I am furious
 

My 90 year old cousin lives in St. Petersburg. She was raised in my hometown of Weirton, WV and attended Catholics Schools there. She is a former Marine and was married to a Marine Colonel. They lived all over the world prior to his retirement. She was widowed about 12 years ago.

During the Korean war, he was seriously wounded. My cousin went to her parish priest and asked that a mass be said for him. The priest declined because her husband was not Catholic. Since that time, she has been an on again, off again Catholic. (mostly off)

She became extremely ill about a month ago and was given only a few weeks to live. Last week ,when it seemed that the end was near, her son called the priest in the St. Petersburg parish where she lived and asked if he would visit her in the hospice and administer the "anointing of the sick" rites. He declined, saying that she was not an active member of his parish and would not do it.

What right does a person have to call himself a man of God who refuses to tend to the sick . If he was walking down the street and saw a person dying on the sidewalk, would he check to see if the person was a member of the parish before he would tend to his spiritual needs. What if a devout practicing Catholic from Chicago was in St. Petersburg and fell ill. Would this priest refuse to visit the sick individual?

In her two greatest times of need, the church turned it's back on her.

My cousin died last night. She was a dear soul with never an unkind word about anybody. Some of her last words to me were, "when you speak to the man upstairs, please mention my name."


JLK

So sorry for your tragic loss and the treatment of the Catholic church. I have a similar story about a priest not stepping up to be a man of God at a time similar to your aunts. But I wish not to hijack your thread and full attention must be given to you. I am so sorry to hear about this. My condolences to your family. So sad.

I am SO sorry for your loss TH. I too have many issues with the Catholic Church and their politics/policies that I have become aware of since our daughters death in 1993 that I don't want to go into at this time.

I hope that you can find it in your heart to understand that some withing the Church as also "mere mortals". Did your cousin at least recieve last rights from an attending priest?

Mere Mortals is right. God was there.

First, my condolences on your loss. I have no words for that priest's behavior. It is completely and totally inexcusable. He may claim to be a man of God, but he falls far short of following the word of God and following the tenets of his church. Something tells me that when his time comes, God will find him sorely lacking.

So sorry for your loss and feel so very annoyed for the misbehavior of this man of the cloth. I too have had many issues with the Catholic religion which I don't usually discuss since I have found my own way to deal with my spiritual feelings.

barb1191

Dear Talk Host
 

You have every right to be furious.....So sorry that this happened to your cousin....I want to think that this was one priest that is the exception instead of the norm....

I share your anger and frustrations. My condolences on your loss. How sad it is that the church wasn't there for your cousin in her times of need. I hope a priest associated with the hospice or hospital was there to support her and her son. Many of God's representatives fail him. I expect he's aware. However, I trust God was with your cousin in her final time of need and that he welcomed her with open arms.

As others have noted, I too have many issues with the Catholic Church. I speak directly to God from my home. I don't need a church building or a priest to be my conduit. God hears me and I'm sure he heard directly from your cousin.

While it probably won't do any good, her family may want to write a letter to the local Bishop and copy the Vatican, noting this church's reps and their shortcomings.

I am so sorry for your loss and share your anger and frustrations.

My dear, departed mother attended church in St. Petersburg for years. After many years of living in Treasure Island, my parents moved to a senior community in Seminole. Shortly after, my mother was diagnosed with brain cancer and was receiving in-home hospice. We contacted her parish in St. Petersburg, St. Johns, which she faithfully attended even after moving to Seminole, asking for a priest to come visit for the "anointing of the sick" rites. We were told that she no longer lived in that parish and they would not travel to Seminole. Needless to say, my father, sisters, and I were furious. Several friends of my parents, who were still members of that parish, contacted the priest and we told the same thing. We were finally able to find a priest from a parish in Seminole to come to the house. He came from a party, smelled like alcohol, and burped and passed gas during the entire time he was administering the "last rites" to my mother. Needless to say, we were were not happy. Before he left, he looked at us and said "that will be a $20 donation for the parish". My mother, who could barely speak at the time, told him to "get out of my house". You could see the disappointment on her face that her parish priest made no effort to come see her in her last days.

Talk Host, I personally share your frustrations. I never knew that God had limits within certain parishes. My mother donated thousands of dollars to that parish, which she obviously loved. My family decided to bring her "home" to New York for her funeral and burial. The parish she attended when she lived in New York welcomed her and provided a beautiful funeral mass, even though the priest did not know my mother.

I personally have some issues with the Catholic faith. I have tremendous issues with St. John's parish in St. Petersburg. It is a huge parish but I still do not understand why they could not come to see my mother, a faithful parish member.

TH I am sorry for your loss and thoughts and prayers are with you. I find this thread disturbing as to the behavior of the church. Makes one stop and think about their beliefs.

Teacher
 

Sorry about that.However as a retired Catholic school teacher,there are many many fine priests. Cannot tell you how many fine deeds over the years. Seems lots of people love to "bash" the catholic church.

Sorry for your loss. Furious doesn't even begin to describe a faith that prefers to act as a business vs as a religion.

No wonder there is such a problem drawing men into a calling of being a priest.

I'm sorry you see this as "bashing the Catholic church." Are you saying that this is acceptable or perhaps routine behavior in the Church? Where did this priest get the idea that this is okay? Did he make it up himself, or is it under the direction of the Diocese.

I may be blinded in my current anger, but I can't find any justification for an ordained priest to turn his back on the request of a dying woman. I can't even think of the right words to describe how I feel about his rejection of the request to help this poor soul. Her son and his family will never set foot in a Catholic Church again.

Did Jesus every check parish ID cards?????????????????

For the record, I was raised Catholic, attended Catholic grade school, Catholic high school, served hundreds of masses as an altar boy and even gave serious consideration to being a priest. At this moment, I'm glad I didn't follow through on that.

Is there any wonder why membership in the church is declining, why there is a shortage of priests, almost no nuns and churches closing and consolidating. A church can't grow by turning people away.

JLK

TH is not bashing The Catholic church. As many of the posters have admitted their own issues. When my 15 year old nephew (he was not Catholic) was near death, the only clergy at the hospital was a priest. He refused to give last rites or whatever else expect from him (because he wasn't Catholic).

My condolences on your loss. As others have said, I find the (in)actions of these men reprehensible. My experiences are completely different. Neither my mother-in-law and father-in-law were active in their parish, yet both received visits from a priest in their last days. I would hope this is a failure of these men rather than a diocese policy. I can think of no reasonable excuse for it if it is policy.

Dear TH,
I am sorry for your loss. please take solace in the fact that her last words were, "When you speak to the Man upstairs, please mention my name". To me this shows a soul seeking her God.

The Bible clearly says those who seek me shall find me. Only God knows the thoughts and intents of the heart. Without getting into a deep theological discussion, I believe your cousin is in the loving arms of her savior, experiencing the joys of Heaven we cannot imagine.

I was raised Catholic, but after much study, etc, during my teenage years found my faith in Christ as a Protestant. I have found that in the end, it is all about Grace. There is nothing we can do to make God love us any more then He does, and nothing we can do to make God love us any less.

In fact, the only time in the New Testament that Christ got angry was with the "Religious Zealots".....moneychangers who turned faith into a business. Sadly, there are those today in every denomination who have done this. Thus the parable of the sheep and the goats.....Jesus himself said many who claim to have lived a religious life will be told by Him, "Depart from me, I never knew you....".

Again, I am sorry for your loss.

Respectfully, Frank

church
 

Talk host. Saying you are catholic and attended catholic schools,why not get involved and try and change these things. Sitting back and being negative about the church will not slove anything.

My condolences to you and your family.

I am not a Roman Catholic nor am I a particularly religious person as it relates to organized religions. However, I understand the importance of last rites and anointing of the sick to Catholics. If ever they needed the church, that's when they need it most. So, I fully understand TH's anger.

It may help to hear another experience. My late son-in-law was raised by strict Roman Catholic standards. Parochial schools, altar boy, etc. As soon as he reached adulthood he walked away from the Church. In his early sixties he was diagnosed with incurable cancer. While in the hospital and during the final stages my daughter asked a local parish if someone would attend him. Subsequently a priest visited him regularly. He was wonderful. I can not describe how much it meant to him and his family.

That is not my only positive exposure to a priest stepping forward when badly needed.

Shifting the blame to me will not mitigate the inexcusable actions of this representative of the church.

Did the battlefield chaplains check church membership cards during WWII?

Condolence
 

So sorry to read of your loss. Rest in the knowledge that God will be happy to receive your aunt, and appoint her to one of His many mansions. Sandra

Sorry for the loss and the frustration. Regarding the commentary
 

by some of the "Catholic Church" doing or not doing....it happened to be that particular priest who is specifically to blame in this instance....not the "Catholic Church".

btk

JLK, I'm so sorry for your loss. My wife also had a negative experience many years ago with a priest when her mother died. Heaven knows that I'm not a religous man, but it's a shame that the actions of a relatively few have to reflect on an entire religion.

If you would please provide me with the names of both your deceased cousin and her pre-deceased husband either here or in a PM? I have a cousin in Alaska who's a priest and also a priest freind in Staten Island who is specially trained in Cannon Law. I would like to send both of them a copy of your posting, if that's alright with you, and ask both of them if they would include both your cousin and her husband in their prayers at a future mass.

Dear TH

I'm so sorry for your loss and the loss of your faith in the Catholic Church.

Many years ago I lost my Mother and Sister in Jonestown. My Mother and Sister refused to see me for five years before their deaths because I did not believe in their faith. For many years I had distain and resentment for all churches. Now I look at these organization differently, they are run by people who are so human and not perfect.

Currently I have a wonderful relationship with my God of my understanding. I need to reduce my expectations of others and somehow I feel better. Please know I'm so sorry for your experience TH, but I believe your Cousin had a relationship with her God and she is at peace.

I believe religion is about faith. For Christians, Jesus said "If you believe, you will be saved" It sounds like your cousin believed.

I studied for the priesthood for years, but left the seminary before receiving holy orders. I left because I struggled with my faith. I believe more deeply today, but I'm still not there yet. The mysteries and seeming illogic of Catholicism, (and maybe other religions too) is daunting. The sacraments of the church, including the anointing of the sick and dying, are external rituals, meaningful and comforting, but not essential for salvation. My faith wavers because I know I would always fail to measure up to what Jesus would ask of me as his representative. There is no greater challenge than knowing you are imperfect and trying to be perfect anyway.

All priests fail in many small ways, some spectacularly. But nothing humans do is an indictment of the religion, it is only proof that we humans often fall short of meeting this "test" on earth.

As you grieve, perhaps you also know that your cousin was a very good, christian person who did not need the external sign of a sacrament to be assured of a place in heaven, and that you can take comfort in that.

I am sorry that you have lost your cousin. It is very hard to let someone near to us go.

I pray that you will be comforted as time passes.

Condolences
 

TH

Sorry for your loss, what the priest did was reprehensible.

The Church is not the Priests
 

I was concerned when I read you were made to stop about your beliefs. At times like this we tend to hand OUR CHURCH over to the priests as if it was theirs. It is not, it belongs to all God's people. The clergy is made up of mere mortal men. As with any group of humans there are good ones as well as bad ones. This one was at least having a very bad day. This behavior should never effect our beliefs in God because he/she was not involved in this, a person was.

As a hospital chaplain I have seen many clergypersons in action. Some were horrible IMHO, but most were good to absolutely beautiful. I have witnessed Annointing of the Sick rites which brought me and the family/patient to tears due to their beauty.

I am so sorry that this happened. It was inconscienciable. :cryin2: Yes, it is true that in times of great happiness or stress people turn to the churches even when they have not been terribly active before that. Perhaps the priest was over worked as most of them are but this story as we are hearing it here, is truly sad.

We need to lift the people involved up to the Lord for healing of pain, grief, and anger. We need to lift our clergy persons up as well. I know I will do so. This story really increases my desire to be the very best chaplain I can be to people in hard times.

WWII "What" ??????????????

TH, I'm so sorry for the loss you and your loved ones have suffered. I'm sure your cousin is once again whole, happy and rejoicing. May God help you replace your feelings of loss with joy when you remember her. I also pray that this priest be granted the compassion and understanding for loss that we all face one day. May he be reminded that this is his calling and tending to the sick is what he has pledged to God to do.

Totally uncalled for in this particular thread.

TH - very sorry for your loss. I am sure she is now at peace and in a better place.

"totally uncalled for in this thread" You mean standing up for my catholic religion. I am proud of my catholic religion. Bringing up WW2 is dumb.

so sad
 

this whole thread makes me very sad...sad for your loss, TH, and sad for the church which i love so dearly..it is true our priests are overworked and do have to serve their parishioners before others whom they do not know, but this incident is sad for all concerned...there is a program in the church called catholics coming home, for fallen away catholics...it is going on now at st vincent de paul parish. for whatever reason one might have grown angry at some priest, don't let that deprive you of the blessings of the faith and the comfort of the sacraments at your time of death...we must choose freely to be part of the body of Christ as we understand it, not wait until on our deathbed. i am sure God knew your cousin's heart had not forgotten her faith nor Him and she is with Him now....for those of us who still have time, if you want to be a catholic, then be one always.

God is greater
 

Thank God we have a God who is not limited by man-made parish or denominational boundaries.

He would be a "weakling" indeed if limited to the territorial boundaries mere mortals fight to rule over.

This is The King who holds your cousin in His arms:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upGCMl_b0n4[/ame]

Once again, I will say, deflecting the issue and placing the blame on me is outrageous. This is not a "dumb" thread. It is a real thread about a real uncharitable act by a man of the cloth.

How dare you redirect the blame for this uncharitable action to me. It was MY FAMILY that was the recipient of this ecclesiastical snub. We were not the perpetrators of it.

I was trying to say that, Pooh.

Beautifully stated, cha cha. I can feel your love for your church and also your sadness about a failure; priests are also human.

I am not Catholic - though was raised that way - and I wish all those who are called remember that God trusts them to minister to the sick.

Wow, this is really disturbing. I remember years ago that my now non-practicing Catholic husband had a medal he wore that said "I am Catholic. Please call a priest." When I asked him about this he explained that 'last rights' is one of the sacraments and that it is very important to a dying Catholic to have it administered. I'm not Catholic and so I don't entirely understand but I do know at one time this sacrament was of the utmost importance to him and a vital part of his faith. To have it refused....