The disgraced former lobbyist and convicted felon was on 60 minutes last night to deliver his mea culpa. He seems genuinely contrite and laid out the details of how he manipulated congressmen. Watching something like this makes me feel so helpless and discouraged that I don't know how we will fix this system. While Abramoff mostly worked the republican side, I am sure he has counterparts working the democrat side using similar tactics. How in hell are we the people going to get some control of this system and get the lobbyists and money influence out of politics. We on this board and others like it can rail at the republicans or the democrats or the president, the congress, the supreme court, or each other, but the system has evolved into something that has virtually nothing to do with ideology, logic, ethics, or any other lofty ideal we may debate. I think that most people get into public office with altruistic and idealistic intentions, but the system seems to corrupt most, if not all, in time.

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

The disgraced former lobbyist and convicted felon was on 60 minutes last night to deliver his mea culpa. He seems genuinely contrite and laid out the details of how he manipulated congressmen. Watching something like this makes me feel so helpless and discouraged that I don't know how we will fix this system. While Abramoff mostly worked the republican side, I am sure he has counterparts working the democrat side using similar tactics. How in hell are we the people going to get some control of this system and get the lobbyists and money influence out of politics. We on this board and others like it can rail at the republicans or the democrats or the president, the congress, the supreme court, or each other, but the system has evolved into something that has virtually nothing to do with ideology, logic, ethics, or any other lofty ideal we may debate. I think that most people get into public office with altruistic and idealistic intentions, but the system seems to corruct most, if not all, in time.

Great post.....you are correct and it is scary that either party has nothing in mind but power. It is what it is and I can think of nothing that will resolve it.

We here on this forum are great examples. Those who believe in the Democratic party and those who believe in the Republican party will defend those parties against anything and everything no matter what.

Originally Posted by Bucco

Great post.....you are correct and it is scary that either party has nothing in mind but power. It is what it is and I can think of nothing that will resolve it.

We here on this forum are great examples. Those who believe in the Democratic party and those who believe in the Republican party will defend those parties against anything and everything no matter what.

Bucco, I would not imagine myself saying this - I totally agree with you. Excellent posting.

Oh yes. On 60 Minutes he said he thought he "owned" up to 100 congressmen. Disgusting!
Why are not these kind of crimes subject to much greater penalties?

[QUOTE=Bucco;519095]Great post.....you are correct and it is scary that either party has nothing in mind but power. It is what it is and I can think of nothing that will resolve it.

We here on this forum are great examples. Those who believe in the Democratic party and those who believe in the Republican party will defend those parties against anything and everything no matter what.[/QUOTE]

I don't believe in any party

Party on, dudes!!!

[quote=eweissenbach;519107]

Originally Posted by Bucco

Great post.....you are correct and it is scary that either party has nothing in mind but power. It is what it is and I can think of nothing that will resolve it.

We here on this forum are great examples. Those who believe in the Democratic party and those who believe in the Republican party will defend those parties against anything and everything no matter what.[/QUOTE]

I don't believe in any party

EASY...neither do I.

I said...."those.."..I didnt say ALL...I didnt say YOU....I said "THOSE"

I openly admit to being someone who does not in anyway believe in the current WH. BUT I assure you that NO party has, nor will ever make up my mind on anything nor will I ever vote party lines.

I am sorry you got so offended, but I, as dumb as I am, thought it was clear....you can tell those who are in love with the party on here. Their posts are pretty much polls and tweets from the party or affliations of.

My posts, I am sure, seem party to some but this WH affects what is going on in both the senate and congress. We have had no budget for all these years because the President does not want one. It is easier to politic without one.

[quote=Bucco;519207]

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

EASY...neither do I.

I said...."those.."..I didnt say ALL...I didnt say YOU....I said "THOSE"

I openly admit to being someone who does not in anyway believe in the current WH. BUT I assure you that NO party has, nor will ever make up my mind on anything nor will I ever vote party lines.

I am sorry you got so offended, but I, as dumb as I am, thought it was clear....you can tell those who are in love with the party on here. Their posts are pretty much polls and tweets from the party or affliations of.

My posts, I am sure, seem party to some but this WH affects what is going on in both the senate and congress. We have had no budget for all these years because the President does not want one. It is easier to politic without one.

I wasn't offended, nor was your post unclear. I just am so angry at the current political process, parties, and system that I wanted to make my feelings perfectly clear. A pox on both their houses.

[quote=eweissenbach;519223]

Originally Posted by Bucco

I wasn't offended, nor was your post unclear. I just am so angry at the current political process, parties, and system that I wanted to make my feelings perfectly clear. A pox on both their houses.

Glad you were not upset because on this I think we totally and 100% agree

Looks like bucco, buggy, carla and I are the only ones offended and disgusted by these revelations.

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

Looks like bucco, buggy, carla and I are the only ones offended and disgusted by these revelations.

Would not take that personally. If there are no arrows to sling, some ignore. If it an arrow at both will not respond....arrow at some party specific and you get responses.

While I am for sure anti Obama, I do totally realize what is going on in both parties, and have been trying hard to add that point because it has become very bad

Originally Posted by Bucco

Would not take that personally. If there are no arrows to sling, some ignore. If it an arrow at both will not respond....arrow at some party specific and you get responses.

While I am for sure anti Obama, I do totally realize what is going on in both parties, and have been trying hard to add that point because it has become very bad

Sad! Could it be that this is why we have no effective governance?

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

Sad! Could it be that this is why we have no effective governance?

This should endear me to all...

I think that what NEEDS to be done is/will be extremely unpopular, and those who lead that will be scorned so badly...and that fear is so much a part of so many in Washington it has frozen them with fear. Of course I am speaking of austerity and dismantling much of what has been built in WASHDC.

Sorry...probably sound crazy but that is how I feel