Talk of The Villages Florida

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-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Lawn ornament trolls (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/lawn-ornament-trolls-283938/)

billethkid 02-08-2019 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roob1 (Post 1623023)
The reporters are not interpreting the rules. They are reporting a "possible" violation. Community Standards then decides if a rule is violated. If they feel it is, they take action.

Again, the projection of blame.....

The action being notified is getting a letter stating the "confirmed"(?) violation.
Which often times goes to the circular file.

No follow up....

Selective, complaint driven system implies no complaints = no violations.
Then there is the assumption that.....the violator knows they are in violation. About the same level of concern as exhibited in the daily continuation of vehicle moving violations...speeding/stop sign running being at the top.

There is no objectivity in selective or complaint driven enforcement....did I mention that?

graciegirl 02-08-2019 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatureBoy (Post 1623032)
On the point that "it hurts nobody; if the neighbors are happy, keep your nose out of our business":

People tour the Villages, they visit exploring places to live. If they see various lawn ornaments - or whatever other things that violate the deed restrictions - they will think they can have a house that looks like that. Then they buy and discover they really can't have/do whatever. Now they are grumpy customers/residents. That hurts The Villages' image.

And as has also been pointed out, selective enforcement becomes a weapon that can be used against "undesirables". That sets up an environment of mob rule, not rule of law.

There's a quote out there somewhere that I couldn't find that essentially says: ignoring one law weakens respect for all laws.

So if the lawn ornament rule is so widely ignored & unenforced, it probably ought to be modified. But I doubt it will be. The books have many laws that get selectively enforced, they are political weapons at the ready. Many people like it that way.

I think I remember that you are considering living here?

It is my opinion that the "lawn ornament rule" is not widely ignored at all. I have lived here for eleven years. In new areas there is a time when deed restrictions are not processed, until that area is "turned over" to the CDD.

fw102807 02-08-2019 07:48 AM

I refuse to report anyone and my yard is compliant. End of story for me.

graciegirl 02-08-2019 07:57 AM

We live in a small village. All of the homes are compliant. I did not report anyone in this village but I did report a neighbor in our previous village. She had placed more than two dozen items in the front yard.

I didn't dislike her because of that. I was not unkind to her because of that. She asked me about it and I explained the rules. I understand that we each like different things and see beauty in different things. We all have different experiences and expectations from the areas we left behind.

I reported the infringement. The items were removed. She didn't ask me if I reported her and I didn't volunteer the information. I am either a sneaky coward and a yard (will not type that word) or a good citizen or just someone who likes unadorned lawns. The rules were on my side.

Everything You Need To Know About Florida Deed-Restricted HOA Communities - Curri Properties

retiredguy123 02-08-2019 08:07 AM

Where is a good place to buy lawn ornaments?

dewilson58 02-08-2019 08:11 AM

Sometimes I just stand very, very still in my neighbor's yard to see if I get reported.

Chi-Town 02-08-2019 09:09 AM

Interesting lawn sculpture dilemma. Wonder how it turned out.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/dinosaurs-...ry?id=33330576https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...d33bff5d26.jpg

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rustyp 02-08-2019 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 1623053)
Where is a good place to buy lawn ornaments?

From your neighbor after you blow them in.

gqd7806 02-08-2019 09:21 AM

Comply and quit wasting our time...

billethkid 02-08-2019 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gqd7806 (Post 1623078)
Comply and quit wasting our time...

We must be...haven't heard anything......:)

Chellybean 02-08-2019 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1622786)
Chelly, by no means did I mean to disrespect your views but only to correct a very common rumor. You can remain anonymous if you report someone who you think has ignored the deed restrictions.

FW...I do not mean to disrespect you either, but....Tattletale? Whistleblower? Some lawn ornamentation is not pleasing to many people. And some is just plain trashy.

I think some people don't notice lawn ornamentation, and some do. I love the whole "look" of The Villages. I like when you drive down a street here, you see miles and miles of well kept homes and lawns.

Gracie girl i took no offence we all have our opinions.
I just wanted everyone to know some people give their names and the practice of the villages is to give there name to the person that got complained against, which i am not sure that is a good idea. the first time someone retaliates against the complainant violently there will be a lawsuits.
Just fyi.
Stay well Everyone.
P.S. we all read the restrictions hopefully before we built, but no one can be prepared for the nonsense that goes along with it.

Challenger 02-08-2019 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chellybean (Post 1623096)
Gracie girl i took no offence we all have our opinions.
I just wanted everyone to know some people give their names and the practice of the villages is to give there name to the person that got complained against, which i am not sure that is a good idea. the first time someone retaliates against the complainant violently there will be a lawsuits.
Just fyi.
Stay well Everyone.
P.S. we all read the restrictions hopefully before we built, but no one can be prepared for the nonsense that goes along with it.

Don't understand nonsense comment. Person buys property knowing existing restrictions. If they don't it is ,by definition, their fault, as they are of public record. Someone alerts enforcement authority of a possible violation. Authority investigates and if appropriate begins action to eliminate violation. What is the nonsense?

VApeople 02-08-2019 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chellybean (Post 1623096)
P.S. we all read the restrictions hopefully before we built, but no one can be prepared for the nonsense that goes along with it.

The easiest way to "be prepared for the nonsense" is to follow the rules.

anothersteve 02-08-2019 08:26 PM

My God! 18 pages?
Steve

OrangeBlossomBaby 02-08-2019 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatureBoy (Post 1623032)
On the point that "it hurts nobody; if the neighbors are happy, keep your nose out of our business":

People tour the Villages, they visit exploring places to live. If they see various lawn ornaments - or whatever other things that violate the deed restrictions - they will think they can have a house that looks like that. Then they buy and discover they really can't have/do whatever. Now they are grumpy customers/residents. That hurts The Villages' image.

And as has also been pointed out, selective enforcement becomes a weapon that can be used against "undesirables". That sets up an environment of mob rule, not rule of law.

There's a quote out there somewhere that I couldn't find that essentially says: ignoring one law weakens respect for all laws.

So if the lawn ornament rule is so widely ignored & unenforced, it probably ought to be modified. But I doubt it will be. The books have many laws that get selectively enforced, they are political weapons at the ready. Many people like it that way.

If they see lawn ornaments they might be seeing them in areas of the Villages that ALLOW them. Some areas do allow them afterall. Also as I've said, there's been lawn ornaments in spots throughout the Villages, in areas that don't allow them. And - those are actually homes for sale, on the official Villages Homefinder page. So even The Villages, corporation, has no problem with these decorative touches and uses them to sell homes on their website.

This is why it's a problem. The restrictions aren't the same from one section to the next, and even the restrictions in one spot, aren't enforced universally within that section. It's only enforced if someone complains. If no one is complaining, AND if no one is enforcing the rule even without a complaint, then the rule is no longer valid and should be replaced or reworded.

It seems pretty clear to me, based on this one thread alone, that the current deed restrictions would benefit from revisiting by the boards of whatever is in charge of making them.

Barefoot 02-08-2019 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623236)
It's only enforced if someone complains.

And if everyone followed the deed restrictions, complaining would be unnecessary.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by Chellybean
P.S. we all read the restrictions hopefully before we built, but no one can be prepared for the nonsense that goes along with it.

Response posted by VApeople
The easiest way to "be prepared for the nonsense" is to follow the rules.

karostay 02-09-2019 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fw102807 (Post 1622968)
I have no problem with the restrictions. I have a problem with how they are enforced.


That's what they say about ICE

graciegirl 02-09-2019 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623236)
If they see lawn ornaments they might be seeing them in areas of the Villages that ALLOW them. Some areas do allow them afterall. Also as I've said, there's been lawn ornaments in spots throughout the Villages, in areas that don't allow them. And - those are actually homes for sale, on the official Villages Homefinder page. So even The Villages, corporation, has no problem with these decorative touches and uses them to sell homes on their website.

This is why it's a problem. The restrictions aren't the same from one section to the next, and even the restrictions in one spot, aren't enforced universally within that section. It's only enforced if someone complains. If no one is complaining, AND if no one is enforcing the rule even without a complaint, then the rule is no longer valid and should be replaced or reworded.

It seems pretty clear to me, based on this one thread alone, that the current deed restrictions would benefit from revisiting by the boards of whatever is in charge of making them.

There are few restrictions about lawn art in the beginning three areas; Country Club Hills, Silver Lake and Orange Blossom Gardens. Those are the three Villages Northeast of 441/27.

In the others Deed restrictions are on. You cannot place a for sale sign or a political sign in your yard etc.

It is pretty clear to most of us who live here that we are happy with the deed restrictions the way they are. If you should choose to buy here it is a good idea to go to the free workshop to explain just how a CDD works.

Happydaz 02-09-2019 08:03 AM

And everyone lived happily ever after. The society was perfect and no one ever questioned the system they lived under. Everything ran smoothly and nothing was ever changed.

graciegirl 02-09-2019 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happydaz (Post 1623268)
And everyone lived happily ever after. The society was perfect and no one ever questioned the system they lived under. Everything ran smoothly and nothing was ever changed.

I think there are good reasons to effect change in Orlando, but not here. Not all change is good. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Here take a golf cart ride around this paradise;

youtube. golf cart ride in the villages, florida - Bing video

Happydaz 02-09-2019 08:29 AM

I want the last word.

DeanFL 02-09-2019 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happydaz (Post 1623275)
I want the last word.


You must be a married person...

Bogie Shooter 02-09-2019 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623236)
If they see lawn ornaments they might be seeing them in areas of the Villages that ALLOW them. Some areas do allow them afterall. Also as I've said, there's been lawn ornaments in spots throughout the Villages, in areas that don't allow them. And - those are actually homes for sale, on the official Villages Homefinder page. So even The Villages, corporation, has no problem with these decorative touches and uses them to sell homes on their website.

This is why it's a problem. The restrictions aren't the same from one section to the next, and even the restrictions in one spot, aren't enforced universally within that section. It's only enforced if someone complains. If no one is complaining, AND if no one is enforcing the rule even without a complaint, then the rule is no longer valid and should be replaced or reworded.

It seems pretty clear to me, based on this one thread alone, that the current deed restrictions would benefit from revisiting by the boards of whatever is in charge of making them.

Not sure you would be happy here.

Chellybean 02-09-2019 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Challenger (Post 1623180)
Don't understand nonsense comment. Person buys property knowing existing restrictions. If they don't it is ,by definition, their fault, as they are of public record. Someone alerts enforcement authority of a possible violation. Authority investigates and if appropriate begins action to eliminate violation. What is the nonsense?

My nonsense comment was about trolls coming to other neighborhoods to make multiple complaints against other villagers for revenge for them being disciplined.
My only point is maybe that neighborhood is in agreement with the way there yards have lawn ornaments and like it.
But a troll feels a right to come to other neighborhoods to get everyone to follow the rules so there is NO SELECTIVE enforcement.
Is that enough NONSENSE for you!

Chellybean 02-09-2019 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeanFL (Post 1623278)
You must be a married person...

I always get the last two words in my HOUSE!
"I'm Sorry"
God i crack myself up. lol

graciegirl 02-09-2019 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chellybean (Post 1623281)
I always get the last two words in my HOUSE!
"I'm Sorry"
God i crack myself up. lol

You have a good heart, fellow!

Happydaz 02-09-2019 09:32 AM

Last word

Chellybean 02-09-2019 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1623290)
You have a good heart, fellow!

LOL

Maybe but as the old saying goes fight the fights you can will.
"Yes Dear" LMAO

Happydaz 02-09-2019 12:27 PM

Last

OrangeBlossomBaby 02-09-2019 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter (Post 1623279)
Not sure you would be happy here.

Consider your signature line quotes. Apply them to yourself.

Transparency and truth. That's really what this thread is about; the designation (or lack thereof) of transparency and truth.

Truth: There are rules.
Also truth: they are not evenly enforced.
Also truth: rules are often broken, not always intentionally.
Also truth: some peoples' rule-breaks are overlooked for years. Others are addressed immediately, and still others are only addressed if someone complains.

Summary: All of the above, combined, makes for confusion, frustration, and exasperation from the people breaking the rules, the people not breaking them, the people complaining about the breaking, the people complaining about the complainers.

Result: the rules would probably be of more benefit to all, if they were re-visited, made less vague, and better-defined. And then - more evenly enforced.

Bogie Shooter 02-09-2019 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623354)
Consider your signature line quotes. Apply them to yourself.

Transparency and truth. That's really what this thread is about; the designation (or lack thereof) of transparency and truth.

Truth: There are rules.
Also truth: they are not evenly enforced.
Also truth: rules are often broken, not always intentionally.
Also truth: some peoples' rule-breaks are overlooked for years. Others are addressed immediately, and still others are only addressed if someone complains.

Summary: All of the above, combined, makes for confusion, frustration, and exasperation from the people breaking the rules, the people not breaking them, the people complaining about the breaking, the people complaining about the complainers.

Result: the rules would probably be of more benefit to all, if they were re-visited, made less vague, and better-defined. And then - more evenly enforced.

I repeat, not sure you would be happy here.

Happydaz 02-09-2019 01:41 PM

“You can’t handle the truth!”

graciegirl 02-09-2019 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623354)
Consider your signature line quotes. Apply them to yourself.

Transparency and truth. That's really what this thread is about; the designation (or lack thereof) of transparency and truth.

Truth: There are rules.
Also truth: they are not evenly enforced.
Also truth: rules are often broken, not always intentionally.
Also truth: some peoples' rule-breaks are overlooked for years. Others are addressed immediately, and still others are only addressed if someone complains.

Summary: All of the above, combined, makes for confusion, frustration, and exasperation from the people breaking the rules, the people not breaking them, the people complaining about the breaking, the people complaining about the complainers.

Result: the rules would probably be of more benefit to all, if they were re-visited, made less vague, and better-defined. And then - more evenly enforced.

If someone is bothered about a deed restriction infringement, than they can report it and it will be dealt with. It may not be an infringement and the person may have sought and have been given permission for their lovely dark bronze sand hill crane in the front yard or their beautiful fountain.

AND there is not a way to change the rules in a CDD. It is a privately owned business and when you buy here, you also accept the rules. The choice to live here also comes with some baggage. You will see more older people than you have ever seen in your life. You will see one of the best run businesses you have ever seen. You will be exposed to mini-cultures from all over the country. Some will be too outspoken for you and some very polite and as some describe as "passive aggressive". If you are used to speaking your mind, your thoughts may not be enjoyed by others and if you are used to quietly hoping that the Morse Family will remove the Dalmation statue peeing on the fire hydrant next door....without making a call about it, it won't happen. But flowers are planted at each new season and the bushes and grass and trees along the cart paths are kept lovely without anyone asking. The beautiful accessories in the rec centers are a joy to see and the card table chairs are comfy in the card rooms and there are dozens of volunteers willing to teach you to craft and to paint and to draw and to dance and to clog and to sew quilts.

And you will learn as I have that Bogie Shooter is almost always right.

Happydaz 02-09-2019 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter (Post 1623366)
I repeat, not sure you would be happy here.

Who says? Someone here works for The Villages. I wonder who?

Bogie Shooter 02-09-2019 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happydaz (Post 1623372)
Who says? Someone here works for The Villages. I wonder who?

Your implication is way off base or maybe just a WAG.
Nope don't work for TV, actually don't work for anybody.

OrangeBlossomBaby 02-09-2019 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happydaz (Post 1623372)
Who says? Someone here works for The Villages. I wonder who?

According to the deed restrictions I just finished reading, the restrictions expire in January 2020 and will be automatically renewed for another 10 years IF there is no vote to change them first.

Some people like the status quo. Some people likes knowing that they can drive into neighborhoods nowhere near their own, for the express purpose of filing formal complaints about perceived violations. Some people get some kind of sick, twisted thrill out of knowing that they've caused upheaval to an entire neighborhood.

And of course some people are adverse to newcomers, snowbirds, and anyone who isn't "just like them." Which would be just fine, if this wasn't a senior community where the average lifespan from move-in to funeral home is less than 30 years. At some point - y'all will have vacant homes next to you. SOMEONE will be moving in, like it or not. It can be rats and other vermin as a result of abandonment, or it can be neighbors who you might or might not want to hang out with. It might even be neighbors who don't really want to move there, but that's the best they could find in their particular circumstances.

You can be "stuck" with the results, or you can embrace the results. Your mileage may vary but I'd think carefully about who you choose to shun and dismiss. They could become your next door neighbor.

Bogie Shooter 02-09-2019 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazuela (Post 1623378)
according to the deed restrictions i just finished reading, the restrictions expire in january 2020 and will be automatically renewed for another 10 years if there is no vote to change them first.

Some people like the status quo. Some people likes knowing that they can drive into neighborhoods nowhere near their own, for the express purpose of filing formal complaints about perceived violations. Some people get some kind of sick, twisted thrill out of knowing that they've caused upheaval to an entire neighborhood.

And of course some people are adverse to newcomers, snowbirds, and anyone who isn't "just like them." which would be just fine, if this wasn't a senior community where the average lifespan from move-in to funeral home is less than 30 years. At some point - y'all will have vacant homes next to you. Someone will be moving in, like it or not. It can be rats and other vermin as a result of abandonment, or it can be neighbors who you might or might not want to hang out with. It might even be neighbors who don't really want to move there, but that's the best they could find in their particular circumstances.

You can be "stuck" with the results, or you can embrace the results. Your mileage may vary but i'd think carefully about who you choose to shun and dismiss. They could become your next door neighbor.

wow!

graciegirl 02-09-2019 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623378)
According to the deed restrictions I just finished reading, the restrictions expire in January 2020 and will be automatically renewed for another 10 years IF there is no vote to change them first.

Some people like the status quo. Some people likes knowing that they can drive into neighborhoods nowhere near their own, for the express purpose of filing formal complaints about perceived violations. Some people get some kind of sick, twisted thrill out of knowing that they've caused upheaval to an entire neighborhood.

And of course some people are adverse to newcomers, snowbirds, and anyone who isn't "just like them." Which would be just fine, if this wasn't a senior community where the average lifespan from move-in to funeral home is less than 30 years. At some point - y'all will have vacant homes next to you. SOMEONE will be moving in, like it or not. It can be rats and other vermin as a result of abandonment, or it can be neighbors who you might or might not want to hang out with. It might even be neighbors who don't really want to move there, but that's the best they could find in their particular circumstances.

You can be "stuck" with the results, or you can embrace the results. Your mileage may vary but I'd think carefully about who you choose to shun and dismiss. They could become your next door neighbor.

There have been a few people who have reported lots of infringements, but it is a rare happening. I say this because I live here and I read this forum and others. You are jumping to conclusions. But if they did, they would be within their rights to do it. And maybe they aren't trying to get some "sick twisted thrill out of causing upheaval to a whole neighborhood". The truth is that a large majority of people who live here, like deed restrictions.

I didn't see any evidence of anyone shunning anyone, but some of us didn't agree with some views. No one made anyone move here with all of these deed restrictions. There are very few vacant homes for very long anywhere in The Villages, unless they smell like cigarette smoke, cat pee, or are gross and over priced.

Happydaz 02-09-2019 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazuela (Post 1623378)
According to the deed restrictions I just finished reading, the restrictions expire in January 2020 and will be automatically renewed for another 10 years IF there is no vote to change them first.

Some people like the status quo. Some people likes knowing that they can drive into neighborhoods nowhere near their own, for the express purpose of filing formal complaints about perceived violations. Some people get some kind of sick, twisted thrill out of knowing that they've caused upheaval to an entire neighborhood.

And of course some people are adverse to newcomers, snowbirds, and anyone who isn't "just like them." Which would be just fine, if this wasn't a senior community where the average lifespan from move-in to funeral home is less than 30 years. At some point - y'all will have vacant homes next to you. SOMEONE will be moving in, like it or not. It can be rats and other vermin as a result of abandonment, or it can be neighbors who you might or might not want to hang out with. It might even be neighbors who don't really want to move there, but that's the best they could find in their particular circumstances.

You can be "stuck" with the results, or you can embrace the results. Your mileage may vary but I'd think carefully about who you choose to shun and dismiss. They could become your next door neighbor.

Very interesting! It looks like people could effect changes in the deed compliance program. I would lobby that only Villagers with a valid Villages ID and who live within the affected Village could register a complaint. The email complaint system allows for abuse. When I looked at the VCDD site on deed compliance it looked like anyone, anywhere could make a complaint. No place for Village ID number, or name on the email form. That would mean non Villagers could make a complaint.

If changes can be made in 2020, then people should look to make changes if they wish. I must say that I agree with the concept of deed restrictions. It does make for our beautiful Villages environment. We love it here and we would not want to see any drastic changes, but a small change here and there that is desired by the majority of Villagers would be OK with me.

OrangeBlossomBaby 02-09-2019 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happydaz (Post 1623390)
Very interesting! It looks like people could effect changes in the deed compliance program. I would lobby that only Villagers with a valid Villages ID and who live within the affected Village could register a complaint. The email complaint system allows for abuse. When I looked at the VCDD site on deed compliance it looked like anyone, anywhere could make a complaint. No place for Village ID number, or name on the email form. That would mean non Villagers could make a complaint.

If changes can be made in 2020, then people should look to make changes if they wish. I must say that I agree with the concept of deed restrictions. It does make for our beautiful Villages environment. We love it here and we would not want to see any drastic changes, but a small change here and there that is desired by the majority of Villagers would be OK with me.

This seems the most reasonable response to the situation. The situation being - the demographics of the community have changed. The original deed restrictions are due for renewal or change, and if there are that many violations (36 in just one neighborhood, according to this thread), then perhaps some of the restrictions need to be adjusted.

Not eradicated - I agree with you. Restrictions maintain a certain standard of upkeep and keep the property values reasonable. But maybe an "under the eaves is now acceptable, and no tacky flamingos, period!" could be an addendum.

Things like that.


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