[asianthree]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Sarcasm Sheldon, sarcasm.

You didn’t post the sign without an emoji you have to post the sign.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by asianthree

You didn’t post the sign without an emoji you have to post the sign.

I wish that had an emoji

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC

We have no clue what the developers really are planning.

My guess is they will be building some amount of apartments and if successful and they make money they build more and more until it affects the sale prices of new housing.

I think I remember you just moved here this year? We have been here since 2007. I don't see any reason why the Morse family would take to shooting themselves in the foot. Up until now they have made wise decisions. At one time I sensed that the family weren't all on board with going forward but they did continue. Those who harbor good feelings toward them will find good reasons and those others will call it greed.

I am not a renter. Really not fond of renters, but people rent their homes out here right and left. It is a fact of life. Many villagers buy homes in order to rent them out. Renting is allowed and will happen. I am of the opinion that it will not harm anyone's property values, but other people think differently. I think. I hope that when these much smaller version of Brownwood Lofts are built and people rent the upstairs at Spanish Springs it will be an..........Oh Well. No big deal.

[npwalters]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I think I remember you just moved here this year? We have been here since 2007. I don't see any reason why the Morse family would take to shooting themselves in the foot. Up until now they have made wise decisions. At one time I sensed that the family weren't all on board with going forward but they did continue. Those who harbor good feelings toward them will find good reasons and those others will call it greed.

I am not a renter. Really not fond of renters, but people rent their homes out here right and left. It is a fact of life. Many villagers buy homes in order to rent them out. Renting is allowed and will happen. I am of the opinion that it will not harm anyone's property values, but other people think differently. I think. I hope that when these much smaller version of Brownwood Lofts are built and people rent the upstairs at Spanish Springs it will be an..........Oh Well. No big deal.

I bought my home here about 5 years ago. I've lived here either as a snowbird or full time since. It doesn't take me (2020 - 2007 = 13) 13 years to figure out what is happening. I think I see it better than you do currently.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I think I remember you just moved here this year? We have been here since 2007. I don't see any reason why the Morse family would take to shooting themselves in the foot. Up until now they have made wise decisions. At one time I sensed that the family weren't all on board with going forward but they did continue. Those who harbor good feelings toward them will find good reasons and those others will call it greed.

I am not a renter. Really not fond of renters, but people rent their homes out here right and left. It is a fact of life. Many villagers buy homes in order to rent them out. Renting is allowed and will happen. I am of the opinion that it will not harm anyone's property values, but other people think differently. I think. I hope that when these much smaller version of Brownwood Lofts are built and people rent the upstairs at Spanish Springs it will be an..........Oh Well. No big deal.

I certainly hope you are correct. This is not something that I want my suspicions to be right about.

I am concerned that this meeting was held as far away as possible not to mention difficult to get to for the people at Hacienda. The way they tried to rig the recent election for commissioners in Sumter started me thinking on this path.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by npwalters

I bought my home here about 5 years ago. I've lived here either as a snowbird or full time since. It doesn't take me (2020 - 2007 = 13) 13 years to figure out what is happening. I think I see it better than you do currently.

I wouldn't count on that

[Laker14]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

So it's your opinion that all 12 country clubhouses north of 44 will be demolished for apartments????? Reality check much?????

that would never happen. Unless it were found to be more profitable than maintaining them as country club restaurants. Then it would happen in a heartbeat. Why wouldn't it? It's their property, and they have every right to maximize profits. Right?

[jimbomaybe]

Originally Posted by Laker14

that would never happen. Unless it were found to be more profitable than maintaining them as country club restaurants. Then it would happen in a heartbeat. Why wouldn't it? It's their property, and they have every right to maximize profits. Right?

No they don't ,anymore than the right to build a waste dump next door to your home, apartments can only reduce the property value of your home, that is why zoning laws and restriction are in place across the country, its your home,your property ,can you do whatever you want? I have recently moved here and if apartments start going up I think I will look elsewhere. I have lived in large cities and have seen homeowners fight changes in zoning to protect their property values and have seen what happen when developers have their way, you will note that no apartments will be built in the new sections, at least until the developer has sold all the property.

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

So it's your opinion that all 12 country clubhouses north of 44 will be demolished for apartments????? Reality check much?????

How many times do you have to be hit in head to see the next one coming??? As soon as major maintenance is required on a clubhouse it will be demolished for apartments. Maybe a few clubhouses will be maintained for ad brochures. In the 14 years we have lived here we have seen a lot of dirty tricks on the part on the developer, and he didn’t usually win because residents didn’t just roll over and hope for the best.

[donassaid]

So much for "representative" government. Amazing that elected officials can be this tone deaf to the will of the people.

[Worldseries27]

When the president of the usa, governor and ag of florida, and all their local minions show up in tv in the eventual campaign stop, i suggest all those who are upset about this issue show up with their own leaflets and signs and put democracy in action instead of merely venting on this thread. Governor mario cuomo, a small queens, nyc local lawyer made his fame fighting for a queens residential neighborhood to limit the size and scope of proposed multi family housing. I'm sure there are other ambitious individuals around who can see the same opportunities to benefit all involved.

[npwalters]

Originally Posted by donassaid

So much for "representative" government. Amazing that elected officials can be this tone deaf to the will of the people.

To be clear and a point I should have emphasized in my original post. I wish I had clarified that up front.

The Sumter County representatives at Monday's meeting are not elected officials. They do not have the authority to approve or deny these actions. They are the body charged with making a recommendation to the Sumter County commissioners.

The commissioners will hear public comment and vote in October. They ARE representatives of the people and subject to reelection. Three of the five are lame ducks.

[mrrmauu]

For what it’s worth. My wife and I were at the Trillium pool the first few days it was open. We met several new residents of the apartments. Guess what. They were all current Villagers that wanted to downsize. One was a Villager who went from a Villa to an independent living facility. The apartments gave her the ability to have a more normal Villager life and she was thrilled to be back.

If you look at the Villages you will see the ultimate 55+ lifestyle in the world that is relatively affordable. This is due to the vision of the developers, from Mr. Schwartz to the current generation. There is a reason the new homes are sold faster than the developer can build them. People want to be here. If you look at everything here you will see the most well planned community in the world. Why is there such distain for the developers?

[rtrav711]

This topic has popped up before...and I posted the following comments on the last one. As it states, the developer was required to put in writing how their property was developed...and how to was to be developed going forward. It would be difficult if not impossible for the developer, to rescind what he/she presented to a legal body such as a State. Going forward...it is also apparent their promises are in writing to those who depended on them when purchasing their home in The Villages. I am not an attorney....but I find it difficult to believe that those effected would not be able to sustain a Class Action suit.
The big problem...is no one will really sustain a real estate value loss until the developer has effected the changes. It should be kept in mind; just because a zoning commission, etc., approves a zoning or building change...doesn't eliminate one's written promise or written vision of how a piece of property is to be developed.
In addition...the developer may also be exposed to a punitive suit....which in many cases far exceeds the value of the compensatory damages.



Déjà vu…..what comes around-goes around.
Recently responded to several comments made re the changes at Hacienda CC.
To reinterate…it was necessary for the developer to file with various States a Property Report which stated on its’ face “The developer is responsible for the Accuracy and completeness of this report”.
The one filed with the State of Connecticut was a 34 page detailed document, revised in 2003.
My personal initiative to purchase in The Villages was partially dependent on this report ;(some would refer to this as "due diligence") which in writing promised a “vision” of how The Villages were developed to that point; and what the developer was to do in the future.
There have been hundreds, if not thousands of purchases in The Villages, by individuals who were led to believe what was presented to them in writing.
There is absolutely no problem for someone to revise a plan going forward in a new area…but there is a problem for one to significantly change what was a written promise and now proves detrimental to one who had depended in it.
Additionally…there has been many pieces of sales material handed out by the developer over a period of time that states the same objectives, etc..
E.g…..Under additional information on the Restated Report filed with the Connecticut authorities…..it states on page 32 ..”40. Describe type of building, such as high rise, cluster, garden, etc….The answer is “The Villages is currently developed in two sections as “units” and “villas”. This follows the previous remark “39. …..The units are intended for and restricted solely to single family home usage”. It does not say anywhere in the report, that apartments will be part of the Villages….nor does it say anywhere in the report that multiplex buildings will become part of the Villages…nor does
it say anywhere in the report, any reference to do with specifically with apartments at Spanish Springs or Sumter Landing.
No one should have any problem….going forward on new expansion areas of The Villages as to what is to be built....as it's going forward you are made aware of the plans.
It’s when you back up and take something away…or radically change what you have promised in writing…that causes a problem.
So what changes have been made against written promises on an Official document in this case filed with the State of Connecticut. The elimination of the pool, pro shop, tennis courts, dining facilities etc., of Hacienda CC which are specifically mentioned in the report, (eg..page 3 paragraph 3,page 20 under #17,page 21 under #18, and so on). This not only effects the adjacent homeowners….but also the greater area surrounding The HH CC …. For the hundreds of homes that considered this course their CC because
of their location to the course.
What other changes have/are occurring …… closing of the restaurant at Chula Vista; restaurant closing at El Santiago… the closing of Katie Belle’s which was a written promise of Resident Dining in a 2004 sales brochure given prospective property buyers….the proposed apartments at Katie Belles….proposed apartments on other Spanish Spring property…proposed apartments at Sumter Landing…and so on.
There has been talk of a Class Action Lawsuit by several groups, for compensatory Damages, on those several hundred homes that may be effected by the complex that is proposed at the HH CC location.
On speculation…say the developers are making 20% on a home…and they are averaging or have averaged about 5,000 homes a year…at about $300,000 a home sales price…the profit would roughly be $300,000,000. Again, this is speculative…and I have no basis for the profit margin…but just a guess. My point would be…that even if it’s half of that….to actually lose 5, 6 or even $700,000 on the promises they have made…. (restaurants…CC..etc)….would literally be nothing…and allow them to maintain what they promised in writing.
In addition to a compensatory Class Action suit…there is a question as to whether or not the developers would be exposed to a Punitive Damage count. Generally, punitive damage judgments involve a tort claim, or contract claim Eg… insurance policy. The problems here arise out of contractual purchases,
based on written promises.
Punitive Damages, or exemplary damages, are damages assessed in order to punish the defendant for outrageous conduct and/or to reform or deter the defendant and others from engaging in conduct similar to that which formed the basis of the lawsuit.
I am not an attorney…but have read about these substantial judgments. Given the importance… of filing a detailed property report with requiring official state entities…the content of these reports cannot be viewed lightly.
In this situation, if the breach of written promise is so egregious, to amount to a breach of the implied good faith and fair dealing; there may be a basis for a punitive damage award. Again….I am not an attorney…and what I have concluded may be all wet…but it might be a consideration for those directly effected by the developer’s actions.
We moved to the Villages many years ago...and will remain regardless of what changes will be made.
It still is a special place...but am disappointed that written promises that have been made are being
broken,

[Laker14]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

No they don't ,anymore than the right to build a waste dump next door to your home, apartments can only reduce the property value of your home, that is why zoning laws and restriction are in place across the country, its your home,your property ,can you do whatever you want? I have recently moved here and if apartments start going up I think I will look elsewhere. I have lived in large cities and have seen homeowners fight changes in zoning to protect their property values and have seen what happen when developers have their way, you will note that no apartments will be built in the new sections, at least until the developer has sold all the property.

actually Jimbo, I agree with you. However, it seems that they ARE getting away with doing whatever they want. Some of the same people who claim that the developers SHOULD be able to do whatever they want are the same people who think it's unthinkable that they would do it again with the other CCs. They know how to get what they want, and they usually do. I don't think it's unthinkable at all that if the current plan for apartments proves profitable, they wouldn't do it again, and again.