[Northwoods]

Originally Posted by dtennent

In the small rural upstate NY town in which I lived, I was involved with the Planning board and eventually became the head of the Town Board. I knew the budget inside out. With that experience, I am not surprised that a large tax increase came after years of no tax increases. I am aware that there has been incredible increase in the tax base. However, residential development has a large infrastructure upkeep in the long haul. Roads don't last forever. With more residents, there is an increase need in the sheriff department, the court system, health department and many other government services. I am sure that the new board members are on a steep learning curve about the budget, how the county government runs, etc. I applaud that they are taking 6 months to learn enough to make a sound decision regarding the impact fees as well as our tax rate. Hopefully, as they go through the process, they will help all of us learn some of the intricacies that impact their final decision.

Excellent post. It's refreshing to hear from someone who can speak from experience.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by Northwoods

Excellent post. It's refreshing to hear from someone who can speak from experience.

Nothing new from the refreshing post.
All points stated before.
=Tax increase after years of none.
=Developments have infrastructure.
=Roads wear out.
=Expansion need sheriff, courts, health, etc.
=Trio are inexperienced, clueless and need education

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by Advogado

You have not said one word about the issue here: Why should the current residents pay for county infrastructure necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages? Somebody has to pay for it, and that somebody clearly should be the Developer.

Prior expansions have been supplemented thru the current impact fee structure with no tax increases. The County should have increased taxes a percent or two over the last ten years. If they would have done this, the County would not have increased taxes by 25% in one year. The math is there. SO, Pay Me Now, Pay Me Later. Later is here.


So all this whining is for less than $1 per day.


County Taxes, State Taxes & Federal Taxes are used for roads that I will never use and that you will never use.


Less than $1 per day.



Even if the Impacts Fee were at 100% of the Professionally Recommended structure, the property taxes would have still increased by over 22%.


Less than $1 per day.

[Advogado]

By about a two-to-one margin, the voters of Sumter County have already rejected the pseudo economics set forth both on this site (in posts by a couple of Developer defenders) and in the Daily Sun (in a series of so-called articles written by the Developer's Minister of Propaganda, David R. Corder). By electing the EMS Team to the County Commission, the voters decided that the current residents of Sumter County should not give the Developer hundreds of millions of their dollars by paying, through the residents' property-taxes, for county infrastructure that the Developer should be paying for through his impact fees.

Now, it is up to the new Commissioners, Messrs. Estep, Miller, and Search, to make good on their campaign promise by ending the Developer's sweetheart deal on impact fees and cutting our property taxes. With a majority on the Commission, they should do so NOW. Commissioner Miller is trying to do so. Commissioners Estep and Search voted to defer action until July.

Contact Commissioners Estep and Search and ask them to keep their campaign promise and to do so now. Deferral of action until July is putting millions of dollars into the Developer's pocket at our expense. The phone number Messrs. Estep and Search is 352-689-4400.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by Advogado

Deferral of action until July is putting millions of dollars into the Developer's pocket at our expense. The phone number Messrs. Estep and Search is 352-689-4400.

Yes, hate to defer action and get the inexperienced Commissioners educated........uneducated Commissioners & posters is much better.

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Prior expansions have been supplemented thru the current impact fee structure with no tax increases. The County should have increased taxes a percent or two over the last ten years. If they would have done this, the County would not have increased taxes by 25% in one year. The math is there. SO, Pay Me Now, Pay Me Later. Later is here.


So all this whining is for less than $1 per day.


County Taxes, State Taxes & Federal Taxes are used for roads that I will never use and that you will never use.


Less than $1 per day.



Even if the Impacts Fee were at 100% of the Professionally Recommended structure, the property taxes would have still increased by over 22%.


Less than $1 per day.

I am not "whining" about "less than a dollar a day". I can afford it, but some people cannot. And the Developer's impact fees should not be limited to 100% of roads, as you imply, He ought to be paying for ALL the county infrastructure necessitated by the massive expansion of The Villages, and if some of those costs get passed on to new home buyers, fine.

The real issue here is the crony capitalism that is putting hundreds of millions of residents' dollars into the pocket of the Developer. He packed the County Commission with his puppets. The puppets then gave him a sweetheart deal on impact fees and hit the residents with a massive property-tax increase.

And I have been doing something to address this malfeasance, not "whining". This includes doing what I could to replace 3 of the Developer's puppet Commissioners with the EMS Team in the last election and insisting that the EMS Team keep their campaign promise. If anybody has been "whining", it is the defenders of the Developer now that his sweetheart deal on impact fees is under attack.

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Yes, hate to defer action and get the inexperienced Commissioners educated........uneducated Commissioners & posters is much better.

The new Commissioners had a full year to study impact fees. They don't need another six months. Time is money.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Nothing new from the refreshing post.
All points stated before.
=Tax increase after years of none.
=Developments have infrastructure.
=Roads wear out.
=Expansion need sheriff, courts, health, etc.
=Trio are inexperienced, clueless and need education

My thoughts too. It seems to me that there is a lobbying effort at foot again. I am not a fan.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by Advogado

I am not "whining" about "less than a dollar a day". I can afford it, but some people cannot. And the Developer's impact fees should not be limited to 100% of roads, as you imply, He ought to be paying for ALL the county infrastructure necessitated by the massive expansion of The Villages, and if some of those costs get passed on to new home buyers, fine.

The real issue here is the crony capitalism that is putting hundreds of millions of residents' dollars into the pocket of the Developer. He packed the County Commission with his puppets. The puppets then gave him a sweetheart deal on impact fees and hit the residents with a massive property-tax increase.

And I have been doing something to address this malfeasance, not "whining". This includes doing what I could to replace 3 of the Developer's puppet Commissioners with the EMS Team in the last election and insisting that the EMS Team keep their campaign promise. If anybody has been "whining", it is the defenders of the Developer now that his sweetheart deal on impact fees is under attack.

Yes U R whining. Continuously.

Yes everyone can afford it, otherwise they should not be in a $300,000 house.
If they are not in a $300k home, they are not paying $1 per day.


Developers DO NOT pay 100%.
Counties & Commissioners want growth & they give incentives.


You have been asked for proof of your "puppet" label and have never delivered support. You may think it, but you have no proof.


Yes EMS is in.
They have no experience.
Made promises and voters fell for campaign promises.
Not sure I would be proud.



Hundreds of millions did not go into the Developer's pocket.

So many posters have tried to educate you.

Please learn, you might be a happier person.

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Nothing new from the refreshing post.
All points stated before.
=Tax increase after years of none.
=Developments have infrastructure.
=Roads wear out.
=Expansion need sheriff, courts, health, etc.
=Trio are inexperienced, clueless and need education

I am having a lot of trouble understanding your position. A simple question, which you continue to dance around as you criticize the EMS Team as "clueless": Who should pay for the County infrastructure necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages-- the Developer or the current residents? Somebody has to pay.

If you answer "both", how should the costs be split? Right now the Developer is paying 40% for the roads and 0% for everything else. The current residents are now paying 60% and 100% respectively. Two thirds of the voters decided that this isn't fair.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by Advogado

I am having a lot of trouble understanding your position. A simple question, which you continue to dance around as you criticize the EMS Team as "clueless": Who should pay for the County infrastructure necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages-- the Developer or the current residents? Somebody has to pay.

If you answer "both", how should the costs be split? Right now the Developer is paying 40% for the roads and 0% for everything else. The current residents are now paying 60% and 100% respectively. Two thirds of the voters decided that this isn't fair.

Simple. Both.
What you don't understand, if the Developer pays 100% of the Impact Study Fee .......you will NEVER get the 25% increase reversed. Never. That's what you are whining for. It ain't going to happen.


Also what you don't understand is the timing of revenues vs expenditure for the County. Even with 100% fee schedule, the County would be upside down on cashflow.



I'm for the Developer paying 100% of the Impact Fee Schedule.
The Villages will be glad to pay that schedule as well.
It's only a couple grand price increase per house.
Not sure if it's fair for a developer or a McDonalds down in Linden Florida to pay the fee.
New business will be hit with the new schedule.....fair??.....nope.



Impact Fees are meant for capital improvements, not operating expenses.
Operating expenses are paid by taxes.


Take time to do the math, understand commissioners' charters, County Government, and purpose of impact fees and maybe you will be a wiser voter next time.......rather than pushing and supporting inexperience and a silly promise.


Hope you have a nice day..............one of these days.

[Mleeja]

Originally Posted by Advogado

IT HAS TO BE GREAT TO BE ABLE TO SET YOUR OWN TAX RATE

Background of the 25% Property Tax Hike. In case any readers still don't know about the Developer's sweetheart impact fee and our huge property-tax hike to preserve it, they can watch this video, recorded at the County Commissioner's hearing on September 24, 2019-- as the Developer's puppets on the Commission were about to hike our property tax 25% to preserve that sweetheart fee: Scott Fenstermaker--How can five guys screw 125000 people? - YouTube

As a result of that property-tax increase, we the voters of Sumter County, last year, woke up to what had been going on and tossed out the three Developer's puppet Commissioners (Butler, Burgess, and Printz) who were up for re-election, and we voted in the EMS team of Estep, Miller, and Search. We did so on the basis of a promise by Estep, Miller, and Search to roll back the property tax hike by requiring the Developer to pay for his own county infrastructure through a reasonable impact fee.

Now this tax-reform process is in doubt.

The Developer's Efforts to Keep His Sweetheart Impact Fee. This process is in doubt because the Developer is doing everything in his power to preserve his sweetheart impact fee. He is lobbying the County Commissioners, packing a Commission meeting with his contractors and allies, filling the meeting parking lot with his contractors' heavy equipment so there were no parking spaces for the public, and running a series of propaganda articles in his newspaper vilifying impact fees. His latest ploy is an attempt to “voluntarily” raise his sweetheart road impact fee by 40% in exchange for protection from imposition from any other impact-fee increases. Well, a 40% increase of his sweetheart road impact fee won't come close to covering the costs of all county infrastructure that the Developer should be paying for.

A Comparison of Impact Fees. It is interesting to compare the impact fees that the Developer would pay in Collier County (where his puppets do not set impact fees) with what he pays in Sumter County:
In Collier County, the builder of a retirement community would pay impact fees for:
>Community Parks,
>Regional Parks,
>Roads,
>EMS,
>Schools,
>Government Buildings,
>Libraries,
>Law Enforcement,
>Jail,
>Water,
>Sewer, and
>Fire.
The total of these impact fees in Collier County is approximately $24,000/house, the exact amount depending on where in the county it is built.

In Sumter County, the Developer pays an impact fee of only $972 for roads. (This is only 40% of what the impact-fee study calculated each of his houses is costing the county for new roads). THE DEVELOPER PAYS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR THE OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE that Collier County collects for. Who pays for all the stuff that the Developer doesn't pay for? We, the residents (individuals and existing businesses), do. The Daily Sun articles claim that reasonable impact fees in Sumter County would “paralyze” growth here. Nonsense. The impact fees are 25 times higher in Collier County, and growth there has not been “paralyzed”. Reasonable impact fees allow lower property taxes and are good for the economy. For the truth about the economic benefit of paying for new infrastructure via impact fees, check out this report: Paying for Prosperity: Impact Fees and Job Growth

What Voters Can Do Now to Get Our Property Tax Rolled Back. If the EMS Team had stuck together and stuck to their promises, with 3 of the 5 Commissioners, the process would have started already. But, for some reason, Mr. Estep made a motion to delay even considering the necessary impact-fee increase for six months, and it was passed with the votes of Mr. Search and Developer puppet Breeden. After Mr. Estep was criticized by the public for his motion, Mr. Search came to his defense in the on-line news, calling voters who believed Mr. Estep's campaign promise of tax reform “ill-informed”. In light of the Developer's brazen proposal to set his own tax rate, it looks like the Developer thinks that he has flipped at least one member of the EMS Team and thus controls at least 3 of the 5 votes. Meantime, the six-month delay puts millions of dollars into the Developer's pocket, at our expense, as the Developer pays impact fees at the sweetheart rate and we subsidize him as our property tax accrues at its inflated rate.

Given the fact that the Developer feels confident enough about his influence over the County Commission to believe that he can set his own tax rate, what can we, the voters, do to successfully roll back the massive property-tax increase? I have to admit: I don't know.

The Sad Conclusion. The sad truth is that we won the battle by voting out the Developer's puppets (Butler, Burgess, and Printz). However, in light of the votes of Mr. Estep and Mr. Search, the Developer may have won the war. Probably all we can do is contact Messrs. Estep and Search and insist they keep their promise to us. We can also contact Mr. Miller and thank him for keeping his. Contact information is available here: About the Commissioners | Sumter County, FL - Official Website Obviously, contacting Messrs. Gilpin or Breeden would be a waste of time. We have to vote them out next year.

Why do you continue to post lies? Comparing Sumter County to Collier County is like comparing apples and oranges. They are both just fruit! In Sumter County the impact fee covers just roads. All the other stuff you mentioned are built and paid with the development bonds.

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by Mleeja

Why do you continue to post lies? Comparing Sumter County to Collier County is like comparing apples and oranges. They are both just fruit! In Sumter County the impact fee covers just roads. All the other stuff you mentioned are built and paid with the development bonds.

You need to do some further research and understand what is going on before accusing me of lying. The fact that Sumter County impact fees only cover roads and only 40% of their cost and nothing for other infrastructure is exactly the point. Why do you think that is?

For your information: The "development" bonds to which you refer, but apparently don't understand, only cover infrastructure within the relevant Community Development District.

To determine what appropriate impact fees should be for county infrastructure requires a study by a consulting firm, as was done regarding the road costs. Until that study is done, nobody knows what those impact fees should be. I have never claimed to have that information. They may turn out to be less that Collier County, but could turn out to be more.

Bottom line: somebody has to pay for the additional infrastructure-- the Developer or the current residents. You seem to be arguing that it should be the current residents. If so, why don't you simply say so instead of accusing me of lying.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Advogado

........Bottom line: somebody has to pay for the additional infrastructure-- the Developer or the current residents. You seem to be arguing that it should be the current residents. If so, why don't you simply say so instead of accusing me of lying.

Bottom line: somebody has to pay for the additional infrastructure-- New residents or the current residents. You seem to be arguing that it should be the new residents. If so, why don't you simply say so, instead of trying to convince people that "the developer" will pay?

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by Advogado

I am not "whining" about "less than a dollar a day". I can afford it, but some people cannot. And the Developer's impact fees should not be limited to 100% of roads, as you imply, He ought to be paying for ALL the county infrastructure necessitated by the massive expansion of The Villages, and if some of those costs get passed on to new home buyers, fine.

The real issue here is the crony capitalism that is putting hundreds of millions of residents' dollars into the pocket of the Developer. He packed the County Commission with his puppets. The puppets then gave him a sweetheart deal on impact fees and hit the residents with a massive property-tax increase.

And I have been doing something to address this malfeasance, not "whining". This includes doing what I could to replace 3 of the Developer's puppet Commissioners with the EMS Team in the last election and insisting that the EMS Team keep their campaign promise. If anybody has been "whining", it is the defenders of the Developer now that his sweetheart deal on impact fees is under attack.

Now there is a new set of puppets........