not so much, because of a lack of a well engineered battery temperature control system.

Tesla battery packs are warrantied for 70% of the original range for 8 years or 100K miles. Teslas with 300K miles are not that unusual.

No, not 2 hours. Read post #7.

You are probably not a candidate for an electric vehicle unless you are willing to take 20 minute recharging breaks every couple of hours.

As soon as they stop subsidizing the oil and gas industry that's been going on for eons. A conservative estimate from Oil Change International puts the U.S. total at around $20.5 billion annually, including $14.7 billion in federal subsidies and $5.8 billion in state-level incentives.

Saw a question posed the other day: As electric vehicle sales/use increases, how are all those batteries safely disposed of when they all start going bad?

Probably the same thing they did with the thousands of millions and millions and millions of batteries from old cars, until they will come up with a solution.

My bad, it's "only" 1/3 of the cost (on the lower priced EVs)...

U.S. Senate panel advances EV tax credit of up to $12,500

And that's just to the consumer. It doesn't count the tax breaks to the manufacturer...

Sustainability | Tesla

Who Knew? A Car Battery Is the World's Most Recycled Product

The same issue exists for all of the lead-acid batteries from gas cars. Recycling of lead-acid batteries is a well developed process. Close to 100% of a lead-acid battery is recycled. I think it is safe to assume that the infrastructure to recycle the lithium-ion batteries in EVs (and subsequent other battery technologies) will scale up as sales scale up.

That is possibly in the future but doesn't exist right now. Your post indicated that you believe that they are currently being subsidized. Also, the $12,500 proposal is only for cars made in union shops so it would exclude the largest EV maker in the US: Tesla. The proposal is for $10,000 for Teslas - not anywhere near 1/2 the cost. Again, possibly in the future. Currently, there are no Federal tax credits for cars from Tesla and GM. Please provide a reference to show that 1/2 is subsidized currently.

You're making major assumptions...

Such as ...

From Tesla:

Any battery that is no longer meeting a customer’s needs can be serviced by Tesla at one of our service centers around the world. None of our scrapped lithium-ion batteries go to landfilling, and 100% are recycled.

Again, possibly in the future. Federal tax credit of $7500 currently exists for some manufacturers; not Tesla and GM. That is hardly 1/3 the cost. Most EVs sold today have prices starting around $50K.