[Goldwingnut]

For those who are interested in the budget for Sumter County for next year there will be budget workshops held on July 9th at 1:00PM and July 10th at 9:AM at the Pinellas Sumter County building Room 102.

These are the meetings that changes can be made, not at the final approval meeting like so many thought last year.

This is a link to the agenda and proposed budget. Take the time to review it and understand what is going on. If you have questions and want to recommend changes then this is the forum.
Agenda - 07/09/2020

I've looked at most of it and have started to digest all 300+ pages. Having dealt with the CDD budgets for the last 6 years and the entire budgeting process I'd like to share a few insights on what to expect.

Bradley Arnold, the county administrator, will be the central mouthpiece at the meeting and will be assisted by some from the budgeting department of the county. The commissioners will for the most part be silent and at the end the chairman will thank them for all the hard work and great job for the great job they did, and how there was so much done to save the taxpayers money, and blah blah blah more political double talk and avoiding the issues. Nothing will change from what has been put forward.

Typically at these "workshops" a handful of residents, if any, will show up and either ask no questions or questions of little relevance to the budget or with some pet project that has little to no value to anyone in the county except that person. Let us not make this another "rubber stamp" meeting. This is our chance as Sumter County Residents to make our voice heard and make a difference.

What I can tell you is that there will be no value in discussing last years tax increase, it is ancient history. Anyone who believes the foolishness of some of the candidates running to replace the commissioners about rolling back the 25% increase needs to rethink the idea. In Florida the budgets must be balanced, if you reduce the income (taxes) you will need to also reduce the expenses - shall we close the Pinellas facility 2 days a week, close the libraries all but 3 days a week and shorten the hours, put one less fireman at each station, or cut the sheriff's department's staffing, because these are the types of choices that would have to be made to attempt such a rollback. Some have foolishly floated the idea of issuing a bond to fund the county budgets instead of raising the taxes, this is the same a paying your mortgage payment with a visa card cash advance, pretty stupid.

I would caution all not to be foolish enough to say raise taxes on the developer and the other business, it doesn't work. You're not going to hurt any business by raising taxes, only yourselves. If you've ever run a business you'll know that businesses don't pay taxes, they collect them. A tax or a fee on a business is no different than labor and material, just another cost that is included in the final sale price and passed on to the consumer. It will actually cost more because the business will have additional overhead costs for the collecting and bookkeeping process and will do as they do with labor and material, mark it up. It's not greed, it's how businesses work.

Demanding the county have the developer pay for anything they aren't legally responsible for is another foolish tactic.

The county is actually proposing a decrease in the tax rate this year. In my opinion this is a patronizing gesture to the residents. They did this same game for 14 years and ignored the realities of the looming budgetary needs until they could shuffle the pieces any more and then hit us with a 25% tax increase due to their lack of planning. Insead of a tax decrease the tax rate should be maintained constant and the funds put into reserves earmarked for specific future needs and kept out of the general funds were it would surely be wasted. One incumbent has foolishly said they've been rolling back the taxes every year to allow us to keep more money in our pockets instead of the county capital reserves, an intentional afterthought, nothing more.

I will be at one if not both of these meeting. I encourage each and everyone of you reading this to look at the budgets and attend the meetings. If you don't understand something in the budget, ask them to explain it, right then and there and take no excuses. It's easy to have digital courage, it's more challenging and useful to have the backbone to stand up and demand answers in person.

Some may agree and some may disagree with some or all of the points I've tried to make here, so be it, but don't complain here, go to the meeting and let your voice be heard loud and clear. I'm a fiscal conservative and a businessman and try to always think in the real world and not just live here in our little bubble.

They do not expect a public turnout for these meetings, a show of residents will let them know that they've been screwing up for the last 15 years and we're not going to stand for it any longer.

See you at the meetings.

There is nothing foolish about replacing the current commissioners who voted for the 25% tax increase and we should also repeal “One Sumter”. They could raise taxes again as they said Sumter will become like Orlando and that population and taxes are directly related. We know know how population is headed. Also, the developer got a great deal on the impact fee, paying less than the Florida average and throwing the burden on existing tax payers. Real conservatives reduce taxes, they don’t raise them.

[bob47]

I agree with most of the original post but take exception to this thought:

"I would caution all not to be foolish enough to say raise taxes on the developer and the other business, it doesn't work. You're not going to hurt any business by raising taxes, only yourselves. If you've ever run a business you'll know that businesses don't pay taxes, they collect them. A tax or a fee on a business is no different than labor and material, just another cost that is included in the final sale price and passed on to the consumer. It will actually cost more because the business will have additional overhead costs for the collecting and bookkeeping process and will do as they do with labor and material, mark it up. It's not greed, it's how businesses work."

That is exactly what should have happened in the case of funding for all the new infrastructure required to support thousands of new homes. That cost should be passed on to the buyers of those new homes in the form of appropriate impact fees. It should not be borne by all the other residents of Sumter County. The developer got a sweet deal from the commissioners.

[dewilson58]

How much of the budget dollars are going to "developer roads"???

[Two Bills]

Originally Posted by John41

There is nothing foolish about replacing the current commissioners who voted for the 25% tax increase and we should also repeal “One Sumter”. They could raise taxes again as they said Sumter will become like Orlando and that population and taxes are directly related. We know know how population is headed. Also, the developer got a great deal on the impact fee, paying less than the Florida average and throwing the burden on existing tax payers. Real conservatives reduce taxes, they don’t raise them.

......which reduces income.
Where do you suggest the cuts are made to counter the lower income?
When you have your answer take it to the meeting and put it to the commisioners.

[Altavia]

Originally Posted by bob47

That is exactly what should have happened in the case of funding for all the new infrastructure required to support thousands of new homes. That cost should be passed on to the buyers of those new homes in the form of appropriate impact fees. It should not be borne by all the other residents of Sumter County. The developer got a sweet deal from the commissioners.

The "other residents" of Sumter County also benefit from the infrastructure investments due to the increased tax revenue from new homes as well as significant growth in the value of properties surrounding The Villages.

[Goldwingnut]

The impact fee is determined by each municipal government and is designed to cover the costs of upgrading and/or providing additional infrastructure to support development they approve. Our unique demographic here in Sumter County with its predominantly age restricted/55+ development(s) skews this number because there is little need for additional schools (very few children in The Villages), recreation facilities, and additional infrastructure to support the new development is provided by the developer through the use of the CDD development bonds.

For example, if you look at other developments, they would rely on the city/county to bring in the water and sewage mains into the new development and then add these costs into the impact fee calculations. The higher impact fee is then added to the individual home cost. In Sumter County the developer is responsible for nearly all infrastructure requirements and includes these in the development bonds, which is passed onto the homeowner. Either way, the new homeowner pays the costs, the advantage of the way The Villages is developed is they've taken out the additional layer of government bureaucracy that wastes both time and money to do the same job. Imagine how slowly things would move in The Villages if they had to wait on the county to put out to bid, make a decision, coordinate, and then run the work, the developer would go out of business waiting.

The developer also isn't responsible for upgrading the existing county roads to support the development that was approved by the county or city. Why? Because that is exactly what the impact fee if for! CR468, 501, 470 all have to be upgraded to support the approved development and the fees for this come from the impact fees. These fees continue to be paid with each new home. What happens to the money once the county gets it is another issue, perhaps mismanagement, perhaps incompetence, in either case, we the taxpayers ultimately have paid the price.

Some compare the building of Morse Blvd and Buena Vista to the upgrades to 468 & 501, this is folly. Morse and Buena Vista did not exist prior to development so the developer was responsible for 100% of the cost to build these roads. The county did not pay for these roads, we did as homeowners through the development bonds on each of our homes, no one else north of CR466 or elsewhere in the county paid a dime for these roads. 501/468 have been county roads, and the county's responsibility for decades, take a look at the historical maps on Google Earth of the area and you will see they have existed for decades. The county is benefiting from The Villages upgrading these roads. The developer already has the manpower and equipment mobilized and can upgrade these roads for the county at a lower cost per mile than the county government can, and they get paid for this work by the county.

If there is an issue with the impact fees it is the county's fault. The fee is discounted 66% for age restricted communities in a county where 90% of the development is age restricted communities? What genius thought that made any sense? Does it benefit the developer? Once again NO, they will just roll any fee into the cost of a new house when it is sold. Does anyone really think that an additional $1500 in the price of a house here in The Villages will stop a sale? It won't, the buying demographic for The Villages is predominantly not price motivated.

I do not champion the developer in this discussion, I am trying to champion the facts. The fact is that our county government is not looking out for the long term interest of ALL THE RESIDENTS of Sumter County. They are only looking to make themselves look good. The low taxes and impact fees in Sumter County are not because of any work the government has done, it is in spite of everything that they have done that private industry has flourished and grown that has kept our taxes in check.

It is time for us as residents to muster up more than digital courage and stand up and be heard. We can vent on social media all we want and it does absolutely nothing to change things, when we stand before our government leaders and say, "No, not any more" things start to happen, but it takes more than one voice, it takes all of our voices. The best thing that can happen at these workshops is that they have to be canceled and moved to a larger facility so that our voices can be heard.

[dewilson58]

This is the time to get involved!!!!

[Goldwingnut]

I find it interesting that with all the complaining about the tax increase on this and other sites that there were so few interested in this post. I will be at the meeting tomorrow with my questions.

The real questions however should be coming from those who are running to replace the current commissioners as they will inherit this budget, and the basis of their campaigns has been about the budget.

Today's Daily Sun headline article was all hot air and campaigning for the incumbents. This was little more than patting us on the head to make us feel good after kicking us in the butt last year.

[LuvtheVillages]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

Some compare the building of Morse Blvd and Buena Vista to the upgrades to 468 & 501, this is folly. Morse and Buena Vista did not exist prior to development so the developer was responsible for 100% of the cost to build these roads. The county did not pay for these roads, we did as homeowners through the development bonds on each of our homes, no one else north of CR466 or elsewhere in the county paid a dime for these roads. 501/468 have been county roads, and the county's responsibility for decades, take a look at the historical maps on Google Earth of the area and you will see they have existed for decades. The county is benefiting from The Villages upgrading these roads. The developer already has the manpower and equipment mobilized and can upgrade these roads for the county at a lower cost per mile than the county government can, and they get paid for this work by the county.

If there is an issue with the impact fees it is the county's fault. The fee is discounted 66% for age restricted communities in a county where 90% of the development is age restricted communities? What genius thought that made any sense? Does it benefit the developer? Once again NO, they will just roll any fee into the cost of a new house when it is sold. Does anyone really think that an additional $1500 in the price of a house here in The Villages will stop a sale? It won't, the buying demographic for The Villages is predominantly not price motivated.

.

Yes, 468 and 501 have existed for decades and are the county's responsibility. BUT, the only reason they need to be upgraded is because of all the new homes the developer is building. The developer should be paying for those improvements, either directly or through the impact fee. Yes, he will add that cost onto the cost of the homes, so it ends up that the new homeowners are paying for the improved roads. That sounds fair to me.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

I find it interesting that with all the complaining about the tax increase on this and other sites that there were so few interested in this post. I will be at the meeting tomorrow with my questions.

The real questions however should be coming from those who are running to replace the current commissioners as they will inherit this budget, and the basis of their campaigns has been about the budget.

Today's Daily Sun headline article was all hot air and campaigning for the incumbents. This was little more than patting us on the head to make us feel good after kicking us in the butt last year.

Thanks for the posts. Was wondering about the article in todays paper.

Will not go to the meeting tomorrow but my vote will be influenced by what we have been hearing here.

[Goldwingnut]

Originally Posted by LuvtheVillages

Yes, 468 and 501 have existed for decades and are the county's responsibility. BUT, the only reason they need to be upgraded is because of all the new homes the developer is building. The developer should be paying for those improvements, either directly or through the impact fee. Yes, he will add that cost onto the cost of the homes, so it ends up that the new homeowners are paying for the improved roads. That sounds fair to me.

That is exactly what is supposed to be happening with the impact fees. The question becomes is the fees collected being managed properly? Does it make sense to give over 86% of the new growth impact fees a 65% discount (these are the county's own numbers)? Is the county doing the right thing by offering such a discount? I think the answer to all 3 is no.

[Northwoods]

Thanks GoldWingNut!!! I have to admit your explanation made my head hurt a little bit, but you obviously know what you're talking about.
I agree that there are many people who are upset about the 25% increase. They want to vote out the incumbents. I don't think you're getting a lot of comments on your post because most (if not virtually all) of the people who are vocal about voting out the incumbents don't have a clue about the inner workings of Sumter government. They just want to stick it to the Developer.
I really appreciate your thoughtful and informative post.

[Investment Painting Contractors]

Being bored I've started cleaning out my old paperwork. I found an old tax bill from Racine Wi dated Jan 1990. The building was valued at $40,000 taxable value. My over-all tax bill was $1,520,74. My taxes here seem like a bargain. With the increase my taxes here will be almost what they were when I bought my house 14 yrs ago. People forget that after the crash they lowered our taxable value. Thus lowering our taxes almost every year. I'm a happy camper that I don't have to pay TAXES in Wisconsin. Florida is still a deal. My Humble opinion. Len

[crash]

Originally Posted by bob47

I agree with most of the original post but take exception to this thought:

"I would caution all not to be foolish enough to say raise taxes on the developer and the other business, it doesn't work. You're not going to hurt any business by raising taxes, only yourselves. If you've ever run a business you'll know that businesses don't pay taxes, they collect them. A tax or a fee on a business is no different than labor and material, just another cost that is included in the final sale price and passed on to the consumer. It will actually cost more because the business will have additional overhead costs for the collecting and bookkeeping process and will do as they do with labor and material, mark it up. It's not greed, it's how businesses work."

That is exactly what should have happened in the case of funding for all the new infrastructure required to support thousands of new homes. That cost should be passed on to the buyers of those new homes in the form of appropriate impact fees. It should not be borne by all the other residents of Sumter County. The developer got a sweet deal from the commissioners.

Raising the impact fee on the developer to the same level as any other builder is not a tax but a fee on the developer that he can pass on to new home buyers. The roads built to support the new development should be paid by people buying new homes not the entire county.