[Ptmcbriz]

I have Munn’s come twice a year at any cost. They hook up their laptop to it and run diagnostics and email a copy. Plus they take the housing off and clean things and flush the drain system with a pump. Small price to pay to make sure my AC lasts and never breaks in this heat. My unit is 4 years old and started this proactive maintenance the first year. I’ve had to replace units in past homes and want to push off that huge expense as long as possible.

[Ptmcbriz]

Originally Posted by Joecooool

I've lived in Florida all my life. I don't know anyone who pays for preventative maintenance. They rinse off the coils a couple of times a year, dump vinegar in the return line a couple times a year, and replace the air filters every 90 days - that's it. We only have the AC guys come out when there is an issue.

Wrong. Munn’s hooks up a computer to the system and runs diagnostics and emails the results. Plus they pressure pump the drain among other things. All takes about 45 minutes. Everyone I know has their’s serviced. The only difference is if they do it once a year or twice a year.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Ptmcbriz

I have Munn’s come twice a year at any cost. They hook up their laptop to it and run diagnostics and email a copy. Plus they take the housing off and clean things and flush the drain system with a pump. Small price to pay to make sure my AC lasts and never breaks in this heat. My unit is 4 years old and started this proactive maintenance the first year. I’ve had to replace units in past homes and want to push off that huge expense as long as possible.

Nothing the technician does will ensure that your AC system will never break.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Ptmcbriz

Wrong. Munn’s hooks up a computer to the system and runs diagnostics and emails the results. Plus they pressure pump the drain among other things. All takes about 45 minutes. Everyone I know has their’s serviced. The only difference is if they do it once a year or twice a year.

I have never had my HVAC system maintained by a technician. And, as far as I know, there is no way to connect the system to a computer to run a diagnostic test. What information do you get from the email that they send?

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Nothing the technician does will ensure that your AC system will never break.

Thoroughly cleaning the drain line will greatly reduce the risk of it clogging.

Measuring the capacitor will determine whether it is about to fail and facilitate replacing it before it does.

Checking the delta temperatures will reveal if the system is functioning optimally and will initiate a conversation about replacement before a complete failure.

Inspecting and cleaning the evaporator coils will improve efficiency, reduce electrical usage/cost, and detect premature corrosion.

None of these will ensure that the system never breaks but they all lower the risk of it breaking suddenly in the middle of a heatwave.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

I have never had my HVAC system maintained by a technician. And, as far as I know, there is no way to connect the system to a computer to run a diagnostic test. What information do you get from the email that they send?

Mine has no connection either but I am not at all surprised to learn that newer systems do. It's probably a very inexpensive modification to have a pressure sensor changed from a binary good/bad to be calibrated and report the actual pressure. Temperature sensors before and after the evaporator coil could report delta temperatures. Ammeters and capacitance meters could be added to check current draw and the health of the capacitor.

[retiredguy123]

If you are only having maintenance performed once per year, that is not often enough to ensure that the condensate drain will not clog. And, you can easily clean the coils yourself. Also, I think the filter should be replaced at least every 6 months, and you can save money by buying and replacing your own filters. HVAC companies will charge at least $50 for a filter.

[Lancer]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Not really. I have never paid for any HVAC maintenance and my systems have all lasted at least 15 to 20 years, with no real issues.

It would interesting to know how many people, who pay for regular maintenance, have actually had the capacitor replaced during the maintenance visit, and how much extra they were charged.

Sunshine Air charged mine. $164.00 for a capacitor while on a maintenance visit. It was supposedly under warranty.

[crash]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

It seems redundant to pay for maintenance on a system that is still covered by a full parts and labor warranty.

You don’t do maintenance on your car till the warranty dies. Believe that would violate your warranty.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by crash

You don’t do maintenance on your car till the warranty dies. Believe that would violate your warranty.

I change the oil, but that is all. I have never had a problem enforcing the warranty.

[jrref]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

Thoroughly cleaning the drain line will greatly reduce the risk of it clogging.

Measuring the capacitor will determine whether it is about to fail and facilitate replacing it before it does.

Checking the delta temperatures will reveal if the system is functioning optimally and will initiate a conversation about replacement before a complete failure.

Inspecting and cleaning the evaporator coils will improve efficiency, reduce electrical usage/cost, and detect premature corrosion.

None of these will ensure that the system never breaks but they all lower the risk of it breaking suddenly in the middle of a heatwave.

Exactly

[jrref]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

Mine has no connection either but I am not at all surprised to learn that newer systems do. It's probably a very inexpensive modification to have a pressure sensor changed from a binary good/bad to be calibrated and report the actual pressure. Temperature sensors before and after the evaporator coil could report delta temperatures. Ammeters and capacitance meters could be added to check current draw and the health of the capacitor.

As far as connecting "a computer" to your system, what that person was referring to is they usually have a tablet device where they login for your visit and enter all the readings they are measuring such as pressures and temperatures, super heat, sub cooling, fan motor current draw, capacitor reading, etc... They are not connecting to any electronics in you system because there are no computerized electronics in it to connect to.

The only time they can "connect" electronically to your system is if you have a Carrier Infinity system. That system has electronics in it that enables the technician connect to it via bluetooth and gather all the readings, load software if necessary, etc... This system also has electronics that monitor's itself to help the technician determine if there is a problem and how to approach fixing it. Very cool.

[jrref]

Another case in point where you want a professional to put gauges on your system to measure the pressures, temperatures, super heat and sub cooling.

When the refrigerant as a liquid goes into your evaporator coil in your air handler, as the hotter air from your home passes over the coil, that cold liquid changes to a gas. If you have a dirty filter, fan motor not running at spec. so there is inadequate air flow, faulty TXV valve, etc., the refrigerant will not change 100% to a gas and a gas/liquid refrigerant mixture will go back to your compressor and make it fail prematurely. Your system will seem like it's running just fine but in reality it's slowly dying. The only way to detect this is by looking at the super heat when measuring the refrigerant with gauges and checking the airflow and current draw of the fan in the air handler. So while most think they are taking good care of their system by changing filters, cleaning the condenser coil and condensate line, not checking the refrigerant which requires specialized equipment and knowledge on how to use it, and not taking certain amperage reading of the fan motors is hiding potential problems that could be shortening the life of your system.

But many will say "Wait a minute, I do minimal maintenance and my system has been running with minimal problems for 15 years". That may be the case but it may last even longer if you detect and fix some of these other common issues which can shorten the life of your system.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by jrref

Another case in point where you want a professional to put gauges on your system to measure the pressures, temperatures, super heat and sub cooling.

When the refrigerant as a liquid goes into your evaporator coil in your air handler, as the hotter air from your home passes over the coil, that cold liquid changes to a gas. If you have a dirty filter, fan motor not running at spec. so there is inadequate air flow, faulty TXV valve, etc., the refrigerant will not change 100% to a gas and a gas/liquid refrigerant mixture will go back to your compressor and make it fail prematurely. Your system will seem like it's running just fine but in reality it's slowly dying. The only way to detect this is by looking at the super heat when measuring the refrigerant with gauges and checking the airflow and current draw of the fan in the air handler. So while most think they are taking good care of their system by changing filters, cleaning the condenser coil and condensate line, not checking the refrigerant which requires specialized equipment and knowledge on how to use it, and not taking certain amperage reading of the fan motors is hiding potential problems that could be shortening the life of your system.

But many will say "Wait a minute, I do minimal maintenance and my system has been running with minimal problems for 15 years". That may be the case but it may last even longer if you detect and fix some of these other common issues which can shorten the life of your system.

I am not saying that regular maintenance does not help to diagnose some issues. But, in my opinion, regular maintenance is not worth the cost in terms of return on investment. It benefits the HVAC companies way more than the customers. The same AC systems are used around the world in countries that have worse weather conditions than The Villages, and most of those systems are never maintained. I lived in Saudi Arabia where the average daytime temperature was about 115 degrees, and they did no maintenance whatsoever. I think that spending $100 to $200 every year to have a technician spend an hour checking gauges is a waste of money. If the unit is running and I am comfortable, I'm happy. Can you provide any benefit-to-cost data to justify the cost of a regular maintenance program? I would also add that none of the HVAC companies who promote these maintenance programs offer a written guarantee of repairs or system longevity.

[jrref]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

I am not saying that regular maintenance does not help to diagnose some issues. But, in my opinion, regular maintenance is not worth the cost in terms of return on investment. It benefits the HVAC companies way more than the customers. The same AC systems are used around the world in countries that have worse weather conditions than The Villages, and most of those systems are never maintained. I lived in Saudi Arabia where the average daytime temperature was about 115 degrees, and they did no maintenance whatsoever. I think that spending $100 to $200 every year to have a technician spend an hour checking gauges is a waste of money. If the unit is running and I am comfortable, I'm happy. Can you provide any benefit-to-cost data to justify the cost of a regular maintenance program? I would also add that none of the HVAC companies who promote these maintenance programs offer a written guarantee of repairs or system longevity.

Let me ask you, can you provide any benefit-to-cost data that doesn't justify the cost of a regular maintenance program?

But I see your point. What I disagree with is when you say spending money on having a professional check your system periodically is a waste of money.

I would have to go look for studies but you can go on Youtube and see tons of videos of HVAC repairs where the homeowner did no maintenance and the results.

Regardless, you just have to look at the science and engineering on how these systems work and how they typically fail to determine whether you think preventive maintenance helps prevent a failure and or prolongs the life of your system.

We can argue over preventing failures and I don't disagree, that's a whole other discussion but what we know for sure is depending on the maintenance you do or not, will have an effect on how long your system lasts. You can have what you think is a perfectly running unit, cooling the home just fine and have an electric bill that "looks" good but your system may not be running not as efficient as it could so you may be wasting money on excess energy exceeding the $200/year you could have spend making sure it's running efficiently. It's possible. I think out of all the discussion we have been having, this is the main point. And you can't know for sure unless you take some measurements because If your not testing, you are guessing.