[OutsiderWithInterest]

Originally Posted by EdVinMass

Lets not confuse the issue by using the trail fee argument as a justification for allowing the developer to add fees at his whim to the basic amenities and pocketing the revenue.

The trail fees are revenues that go into the operating funds of the amenites and offsets the cost of maintaining the executive course golf cart paths. That revenue I believe is listed on the Village Center Community Development District's (VCCDD) Recreational Amenities Division (RAD) annual budget as "Parks & Recreation Fees & Charges" to the tune of 1.6 million dollars. Here's a link to that http://www.districtgov.org/vccdd/you...bas_090131.pdf

As far as I know, not one cent of the 8 dollars per month charged for the online tee time system ends up in the revenues of the VCCDD's RAD.

Now if I'm wrong about that and those fees are in fact revenue to the VCCDD, then I would withdraw my objection to it and any discussion of the issue can focus on whether or not one feels it's worth the value added and use it or not based on personal choice.

The argument could also be made that the presence or absence of the online system in no way affects anyone's ability to golf at the villages. How would you quantify this added value then? Resident 1 may be golfing 7 days a week using the phone system with no complaints. Resident 2 may be doing the same via the online system, also with no complaints. What's the difference of benefit? One might say, "It's too hard to work with groups on the phone." Others then might say, "I don't care about groups. It works fine for me and my small group."

Nevertheless, let's cut to the chase. The REAL argument is about you not getting access FOR FREE right?...with "FREE" meaning that whatever the cost, it is spread among every resident. In other words, why should you pay $8 when you could by paying $1 or $2? If it was $0 there would be no problem whatsoever right?! That's what's going on here. You want to use whatever tool possible (now legal documents) to force the issue, so you can use the online tee time system for free.

So then, why not advocate that the district pay for it then? Charge every house a couple of bucks a month and be done with it. Then you get it for FREE. Provided that $2 bucks a house would cover the costs. Never mind those who have no need for it or ever want it. Make them pay anyway.

I have to say, fwiw, this is how the US got so screwed up. Some group in Oregon needs 50-million bucks for something. Instead of them forking over the cash, they tickle the ears of their representative (and leave a few bucks in his pocket), and he goes back to Washington and gets it appropriated. Then I, way down here in Florida, get to help pay a few cents for a little project in Oregon that I will never see, touch, smell, or worse of all, even know that I paid for part of it.

[EdV]

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

......Nevertheless, let's cut to the chase. The REAL argument is about you not getting access FOR FREE right?

Wrong!

Furthermore, this is not a political discussion. If you want to discuss politics and how tax dollars are spent, there is a forum for that. This is about business. The amenity fee is not a tax, it’s a fee that is mandated by a contract between the developer and every villager.

And the amenities identified in that contract are supposed to be managed according to that contract. This is a discussion about whether or not the developer should be allowed to add a service to an amenity and charge separately for it and pocket the profits instead of having that service funded by the amenity and being paid for by the service fees collected from the golfers that prefer to use that value added service.

[dillywho]

I signed up with the Villages.net when I ditched Comcast Cable internet and went with Sprint DSL (now Embarq) because I could no longer afford the cable internet. At that time it was $6. The way cable keeps going up, it stands to reason that they are not furnishing Villages.net for nothing. Contracts expire and maybe that is what has happened here. Don't know how it all works, but it could be that Villages.net now has to pay Comcast. Everything is not covered by the ammenity fee...else we couldn't afford the fee, either. My son lives in Jacksonville and pays $176 monthly fee and for that gets an outdoor pool, a party room, workout room, and maintenance for his postage stamp yard.....no golf courses, no rec centers, no golf cart privileges, etc. Seems we already get a lot for our money.

[Hancle704]

I have no way of knowing what transpired back then, between the Developer who apparently owns TheVillages.net and Comcast, that provided online access for Village's Comcast clients to the tee time system. I am of the opinion that there had to be some arrangement made $$$$, that gave TheVillages.net some compensation for this service. Now that the contract is about to expire it would seem reasonable for Comcast to either renew it and continue to pay the fee or, give it's clients who have been using the service a reduction in their monthly high speed internet charge.

Am I alone in this thinking view?

[aln]

Here's my opinion folks......... it's kinda like the buffalo!

[The Great Fumar]

When the villages are completed there will be 46 golf courses (including 12 country clubs with 27 holes each.) Having the ability to go online and scan all the courses and pic and choose the one you want is an outstanding perk that is cheap at 8 bucks.....I haven't lost one minutes sleep over it and to cover it , once a month I won't go to McDonald's for lunch on my way home from the golf course...However now that I think about it , I don't think I ever did go to McDonald's for lunch so I probably won't miss it......
That said, let me respond to a poster who said that the Exec courses are not for real golfers and just for beginners and old people ......I will be glad to forward your note on to NANCY LOPEZ who played pelican from the blues and stated afterward that she didn't think she was ready for this tour......

The online system is a valuable service to me and many of my golfing friends and I for one consider it a great tool for creating ease of play in the villages , I consider it a heleva deal....
for those who don't , Then DIAL ONE FOR ENGLISH !!!!!!

THE GREAT FUMAR...

[dillywho]

Originally Posted by The Great Fumar

When the villages are completed there will be 46 golf courses (including 12 country clubs with 27 holes each.) Having the ability to go online and scan all the courses and pic and choose the one you want is an outstanding perk that is cheap at 8 bucks.....I haven't lost one minutes sleep over it and to cover it , once a month I won't go to McDonald's for lunch on my way home from the golf course...However now that I think about it , I don't think I ever did go to McDonald's for lunch so I probably won't miss it......
That said, let me respond to a poster who said that the Exec courses are not for real golfers and just for beginners and old people ......I will be glad to forward your note on to NANCY LOPEZ who played pelican from the blues and stated afterward that she didn't think she was ready for this tour......

The online system is a valuable service to me and many of my golfing friends and I for one consider it a great tool for creating ease of play in the villages , I consider it a heleva deal....
for those who don't , Then DIAL ONE FOR ENGLISH !!!!!!

THE GREAT FUMAR...

Real golfers??? As far as I know, Nancy and Arnie are the only ones here that have been on a real tour. I don't know of any of the other "real golfers" here that have a Green Jacket, either.

[chuckster]

Agree with all you say Fumar except Tierra and OBH are 18 holes. Thought I would point that out as I knew you were testing us to see who would catch it first.

[Russ_Boston]

Originally Posted by dillywho

Real golfers??? As far as I know, Nancy and Arnie are the only ones here that have been on a real tour. I don't know of any of the other "real golfers" here that have a Green Jacket, either.

Not sure what your point is. There are some excellent players who live in TV.

And besides, TV golf is for everyone to enjoy.

[zcaveman]

Originally Posted by dillywho

Real golfers??? As far as I know, Nancy and Arnie are the only ones here that have been on a real tour. I don't know of any of the other "real golfers" here that have a Green Jacket, either.

I have a green jacket. Does that make me a real golfer or just a guy with a green jacket. Ami I missing something?

[Ooper]

Originally Posted by dillywho

Real golfers??? As far as I know, Nancy and Arnie are the only ones here that have been on a real tour. I don't know of any of the other "real golfers" here that have a Green Jacket, either.

Wow... went over my head!

[dadspet]

$8 for what you get is a rip off. Way over priced for a single function internet used a few times a week for a very short period of time. Perhaps those who play Championship courses don't mind the extra fee but to me it stinks!

And using the phone system is a real hassle!

[dillywho]

Originally Posted by Russ_Boston

Not sure what your point is. There are some excellent players who live in TV.

And besides, TV golf is for everyone to enjoy.

I'll try and spell it out for ya'll. I was referring to the remark in the quote I included that alluded to the idea that the executive courses were for those in TV that are not "real golfers" and was wondering just what a "real golfer" by their definition would be. I got from that post that some of the excellent golfers you referenced feel that they are too good to stoop to the level of playing executive courses. They may be good, but not as good as Nancy Lopez or Arnie Palmer for instance, and she evidently will play those courses. As for the green jacket, I meant the one earned by playing and winning the Masters. Sorry, I didn't mean to offend anyone by questioning the post and you're right...TV golf is for everyone to enjoy and not be belittled by which course or courses they choose to play in the process.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by dillywho

Real golfers??? As far as I know, Nancy and Arnie are the only ones here that have been on a real tour. I don't know of any of the other "real golfers" here that have a Green Jacket, either.

Lucy, please splain!

[jackcis]

I agree with you, also, I think that especially during the Holidays most anyone who visits the home owners are either grand children, sons etc. When you take them to an Executive
Course and they charge you $10.00 each for the kids, but things must be really bad, they charge and additional $5.00 for the kids to ride in your golf cart.
Hard to understand how much money you now have to pay for a little enjoyment with you family