Do We All Live On The Same Planet? Do We All Live On The Same Planet? - Talk of The Villages Florida

Do We All Live On The Same Planet?

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Old 12-21-2012, 03:58 PM
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I'm stunned that my mind, my logic, and my life experience is so different from that of the spokesmen of the NRA.

Their promised first "meaningful contribution" to the nation's response to Sandy Hook is to support arming more people with more guns.

How is it possible to conclude this when there are two unchanged axioms throughout human history:

1) The more weapons man possesses, the more violence and death occurs.

2) The more sophisticated and deadly weapons are, the more serious injuries and death occur.

Someone has to refute these two realities before I will begin to question my sanity, but again, I'm astounded that there is such a divergence of opinion on this.

Oh! The first of my kids is arriving! Merry Christmas everyone!
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ijusluvit View Post
I'm stunned that my mind, my logic, and my life experience is so different from that of the spokesmen of the NRA.

Their promised first "meaningful contribution" to the nation's response to Sandy Hook is to support arming more people with more guns.

How is it possible to conclude this when there are two unchanged axioms throughout human history:

1) The more weapons man possesses, the more violence and death occurs.

2) The more sophisticated and deadly weapons are, the more serious injuries and death occur.

Someone has to refute these two realities before I will begin to question my sanity, but again, I'm astounded that there is such a divergence of opinion on this.

Oh! The first of my kids is arriving! Merry Christmas everyone!
You are very sane.

I don't think more firearms are needed to be worn by everyone. Are we as a society, to look at each other where I need to protect myself against everybody?

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and yours.
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Old 12-21-2012, 06:36 PM
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I don't profess to know what the best decision is for any of us, or all of us as a country. I can't imagine that one decision can cover all circumstances. Do we limit the TYPE of weapon one can own? Will that limit carnage?

I am glad there are those who have never had the need to own/learn how to handle/carry a gun for protection. May they never have to face a different scenario.

All the words that can be said have been said before. You know I do not originate them.

We all know the slogan, " Guns don't kill people. People kill people."

We know that those who have the desire to cause chaos and death will attempt to do so by whatever means they can.... if not guns, then fire, planes, etc. or perhaps a homemade bomb strapped to their bodies before entering a location to detonate. We only have to look about our world, remember or read history to see that. One only has to search the internet for evil, creative ideas.... do we ban the internet too? We all know that only good people follow the rules anyway.

Having said that, and meaning no disrespect to anyone, I would NOT keep/accumulate accessible firearms in a home with a member who has psychological/ emotional or mental problems, no matter of what origin nor what treatment may be in place.

Very sad that it now is too late for a Mother to make different choices.
I can only add my prayers for peace and comfort to the families.
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Old 12-21-2012, 06:45 PM
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"The only way to combat a bad man with a gun, is a good man with a gun".

So it sounds as though the NRA is advocating a gunfight at the OK Corral solution to gun violence. They believe teachers and administrators should be armed. Now think about it - a madman with assault weapons enters a classroom. By the time the teacher recognizes a threat and pulls a weapon out of their desk, or wherever, the madman has already mowed down a half dozen children, including, perhaps the armed teacher. If the teacher avoids being killed in the initial volley, he/she and the madman engage in an old fashioned gunfight in a crowded classroom. Yep, that will solve all our problems! The LEADERSHIP of the NRA is out of touch with the members of their own organization, and in another world from the rest of America. Good grief!
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:12 PM
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It would be interesting to hear some of the gun advocats speak their words of encouragement to the NRA idea of arming schoolteachers and administrators as well as college age students being allowed to carry handguns to classes.
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:20 PM
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You may not like guns, want a gun or want others to have them. You may feel the same way about God. But when someone breaks into your house the first thing you do is call someone who has a gun and pray they get there on time...
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:33 PM
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http://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/f...gh-Targets.pdf

http://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybel...control-lobby/

http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/20...html#read_more
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob45 View Post
You may not like guns, want a gun or want others to have them. You may feel the same way about God. But when someone breaks into your house the first thing you do is call someone who has a gun and pray they get there on time...
Are you implying that someone who is interested in common sense gun control is also a nonbeliever in God? And are you implying that someone who calls the police because someone breaks in, should therefore believe in the concept of teachers and students being armed in schools? Please clarify your beliefs, because I am offended by what I read into your remarks.
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eweissenbach View Post
"The only way to combat a bad man with a gun, is a good man with a gun".

So it sounds as though the NRA is advocating a gunfight at the OK Corral solution to gun violence. They believe teachers and administrators should be armed. Now think about it - a madman with assault weapons enters a classroom. By the time the teacher recognizes a threat and pulls a weapon out of their desk, or wherever, the madman has already mowed down a half dozen children, including, perhaps the armed teacher. If the teacher avoids being killed in the initial volley, he/she and the madman engage in an old fashioned gunfight in a crowded classroom. Yep, that will solve all our problems! The LEADERSHIP of the NRA is out of touch with the members of their own organization, and in another world from the rest of America. Good grief!
Not totally agreeing with the NRA nor with you!
The point (which, of course, no one can guarantee) is that if a teacher had a gun and was trained in its use - perhaps - PERHAPS the gunmen could have been stopped. If the madman had killed a half dozen maybe the others would have been spared.

Obviously no one knows.

There are NO easy answers!
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by ugotme View Post
Not totally agreeing with the NRA nor with you!
The point (which, of course, no one can guarantee) is that if a teacher had a gun and was trained in its use - perhaps - PERHAPS the gunmen could have been stopped. If the madman had killed a half dozen maybe the others would have been spared.

Obviously no one knows.

There are NO easy answers!
You are correct, obviously no one knows AND there are NO easy answers. It is however, good to look deeply and with objectivity into these issues rather than jump to easy conclusions based on preconcieved notions.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by ugotme View Post
Not totally agreeing with the NRA nor with you!
The point (which, of course, no one can guarantee) is that if a teacher had a gun and was trained in its use - perhaps - PERHAPS the gunmen could have been stopped. If the madman had killed a half dozen maybe the others would have been spared.

Obviously no one knows.

There are NO easy answers!
And PERHAPS that gunman would have quickly dispatched the teacher or mall cop in the hallway and now has another weapon and more bullets for his/her killing spree. You see PERHAPS works both ways, perhaps. But it defies logic to have gun totin' teachers as your line of defense against the repetition of last Friday. It IMO is also important they we don't try to find a solution to this one episode and not look at the bigger picture of gun deaths in America. Avoid the kind of simplistic cure that taking off our shoes would make air flight safe because of one use of shoes to bring down a plane.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugotme View Post
Not totally agreeing with the NRA nor with you!
The point (which, of course, no one can guarantee) is that if a teacher had a gun and was trained in its use - perhaps - PERHAPS the gunmen could have been stopped. If the madman had killed a half dozen maybe the others would have been spared.

Obviously no one knows.

There are NO easy answers!
Yes, there are answers. Do NOT be distracted by hollow arguments. You can find an example of violence which 'proves" or 'disproves' every argument.

The NRA would like us to spend our time debating armed guards in schools and then our resources implementing the plan. But wait! There were two armed guards in Columbine High School on that awful day. Neither was able to prevent any of the slaughter.

The answers are as simple as always. They are in the original post. Reduce the number and deadly potential of weapons and regulate their availability to the general public. The amount and severity of violence will AUTOMATICALLY be reduced. Sure there are many other things which might help, but what could be more sensible than uniform gun control?
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:23 PM
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I'm not a gun owner, not an IRA member, just a worried Grandpa!!!

This is my opinion......

1) Deranged people have been shooting up public locations killing innocent people... Isn't this Terrorism???

2) Nothing is in place or on the near horizon to stop this,

3) Even with stringent gun control, these people will have access to weapons, the black market will provide...just like with drugs,

4) One of these deranged people walked into Sandy Hook Elementry School and killed 26 innocents,

5) No more than 26 deaths would have occured and perhaps many less would have died if that deranged person had met someone, anyone with a gun to stop him.

6) I've never heard of one innocent being hurt by protectors in those locations where armed guards are present.

7) If President Obama's daughters are protected by armed guards, why not my grandchildren.

Until we reach Utopia, I want my grandchildren PROTECTED, by an armed policeman guarding the single entryway to their schools or a trained staff member with a gun centrally located in the school, or an armed Grandpa patrol sitting outside the door of the school.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eweissenbach View Post
"The only way to combat a bad man with a gun, is a good man with a gun".

So it sounds as though the NRA is advocating a gunfight at the OK Corral solution to gun violence. They believe teachers and administrators should be armed. Now think about it - a madman with assault weapons enters a classroom. By the time the teacher recognizes a threat and pulls a weapon out of their desk, or wherever, the madman has already mowed down a half dozen children, including, perhaps the armed teacher. If the teacher avoids being killed in the initial volley, he/she and the madman engage in an old fashioned gunfight in a crowded classroom. Yep, that will solve all our problems! The LEADERSHIP of the NRA is out of touch with the members of their own organization, and in another world from the rest of America. Good grief!
It's been reported that there were two armed guards at Columbine High School. Virginia Tech has it's own SWAT team. Jarod Laughner fired off 31 shots in 30 seconds in Tuscon.

If a person encountered a "good guy with a gun and a bad guy with a gun", how would you possibly know which was which?

Wayne LaPierre is the Washington lobbyist who makes sure mass murderers have everything they could possibly need.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:52 PM
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From what I have heard, unless you are a 'hothead' the average person will hesitate before pulling a trigger, even if they feel threatened. It is during this moment of hesitation that the assailant gets the upper hand. The common statement that criminals will find a way to get a weapon may be true, but a scarcity of weapons would drive up the price, therefore not every nut would be able to afford one. I'm not sure I can accept the idea that some form of gun control is contrary to the Constitution. I don't think the founding fathers were talking about assault weapons and arsenals. At the time the constitution was written, there were no phones to call for help when you found someone lurking around your property, many people live miles from any town or city and needed protection. In this case, the only viable solution would be to arm yourselves. It seems to me that the same constitution that allows this 'freedom' is the constitution that denied women the right to vote and was then changed when people realized the stupidity of the this law. We have the right to seek change when it is causing harm to United States Citizens.
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