[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

Very true today, time marches on and technology improves. No telling what tomorrow will bring. If there is money to be made, someone will make it. Morals, ethics, and religious beliefs all take a back seat to profits in our society.

Not saying that is a good thing, actually, I believe it is a bad thing, it just is what it is.

If people want to make money on biological men fracturing women's skulls (ie Fallon Fox), count me out...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

This thread seems to be about a couple of things - only loosely related.

As far as the problem of sports, I have for a long time thought the "solution" to this whole drug/sex/enhanced thing was pretty simple. Just follow the drag racing model - pure stock, modified, and super modified.

I seem to recall that prosthetics are no longer allowed - like running leg replacements because real legs can no longer compete. Hmmm, seems like a modified class would solve that.

"Drag" Racing... (giggle...)

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

So how would you feel if a woman with a significant physical advantage over other women, due to being born (a physically amazing gene pool) as a woman, wanted to compete with other women?

Or hm - a woman with prodigial hand-eye coordination, that most golfers lack, competing in womens' golf against other women who don't have that prodigial hand-eye coordination?

Should Tiger Woods have been rejected from pro-golf because he has a significant biological advantage over other golfers (golf is both a physical and mental sport, and he mastered it from both ends, something others COULD NOT DO)?

How about [insert name] the pro-football running back who can do whatever the heck he does better than any other football player due to his physicality? Should he be disqualified so that lesser men can have a chance at winning?

A woman with naturally broad-shouldered frame and narrow hips will have a much higher shot at being a championship swimmer than a woman with narrow shoulders and wider hips. Should that broad-shouldered woman not be permitted to compete?

People are both however they're born, and their physicality doesn't prevent them from competing. In fact, often it's their physicality that allows them to win. Do we tell those with superior physicality that they're no longer allowed to compete because it's not fair to those with less superior physicality? No, no we don't. In fact, we applaud it, and pay them the winning prize for it.

UNTIL you start talking about something that you don't understand or fear. Then it's a bad thing. Physical traits becomes taboo, no longer permitted. THIS physical trait will ruin the game, it gives everyone else an unfair advantage.

Maybe they should just check testosterone levels. If your levels are on par with the levels of the rest of the people on your team, then you can play. If they're not, you can't. No matter what your DNA says you are. A man with super-low testosterone levels as a result of genetic mutation, should be able to compete on the womens' team. In fact, change the names. No more womens' teams and no more mens' teams. Make it Hi-T and Low-T.

You want it to be fair, then go down that road instead. The presence or absence of a ***** or vagina doesn't mean diddly, except in the case of reproduction and whether or not it's easy to pee standing up.

Ah, the MIRACLE of peeing standing up.....evolutionary superiority at its finest. And PLEASE pass me some of that HI-T soft drink mentioned in the post.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

High tops make a fashion statement. They are practical, comfortable, and WAY cool!

How are they practical? (aside from keeping crap from falling into your shoes when hiking?)

Comfortable? Typically hotter than low tops...

Way cool? Meh...

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by wamley

To a great extent Professional sport salaries are a refections of the amount of money that it brings into the owners and the organization that runs them. Women sports are just not not viewed or produce near the same revenue that men sports do. Example, there are no professional football teams and their basketball teams suffer from revemue short falls. I guess you could put this inder natural selection, not because of prejudice.

It is more like a social phenomenon (male-dominated sports) that has lasted past its real usefulness. Society changes slowly. Remember that Billy Gene king changed the sport of tennis - and now women mostly get equal pay and equal time for their matches on TV.
..........I call that an improvement (like Chapter 9 in college sports) as society PROGRESSES forward.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC

Silly me thought we were talking about differences between males and females. So now you want to complicate it by talking about some males are stronger than other males and vice versa?

I could see that those were examples to prove a point - the point of this thread. The post was well written.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by MartinSE

Well, I have enjoyed your posts on this topic (as well as others). But, I will take a slight exception here, the "1950's". Today's changes and opinions about sexuality, privilege, etc. are engrained based on thousands (if not millions of years) of male dominance. Originally for some reason, humans split responsibilities between males and females.

The 2 sex model is primarily a religious doctrine and not so much a scientific one, and with between 65% and 90% (depending on which poll you believe) of Americans believing there is a God, it is not surprising that sexual fluidity is on an uphill path, that there is significant resistance to that change.

Athropogically speaking humans did divide into 2 groups. Males USUALLY did the hunting and the females did the gathering of fruit and grain. That division of labor would cause the men to develop larger frames and muscles over anthropological time. And women developed greater skills in organization, sociability, and language skills. (men hunting just had to point....that's a joke). But, some females probably hunted and some males (maybe older ones) probably did gathering and cooking. Males were probably more replaceable (less valuable) than women because reproduction was essential to continue the species.
.........Now we are in a period of modern humans and our brains are evolving rapidly to take in rapid scientific and social changes. Modern life in an office may be more like the GATHERING and communication skills possessed by women than the HUNTING skills possessed by men.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

It is more like a social phenomenon (male-dominated sports) that has lasted past its real usefulness. Society changes slowly. Remember that Billy Gene king changed the sport of tennis - and now women mostly get equal pay and equal time for their matches on TV.
..........I call that an improvement (like Chapter 9 in college sports) as society PROGRESSES forward.

How did "Billy Gene" (sic) King change the sport of tennis?

And "Title 9" is being destroyed by biological men competing as women...

[KAM+6]

Originally Posted by I'm Popeye!

I agree 100% Stu....., but we found out 2 weeks ago that some people can not determine or identify a "Woman" when asked to define a woman...

We found out 2 weeks ago that the person asking the stupid question didn't know the answer.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Athropogically speaking humans did divide into 2 groups. Males USUALLY did the hunting and the females did the gathering of fruit and grain. That division of labor would cause the men to develop larger frames and muscles over anthropological time. And women developed greater skills in organization, sociability, and language skills. (men hunting just had to point....that's a joke). But, some females probably hunted and some males (maybe older ones) probably did gathering and cooking. Males were probably more replaceable (less valuable) than women because reproduction was essential to continue the species.
.........Now we are in a period of modern humans and our brains are evolving rapidly to take in rapid scientific and social changes. Modern life in an office may be more like the GATHERING and communication skills possessed by women than the HUNTING skills possessed by men.

Please explain then, why in all primates (our closest cousins in the animal kingdom) are the males stronger than the females?

Only women can give birth (last time I checked), so we never "divided" into anything...

Your "office" analogy has absolutely NOTHING to do with sports, the actual topic at hand...

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

There is plenty of money to pay teachers. It's just that the school boards can't run their finances properly...

Well, defined properly. They are very good at paying 10 times what a school book is actually worth, hence someone makes lots of money - hmm, I am sure school board don't think about that.

And let's understand that being an educational administrator requires very high salaries.

Enough sarcasm, I know. They are VERY good at doing what they do, it just has little to nothing to do with Education.

Teachers on the other hand, of the lowest paid on the totem pole, and massively underpaid considering the importance to our kids and the country. Education in todays world economy is extremely valuable.

[MartinSE]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Capitalism has plenty of flaws. It just beats out all the other systems.

I completely agree with you, I just wish we had capitalism here.

[RayMan]

jimjamuser You should educate yourself before talking such nonsense. No one wakes up and decides to switch genders... Did you have to sleep with a man to "decide" you were heterosexual? No, you just knew...right? The same goes for gays, lesbians, trans, etc... They know. It's just that because of the lack of acceptance from their family, part of society, etc... they wait to come out when they've built up enough courage to deal with all the negativity that comes from ignorant people like yourself. Live and Let Live!!

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

There is plenty of money to pay teachers. It's just that the school boards can't run their finances properly...

Actually, it is that rich people place other rich people on the school board. Then they vote out expensive programs like vocational (big in the old days) making everyone believe that they MUST go to college and shunning those that prefer to work with their hands. The end result is that property taxes are kept as low as possible by lowering public school costs.
........The other method is to emphasize PRIVATE schools. And then in the private schools, there are many students that will buy the latest fashions like various VERY EXPENSIVE shoe designs and clothing. It becomes pure Capitalism and a high-level consumer's heaven.

[RayMan]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

I agree with the 2nd sentence. But, I also realize that we are NOT talking about a SIMPLE black and white issue here. Times have changed and GENDER is now much more fluid than in ....say 1950. There are more medical treatments that can alter the original testosterone production of a young male .......to the point of being compliant with the rules of say......the Olympics Committee. I imagine that it must be very complex and put a large and newer burden on Sports Officials to make the determination of GENDER. And the end result/determination will NEVER PLEASE everyone!
......... Since gender fluidity has changed in our lifetimes, imagine (if you will) the future......like in 2100........Gender could mean something very different. Humans may have the capability to change GENDER every 2 years if they desire. Or maybe they could wake up in the morning and say, "today I think I feel like a boy". So, they go into a shower-like area and turn a dial to.......boy. Sounds like a good plot for a science fiction book?

You should educate yourself before talking such nonsense. No one wakes up and decides to switch genders... Did you have to sleep with a man to "decide" you were heterosexual? No, you just knew...right? The same goes for gays, lesbians, trans, etc... They know. It's just that because of the lack of acceptance from their family, part of society, etc... they wait to come out when they've built up enough courage to deal with all the negativity that comes from ignorant people like yourself. Live and Let Live!!