[Putt4Dough]

Golfing Eagles

You are a reasonable person, giving benefit of the doubt. Meanwhile, DeafDeaf aka Louis Schwarz is lurking here, reading every post, and too much of a coward to post what he thinks. He was given the chance in his 2011 thread to state what he wanted and get some help before this got ugly and did not step up. Dirtbanker is correct, this guy is a jackass.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by dirtbanker

The guy could have easily gone to any of these retirement communities Senior Citizens Who Are Deaf

But, he would have nobody to pi$$ off there.

Actually, his whining and complaining would fall on deaf ears

We needed a break for humor, no offense to anyone.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Putt4Dough

Golfing Eagles

You are a reasonable person, giving benefit of the doubt. Meanwhile, DeafDeaf aka Louis Schwarz is lurking here, reading every post, and too much of a coward to post what he thinks. He was given the chance in his 2011 thread to state what he wanted and get some help before this got ugly and did not step up. Dirtbanker is correct, this guy is a jackass.

I just don't know if he is a coward or not. As soon as a lawsuit is initiated, the golden rule is DON"T TALK ABOUT IT, WITH ANYONE. We also heard nothing from the LLLC over 8 years until the announcement it was closing. Their lawyers also told the to keep quiet.

And dirtbanker may still be right----in fact I'm leaning 92-8 in his favor.

[perrjojo]

So if those that think the plaintiff is just being a pain; perhaps they should sue Mr. Swartz for taking away a benefit of the community. LOL.

[Carla B]

My bad...I shouldn't have asked him how he would solve the problem. He must keep quiet until the matter is settled by the court.

[mysunshine1948]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Unbelievable

WHAT A CREEP! Glad he is not my neighbor!!!!!!

[Putt4Dough]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

I just don't know if he is a coward or not. As soon as a lawsuit is initiated, the golden rule is DON"T TALK ABOUT IT, WITH ANYONE. We also heard nothing from the LLLC over 8 years until the announcement it was closing. Their lawyers also told the to keep quiet.

And dirtbanker may still be right----in fact I'm leaning 92-8 in his favor.

Yes but he had the chance in 2011, before the lawsuit was initiated to state exactly what he wanted to the posters in that thread. It is obvious the posters responding truly wanted to help. He did not. A reasonable person would conclude his agenda was already set at that time. Other posts we have found like his letter to the editor at Viilage news saying "yeah we can sue, why not?" make it obvious.

And hiding behind lawyers "don't talk to anyone" is just an excuse, mark of a coward. He could disolve this and fire them anytime.

[CindyNah1]

Let's move forward and find out HOW TO RESTART a new Learning Center. sounds like being in the school building complicated the issue. I'm sure there are plenty of retired lawyers here that can help.

Someone take the lead then let us know how we can help

[TexaninVA]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

I just posted some math to estimate a cost under a certain set of conditions. Don't shoot the messenger. This is not the cost of "buying him off", this is the cost of complying with federal law, as it might be interpreted by a judge. Personally, I don't think this guy deserves a penny, and neither do the bottom feeding scum sucking attorneys that he hired. But I didn't write the law, otherwise it would have been much better. I'm not the judge, but I can tell you my ruling if I was, and the plaintiffs would not like it. And I'm not sure a precedent can be set, since the RLGs and Rec centers are run completely differently than the arrangement between the VCS and the LLLC

No intent to “shoot the messenger” Point taken.

Speaking of math, your comment prompted me to do some math of my own.

The lawsuit has clearly led to the demise of the LLLC. We can already read in several posts of people who were thinking of moving here when they retire, but the unknowns caused by the plaintiffs’ action has caused them to reconsider. That makes total sense, and is exactly what I would have done. The result is some level of “market uncertainty.”

This means that the market value of all homes in The Villages has likely already been adversely impacted – i.e. decreased. ( Ironically, this includes the 32 plaintiffs who have been impacted as well.)

How much has the market value gone done? No one knows but we can estimate in a manner similar to yours. Here a guesstimate:

• There are approximately 50,000 homes in TV
• Zillow lists the median price at $248,600 as of October, 2016 The Villages FL Home Prices & Home Values | Zillow
• That’s a total market value of $12,430,000,000
• One can make assumptions … which is what we do when we don’t know for sure
• A 1% market drop is $124,300,000. That’s probably about right
• If one postulates a 3% market drop, the total loss just incurred by all Villagers is about $374 million

If, for sake of simplicity, we assume only 2 people per household (it’s probably higher) that means each couple in TV has just suffered a loss of somewhere between $4,972 and $14,916 as a result of what’s happened.

.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I am so angry about this. Someone wanted to show their superior Washington lobbying skills is MY opinion. Are you happy now????

P.S. I am legally deaf in one ear and have a handicapped child but see NOTHING meritorious in this action.

The law firm is in NYC and I believe the case was heard in Ocala first?? In the Federal Court in Ocala and is being appealled to the Court in Atlanta. Court Role and Structure | United States Courts We are in the 11th Circuit for the Federal Courts of Appeal. They are in Atlanta, Georgia.

DC has little to do with this matter. The ADA has a long history in its origins covering many US Presidential Administrations. The History of Americans with Disabilities Act

Timeline of the Americans with Disabilities Act - Reeve Foundation

[pgc4340]

I feel the same way! I have two theories, but my strongest theory is people looking to make a buck at the expense of others.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Putt4Dough

Yes but he had the chance in 2011, before the lawsuit was initiated to state exactly what he wanted to the posters in that thread. It is obvious the posters responding truly wanted to help. He did not. A reasonable person would conclude his agenda was already set at that time. Other posts we have found like his letter to the editor at Viilage news saying "yeah we can sue, why not?" make it obvious.

And hiding behind lawyers "don't talk to anyone" is just an excuse, mark of a coward. He could disolve this and fire them anytime.

I'm not sure you get it. He is an activist, a crusader, a fanatic, a true believer. He is a dog with a bone who doesn't see the forest for the trees. He is oblivious to the consequences when pursuing his goal. He probably does not feel he owes any explanation--he "knows" his rights. The world owes HIM because he cannot hear. No one should enjoy anything if he can't. And he is not alone. There are organizations devoted to this crusade, almost a sub-culture. He convinces himself and others that his goal is to be able to participate, but then initiates actions that in the end will only deprive others of participation. And if he cannot participate, on HIS terms, then he wants monetary compensation for the perceived slight. I think the speed bump post pretty much says it all.

[mysunshine1948]

So, where are you Mr. Swartz???? And the others listed?? We all know you are reading these posts and all the posts
and comments on other forums. Are you happy with what you have caused? As a retired special educaton teacher, I have worked with thousands of children with disabilities. ADA did a lot of good for many people. But, it was not intended to destroy
opportunities for over 100,000 people because a few dozen did not get what they wanted. There are ALWAYS solutions - granted, maybe not the perfect solution, but a solution. I know that the LLL center would have provided what you....as an individual, needed for any class you actually signed up for. Speak up! Accept the requests to qualify your need to start this lawsuit and pursue it to the point of forcing the Lifelong Learning College to close. You loose and so do all of the other 18,000
residents who were looking forward to taking classes next month. And, what about the instructors who DID depend on this small supplemental income AND the employees of LLL. I read your letter from a few years ago about speed bumps. You ended by saying "you could sue" "why not" . My goodness, you must be an angry man along with your hard of hearing g friends. Yes, my mother was deaf.....not easy, but neither is being blind or physically disabled. However, you do not have to ruin a wonderful thing for so many people.....just to prove your point. This is the season of Love. Think about your actions.

[Putt4Dough]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

I'm not sure you get it. He is an activist, a crusader, a fanatic, a true believer. He is a dog with a bone who doesn't see the forest for the trees. He is oblivious to the consequences when pursuing his goal. He probably does not feel he owes any explanation--he "knows" his rights. The world owes HIM because he cannot hear. No one should enjoy anything if he can't. And he is not alone. There are organizations devoted to this crusade, almost a sub-culture. He convinces himself and others that his goal is to be able to participate, but then initiates actions that in the end will only deprive others of participation. And if he cannot participate, on HIS terms, then he wants monetary compensation for the perceived slight. I think the speed bump post pretty much says it all.

I get it real good, just trying to make sure you and others do as well, if you look back in this thread I am the one who brought up most of the history here.

[pgc4340]

Originally Posted by ctmurray

Does anyone know the details of the suit? Why were the attempts by the College not enough to meet the ADA? Were the plaintiffs only interested in monetary compensation or were they interested in changes in the operation that are just too expensive? I am a new resident and was looking forward to taking classes, and I too am sad that closing seems to be the only solution.

For copies of legal papers involved in the lawsuit go to The Villages News website. Someone has posted everything there for all to see. It seems apparent from everything that I have read, that this is about money and btw, the lawsuit is not just against the Lifelong Learning College. There are 32 people involved in this lawsuit some of which appear to be husband and wife. While I support their need and right to be accommodated in reasonable ways, I do not support 32 people who caused the LLC to be shut down, removing opportunities for over 100,000 residents of The Villages. The classes were my biggest draw to this community without the opportunity for clubs and classes, I would not be living here. I can see the handwriting on the wall.