[Jaggy]

Yikes.. Do I need to quit reading the TOTV?? Seriously.. great information but don't scare me like that first thing on Sunday morning, during the first full month of being a village resident.. I get a kick out of people.Doomsday is coming!!! the sky is falling..
remember.. we only have until Dec 21 and then we are all gone anyway.. Poof..or is it the 22nd??

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by EdV

The residents of TV have absolutely no interest in this dispute in spite of what Ms. Ritchie would like you to believe.

You have a simple and straightforward contract with the special district (VCCDD north of 466 or SLCDD south of 466). You are obligated to pay a monthly amenity fee that can never be increased annually by more than the consumer price index and that special district is obligated to maintain the amenities in a usual and customary manor.

If for any reason either of the special districts were to fail to maintain the amenities properly, then another class action suit would be brought against them just as it was a few years ago which resulted in a settlement in favor of the residents....

If residents are to be part of a class action lawsuit as a result of this dispute, as a resident it sure concerns me. If the special district is paying out money for legal fees and ultimately bond interest, it certainly begs the question of where the money is coming from to maintain the amenities.

[graciegirl]

It could mean that the whole thing will validate that it is perfectly tickety boo and that the CDD can continue to do business in the way they have...which I hope.

The Morses had more than adequate financial resources to cover this five years ago but apparently they and their legal counsel felt it was worth standing for.

It all depends whether you think that they would gamble their reputation on something shady since they have a number of legitimate ways to make money and they are making tons of it.

We were one of the thousands of people who bought property surrounded by swamp lands in the center of Florida, the lightning capital of the country and where sinkholes are rampant.

Damn I am glad we did.

[bimmertl]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Money that would be rightfully theirs? I will link again to that lawsuit that you keep bringing up. Read this again please.

Villages developer to pay $40 million for recreation upgrades to settle a lawsuit - Orlando Sentinel

ANYONE CAN SUE ANYONE. As a result of this LAWSUIT some individuals who live here apparently got a LOT of money.


Elaine Driedame is the president of the POA.

The developers maintain the areas and create beautiful new ones that I see south of 466 without anyone sueing them. I often wonder about that lawsuit.

You continually overlook a key part of this settlement, the confidentiality agreement. Normally these agreements are made to keep the amount of the overall settlement confidential. In this settlement, the amount was well known. So what is the purpose of the agreement?

As stated in the article. "The settlement includes confidentiality and nondisparagement clauses, which prevent the parties from discussing the case or criticizing Morse of the Villages".

No doubt, during the Discovery phase of this litigation, less than favorable information regarding the developer and his dealings was discovered. So what the agreement did was buy the silence of the parties who sued Morse et al.

Yes, anybody can sue anybody, but you don't routinely get $40 million settlement agreements unless one party feels they have a lot more to lose if the case ever went to trial, which this one didn't. No doubt at some point Morse sat down with his lawyers and discussed the worst case scenario if it went to trial, which was probably greater than the settlement amount, so they agreed on the settlement.

It took a lot of courage to become a named plaintiff against someone as powerful as Morse. It's not a walk in the park being involved in this type of litigation. The 50K each was a reasonable amount for the named plaintiffs to recover and Morse bought their silence with it.

[EdV]

Originally Posted by mickey100

If residents are to be part of a class action lawsuit as a result of this dispute, as a resident it sure concerns me. If the special district is paying out money for legal fees and ultimately bond interest, it certainly begs the question of where the money is coming from to maintain the amenities.

Ah, but when you signed the contract at your closing, you agreed that you have no right or interest in the recreational facilities nor to how the the amenity fees are used:

4.1 (g) Purchasers of Homesites further agree, .......that the owners, their heirs, successors and assigns, do not have any right, title or claim or interest in and to the recreational areas, security facilities, dedicated or reserved areas or facilities contained therein or appurtenant thereto, by reason of the purchase of their respective Homesites, it being specifically agreed that, (1) the Developer, its successors and assigns, is the sole and exclusive owner of the areas and facilities, and (2) the Contractual Amenities Fee is a fee for services and is in no way adjusted according to the cost of providing those services.

I'm not trying to rub anyones face in this but it is what it is so, there's no sense fretting about it now.

[Advogado]

In an earlier post, I mentioned that the Orlando Sentinel seemed to have lost interest in the subject. I guess I was wrong. Kudos to Lauren Ritchie for reporting objectively on a subject that is complex, but of crucial interest to Villagers. Now, if the VHA and the Daily Sun would finally do the same.

One observation about the article: It does not make the point that the potential impact on residents arises from the following. The Center Districts warranted to the bondholders that the interest on the bonds would be tax free. If that turns out not to be the case, the bondholders will sue the Center Districts for breach of that warranty in order to recover the amount of the taxes that they have to pay. (Remember that the bonds are secured by the pledge of the amenity-fee income-- another complication for the amenities system.) If the bondholders prevail, as they presumably would, the Center Districts would then become financially unable to continue to furnish the amenities.

And what happens next? At that point, things really get complicated, but none of the scenarios are pretty. By the way, I hope that none of this comes to pass-- and it may well not.

In anticipation of the "love it or leave it" response to this kind of post, I like it here. I don't intend to sell and leave, but I also, unlike some other posters, I do not intend to ignore the facts in regard to this subject.

[Madelaine Amee]

Originally Posted by EdV

I'm not trying to rub anyones face in this but it is what it is so, there's no sense fretting about it now.

............ they will. This constant bickering goes on and on and on for absolutely no reason. No one on this chat line has any idea what the outcome will be so this is all a waste of time, unless you have nothing better to do .............. so I had better take my own advice and get off here.

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by EdV

Ah, but when you signed the contract at your closing, you agreed that you have no right or interest in the recreational facilities nor to how the the amenity fees are used:

4.1 (g) Purchasers of Homesites further agree, .......that the owners, their heirs, successors and assigns, do not have any right, title or claim or interest in and to the recreational areas, security facilities, dedicated or reserved areas or facilities contained therein or appurtenant thereto, by reason of the purchase of their respective Homesites, it being specifically agreed that, (1) the Developer, its successors and assigns, is the sole and exclusive owner of the areas and facilities, and (2) the Contractual Amenities Fee is a fee for services and is in no way adjusted according to the cost of providing those services.

I'm not trying to rub anyones face in this but it is what it is so, there's no sense fretting about it now.

Back in 2004, when we bought, no one suspected that the Morses would set up the CDD's and have them operate in a manner that wasn't condoned by law. It wasn't until 2008 when the first lawsuit was settled that many residents even had an inkling of the shenanigans that were going on.

[eweissenbach]

As a future Villager, I do pay attention to the IRS issue, as well as anything else having to do with the development. I like to read the articles that Lauren Ritchie writes, as well as the POA statements, and the takes by various TOTVers who keep up on the subject. The great thing about living in a country which does not supress free speech, is the ability to read and hear about all the various sides, opinions, and takes on an issue, and then making one's own mind up about how it affects them. Ritchie is no lover of the developers, but that point of view is informative, even if it may be somewhat skewed. This issue gives me NO pause when considering TV as a future (part-time) home. I have said before, and will say again, the Morse organization has built the greatest utopia for retirees known to man. That does not make them infallable, perfect, or incapable of unlawful behavior, or operating on the fringe of ethics. The only thing that I can personally judge them on is the quality of life that they have provided for me while I am in TV, and on that level they are almost flawless.

[2BNTV]

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

As a future Villager, I do pay attention to the IRS issue, as well as anything else having to do with the development. I like to read the articles that Lauren Ritchie writes, as well as the POA statements, and the takes by various TOTVers who keep up on the subject. The great thing about living in a country which does not supress free speech, is the ability to read and hear about all the various sides, opinions, and takes on an issue, and then making one's own mind up about how it affects them. Ritchie is no lover of the developers, but that point of view is informative, even if it may be somewhat skewed. This issue gives me NO pause when considering TV as a future (part-time) home. I have said before, and will say again, the Morse organization has built the greatest utopia for retirees known to man. That does not make them infallable, perfect, or incapable of unlawful behavior, or operating on the fringe of ethics. The only thing that I can personally judge them on is the quality of life that they have provided for me while I am in TV, and on that level they are almost flawless.

Well said.

[lovesports]

Can't keep up with all these posts. But I sure wish this developer would be more open.
I also think it is good for people looking to know what is going on. Unlike us who have found all this out since we bought.
I can honestly say we have so many friends here that we would never leave. However, had I known all this, I probably would of bought in a different development with a different structure of government.
Just because I pay attention to the IRS issue doesn't mean I'm worrying. I'm not.
Off the computer for the day.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by mickey100

Back in 2004, when we bought, no one suspected that the Morses would set up the CDD's and have them operate in a manner that wasn't condoned by law. It wasn't until 2008 when the first lawsuit was settled that many residents even had an inkling of the shenanigans that were going on.

Weren't the CDD's in place long before 2004?

[mulligan]

If you think this form of government is a little dicey, try a development with a mandatory HOA, or a large condo association. As a previously licensed association manager in Florida, the decision to buy here was easy.

[lovesports]

Originally Posted by mulligan

If you think this form of government is a little dicey, try a development with a mandatory HOA, or a large condo association. As a previously licensed association manager in Florida, the decision to buy here was easy.

I'm sure you are right. That's like comparing one hit in the head to two hits in the head. There are some very open and very well-off developments that my friends live in, that's what I am talking about.

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

Weren't the CDD's in place long before 2004?

The issue is not how long they have been in place, but how they are operating in a manner not consistent with the intent of the laws regarding CDD's. No one knew that until the issues regarding the 2008 lawsuit came out and also the IRS investigation.