[jayerose]

when the development is built out?

thank you!

[downeaster]

Originally Posted by jayerose

when the development is built out?

thank you!

Yes. However there is a cap.

[Chatbrat]

What is the cap ?

[Carl in Tampa]

Originally Posted by Chatbrat

What is the cap ?

It is tied to the Consumer Price Index. If you purchased a home in TV the information is in your paperwork.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Chatbrat

What is the cap ?

funnier yet---what is a build out???

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by jayerose

when the development is built out?

thank you!

Originally Posted by downeaster

Yes. However there is a cap.

How would build out trigger an increase?

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by jayerose

when the development is built out?

Our amenities have increased every year since 2007. But there is a cap.

[Carla B]

Ours went down this year... by 4 cents.

[SouthOfTheBorder]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

How would build out trigger an increase?

Don

[Barefoot]

Originally Posted by Carla B

Ours went down this year... by 4 cents.

Good news. Only a 4 cent decrease, but much better than an increase.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

funnier yet---what is a build out???

Build out is a myth!

[outlaw]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

How would build out trigger an increase?

The idea is that once the non-existent build out occurs, the developer will not have incentive to keep the fees as low as possible to not turn off buyers of new homes. This is a common strategy with many developments. The developer in many developments will eat a lot of maintenance and other costs that would normally be the shared responsibility of all owners, with the idea of keeping HOA fees down while new home sales are active.

[Bryan]

Amenity fees will go up as inflation goes up. Right now the annual increase in the fees is tied to the CPI and there is a cap at around $155.00/month on the total. I suspect the CPI part will remain as long as they calculate a CPI and I suspect, over time, our local government will have to increase the cap to some number above $155.00/month. Nothing (well, almost nothing) keeps getting cheaper.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by outlaw

The idea is that once the non-existent build out occurs, the developer will not have incentive to keep the fees as low as possible to not turn off buyers of new homes. This is a common strategy with many developments. The developer in many developments will eat a lot of maintenance and other costs that would normally be the shared responsibility of all owners, with the idea of keeping HOA fees down while new home sales are active.

Theory is true, but I was wondering about actual numbers. Is the developer subsidizing maintenance?
Amenities fee = $145/mo from over 50,000 homes = 7.25 million/mo = 87 million/year
Costs?--would love to see the budget.
Here are some assumptions, they may be way off so feel free to pounce on this:
35 soon to be 38 executive courses:
The maintenance on a full 9 hole course in NY is about $140,000/year. This course is twice as long as an executive and does not have the economy of scale that 38 courses in proximity have regarding equipment, labor and chemical purchases, but because of climate is only open 7 mo/ year and gets far less play. So let's go real high and assume $120,000 year for each course = $380,000/ mo = 4.6 million/year
About 80 rec centers:
I am part owner in a 30,000 sq ft commercial office, cleaning and maintenance runs about $50,000 year. IF equivalent this would be about 4 million/year for the rec centers
About 80+ pools
My pool costs less than $1000/year, so let's assume $10,000/year for a public pool = $800,000/year
Plantings at RBs and intersections changed out 4x/year
Maybe $5,000/year each on about 100 = $500,000/ year
100 miles of MMP's---who knows, but it is Florida climate and not maintained by state workers, so throw a few million at that (unless getting striped)
Neighborhood watch and gates
Maybe a staff of 200 earning 25K /year max = 5 million/year
Any subsidy of nightly entertainment?
Say 1/2 of $800/night at each square = 4 million/year

So far, the above math only accounts for about 20 million/year of 87+ million. I'm sure I've forgotten some things, like the Sharon, the administrative staff, etc, but there seems to be plenty of room without major developer subsidy, so I'm not sure amenity fees are pre-destined to increase dramatically after the " build out"

[outlaw]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Theory is true, but I was wondering about actual numbers. Is the developer subsidizing maintenance?
Amenities fee = $145/mo from over 50,000 homes = 7.25 million/mo = 87 million/year
Costs?--would love to see the budget.
Here are some assumptions, they may be way off so feel free to pounce on this:
35 soon to be 38 executive courses:
The maintenance on a full 9 hole course in NY is about $140,000/year. This course is twice as long as an executive and does not have the economy of scale that 38 courses in proximity have regarding equipment, labor and chemical purchases, but because of climate is only open 7 mo/ year and gets far less play. So let's go real high and assume $120,000 year for each course = $380,000/ mo = 4.6 million/year
About 80 rec centers:
I am part owner in a 30,000 sq ft commercial office, cleaning and maintenance runs about $50,000 year. IF equivalent this would be about 4 million/year for the rec centers
About 80+ pools
My pool costs less than $1000/year, so let's assume $10,000/year for a public pool = $800,000/year
Plantings at RBs and intersections changed out 4x/year
Maybe $5,000/year each on about 100 = $500,000/ year
100 miles of MMP's---who knows, but it is Florida climate and not maintained by state workers, so throw a few million at that (unless getting striped)
Neighborhood watch and gates
Maybe a staff of 200 earning 25K /year max = 5 million/year
Any subsidy of nightly entertainment?
Say 1/2 of $800/night at each square = 4 million/year

So far, the above math only accounts for about 20 million/year of 87+ million. I'm sure I've forgotten some things, like the Sharon, the administrative staff, etc, but there seems to be plenty of room without major developer subsidy, so I'm not sure amenity fees are pre-destined to increase dramatically after the " build out"

You forgot the vig of 67M. Just kidding. The one thing I would point out regarding your analysis is either your estimates are waaaaay off, or some one is stashing a lot of moola, or both.