Just counting the days till we find out that Obama's heathcare is declared unconstitutional. Plan on celebrating another poor idea of his.

Another one of Obama's controversial and dangerous "transformations" of the U.S. found in SECTON 1899A of the ObamaCare bill is the establishment of an
"Independent Medicare Advisory Board" (IMAB) or otherwise referred to as the "death panel"

Let me translate the bill: IMAB is nothing more than a GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED PANEL, that in its quest to cut costs will establish policies to prohibit certain medical procedures.

Lets say your 72 yrs old and need a heart transplant. with it you can probably enjoy another 15 yrs of life or more. The IMAB could DENY seniors
the heart transplant in the name of Fairness since there is only so much money to go around and medical rationing becomes a reality. Instead they give it to the 33 yr old because he is more "productive" in society and the elderly, in their view will have outlived their usefulness.

You think that is far fetched?? On June 13, 2009 in his weekly radio address Obama talked about specifically giving Doctors "incentives" to "avoid unneccessary hospital stays, treatments and tests that drive up costs. Obama says "Make no mistake : the cost of heath care is a threat to our economy. WAKE UP SENIORS!!! Is this what you really want??

Here's my thought on a cost saving solution: CLOSE EMERGENCY ROOMS to NONCITIZENS!!! That would go a long way to save the healthcare system.

Originally Posted by hulababy

Just counting the days till we find out that Obama's heathcare is declared unconstitutional. Plan on celebrating another poor idea of his.

Another one of Obama's controversial and dangerous "transformations" of the U.S. found in SECTON 1899A of the ObamaCare bill is the establishment of an
"Independent Medicare Advisory Board" (IMAB) or otherwise referred to as the "death panel"

Let me translate the bill: IMAB is nothing more than a GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED PANEL, that in its quest to cut costs will establish policies to prohibit certain medical procedures.

Lets say your 72 yrs old and need a heart transplant. with it you can probably enjoy another 15 yrs of life or more. The IMAB could DENY seniors
the heart transplant in the name of Fairness since there is only so much money to go around and medical rationing becomes a reality. Instead they give it to the 33 yr old because he is more "productive" in society and the elderly, in their view will have outlived their usefulness.

You think that is far fetched?? On June 13, 2009 in his weekly radio address Obama talked about specifically giving Doctors "incentives" to "avoid unneccessary hospital stays, treatments and tests that drive up costs. Obama says "Make no mistake : the cost of heath care is a threat to our economy. WAKE UP SENIORS!!! Is this what you really want??

Here's my thought on a cost saving solution: CLOSE EMERGENCY ROOMS to NONCITIZENS!!! That would go a long way to save the healthcare system.

This is a moot point because Mitt Romney promises to repeal The Affordable Care Act on day one. On day two, he promises to repeal Medicare as we know it and replace it with a voucher system, al la Paul Ryan Plan. Just pray that no one out there has a pre-existing condition while shopping for health insurance with their voucher.

CLOSING EMERGENCY ROOMS TO OLD PEOPLE would be much more cost effective.

Originally Posted by hulababy

Just counting the days till we find out that Obama's heathcare is declared unconstitutional. Plan on celebrating another poor idea of his.

Another one of Obama's controversial and dangerous "transformations" of the U.S. found in SECTON 1899A of the ObamaCare bill is the establishment of an
"Independent Medicare Advisory Board" (IMAB) or otherwise referred to as the "death panel"

Let me translate the bill: IMAB is nothing more than a GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED PANEL, that in its quest to cut costs will establish policies to prohibit certain medical procedures.

Lets say your 72 yrs old and need a heart transplant. with it you can probably enjoy another 15 yrs of life or more. The IMAB could DENY seniors
the heart transplant in the name of Fairness since there is only so much money to go around and medical rationing becomes a reality. Instead they give it to the 33 yr old because he is more "productive" in society and the elderly, in their view will have outlived their usefulness.

You think that is far fetched?? On June 13, 2009 in his weekly radio address Obama talked about specifically giving Doctors "incentives" to "avoid unneccessary hospital stays, treatments and tests that drive up costs. Obama says "Make no mistake : the cost of heath care is a threat to our economy. WAKE UP SENIORS!!! Is this what you really want??

Here's my thought on a cost saving solution: CLOSE EMERGENCY ROOMS to NONCITIZENS!!! That would go a long way to save the healthcare system.

There is not now nor ever was a DEATH PANEL in the bill. However, the bill will pay for you to consult a doctor about your end of life issues. I have already done that and have a will, medical power of attorney and my end of life wishes documented. I suggest you should do the same.

You may not like Obama Care but for me it will be helpful as my company has pulled the retiree healthcare we had been promised for, in my case, 23 years and COBRA only lasts for 18 months. (Not to mention they also pulled our retirement plan)

I have worked in hospital for all of my adult life and still do. If you don't think there is fraud and misuse of medical resources you must lead a very sheltered life.

Just saying.....

Hula,hope you don't have a pre-existing condition.

Originally Posted by cologal

There is not now nor ever was a DEATH PANEL in the bill. However, the bill will pay for you to consult a doctor about your end of life issues. I have already done that and have a will, medical power of attorney and my end of life wishes documented. I suggest you should do the same.

You may not like Obama Care but for me it will be helpful as my company has pulled the retiree healthcare we had been promised for, in my case, 23 years and COBRA only lasts for 18 months. (Not to mention they also pulled our retirement plan)

I have worked in hospital for all of my adult life and still do. If you don't think there is fraud and misuse of medical resources you must lead a very sheltered life.

Just saying.....

Government controlled healthcare inevitably leads to some sort of rationing due to shortages of services and financing.

If you don't believe that the logical place for that rationing to occur here in the good ol' USA, as in all other nations who have national healthcare, is on the doorsteps of the elderly and those who have a negligible chance of full recovery, you'd have to be a bit naive.

Originally Posted by RichieLion

Government controlled healthcare inevitably leads to some sort of rationing due to shortages of services and financing.

If you don't believe that the logical place for that rationing to occur here in the good ol' USA, as in all other nations who have national healthcare, is on the doorsteps of the elderly and those who have a negligible chance of full recovery, you'd have to be a bit naive.

Richie...you are worried about rationing and I am worried about NOT having any healthcare at all.

We have rationing now...most drug plans only allow generic drugs, mine sure does that. I am trying to get into see a specialist and can't get an appointment for months.

We, as a nation, cannot sustain the current "free market" model of healthcare.

Release the hounds!!! She attacks the "free market".

Originally Posted by cologal

Richie...you are worried about rationing and I am worried about NOT having any healthcare at all.

We have rationing now...most drug plans only allow generic drugs, mine sure does that. I am trying to get into see a specialist any can't get an appointment for months.

We, as a nation, cannot sustain the current "free market" model of healthcare.

Release the hounds!!! She attacks the "free market".

COLOGAL,

With all due respect, I have been blessed thus far with good health and am old enough on the other hand that this bill probably will never influence me in any way but I would like to ask two questions simply because I do not know and is not meant to be argumentative..

1. Are there not drug plans that you can get that use NON generic drugs ?

2. Is the reason for your inability to see the specialist one of the specialist himself and being popular and/or your choice of a specific specialist ?

The reason I am asking is that this would not be a rationing but in fact, good examples of free market, in that you CAN get both, but it is a cost issue !!!!

Again, not meant to be argumentative but if I am correct and I hope you will correct me if I am, THAT is one of my many beefs with this particular bill....it does not in anyway, AS PROMISED, address health costs in anyway !

Thanks

Originally Posted by janmcn

This is a moot point because Mitt Romney promises to repeal The Affordable Care Act on day one. On day two, he promises to repeal Medicare as we know it and replace it with a voucher system, al la Paul Ryan Plan. Just pray that no one out there has a pre-existing condition while shopping for health insurance with their voucher.

CLOSING EMERGENCY ROOMS TO OLD PEOPLE would be much more cost effective.

Given the point of the lawsuit against the Affordable Healthcare Act is requiring everyone to sign up. Then if the Supreme Court overturns then no one without Healthcare Insurance should be treated at all!

That would free up the system...we, the ones with healthcare, are paying for the ones that don't.

Originally Posted by hulababy

Just counting the days till we find out that Obama's heathcare is declared unconstitutional. Plan on celebrating another poor idea of his.

Another one of Obama's controversial and dangerous "transformations" of the U.S. found in SECTON 1899A of the ObamaCare bill is the establishment of an
"Independent Medicare Advisory Board" (IMAB) or otherwise referred to as the "death panel"

Let me translate the bill: IMAB is nothing more than a GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED PANEL, that in its quest to cut costs will establish policies to prohibit certain medical procedures.

Lets say your 72 yrs old and need a heart transplant. with it you can probably enjoy another 15 yrs of life or more. The IMAB could DENY seniors
the heart transplant in the name of Fairness since there is only so much money to go around and medical rationing becomes a reality. Instead they give it to the 33 yr old because he is more "productive" in society and the elderly, in their view will have outlived their usefulness.

You think that is far fetched?? On June 13, 2009 in his weekly radio address Obama talked about specifically giving Doctors "incentives" to "avoid unneccessary hospital stays, treatments and tests that drive up costs. Obama says "Make no mistake : the cost of heath care is a threat to our economy. WAKE UP SENIORS!!! Is this what you really want??

Here's my thought on a cost saving solution: CLOSE EMERGENCY ROOMS to NONCITIZENS!!! That would go a long way to save the healthcare system.

IMHO Government funded healthcare - Medicare, if that works for seniors (and it does), why can't that work for everyone after the FAT is trimmed.....And you know that there is a lot of waste!....I wonder how many 33 year olds were passed by while Cheney got his transplant, that was a mistake!!!!!...Do you really think that closing emergency rooms is the answer, please, how can you turn away a 3 year old Latino that was hit by a car, a little radical don't you think? Obamacare is NOT really a bill that this administration was in love with, only in "like" with....Many changes are in this bills future....Good points on this bill, you can not exclude anyone for a pre-existing condition (insurance companies can not pick and choose who will add to their bottom-line - profit!, shouldn't insurance companies take the same risk that all of us do when signing up for their policy), no life-time limit to benefits (how would you like to find out that your limit of care has ended because you've "max'd out", children can stay on their parents insurance until 26....Healthcare should not be political, I know both parties would benefit from this bill, only hope the Supreme Court agrees with me. Bottom line, To quote Pres. Sadat — 'we all understand our differences but we have to find our similarities so we can live together in peace.

Originally Posted by RichieLion

Government controlled healthcare inevitably leads to some sort of rationing due to shortages of services and financing.
[snip]

richielion - don't stop at healthcare...gov't controlled ANYTHING leads to rationing etc!

The right wing has been amazingly successful at convincing people whose interests could be greatly served by things like the affordable healthcare act, increased income taxes on the wealthy, and raised limits on social security taxation that they should be against these things because they are largely promoted by democrats. Carl Rove, Grover Norquist and other right-wing spin meisters, with the financial support of the Koch bros, among others, have spun middle and even sometimes, lower economic class folks into allies, against their economic self-interest. They rattle the sabres of abortion, gun-control, and religion to suck people in, while really caring only about keeping and making more money, and reducing government regulation so they can pollute, and treat worker and consumer safety without regulatory interference. If you are gullible enough to be sucked in by their tactics, you deserve what you get, but if enough of you continue to be hoodwinked, you will bring the rest of us down with you.

My problem with nationalized government healthcare for all is....

a) It's never proposed in Congress or by the White House for "All". Congress, Executive Branch, Judicial Branch, and "all" federal and their union employees are never included as insureds in the proposals for "the public option", Public Medicaid, health insurance exchanges, etc. ". They have their choice of the best of the best PRIVATE insurance plans, with the taxpayer paying about 3/4 of their premiums! See link (1) at the end.

b) I cannot imagine the elected politicians in Washington managing, and worse yet, appointing local/regional politicians to manage the financing and delivery of "all" OUR healthcare (not theirs......their private insurance companies can fire employees for stinking job performance).

Who could possibly want this congressional bunch of clowns to run all healthcare for us, the same way they ran Cash for Clunkers....in which taxpayers ultimately paid $24,000 per vehicle sold, and the Top 10 Vehicles Sold were ASIAN makes????? (2) (3)

See:

(1) Insurance Programs for Florida Federal and Congressional employees

(2) Cash for Clunkers Results Finally In: Taxpayers Paid $24,000 per Vehicle Sold, Reports Edmunds.com - Edmunds.com

(3) http://news.consumerreports.org/cars...trade-ins.html

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

The right wing has been amazingly successful at convincing people whose interests could be greatly served by things like the affordable healthcare act, increased income taxes on the wealthy, and raised limits on social security taxation that they should be against these things because they are largely promoted by democrats. Carl Rove, Grover Norquist and other right-wing spin meisters, with the financial support of the Koch bros, among others, have spun middle and even sometimes, lower economic class folks into allies, against their economic self-interest. They rattle the sabres of abortion, gun-control, and religion to suck people in, while really caring only about keeping and making more money, and reducing government regulation so they can pollute, and treat worker and consumer safety without regulatory interference. If you are gullible enough to be sucked in by their tactics, you deserve what you get, but if enough of you continue to be hoodwinked, you will bring the rest of us down with you.

Hail the Government!!

Originally Posted by RichieLion

Hail the Government!!

If you are gullible enough to be sucked in by their tactics, you deserve what you get.

The posters on this forum will be screaming the loudest when they can't buy health insurance with their vouchers, after, as promised, Mitt Romney ends medicare as we know it, because they have pre-existing conditions. Republicans have been trying to get rid of medicare since its inception.